Hi Everyone,

I don't have the energy to elaborate much, but I'll try. I'm having a hard time right now. I tried being honest about the way I felt regarding a certain situation (with my mother), and it didn't go well. We were already arguing, so I thought "what the heck" and opened up a little more, explained how I feel when she says certain things. I wanted to help her understand why I feel the way I do sometimes. But it's caused so much turmoil that now I don't know if I'm completely wrong, if I overreacted, if I had no right...

I recently told my mom that there were certain things I wanted to keep to myself, and she says that she respects this, but she keeps bringing up how much it bothers her that, as a mother, she doesn't know what's wrong with me. And she's gotten so upset over it. I am at such a loss of what to do. My father happened to call me today, which never happens, while I was upset and driving back to my apartment, so I had to tell him a little bit about what was going on. It helped telling him some of what was going on, but that changed. I should never expect understanding from him. He then sent me an email several hours later and he said that he talked to my mom, and they talked about me, and he told me that I need to apologize. Of course, this all happened (or re-began, continuing from the emails I exchanged with my mother a week or so ago) at dinner with my mother on Mother's Day. I didn't bring up the topic specifically because it was Mother's Day, but she did. After that, I couldn't act like everything was fine after that, and I'm being blamed for ruining the night. Which I did do...I don't know. I feel pretty much awful right now, and I have a week before I see my T.

I'm sorry I haven't posted lately - it's been a weird past few days. I feel badly for coming back only when I'm asking for help, but I'm grasping at anything to help me get through this next week. I keep trying to be understanding with my mother, but it seems like I can never do the right thing, and I don't know what I'm supposed to do.

Hi Kashley,

I am sorry to hear that you are having such a hard time. Hang in there.

I can't help but wonder if ther is a trust issue between you and your mom. You do have the right to your privacy, but perhaps she is feeling left out of your life. Then again, you might need her to be on the outside for a while. Only you can answer this.

My T reminds me that it is very important to have my needs met, but if we can do this in love, then all the better.

I hope it gets easier for you kashley as you sort things out.

Hi K,

Been MIA myself lately. I'm sorry you're having a hard time right now. I was hoping you were getting things sorted out with your T. Are you doing the every-other-week schedule with your T, too?

I agree with BB that your mother sounds like she's saying two different things here. You can't tell someone you respect their privacy but then tell them that it's bothering you that you can't know what's going on in their life. I pretty much say ditto to what BB says in the rest of her post, too. I'm sorry you're in such a bad spot. It's hard when we love our parents and want their approval, their love, their acceptance, and we want to make everything right for them at the same time that we want things to be right for ourselves. It's unfortunately not always possible to have your cake and eat it too, ya know what I mean? I wish I had some great words of wisdom but I am the last person to be able to give you good advice here. I really just wanted to let you know that I agree with BB that you deserve a break, girl. You're struggling and working at making things turn out for the better, and it's hard when they get worse instead of take a turn in the 'right' direction. I'm sorry. Hang in there, and please keep posting about your feelings and thoughts until you can get in to see your T. We're here for you!!

MTF

Thank you so much for helping me out. My internet has been very sketchy, so I'll have to respond with more later, but I just wanted to thank you all.

Hi Kashley,

I'm sorry that you are finding yourself in such a difficult position with your parents. You were extremely courageous to bring this up with your mom at all, IMO. It sounds like she is afraid of how you are changing and just wants things to go back to the way they were. But like others have said, it is okay for you to move on and have your own space. I thought everyone else's responses to you were really good, but I especially liked this from Blackbird:

quote:

the parent child relationship is not supposed to be a batlleground where we have to defend out rights to be autonomous at the expense of their love and respect for us.

Negotiating boundaries with our parents is incredibly difficult work...maybe only slightly less difficult than, say, nuclear physics...and what is "healthy" for one parent-child combination may look very different than what is "healthy" for the next. But I just want to encourage you by saying that I think you have every right to whatever privacy you feel is healthy for you. And I also think it is okay to "let go of the rope" (as in The Bridge that AG posted) by choosing not to take responsibility for how your mother chooses to react to your setting boundaries that are healthy for you.

But I know how incredibly difficult that can be to actually carry out, especially considering how parents can make you "pay" for making that choice. I had to wait until the trade-off was really obvious before I could do it. I have had to set some pretty strict boundaries with my mother after years of really toxic behavior toward me and it is still uncomfortable, and I still wrestle with guilt over having let go of the rope. And as far as I can tell, she still thinks I should have kept hanging on. So I really understand how painful and confusing this is.

I'm sorry to hear it's so long until you see your T again! Please keep coming here and talk as much as you need to so we can encourage you and remind you that it really is okay to take care of yourself.

SG

Hello Kashley I’m so sorry you’re having a bad time with your mother (and family!) I read your posts in the other thread (can’t remember the title now) and was going to start a new thread devoted to Mothers with a capital M - but sort of got sidetracked by other events.

