Our couples T called back a little while ago. She was very nice…she said she had arranged for my transfer to the new T, that she is very experienced and has done lots of family of origin work. She also told me that the meeting tomorrow morning is a transitional meeting between my old T, my new T, and me, so my old T can summarize for the new T where we’re at, and I’ll have a chance to contribute, to meet my new T, and also say good-bye to my old T. I told her I didn’t know I was supposed to be there. She said I sounded anxious about that. I said I’d like a heads-up as to what my old T is going to say because our last session didn’t go very well, and I didn’t want any more surprises. She said she didn’t know exactly, but it sounded to her like we tried to work through the issues and just couldn’t go any farther. I asked if my T was upset with me and she said no, not at all. She said I’ve been very open about bringing up the issues, and assertive about asking for what I need, and that I’ll be in very good hands with the new T. She also confirmed with me that my husband and I will continue seeing her for couples work.

Now I’m feeling bad about a lot of the posting I’ve done...no one is actually blaming me for anything. Also not shaming, rejecting, or abandoning. That must have come from me and my overactive imagination, jumping to conclusions and trying to read minds. Why do I always assume the worst?

Well, maybe the new T will be able to answer that. I’m really nervous about tomorrow. I’ll let you know how it goes.

Cheers,
SG

Hi Summer,

I was so scared by the time our couples T called, I was relieved to just have it "smoothed over". It bothered me a little that she didn't address the concerns brought up last time I talked to her, like why my old T was doing that kind of therapy when no one at that clinic is trained to do it, and what did her review team think of the printouts I brought. But I do believe he was doing his best to help me.

When we first started seeing him, we told him that the first couple therapists we had tried hadn't worked out. Judging from some things he said to us, and to me later, I think he felt personally responsible to make sure it worked this time. Seeing that pedestal probably made it worse, like I expected him to be a hero. And wanting to be a hero isn't bad - it's probably why a lot of T's become T's, right? So maybe that's why he kept trying to help long after he should have referred me.

Argh, I'm doing it again - trying to figure out my T.

The only thing our couples T said to me today by way of explanation for the transfer was "We don't want to hurt our clients. That's a no-no." She said that a couple of times. I'm not exactly sure how to interpret that and I was too scared to ask her to explain. It's hurting me to have feelings for him that aren't possible to fulfill, and that may hurt my marriage, maybe?

Thanks for your encouragement, Summer - I really appreciate it
SG

Hi Echo,

I don't mind you asking that - it's a very important question. When the subject of my attraction to my T first came up, I didn't tell my husband because I was afraid he would feel threatened or jealous about my going to therapy. I had been reading a lot about transference at the time, so I knew that it could be really useful, but also really confusing, so I figured I would tell him after I'd worked through it and could explain it better.

Later in the therapy, my T decided to move the couples therapy to a different T and continue individual therapy with me, because by that time we'd been meeting long enough that there would be a bias if we tried to return to couples therapy with him. I asked my T if I should tell my husband about the transference work. He said no, not because it's a secret, but because it could be misunderstood, and I could tell him later, when we'd gotten past this point. This made sense to me at the time.

But when we brought my husband back for a session to discuss the plan for couples therapy, I felt uneasy about it. I knew that there was nothing "wrong" with transference, but it just felt wrong not telling him. I am still questioning myself as to why I didn't tell him. I mean, it's MY marriage. Just because my T recommended I not tell him, didn't mean I couldn't.

We only had a few more sessions after that, and then that last one. I told my husband then. He took it amazingly well and was very supportive. He only made one threat regarding my T, that he wants to stake him over an anthill and cover him with syrup. But he said it with a smile (and not an evil one, either )

I thought for sure he'd get jealous over the next 3-4 days when I couldn't stop crying and couldn't eat, but he didn't seem to. A few days ago, we were talking about it again, when I was speculating that maybe my T just asked about my transference to entertain himself (I was in a low spot again), and then I said, "Well, he didn't really hurt me, he just hurt my ego." And my husband replied, "I don't know about that. The way you were crying, it sounded like he hurt your heart, too."

He said this without any bitterness or jealousy or anger at all. It was just a simple statement, but it was right on. And I was stunned. I really, really, REALLY don't understand my husband at all. And I don't understand why I don't put HIM on the pedestal.

