Me and my husband have had interactions with these over the years and are getting quite good at spotting them. They are people who feel inadequate and find that being a therapist, or training to be a therapist meets their own needs for validation and feeling ' better' than other people. It is a subtle thing but often strikes people IN therapy and they just can't seem to help themselves...

!. They have wounds and are feeling vulnerable so they hide behind trying to be a therapist like THEIR therapist and it gives them a sense of being important
2. they use the being 'special' as an aid to subtly feeling superior so that their own feeling of inadequacy can be soothed.
3. they really do believe they are healed and they feed off their new found status.
4. they like to be more 'inportant' than other people in most situations but play this down by acting quite humble
5. they are very good at worming their way into this therapist or assistant therapist role.
6. They like to get the authority or be in the 'boss' role or something similar.
7. they can appear very together to their clients but people who know them, know they are very messed up and cannot imagine them being therapists and really feel horrified that they are.
8. they seek out supervisors who affirm their perspective and stroke them.
9. they are adept at cleverly putting down others who might threaten their position and role.
10. their construct of themselves as 'healer'/therapist is an important part of their self identity and are very protective of this.
11. they can feel easily threatened but often go on the attack so cleverly that the other feels put down and backs off.

Sadly,

You've made some astute observations over the years. I guess it all comes down to that there will be good therapists and bad therapists just like in any other profession. It might just depend upon whether or not you believe that most are benevolent in nature or just plain evil. Each one of us is, afterall, human, which translates to, IMHO, imperfect.

As a therapist wannabee, I find this post to be offensive, Sadly. I am one who both finds myself in therapy and also desires to someday attain my goal of being an LCSW. I realize that I need to work through all of my issues before I will be able to be a good therapist, that I must be healed before I can help others or else I will end up using them for my own healing. My own T has advised me the same, and because of this I struggle with the confidence to move forward towards this goal. I concede that currently I do feel inadequate. But I refuse to label myself as goods so damaged that I am beyond repair and beyond giving back. As I read through your list, I am sure there is some insight there into the characteristics of bad therapists. However, I also think any one of those items could potentially be used subjectively and with bias against a therapist, based upon the current mindset of a client who may be projecting these qualities onto a T. A client who is disgruntled with their therapist will look for justifications for his feelings. We all do this, myself included. Certainly there have been many examples on this board of clients harmed by their T's, you being one of them. But your list is so subjective that it could be used to discredit 99% of all therapists, if one was seeking to do so.

Hm...I tend to think the list is really insightful, but that it just doesn't describe therapist wannabees- it just describes every human person. We *all* struggle with this stuff, every one of us, to some extent or other- so anybody struggling with the items on this list could certainly still be a very effective therapist- as long as they learn to keep that hour with the client "sterile" and not allow these tendencies that we all struggle with, into that hour. (or 50 minutes) this requires training and hard work on the part of the therapist, right? And a good deal of (continuing) insight into the self, and human nature, which I think that you possess, MH.

the list can actually be used to discredit 99 percent of humanity. I sometimes am beginning to doubt that it is wise to give another person, no matter how well-intended that person is- *this* much power over us. It seems like a person getting corrupted by that kind of power is almost inevitable. But I speak from a very disillusioned place, right now. We are none of us "better" than another. Interesting discussion, Sadly.

Oh- the reality is that anybody choosing to spend their days trying to uncover what lies in another's unconscious has been in a great deal of pain themselves at some point, and receives something- some kind of validation, good feelings- a sense of connection- from helping others. That is no wrong! That is the source of healing! Wanting connection with others is healthy, and we give something "back" to our therapists when we let them help us, which is wonderful for all concerned. I don't think that therapists need to be "perfect" in their motivations to want to help others. But just, willing to work hard to keep that time with the client sterile.

Sadly, I'm confused by this post. What is the purpose of it? Are you addressing bad therapists "out there" in the world? Yet you call them "wannabees" so does that mean some student population you are involved in somehow? Then I wonder to myself what does that have to do with the forum. I guess I'm wondering why/how you and your husband have encountered all these therapist "wannabees".

I'd love to respond more thoroughly to your post but maybe if you filled me in a bit more on what you mean I can put together a response.

I do hope you are not directing this to any members here. There are quite a few of us here who are psych students (myself included) and this could be very hurtful and harmful to them.

TN

Very good point, TN- I know this post hurt me when I read it, and my initial reaction was that there would be people here very hurt by it, because lots of us have considered or are working towards becoming therapists, and yet are not fully healed enough to not assume that we possess all of these bad characteristics.

