anyone doing this SPECIFICALLY?? please expand on it if you are, not really something i am finding much on, and apparently it is good for Borderlin Personality Disorders such as exhibited by me, myself, and I.

jill,

DBT is a technique developed to help emotionally sensitive people get a handle on their emotions.

I began attending a DBT Skills class last October. It was recommended by my T when I lost my temper with her after refusing to allow me to make a follow up appointment in the same week. DBT Skills is not a program. A DBT Program requires usually a six month contract, individual therapy, and psychiatric evaluations with meds. These are usually offered to inpatient psychiatric patients. But a skills group like I am in meets each week with a T to discuss one of the DBT Skills. We use a workbook and practice those skills during the week on our own. These skills are practical and anyone, including therapists!, can benefit from them. I don't think anyone in my current group is diagnosed with BPD but certainly traits of it exists at one time or another with all of us.

I think the skills really are beneficial. It is not good to live in the intellectual side of our brains. It is also not good if not worse to live in the emotional side of our brains. Since what we think influences how we feel, the skills help the emotions 'think' a little better. If that makes sense.

I purchased the book "Don't Let Emotions Run Your Life" by Scott Spradlin, MA. and have found it helpful. It gives step-by-step instructions for how to understand, untangle, and tolerate intense emotions and how to effectively communicate ourselves to others. It also includes learning how to distract and/or soothe yourself and how to interrupt cycles of depression and anxiety. DBT begins with the premise that we are doing the very best that we can with handling our emotions but we want to do better. I didn't see the need for this until my desire to face intensely painful memories ran smack in to boundaries of my T. Even with several months of DBT 'under my belt' the pain was so excruciating when my therapist terminated me that I began to self-harm. The pain was excruciating. I am still sorting out what all that pain is telling me about my childhood and about the relationship with my now ex-T). Ugh. I could drone on. Sorry.

Learning DBT Skills is another tool for your toolbox. If we had attuned caregivers as children then we would have learned from them how to understand and regulate our emotions. The problem with not learning these skills is that our emotions can create tension in our relationships. We don't know how to ask for what we need. When we lack the emotional maturity (muscles)to handle the more intense (strong) emotions and needs we are prone to resort to all sorts of coping mechanisms. These rarely support effective interpersonal relationships or healthy self-care. Instead of acting in a healthy way, we pick up the torch and continue treating ourselves the way they irresponsibly treated us.

One of main skills repeated in the skills group is core mindfulness. It is key to successfully changing emotional and thinking patterns. I will end with the most recent example of how this skill could have helped me in a difficult situation. This past week, my DH and I joined a group of people for dinner at the home of an acquaintance. Before leaving the house, I felt insecure and vulnerable and didn't want to go. But, I knew we were bringing a main dish and so I slipped on my shoes and headed to the car. We arrived and I did what I had just done at home....grabbed the food and my purse and went inside the house. A woman I know, but not very well, approached me and asked "How are you?" I stood in front of her speechless. I didn't know what to say. I can't answer honestly unless I know she knows me well. I don't want to lie but I don't know what is an appropriate truth. It was very uncomfortable for both of us. Hence, my interpersonal issues staring her in the face. I settled in and the rest of the evening went well. But back in the car I asked my DH to help me remember to take a moment to be mindful before going into any social situation. That moment will give me the time I need at this season of my life to think about what I am about to do and why I am doing it. It will ground me in the here and now and help me be more effective as a person. If you overlap the intellect..left brain...reasonable mind with the emotional...right brain....feeling mind you will find a very small target called the wise mind, according to DBT Skills. That is what mindfulness is aiming at. Unfortunately, I have a quiver full of failed attempts to hit my wise mind but I am doing the best that I can do.

I like to think that I would not have needed DBT if I had a T willing to help me uncover the reason for the sudden intense pain and willing to sit with me in it, thus letting me internalize her strength. But, that is not what happened. My guess is she felt I needed the skills to help me handle what is behind that level of pain. That's what I've settled on as an explanation. I know I must be about helping myself to heal in any way I can and to do it with some measure of dignity and conviction. I didn't start the fire but it is my job to contain it. No one else can or will do that for me.