That's actually one of the main reasons I went into therapy in the first place. Maybe one of these days, I will!

Good night,
SG

My T met with me and my new T this morning. First he said he knew that the transfer was hard, but I shouldn't think of it as being punished or failing or starting over. He gave a recap of our time together, how it started and where it went. It went fine until we got to the transference part. My T said it was obvious to him and to his review team, from the letter I wrote to him and my reactions during the last session, that he has lost all effectiveness as a therapist because I am focusing too much on my relationship with him, instead of on my therapy goals. I tried to explain about how with people who have attachment injuries, looking at the way the patient attaches to the therapist and working it out IS the therapy, and I can eventually apply it to my life - I even tried describing AG's story because she was kind of in the same situation - but they both just kept shaking their heads and said it sounds like I'm reading all kinds of stuff and probably getting confused as to what it means. She said I need to look at why I'm attracted to unavailable men, and he said I need to look at the way I relate to men. Then he got up, shook my hand, said good luck, and left.

For the last half hour she tried to get to know me, but I started crying almost as soon as he was gone. I tried to answer her questions, but after a while I said I really don't want to get started looking at family of origin stuff just yet, I'm feeling really sad about being transferred. She said I could leave if I want and just ponder over that and we could start again next time. I tried to ask her some questions about herself and her background, but she started asking why is that important to me. She asked since I've been studying psychology, what do I think the reason is that I'm attracted to unavailable men. I said that's a really good question but I can't answer it right now. She seemed to get exasperated with me and said she really does want to help me.

They really seem to know what they are talking about, but I'm more confused than ever. I do not want to go back to her, I felt no connection to her at all and she seemed to have no real empathy for how I was feeling about my T. Neither of them are interested in hearing about what I've been reading and how I've been interpreting it. And they sound so sure that I'm mistaken. I'm sorry to sound so negative, and I know you're all going to want to encourage me to keep going, but I simply don't think I have the energy to keep doing this if it only makes things worse. I gave this therapy all I had, I was as honest as I knew how to be, I opened up some really old hurts and risked showing them to my T, and he didn't understand. Maybe I really am misinterpreting everything and even unknowingly misrepresenting it here. Which makes me feel really bad because you've all been so good about responding and sharing your own stories. Thank you for that, and no matter what, I really wish you all the best in your journeys. You're a wonderful group of people with lots of heart.

SG

Hi SG,
May I once again commend you for how well you're handling all this? I really am amazed!

I agree with Summer that I think your T is doing the ethical thing in referring you out if he thinks he's in over his head. BUT I don't like the way that the clinic is leaving you out of the decision making process. I get this feeling that you're being treated like a child. The adults went off and discussed the problem and are now informing you that you're going to a new T without discussing it with you. In my experience therapy is a very collaborative process and I know one of the things I respect and value about my T is that he really is humble in that yes, he brings his experience to the process but he is also very open to my input and assumes that I know myself better and can discern what I need. Therapists who think they don't need to listen to a patient can really miss the things that they need to hear.

On the other hand, I am glad that you're getting clear feedback that no one thought you did anything wrong, since you didn't! I'd really like to know how it goes if you're up to posting about it.

Hi Echo,
I know you asked SG but I thought I'd chime in since my husband has known about my erotic/parental transference from the beginning. I actually went to my T and told him about the attraction when my husband and I were going for couples counseling (he was my husbands' T first) and before I was working with him individually. After I told my T, I realized that it would be very uncomfortable being in a session with both of them, knowing that my T and I both knew how I felt and my husband didn't. Since we were working on communication and intimacy problems this seemed especially problematic. So the next morning I told my husband how I was feeling and that I had talked to our T and at our next couples session we all discussed it. My husband has been really great about it and I have been pretty open with him, although I must admit to not being completely open about the intensity of the longings. But part of what has made it easier to handle is that by being so open from the very beginning, my husband and I have both felt very confident that I am "safe" and nothing will happen. Now my husband does have the advantage of both knowing and trusting my T and the fact that we occasionally discuss it really helps. I must say that it's made it much easier to deal with because I haven't had to hide it when I've been upset.

AG

That sounds really disheartening. I don't think you've been misinterpreting, it sounds like you've got a pretty clear idea about the stuff that is discussed here.