Your situation reminds me a lot of mine in previous years - where to take a stand for myself involved effectively rejecting my stepmother and father altogether, because between them they ganged up on me to such a degree that nothing I said was heard or respected (but different from your situation in that I was trying to get from them and being rejected, whereas here it sounds like your mother is trying to get from you.) I also had the same experience with my own mother, which involved (and still involves) endlessly trying to get her to notice me, take an interest in me that sort of stuff - and that to stop myself disappearing into her needs I effectively needed to reject her totally.

Not a good or even effective long term solution so I do understand the incredible tension and pain caused by the whole push/pull dynamic you’re in right now.

Sorry I haven’t any useful advice just want you to know you can rely on us for support and feel free to talk about it all as much as you feel able to.

Lamplighter

All of you have really hit on some valid points. Thank you for the insight and support. You all know how to help me keep my sanity..at least for the next week and a half!

The biggest thing that bothers me is that I just don't know if I'm doing the right thing. I don't know if I'm lying to myself when I think that I shouldn't have to apologize. I don't know if I did anything wrong. Heck, I never accused my mother of anything - I just tried to explain how I felt. But then again, I consistently come back to thinking that I must have done something very wrong to warrant a reaction like this and that it would be unfair and irresponsible of me to not offer an apology.

What this all stems from is a very sensitive subject for me, I guess you could say it has to do with a coping strategy of mine. It's not too serious, but I'm terribly ashamed of it. So I feel so incredibly vulnerable whenever the subject is brought up. It is what fueled these fights in the first place, but they kind of stemmed off from there. But, regardless, I know I need to discuss this with my T, but I'm so scared to bring it up. I don't know if I have the courage because I'm so ashamed. The huge catch with this is that I can really only honestly explain everything that has happened with my parents if I tell my T EVERYTHING, but it makes me sick to my stomach to think of doing it.

And my T is pretty booked up...I think I'm lucky to have gotten a spot in with her. Right now, it looks like I'm meeting on the off-weeks of two other people, like I'll meet on a Friday, Monday, Friday, etc. But I haven't met with her in any less time than 10 days in between. It's pretty frustrating. Hopefully Monday will come quickly...

Oh Kashley this sounds like you're in a really stuck place and that you're spinning out about feeling you ought to apologize to your mother - I'm so sorry you're going through this.

10 days is a LONG time between sessions especially when you have something weighing you down so much. Is there any chance you could ask your T for a sooner appointment? And generally see if she won't fit you in on a more regular basis?

I so hope you hang in there with this without negating your own sense of what's right for you, that's got to be your guide in all of this.

Lamplighter

Hi Lamplighter,

Luckily today is Thursday, and my next session is on Monday. So at least I've stuck it out this long. I hope that I can get more regular sessions though, because this is a sort of torture.

Yesterday my father called me again to see if I apologized to my mother - it was an awful conversation. Some of the worst things he's said to me. I know that knowing what is right for me should be my guide, but I don't know if I'm doing that right now. I don't know if I've created a mountain out of a molehill. Especially considering I'm so sensitive about the subject matter that started all of this. I think it's possible that I overreacted, which makes me wonder if I even have the right to be upset, considering I'm the one that probably caused all of this to get so bad.

Sorry for being so negative and self-pitying. This is all just weighing down on me so heavily because if this is my fault, then I should apologize. Ugh.

Hi Kashley,

FWIW I don't think you are being negative or self-pitying at all. You have a right to have boundaries with your parents, and I'm sorry they are giving you such a hard time about it. I'm glad to hear your next appointment is coming up relatively soon. Hang in there!

I don't know if this will be relevant but what you are describing keeps bringing to mind something that happened between me and my mom several years ago. I was just out of the military and living with my mom and her boyfriend temporarily until I got my own place. During that time I saw a T for a little while to treat panic attacks, and I also talked to him about a few other things along the way, including how much I didn't like my mom's boyfriend. My mother had noticed that I didn't like him all that much (I wasn't actively rude, just went my own way and let him go his) and asked me about it. I said I had been talking to my T about it, but I didn't want to go into any details (because I didn't want to hurt her feelings, and also wanted to avoid a confrontation). But she got irritated at that and said "Well, what did your therapist say about it?" in a really nasty, sarcastic tone...which triggered immediate meltdown in me and I ran out of the house crying.

I think the reason my mom reacted that way is because she felt threatened by my talking to someone else (instead of her) about how I felt about her and her boyfriend. But it really wasn't any of their business because it wasn't about them - it was about my feelings regarding them and the whole situation, and what I needed to do about it to take care of myself. And my feelings and what I do to take care of myself is my business. It's about where I stop and other people begin.