I hope this is helpful.

deeplyrooted

it is, thanks for your time and energy in your response. i will search for a class like that and ask T3 about this. she does a bit of this mindfulness stuff, too. yes, i have black and white thinking when asked 'how am i' what a hard question...somehow, 'terrible, circling the drain' doesn't seem like the right answer, but i have such guilt issues in lying with the 'fine, how are you' drone i usually spit out. actually, i am sure i tell too much, and then appear the fool, y'no....mom tapes.


quite interesting all you said, i read your post twice and need to read it again. i guess i am searching for a specific technique...this whole grounded state sounds so easy to my husband, he doesn't get anything BUT being in the moment, but for me it is like holding onto dry sand...it just slips away it a mindful of shoulds and ought to's and such. and then analyzing why i do this or that and then i am so lost in what the conversation is now about that i feel stunned and out of it, and just wander away, either physically or mentally...usually both...flooded, and anxious as HELL!!

so a technique would be what?? count the legs on the pieces of furniture in the room?? look at the person's eyebrows?? i've heard all these things, but can't stay in the present moment.

i'll order the book...i'm sure my self help book library would rival a public library's!!

thanks my friend!!

jill,

If I had the time right now I would write an explain of a few of the skills listed in the book from each of the three units: 1) Core Mindfulness, 2) Emotion Regulation, 3) Interpersonal Effectiveness. I will however share something that I just finished typing to paste to a 3 x 5 card for my purse from the Interpersonal Effectiveness Unit (Handout #5) of the Skills Training Manual called Cheerleading Statements for Interpersonal Effectiveness.

If you are interested in something like this you might check with the Ph.D. department of your local university to see if they offer groups using student interns. TRIGGER WARNING: This program has its roots in CBT!

1. It is okay to want or need something from someone else.
2. I have a choice to ask someone for what I want or need.
3. I can stand it if I don[‘t get what I want or need.
4. The fact that someone says no to my request doesn’t mean I should not have asked.
5. If I didn’t get my objectives, that doesn’t mean I didn’t ask in a skillful way.
6. Standing up for myself over small things is good practice for doing it with big things.
7. I can insist on my rights and still be a good person.
8. I sometimes have a right to asset myself, even though I may inconvenience others.
9. The fact that other people might not be assertive does not mean I should not be.
10. I can understand and validate another person, and still ask for what I want.
11. There is no law that says other people’s opinions are more valid than mine.
12. I may want to please people I care about but I don’t have to please them always.
13. Giving, giving, giving is not the be-all of life. I am important in this world too.
14. If I refuse to do a favor, it does not mean I don’t like someone.They understand this.
15. I am under no obligation to say yes to people simply because they ask.
16. The fact that I say no to someone does not make me a selfish person.
17. If I say no to people and they get angry, that does not mean that I must say yes.
18. I can still feel good about myself, even though someone else is annoyed with me.

deeplyrooted

DR, thanks, i printed that out and will carry it with me. it amazes me, as these SEEM like such basic things, but when you grow up in a dysfuntional family, you never learn this stuff.

T1 at least taught me that you are not 'guilty' if you don't sin...sin = guilt...seems simple, but i grew up feeling guilty for existing.

just normal stuff, but not if you are never taught by example.

thanks so much for your help!! lot's to explore here!!

Jill
I have much I could say about DBT. I'm not sure how to sort out my thoughts about it.

In a nutshell, a lot of it is fairly simple things that seem kinda basic and obvious. Like stuff I should already know how to do or that seem really simple. Yet I have found DBT to be very helpful and eye opening. There's something about doing it and the way it's structured and doing it with others in a group and/or one on one with my T that really makes it a lot more useful than it seemed to me like it would be.

In DBT sometimes there is accountability built into it, more like a lot of awareness about things I do that aren't working - COMBINED with a HUGE focus on being non-judemental and working on being accepting of where I am at (both by me and by my T).