I don't think that the question "why are you attracted to unavailable men" is even relevant for this situation. It's almost inevitable that you will be attracted to them in some way. Here's a person who is spending time listening intently to every word you say, being compassionate and non-judgmental.


The sorts of relationships you create, you do it with your therapist too. The therapeutic relationship is so important. I think my T and I discuss things about our relationship probably 60% of the time we are talking. If you can't connect with this new therapist either, can you try and find another?

SG,
I must have been posting my last reply at the same time you were posting yours. You are NOT imagining things. Heather said 60% of the time, I'm probably closer to 90% of the time. Now the discussions about the relationship usually lead me to identify things or beliefs from my past but it through the relationship that these things are displayed so we can look at them. The relationship is the medium in which we do our work.

Is there anywhere else close enough to your home where you can get therapy? The problem isn't with you, it's with the idiots at this clinic. How dare they presume to tell you how you're feeling!! or what it means!! Their job is to LISTEN to you so that they can discern YOUR patterns and help YOU understand them so you can changet what YOU want to. Not decided what the optimal life is and tell you what to feel and how to lead it. Forgive how strongly this is worded (and trust me I am behaving and not using a lot of the words I'd like to) but I do not like the way you're being treated. I find it scary actually that these people are therapists. I mean, for a therapist not to recognize that ending a theraputic relationship would need some time and processing is reprehensible. My husband and I were going to my T for couples counseling when my first T told me she was retiring (in six months time, btw so we would have time to process it) and I'll never forget his reaction when I told him. He was really concerned, said what a major and difficult change this would be and wanted to know how I was feeling. And he continued to bring it up throughout the time I was terminating and after.

I'm so sorry, SG, you're working so hard and I believe, doing everything you should, and being treated so badly. You deserve so much more and I'm sorry that you're going through this.

AG

quote:

They really seem to know what they are talking about

I beg to differ in the strongest possible terms.

Hi SG... it's good to see you here posting again. I've been thinking about you and wondering how you are doing. I'm sorry you have had such bad experiences with Ts disappointing you and yes, throwing you under the bus. Therapy is supposed to be healing.

Please do not put any blame onto yourself. You said it... the patient should be able to express any and all feelings and to talk about what they choose. The T's job is to contain the feelings and help the patient sort through the feelings. Your T was inept in handling transference and he was also getting off on your feelings for him. Whether or not he had any feelings should have been irrelevant. Your needs were important and not his. He just didn't get that it was NOT about him. And I think he liked making the others on the team feel that it was about him and he was just too irresistable for you to continue therapy. He was just out of his depth and the fact that you were informed and understood about what was happening was more than he could deal with.

I think you are handling things very well. You were thirsty for getting your needs met.. the ones that were never met in childhood. You were discovering you had the capacity to have an intimate therapeutic relationship...and to form an attachment. Of course it felt good... you had been missing this in your life. If you were freezing outside in the winter cold and someone opened their door and said "come in and sit by my fire to warm up and have some hot chocolate" it would feel good too. Should you feel guilty about that? Or ashamed that you would rather be inside instead of out in the freezing cold? No. Well it's the same thing. So please just put away the blame and the shame over what happened.

I know you feel an urgency to finish what was started and you really do need a competent T to help undo the damage caused by your ex-T. The fact that you feel close to solving what has plagued you for so long is a good thing. Would it be possible to find a T in private practice... someone who is not connected with a clinic? Could you ask your medical doctor for some referrals?

Please keep posting and let us know how things are going for you. Let me know if I can be of any help.

TN

Hi everyone,

I deleted the last couple of posts because having that anger sitting out there really bothered me. It may be understandable to feel it, and express it within the containment of therapy, but I couldn't shake the feeling that it was just too toxic to put up here. So I deleted them. But I still want to thank you for your ongoing understanding and encouragement.

I called a couple of places today that look promising. Both of them say they treat trauma-related issues as well as marriage and family issues.

One of them is a private practice an hour away from where I live, but in the opposite direction from where I was going. There is just one therapist but he's got over 20 years experience. He also claims to integrate faith with psychology (his education includes a Masters in "Divinity" ) and that interests me for personal reasons (understanding not everyone is looking for that, of course). They just called back and I made an appointment for next Tuesday morning.