So anyway I just thought I heard some similarities (in principle, anyway) between this and what is going on with you and your parents, although they seem much more aggressive in their insisting that you apologize (although my mom's got a look and tone that causes complete amygdala meltdown in me - still today - so you might say her aggression is more concentrated...gets a little more bang for her buck, maybe? ). Sorry I don't have any more examples but I avoid any possible confrontations with my mom because of how easily I melt down when they happen. Awful stuff.

As far as apologizing...I had a friend once who told me she only apologizes when she's done something wrong. Have you done something wrong? Or are you being asked to apologize for how your mother feels? Because you aren't responsible for that. And you really are not hurting her by having boundaries. Having boundaries is healthy and keeps people from getting hurt, namely you in this case. And that's nothing to apologize for IMO.

Take care, Kashley...

SG

That's a rough situation with your mom, SG. My dad tends to give me some of the same behaviors as that. More of the passive agressive kind of thing, but he also sometimes openly criticizes the fact that I'm in therapy. Honestly, I would never have chosen to tell him, but my mother told him several months back in some sort of revenge kind of thing, I think. Kind of like, "your daughter is in therapy because of what you did."

quote:

It's about where I stop and other people begin.

I completely relate to this. It's the biggest thing that I'm trying to figure out in regards to whether I should apologize or not. At this point, I feel like if I apologize, I'll be doing it just because I feel like I should, but not because I need to. Honestly, I don't want to apologize at all, but I feel like that's just me being inconsiderate rather than me standing up for my boundaries.

I normally speak to my mother at least every other day, if only for a couple minutes. But I haven't spoken to her for nearly a week now, which is no doubt making everything worse. I feel so helpless right now. My father is now ashamed of me as a daughter (he actually said that), and he also said that he wanted me to go back to being the nice, considerate daughter he thought I was. All because he said that I wasn't being fair and I said that I felt like it wasn't fair that I couldn't express my opinions. It was a futile argument with him, but after everything that's going on with my mother, I guess I was exasperated enough to tell him that. I just don't know what I'm supposed to do.

Kashley everything you’re describing rings big bells for me. You are being bullied and the things your father has said are really hurtful and so so so... uhnn I can’t even find the words I’m spluttering so much - UNFAIR. More than that, really quite nasty. Like - you’re only ok and acceptable if you be a ‘nice, considerate daughter’ - read - thinking only of your parents and keeping your needs and wants out of the relationship.

It sounds like you are really struggling with not apologizing and as you don’t feel ok or on your side in this, maybe it would resolve this awful state you’re being put in by kind of ‘giving in’ temporarily, apologizing just to make yourself feel better and then looking at how it all affects you and what their reactions are to it so you can get a clearer idea of just what’s going on here? My own reaction would be to dig my heels in and say NO WAY but I don’t get the sense that you feel angry enough on your own behalf to do that - so maybe doing a bit of strategic surrendering might actually help you get through this specific bad situation without feeling as if you have betrayed yourself?

You’ve got my support, no matter what you decide to do in the end.

Lamplighter

I think I would have apologized before under "normal" circumstances. But I really don't want to apologize now. But what's messed up about it is that I'm feeling more hesitant to apologize because I feel like my parents deserve sincerity from me if I do apologize, and I know that I can't give that. It would just be a few words coming out of my mouth. I actually get the sense that I may feel worse about myself if I apologize, because I'll berate myself for saying something that's a lie.

I am just repeatedly amazed at the support you all have given me. I know I say it in nearly every post, but I just can't get over it - I would really be in a bad place if I didn't have this forum to air out my thoughts.

quote:

I'm feeling more hesitant to apologize because I feel like my parents deserve sincerity from me if I do apologize, and I know that I can't give that. It would just be a few words coming out of my mouth. I actually get the sense that I may feel worse about myself if I apologize, because I'll berate myself for saying something that's a lie.

Kashley...I think what you said here is really important, and what's more, really beautiful. You want to be genuine. But you sense deep inside that you are being asked to do something that will betray what your real feelings are, in order to make someone else feel better about themselves. It is deeply unfair. To be asked to apologize under any circumstances is always kind of goofy, anyway, even if the person really did do something wrong. Because an apology by it's nature has to come from the heart or it is just a lie meant to soothe the other person temporarily. I wouldn't apologize, unless you really believe firmly that you did something wrong AND you feel really sorry about it. Anything else is not beiong true- to both you and her. An apology over what may not have even been wrong (I don't know because I don't see the circumstances here of the perceived injury) and that you cannot feel sincere about is just adding fuel to the fire. It's the buy now, pay later program...Be true to yourself...and if you have to suffer for it at the hands of your parents, that is really agony, I know that one. Many sustaining hugs are being sent your way.

BB

Thank you, BB. I guess I'm just feeling overloaded with crap right now, because it feels like both of my parents view me as the enemy. I'm not going to apologize - but the next conversation I have with my mother is going to be a biggie, I can already tell. I feel so emotionally drained, though. Hopefully I can work through some of this confusion and hurt in my session on Monday...