I did a lot of DBT groups and DBT based therapy when I was in a intensive treatment for people with PTSD. It was helpful for most everyone on some level to help manage some of what comes with PTSD. I have a friend who has done it who is bipolar, and another who is a recovering prescription drug addict - and they have both said they found it to be really helpful.

For me, DBT style skills have taken a lot of work and time and practice, but it's helped in ways other things haven't. It's just a part of the picture of my work in therapy, but it is a very useful part. The T's at the intensive and my T at home now say they work on using DBT skills for themselves. It's something they find useful to do for themselves. It me just to know they do it, struggle working out and using the skills sometimes too, and find them helpful at other times too.

Over time, doing DBT therapy as a part of my overall therapy has it's really helped me manage my emotions better, and experience my own emotions more, and even sometimes experience them differently, and at lower levels (instead of so intensely), and to sit with them longer. Being able to do that more and more over time has helped lead to better insight and more room for exploring issues, change, and healing in therapy that has helped to do more than just simply endure emotions better.

It has also helped me be more self aware and pace the therapy better so that I don't get overwhelmed by therapy too much or back off from it too much.

There are some parts of DBT that don't work for me and/or rub me the wrong way. So I try those every now and then and see if they work but then if they don't just let them go. Some skills I have to practice a lot before they really click.

I'm not in a DBT group anymore but I do still have lots of worksheets and a couple of books on it that I work through on my own and bring into my T. It's been really good for me to integrate it into other kinds of therapy.

I have a really hard time at times staying grounded as well. I often am pulled to be numbed out and then I get flooded and it's awful... I have been using a list of gounding techniques and things I use often, especially when talking about tough topics in therapy, that help me stay present and not numbed out or flooded. It's weird - but some of the things work for me. I'm in eq therapy too and I have to use the grounding skills and mindfullness skills a lot to stay present with the H too. They are begining to be easier and more automatic over time and are helping me stay in the conversation and not all scattered and/or overwhelmed... I gotta run but I can post that list later if it might be helpful?

Did you order the book? if so, can I ask which one did you order?

Like every therapy, I'm guessing DBT therapy or DBT type skills doesn't help everyone. Some people like it and others don't. I find some of it really helpful and some of it not. When I was in the intensive treatment and in DBT groups as a part of it, some things we would practice would really click and work for osmeone people and not others - but then we would try another skill and that would work. I hope that maybe there some that is helpful to you or that you find other things that help.

Do let us know how your exploration of it goes - if that's helpful for you.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: janedoe,

quote:

this is very helpful, love what you say..instead of ENDURING emotions...i would love to know more, haven't ordered a book, been waiting to talk to my T about it, we have had two weeks off, and i go in on monday. i think it could be really helpful. glad to hear some of it is working for you, that is good, if SOMETHING is at least useful!! so often, at least with T1, it seemed that NOTHING was useful, just more head pounding! i think this mindfulness type thing/dbt, too, i suspect, is what many t's and p's work on in their own therapy, i remember one of my p's was into mindfulness (and quite dismissive of Christianity i might add...and they DON'T have to be mutually exclusive) anyway, no ranting here, but thanks. would love to know the booklet/workbook that you use. i'll post up after my appt as that is one of many things on my two week STARVATION break list of topics.

is it possible to express a specific technique? i know some of that 'centering' stuff is key to mindfulness.

the floating stinks, doesn't it. no one can understand, the flooding then the 'parachute out'...then the question as what is real...really threw T1, he had NO IDEA what was going on, but wasn't kind enough to tell me. a-hole!! (sorry!)

thanks jill

Hi jill, sorry it’s taken me awhile to get back to this.

I totally wanted to say I very much agree about DBT and Christianity (or even most religions that I can think of) not being two things that must be exclusive of each other. My T that does DBT is Christian too. They can be done in a way that is really contradictory - but it’s hard to get there…. They actually can be really in sync with each other!

I really don’t like that feeling of floating away… and then when nothing feels real… it’s really awful. It's like watching a movie I can't get into or out of.