The other one is also a private practice that, unfortunately, is kitty-corner across the street from where I was going. There are two therapists there, a man and a woman, both with over 20 years experience. The reason I'm interested in that one is because they also do hypnotherapy. I'm wondering if that might help me resolve some of this longing for what I didn't get as a child.

From what I've been reading in books and on this board, I believe that this is what is behind the longing for the old BF. Running into him triggered a longing so strong that it can't possibly be just about him. And unless one of us moves, in a couple of years I'll be running in to him regularly because our kids will be going to the same school. I want to have worked through my whatever my issue is, and make my marriage strong, so that it won't trigger that longing again. That's why I'm being so stubborn about getting to the bottom of this.

Thank you for helping me get through the past few weeks, and for taking the time to give me your support and encouragement. I will keep posting to let you know how it goes. And I look forward to continuing to get to know all of you.

Take care,
SG

TN and Summer,

I also loved the fire/hot chocolate analogy. That's exactly what talking and laughing with him felt like, for while, anyway. I miss him.

Thank you both for reminding me not to dwell on shaming or blaming. It doesn't help anything, does it? Reminds me of a movie quote:

"I never look back, dahling. It detracts from the Now." - Edna, in The Incredibles (referring to Mr. Incredible's old super suit)

I need to remember this.

strummergirl

Hi SG... I just wanted to say sorry that I was MIA from the Board this week. With family, work and school things have been busy. Also had a really gut wrenching therapy session on Monday. Oh, my T was wonderful as usual... it was just the subject matter that was tough.

I am really happy to hear that you have two potential Ts lined up to meet with. Take your time deciding and maybe go in with a list of questions written down so that you don't get nervous and forget what you wanted to ask about. Look around their office, ask about policy and procedures and how they schedule etc. This is about you and how comfortable you feel working with them. You are doing the interviewing not them.

I think you have handled everything very well and I'm really impressed. I'm also happy to see you here on the Board posting again and offering support to others. I do think helping others also helps us. Have you heard anything from your old clinic? Are you also looking for a new couples therapist?

I do know that despite what happened you will still miss your old ex-T. That is only human and don't feel guilty about it at all. I'm sorry if my hot chocolate scenario brought you any painful memories.

Let us know how you are doing and what happens in your interviews with the new Ts. Best wishes on that.

TN

Hi TN...no sorry necessary, but it's always good to hear from you. Your support has been priceless. I would have been lost without you and the encouragement from others on this board. I can't thank you enough, so I'll just say it again: Thank you!!!

Now that school is back in session our days are flying by too. I'm glad to hear you're holding up under some tough therapy and I hope it brings some rewards for all your hard work. Your T sounds pretty amazing.

Thanks for the well-wishes on the T-search. The T who does hypnotherapy is not covered under our insurance so I ruled him out. And thanks for suggesting the list of questions - I've started one already for the other T I'm seeing on Tuesday. I will definitely be much more careful before jumping in again. Depending on how it goes, he'll probably be our couples T, and I'll continue looking for an individual T, probably a woman this time, to work through my feelings about what happened with the ex-T.

I haven't heard anything more from the other clinic and don't really expect to, or want to. I'd just like to learn from what happened and move on. Today I realized that it felt so good to have someone who was paying attention, that I minimized several signs that he was not really tuned in. I mean, there were some really BIG red flags flapping in the breeze. Not that it makes him a bad T...he's actually a very good T, I believe...he just wasn't the right T for me, at least not long term. It helps to go back through the journal I kept because I can see lots of good things he gave me. "Therapy gold." I'm still going to do that project.

As far as how I'm feeling, yesterday I was on another down-turn, and those really suck, but today I'm back up. And every time I come up, it's better than the last time. I think acceptance is starting to settle in, and it's a good thing. And I learned some new things...and relearned some old things on a deeper level...I would go in to more detail, but some of it (actually a lot of it) has to do with my faith, and I'm not sure how much of that I can talk about here without offending. So I'll keep it general for now.

And I loved your hot chocolate analogy. I think I just got a little too close to that fire but no permanent damage done. At least no more than was already there.