We need *not* have 100 percent perfect motivations, or be completely selfless in our approach to others, in order to still be able to help them, and receive something good and validating for ourselves, too. It feels good to help others, and to connect with those whose pain we can understand and help them to make sense of. I think that's a really good motivation for wanting to be a therapist.

Hi Sadly,

There are therapists out there who are horrible and do hide behind therapy to avoid their own problems. But there are also a lot of therapists (mine included) who go through their own healing in therapy and *because of that* they are better therapists. My T has frequently told me about experiences in her therapy that are similar to mine as a way to normalize the experience. Sadly, your list could be applied to pretty much any role in any profession where a person has some sort of superiority to someone else. Unfortunately, it does have the potential to be (and almost always is) much, much more hurtful in a therapeutic situation.

I agree with MH that this list could discredit pretty much every therapist. And it makes me wonder all the more what the purpose of this was. Like MH and TN and many others here, I am a psych student, a year from going to grad school. Sure, I often wonder what makes me so fascinated with psychology, but I'm trying not to question it. No kidding, every one of my friends in the psychology department are all in therapy or have been at some point. It's almost inherent with this field of study and profession that it's our own struggles that make us want to find ways to help others.

Most schools (in the US at least) require that students training to be therapists HAVE to go through a certain number of hours of their own therapy before they can even get near a client. Unfortunately, some don't, and that's where you get the Ts who use therapy as a way to hide. Most supervisors support the therapists but would never say anything that would hurt the client. If a supervisor saw something that the therapist needed to address, they would say it. Most training therapists cannot pick who their supervisors are, they are assigned one. I know this is all specific to the US, but I just wanted to put it out there.

Anyway, I'm not offended (and I hope it doesn't come across that way) because I know you have seen your fair share of bad therapists and are understandably hurt from it. Of course, certain items on your list make it feel threatening to post and also make me wonder if you'll take what I'm saying at face value. It would be very helpful if you could shed more light on this.

I am not in good enough a place to read your posts but I skimmed a few and i am interested in how defensive people are already. Obviously I struck a raw nerve.

I just wanted to say that I'm disappointed that it sounds like you are fine with provoking people and watching the reactions. I won't jump to conclusions as to the purpose of your original post, but your response to all of the posts makes me wonder. Perhaps a better thing to do would have been to come back and only post once you feel able to respond in a way that addresses some of the questions raised here.

Sorry I'm late to the party, but DF and Kashley already said what I wanted to (thanks Ladies!)

Sadly? What WAS this about? Cause right now from where I'm sitting it's hard not to ascribe ill intention to your posting this. An explanation (other than we're a bunch of defensive, reactive, projecting people) would be welcome as I hate questioning any poster's intention on the forum and would prefer to believe this a gross error in communication.

AG

Edited to remove reference to bad language. Sorry.

The only thing I can say is that she did mention clients in one part of her list. SO I was thinking maybe she meant an actual licensed therapist??

But to me to be proud of the fact that one has healed or done a lot of psychological healing is great. I don't think there is anything wrong with that. MOstly because it takes a lot of work to get there.

I want to thank everyone for being so candid here. I saw this post yesterday and wanted to crawl into a hole....as I am one of those sad pathetic psych students. I am now angry and embarassed that instead of recognizing this post as offensive, I internalized the messages and began wondering what was wrong with me (again). Good for all of you strong women!! I don't want anyone else to question themselves any more than they already do.
seablue

You know the real shame about this thread? Some of the points you made were valid in a sense and worthy of discussion. As someone who has been severely wounded and done significant work to heal, I would want to question my motivation about becoming a therapist and what I was seeking from it. I remember talking to my T and asking his opinion of me possibly becoming a therapist and I expressed the fear that I couldn't keep my own stuff out of the room. His response was that everyone has to do that. That he felt that people who had done significant work in therapy often made good healers because they understood from the inside. He believed in the model of the wounded healer; that though the flow needs to go always towards the patient, there are two very human people involved.

And the power structure of therapy and the responsibility that goes along with it should make any ethical person question their motivations. All human beings struggle with the temptations inherent in having power over others, therapists are no different, although the consequences may be more far reaching.

It would have been a good discussion to engage in if not presented the way it was.

I have done a lot of reading about recovery from childhood abuse. One of the biggest ways that people are damaged by CA is socially. Trust and relationships get warped and destroyed. Essentially one must relearn how to relate as an adult. It's like having a stroke and having to teach yourself how to talk, write or walk again. So, when I read these messages here I try to keep that in mind. That we are all struggling on one level or another to connect and sometimes that connection eludes us.