Books?
I have a couple. The most common one is this one by Marsha L, here. She is considered the original person who started DBT. Her book is called Treating Borderline Personality Disorder, AND it's not limited to that particular diagnosis by any means. The skills can be good for lots of things. (and again, according to my T, they don’t work for some peoplem, even some with BPD.) I was given another DBT book that simply annoyed me to be honest. Most of what I have are articles and handouts from my DBT work when I was in intensive treatment, and from my current T, and that I have just collected in doing my own looking around.

the best website that my T uses sometimes is http://www.dbtselfhelp.com/

centering stuff? like grounding and mindfulness techniques? like to be more present and less floating away? I could write a ton about that... I dunno how much of it would be useful.

There are some good grounding lists I‘ve been given - I’ll see if I can post them.

I wanted to write you about a couple things I do to ground and/or be “mindful” (I like to say “here and present”) that are not so “obvious” and have been more helpful to me. They may not be helpful to you or anyone else, and it’s ok if they aren’t. Heck, they may just be things other people already know… Either way, it’s actually been helpful for me to write this out for myself. I tend to be wordy, so in classic too-wordy-jane-doe-style, this is probably going to be long (sorry about that.)

- One thing that is new and super helpful for me, and is one thing that I would have never have thought of, is to hold something cold and something warm when I’m feeling numb, scattered or overwhelmed. I learned this in the intensive treatment. For someone people, just holding something warm did the trick, for some just holding something cold helped. For me, I needed both. The T’s in the program explained that this is one way to sorta “shock” the system into a lower emotional state, especially when dissociative, haviong a flashback, or flooding, or anything trauma related. Honestly, I thought that it was great that it worked for others, but that there was no way it would work for me. Yet I have used it a number of times and it helps. My T now keeps a frozen orange in her little fridge and a mug she can put hot tap water in for just an occasion. If I hold the orange in one hand and the warm mug in the other WHILE talking about a really tough subject, I stay a lot more present and my emotions are not as strong. My T is really into DBT therapy and even this was a new grounding technique to her. It doesn’t always help, but sometimes it does. (and sometimes, I can use anything I can get that will help!) One time, I was in full blown panic attack (which I don’t normally have) and I sat there and held the orange and the mug and it helped. It helped enough for me to start using other things to calm down and breathe again. Another time I was so numbed out, I barely remember anything of it - and my T got out the frozen orange and the warm mug and I held it. Sometimes all it does it help me not get worse, but often it helps me actually shift my emotional state to a lower gear.

- doing something physical is grounding for me - like walking or running. Just taking off my shoes and feeling the ground beneath my feet helps.

- noticing how things feel against my skin - like how something rough feels to touch and something smooth feels - and how they feel different. I have carried a very small pinecone in one pocket and a smooth rock in another when I went to a tough meeting. I would try to notice the feeling of the rock and the prickly pinecone as we were talking. My counselor ended up writing the word “Grace” on the rock J

- listening to music and singing along. Sometimes if I feel numbed out, playing a song and making myself sing outloud in the car helps. I dunno why.

- smells: I have some strong smelling things I will take around with me and smell to help be grounded. One that sometimes works the best is scented hand sanitizer (like from bath and body works - they sell cheap ones with strong smells. Or Yankee Candle.) It’s grounding in two ways - the smell of it, and the feel of the alcohol on my hands. Plus, I can then have germ free hands! J I also have very strong sour and mint candy or gum I will suck on. A way to be more mindful/grounding is with smells is like if I am cooking, I will notice the smell of each ingredient… sounds silly, but if I am having a really rough day, if I can try to focus on even just the simple smell of what I am cooking, even just for a moment, it helps me get through the emotions, and eventually ‘turn down’ the volume of the emotions in time.

- in the intensive, they often asked us to just say what are our emotions - like label them. And what is our body feeling (tense, relaxed, ecterta) and what is the quality of our thoughts (scattered, clear, present, thinking about the past.) It drove me nuts. Half the time I would know what I was thinking, but not feeling, or feeling but not what my emotions were. Some people had the same problem. But over time, I’m getting to know and recognize my own emotions better. I didn’t really realize this was a problem for me. Now, I not only notice my feelings more, but I notice them at lower levels more often before I’m floating away.