I hope you're having a good weekend! Take care...
SG

Thanks, HB! It is so good to hear from you again. Thanks for your comfort and encouragement.

I've been doing a lot of speculating, sorting, writing, trying to figure out what happened. In doing so, I've read a lot more about the different approaches to therapy. He does CBT (cognitive behavioral therapy), and when I read the detailed descriptions, I can see many ways in which he tried to help me, and he did (focusing on how thoughts affect feelings and actions, and challenging those thoughts to bring about changes, is my rough understanding now). As far as the transference goes, I think he was trying to help me with that too, only from a CBT perspective - I think that's called "eclectic", where a therapist pulls from various disciplines to create their own custom approach. However, I was doing all kinds of reading here and elsewhere, from sort of a psychodynamic/attachment theory perspective, and making assumptions that we were going to look much deeper at the transference. When I look at it that way, a lot of the misunderstandings make sense to me now. He was only looking at the transference from a behavioral perspective, where I wanted to get at the unconscious stuff as triggered by my feelings and thoughts about him. But that's not what he does, and I think that's what he was trying to tell me. It would explain why he kept stopping me. And from my perspective, it would also explain why it felt so awful to be stopped, and then transferred. I wish they would at least say they understand.

I would LOVE to be able to get together with my ex-T and couples T one more time (I don't think they'd let me meet with him alone again, but that's okay) to clear things up. That last session was pretty awful and I hate leaving things that way. Not that it would matter to him, but it really matters to me. Maybe if I tell him I understand now what he was trying to say, and I'm sorry for the misunderstanding, we can end on a more positive note.

Anyway that's where we're at...I'll post later and let you all know how the interview goes with the potential new T tomorrow.

Good night
SG

Hi All,

I'm new at the forum. Was reading it for a cople of days now. Came across it when one day I realized that I'm in love or something of that kind with my therapist. Because it freaked me out I started to search the web to find out more and understand. I came across transference and this website amoung others.

I'm just wondering how is it possible that the therapist would not be trained in dealing with transference. It seems so obvious to me that all therpaist should have the skills and knowledge to 'walk this through' with their patients/clients.
I'd appreciate your comments folks.

HB and Echo,

Thanks for your thoughts on CBT, it really helped. And Echo, I love your sticky idea. This experience taught me the importance of asking what "kind" of therapy a T or P practices.

My search for a new T continues. In an online search on Psychology Today, I found a woman therapist who does psychodynamic and relational therapy in the same town I was going to before, but not anywhere near the other clinic. It says she doesn't accept insurance, but she's relatively inexpensive. She's a pre-licensed professional with 5 years of experience. I sent her an email asking for an appointment.

Earlier this week I did something weird, probably because I was feeling desperate to talk to someone. I called our couples T at the other clinic and left a message. I told her my husband wasn't comfortable coming back for couples therapy (he doesn't want to run in to my ex-T after hearing about the transference stuff), and then asked if she would consider switching to individual with me (instead of sending me to that other T). And I made an appointment with her for Thursday.

Now I'm wondering why I did that...part of what I need to process is the feelings for the ex-T, and I won't feel safe talking to her about that, especially after she seemed to sweep them under the rug when it was happening. And running into my ex-T would be very painful no matter whether he said hi or not. I think I'm still hoping for one more chance at being understood, wanting them not to think I'm a pain-in-the-rear patient. Because if I can get her to understand where I was coming from, then maybe she can make him understand, and maybe we could have a termination "do-over" where my T acts a bit more compassionate, like he really is terminating me for my own good, and not because he can't wait to get rid of me.

Okay, now I know I'm dreaming...I guess I'm still processing some of that hurt. The inequality of the therapeutic relationship is so disorienting. I want to say, I don't understand how a T can be so cold about a termination. But then, I remember that this relationship was never even remotely as important to him as it was to me. Somewhere along the line I managed to forget about that, maybe because he's such a good actor (he can change character and imitate someone at the drop of a hat. It's kind of spooky). This opened me up to be hurt. And I just knew that would happen.

I'll cancel that appointment with the couples T. No matter how I look at it, going back to that clinic just sets me up to "hold things in" and will cause more pain. If I'm just going back to try to win the T's approval then I'm going back for the wrong reason, right? Right.

Moving on.
Good night,
SG

Hi Summer,

Thank you for sharing this with me...it helps more than I could say. But I'm sorry for the reason, that you went through something similar. Abrupt termination hurts so much. I'm glad you've been able to work through it and find healing in other ways. You are a very strong woman and an inspiration to me. I'm grateful for your example to follow and for your encouragement.

The couples T and I have been playing phone tag. She called yesterday afternoon as I was driving, a few minutes before her next appointment. I said I'd call her right back as soon as I pulled over, but by that time it was too late. But it kicked off thoughts of the old T again, and so I had another hard night last night wishing I could talk to my ex-T again and set everything "right". The ironic thing is that this is the reason I went to him in the first place, because of wanting to set everything "right" with the old BF. And my T knew that.

I keep wondering, how could he do this to me when he knew I was trying so hard. I can't tell whether his feelings were over-involved, or under-involved. In a fairly recent session, I showed him a rather graphic picture of this place I'm in when I'm scared of being rejected and abandoned. The picture is of a naked woman curled up on a bed in what looks like a small concrete basement. On the wall she's written the words Fear, Anger, Abandonment, Despair. There are a few other details that make it quite disturbing but I wanted him to have a good idea of the fear I was feeling in between sessions. He said what struck him about the picture was the vulnerability symbolized by her nakedness, and the grayness and bleakness of the room. So I thought he understood.

He also asked me to describe what it's like in that room. I wasn't feeling that way right then, so I asked if I could call him and ask for an extra appointment next time I was feeling that way. He said yes, he would have no problem with that, and then reassured me (again) that I don't have to worry so much about boundaries, that if I bump into one, we'll work together on straightening it out, that we're a team, and we're in the same boat. But obviously that boat sunk.

There was such a push-pull feeling to our therapy relationship once my husband wasn't in the room with us anymore. On the one hand, my T encouraged me repeatedly to talk more, to open up more (the "pull"). On the other hand, I couldn't shake the feeling that he was afraid of me and really wanted to get rid of me. On the few occasions when I was ready to "tell all", he seemed to sense this and would shut me down (the "push). And throughout it all I felt a strong sexual tension in the room. I don't know if it was coming from just me or if it was both of us. At one point I thought maybe I was feeling that way because the therapeutic setup is one where I'm psychologically "naked" and he's not. It made me think of that scene in "Titanic" where Rose is naked on the couch and Jack is sketching her. She's vulnerable, but instead of taking advantage of her vulnerability, Jack draws a picture of what he sees and hands it back to her. Maybe this sounds corny but I thought it was a perfect metaphor of how therapy should go, and I wanted so much to believe and trust that this is what would happen in our therapy sessions. But then, sometimes the way he'd ask questions almost felt like he was trying to make me take more off (the "pull" again). I'm sorry if I'm being too graphic here but I don't know how else to say it. This was one of the things I wanted to talk to him about and I was hoping he'd understand but now I can't.

I also keep hoping that he will "realize" how much this hurt me, and invite me back for one more session so we can wrap things up in a more positive way. You've mentioned that hope before, and it always comes to mind as a wake-up call for me, that I'm probably not going to get it. Sometimes I think, what would be the harm in telling me how he "really" felt at this point? He won't be my T anymore, so why not just tell me what happened on his end, so I'm not left with all these questions? Is it because he's written me off as being too much trouble? Or is it because he really cares? And why is it so important to me that he really cares? Is that a sign that I became too dependent on him?

As you can see I'm still really struggling with this. I've been hesitant to post any more about it because I don't want to keep repeating myself. I really do want to move on. Thank you so much for your support. I've received so much on this board in the way of understanding and encouragement, it's incredible. Sometimes I think I'm receiving more therapy here than I did in therapy. At any rate I'm more grateful for it than I can possibly say.

I have an appointment on Wednesday with a female T who does psychodynamic and relational therapy. She is a pre-licensed professional with only 5 years of experience, but so far she is the closest match I've been able to find for the kind of therapy I'm looking for. So why not try? I'm looking forward to meeting her.