- one mindfulness strategy is to visualize your thoughts and imagine them going down a stream like longs on a river. Or as furniture in a room. The goal is to notice the thoughts, and just notice them as thoughts. I generally have a hard time with this. Instead, I will sometimes just try to write out my thoughts and then go back and look at what is an observation, what is an interpretation, and what is a judgment. Like literally write the word “observation“ and etc. It seems weird, but over time, it’s helped me think “ok… this is an interpretation” and that helps slow me down and be less impulsive. It helps me look at how I am thinking and acting more, to be able to have better insight into what I’m doing. Like I write the thoughts: “I told someone xyz. I am such an idiot.“ I will then write observation by I told someone xyz something, and interpretation by idiot. I don’t try to convince myself I’m not an idiot (that’s a losing battle I seem to win and lose every time) but jut label it an interpretation. Sometimes I take thoughts I write out like this into therapy, and my T gets psychodynamic (I think) about it and asks “why do you interpret that you are an idiot? What other times did you express something and feel this way?” And a very DBT-ish she will often ask is “What other possible interpretations might there be?”

- another mindfulness activity is to write for 10 minutes, trying not to stop, but just writing as much as possible, about something in my environment. I do this sometimes when numbed or sometimes when flooded with past stuff. I’ll spend 10 minutes writing about a plant on my table. It seems tedious and stupid. But I tell myself in 10 minutes I can go back to whatever it is I’m worried or upset about and I usually do - and sometimes, when I got back to it, it’s less intense. It’s not just about distracting, but acknowledging there’s something I want to distract from, then doing the distraction that makes me really focus on my environment in the here and now around me, then going back, if I need to, to what I was dealing with.

- for me being around animals or children is rather grounding. I dunno why yet. Just is.

- mindfulness can be done with different games that require attention. In the program we did a ball toss game that required being on our toes and interacting with others. The goal is that by playing the game, it helps bring awareness to the present moment. The here and now. Things I do on my own are like doing a sudoku game and timing myself, or counting from 100 backwards by three (100, 97, 94...) or sometimes I make it easier or harder depending on what works. Sometimes I count backwards by threes in the alphabet (Z, W, T…) sometimes I just count backwards - 100, 99, 98...

- counting the things that are in the room, like everything that is green, or count tiles on the wall.

For me sometimes stuff that involve more “thinking” or things in my head, like counting things in a room won’t help anything feel more real. I’ll just “crawl up into my head more. If it doesn’t work, I’ve found that usually means I need to do something more physically grounding that gets me out of my head more (like the orange or sour candy or etc)

In the program they talked about how mindfulness without grounding when numbing out can sometimes make the numbing out seem worse for a moment. What is the difference between being grounded and mindful? That’s one I am still figuring out. (Sorry I can't be more clear on that.) That's all just to say that if you try something and it doesn’t work, or if things actually get worse, keep trying and experimenting. It's my understanding that for me, and maybe for you, the floating away and feeling like things are surreal is a coping skill - its just a way our brains are trying to cope and know how to do the best. It takes time for our heads to learn other ways and build new networks. DBT also isn't all the therapy. For me, it just makes the rest of the work a heck of a lot easier, faster, and more effective - and it helps me live life better as I work out the deeper issues. (does that make any sense?)

Most of all, I hope you find some good stuff to ask your T about and find stuff that is helpful to you.

wow, janedoe, thanks, i am relishing all this and just have a second to reply, (putting kids to bed!) but thank you and i will pour over this when i get back. thank you for all this information, and your time in posting it all. i do think this is something i need to work on because rarely am i 'home', y'no?? it is all i can do to be there at flooding times for more than the initial moment. the floating and spinning can be so scary, so thanks for these tips to hang on. xxoo, jill

janedoe, now that i read your post again, with more time, i think some of those things really will help,and it is funny, there were some, like burying myself in suduko, or scrabble on line, or years ago, crosswords and tennis for twenty hours a week, were things i was doing to keep the rush of emotions at bay. but they still served a purpose...feed an addiction to escape emotions. so for me, i think being comfortable, more comfortable anyway IN the emotion is where i need to grow, and that part where you talked about body feeling (tense, relaxed, ecterta) and what is the quality of our thoughts (scattered, clear, present, thinking about the past.) that really is great. i have never separated the two...i need to work on that. and the exageration of another sense (than thinking) with the hot and cold, or the smells, of feeling something smooth or rough. wow, really helpful.

i have a hard time cluttering my mind with the counting, altho i have done that type of thing since a child...counting backwards, don't know what i was doing it for, kindof a weird obsession i always thought, but maybe God gifts you these techniques as you need them, at times.

i think i just always run and hide when emotions are heightened in a room (and i, like most of us, sense the slightest change as time to escape!!) or when they are heightened in myself and then i escape within myself, so i think i need to start working on feeling and accepting them, and knowing they don't have the disasterous consequences they USED to have, that now, i can talk to family about theirs and my emotions and THIS ONE THING ALONE will do LEAPS AND BOUNDS to not pass this sick thing on to my precious boys.

another thing i find tremendously helpful, is music. amy grant for inspiration, but last night we were listening on 'pandora' to a bunch of 70's stuff, big chill era music, and it really kept me alive and fun and happy feeling and in the present with my family.

thanks for your love and kindness in helping me with this!! (jd)

Cool! I'm glad to hear that some of it might be helpful for you. It was good for me to write and remind myself

I have a simillar battle with some of the more "mind based" grounding/mindfullness stuff. I have to even set timers and stuff to not just do sudoku for like three hours and get really sucked into it... It then becomes more of an escape in a bad way than a grounding and mindfullness thing that helps me be present here and now and more of an especaing here and now. Still a balance I am trying to find to be able to let myself distract and how to do it without escaping... sometimes I can do it, sometimes it helps, and sometimes i just need to get out of my head! (we had a T in the program that would sometimes tell us - time to get out of your head! in a very good and kind way

That is just wonderful that you can talk to your family about your feelings! Oh so many don't do that and I agree - it will do so much good and help stop the old patterns of silence and stuffing that can get passed down generation to generation (at least that is true for my family.) I think you are doing a lot of things by working on your own stuff that will help your kids immensely live amaxing lives!!! heck, just having a mom like you who is so brave and real makes them pretty dang lucky

Music is a huge thing for me - not just for grounding and being present but for expressing and... well, sometimes it's just plain healing.

let us know, if it's helpful for you, how it all goes!

when does your break with your T end? When do you see them again? It's inspiring to see you being proactive about still working on things and seeking out more potential resources in the meantime. very cool!

janedoe, don't be too impressed, today is good, yesterday was exceptionally depressing...funny, the weather yesterday was so much like the weather where i grew up, dark heavy atmosphere, humid, threatening rain, no natural sunlight, and i realize just that can set me back and make me feel like i am there again.

you flatter me!! so thanks, i do know, i try like HELL to not pass this SHIT down!! feel like i am learning a completely foriegn language (mothering) as my first language (in mothering from her lousy example) is the only native tongue i have, so having to do every thing in a completely opposite way is my general 'go to' example!! thanks, i know that is my chief prayer, much above my own healing, but i know that without healing myself, i can't do the first job. it is pitiful how much i think that I don't matter. just my kids. i do feel that throughout, and am now just realizing that is not normal.

and the break has just been two weeks, she is new, we are only 4 appts into each other, and i have been trying to find a t since may when i realized T1 had no new tricks...and few tricks at all, really. when t3 talked to him to 'exchange info' (i would have LOVED to hear that conversation) t3 commented that he, t1, was an interesting mix of arrogance and ignorance....took me awhile to realize it, underneath his masters in divinity, he was really a pretty shallow, not very knowledgeable, not very compassionate, nice looking man. he was so dumb he even admitted he didn't know any more about ME than i did...i told him that THAT was REALLY SCARY, and left after he told me he needed 12 -18 months more with me to get me where i need to go. now, explain that!!!!!!!!!!!! he knows nothing more, but needs 12-18 months more of therapy with me....ohhhhhhhhhhhhhh, i can't tell you the rage i feel...................and a masters in divinity, to boot. a real fraud. i digress, anyway, thanks for the encouragement, ms. doe. and yes, music is so good, just wish i could sing!!! but i do anyway!! keep thinking God is going to 'bequeth' me a voice one day, for all my troubles!! hee hee!! jill

just a bump up on this topic. i interviewed a t today (on the phone) that works with this. trained at the marsha lineman (sp?) institute, which i hear is a big founder of this dbt stuff.

she has only been trained 5 years, most experience is with hospitalized people, fairly new practice, i gather, on her own (with her team of dbt people). i don't know that she is 'the one', but a first stab at interviewing someone NOT AFRAID OF PEOPLE WITH BORDERLINE TRAITS!

she was a bit too intent on the 'contract', i don't know, it may be just 'women', but i sense she is not the one, but i feel such undercurrents of these STRONG EMOTIONS (even to a text from a friend changing a carpool schedule...i FEAR i did something WRONG!) that i wonder if this is what i need.

she also (like everyone else you talk to that is NOT into psycho-analysis) 'poo-pooed' my interest in psychoanalytical psychotherapy....seems kind of a hatred in the psychology community of people that they have to either support or rebuke psycho-analytical viewpoints....any one else pick up on this?? it is like people either LOVE or HATE the east coast vs. the west coast...or yankees vs. mets....no neutrality...

anyway, i digress.

but, thought i would up this to see anything new anyone has to say...

i am QUITE NERVOUS to pick up a new therapist...as she pointed out...'look how many therapists you have seen in the last year'...(reminded me of MY MOTHER...y'no..."the problem is YOU, jill, YOU ARE THE PROBLEM" (and i intimate, no one can help me as i am THE PROBLEM!) i think she is sounding a bit punitive already.

i don't know what i am asking, but, i guess some input on psychodynamic vs. DBT for highly functioning possible BPD traits of attachment, abandonment, etc.

and, if it is just MORE CBT stuff...as that just doesn't HIT my emotional pain button.

y'all have told me alot, i am just circling the drain a bit...thanks, i hope to one day repay your kindness! jill

deepfried, i love your name, btw. thanks for the insight, she did mention the contract. and i know first hand about the fear of losing the therapist. thanks, you shitty t3, for reinforcing my fear! but, i feel like i am auditioning for a flipping therapist to take me on, these days. and these deep emotions. i will look on youtube for some videos. so, i know i am the problem, and i don't mean that mean, but, yes, i need to change, and have someone powerful enough to stick with me through this.

i am 'high functioning', how long does a good round of this therapy take?

i ordered two books on amazon regarding this. i am interviewing a few names, there are a handful in my town, so, we shall see. this one was awfully strict sounding, and i guess that is the nature of it. clear boundaries i don't mind. changing boundaries are not good, i know. sometimes i really rely on my 'likability' to earn 'grace'. i guess that would go on that later list you mentioned.

not for the faint of heart.

i think i need it. i have a deep heavy river flowing under the surface that boils up at certain triggers, and, with all the rounds of crappy therapists i have run through, i am mighty triggered.

i am not a self-harmer...except my harsh inner critic. what i have come to ask myself lately, is WHAT IS IT THAT I GAIN FROM BEING SUCH A HARSH SELF CRITIC??? as obviously i wouldn't do it if at SOME level, i found it rewarding. maybe rewarding in getting the punishment i 'feel i must deserve'....shit....that sounds REALLY MESSED UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

i wish i could understand that.

but there is a link i am not getting, i guess that is the link for all self harmers, mentallly or physically.

hmmmmmmmmmmmm

so, how long for a non-suicidal, non-physically self harming (only negative self talk) to come around the bend??

any guesses??

thanks, deepfried, your input is great, and i would love to find a t that can go to the mat with me on this, as i need out of this 'self-hell' i am in!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


((df)) jill