Take care,
SG

SG... I just wanted to make a quick comment here. The picture you described that you showed your ex-T to try to explain how you felt at times...it sounds like the place I got to when I feel that way which is what I call my "black hole". I have discussed this on numerous ocassions with my T. My feelings circle around self-hate, shame, fear, disgust, and hopelessness. To my amazement when doing attachment research I came across a trauma expert, Bessel van der Kolk who describes the "black hole" feeling in his research. If I remember correctly it was in an article on this website with a lot of attachment/trauma articles. It's Diana Fosha's site for AEDP therapy. You may want to check it out...

http://www.aedpinstitute.com/articles.html

TN

TN,

Thank you so much for that link to the AEDP (Accelerated Experiential-Dynamic Psychotherapy) website. Among other things, now I have the official "term" for the kind of therapy I thought we were doing. I'm meeting with the couples T one last time on Thursday for closure's sake (if I don't chicken out first) and this is one of the references I'm going to leave with her. I know I can't change the way they do therapy - and I'm not trying to - but the comments made at that transfer session indicated that the reason I was transferred is because I was pursuing a romantic relationship with my T. At least if I give her a list of references she'll know I really was trying to do therapy. Then I'll just have to let it go.

HB,

Thank you for reassuring me that wanting him to care, and feeling some sexual tension, were normal responses to the intimacy of the therapy relationship. It helps to know that.

quote:

It is often that point that is so unbearable for us and we literally go mad with wanting to know. But if you hear someone else's answer you lose this incredible opportunity to start hearing your own voice and trusting your own feelings. I am not sure if i am capturing the essence of what i am trying to say here, but when you can care irrespective of how the person you care about feels about you, i think you have touched a whole new way of living in the world.

You captured this difficult point beautifully. It's much easier to care about someone when I know they care about me, so it's possible that my caring about them is a reaction to their caring...but if I choose to care without knowing, then it must be coming from within me, and that means I'm free to care without depending on something outside of myself.

Nah...you still said it better . Thank you, HB.

Overall, I think I'm meandering in this general direction, but with setbacks when I start to care too much about how he really felt. But it seems cyclical and the setbacks are getting smaller (I think). When I'm sure I've let it go (probably after working through it with the new T), I want to send him a letter telling him all the things I learned from him and thanking him without any kind of blaming or complaining. I also really want to continue the "therapy gold" project, which has sparked an interest in wood-burning and woodcarving. And I'm excited about that.

SG

Hi SG,
I don't have a lot to add to the discussion because you are getting fantastic insight from many wise women, but I did want you to know that I am reading and that you are often in my thoughts and prayers. And far from posting too much, I think it's a very generous thing you're doing in coming and talking about what you're going through there. There are so many people who read here and you have no idea how you're experience is resonating with them. And I know that you are struggling with feeling overwhelmed and like you're not handling this well, but please know you're doing beautifully. You are displaying an incredible grace and strength as you face this. I am so glad to see that you are looking for a new therapist and not giving up on your healing because of what happened.

Summer,
Would you allow me to tell you that it has been amazing and humbling to watch how you've grown since you started posting on this site? You're courage in facing your feelings and understanding yourself after your sudden termination are an inspiration. And so is watching you reach out and use your experience to help someone else facing the same problem.

AG

SG, I'm very happy if the link to the AEDP website was helpful to you. I read all of the articles on there and found them interesting and helpful in understanding a lot of what I was feeling in therapy and also in explaining the Dyadic relationship. I printed out many of the articles and read and shared some of them with my T. The one article where it talks about how we change our Ts as we ourselves change really struck a chord in me and when I shared it with my T we talked about how much working with me has changed him (for the better). That made me feel very good. Anyway... I know you need closure to your old clinic relationships and if this helps you I can feel good. The fact that you were interested in looking at the transference in a therapeutic way while they were trying to treat you as if you were pursuing a romantic relationship with your T or that you had a problem with being attracted to unavailable men still leaves me shocked and unsettled at how clueless they are. I just want to add here that I admire your courage and perserverence. You have handled this all so well and I'm glad to see you return to the Board to share your experience and to help others.

TN

Summer... we have had a lot of conversation over these past months but I just want to say that you should write about your experience as much as you need to until you heal. And there is a healing in talking about what happened over again and through many different lenses. I just want to say that it was very gracious of you to send your old P a thank you note with a photo. I'm sure it made him happy to hear from you. I am convinced that he left so suddenly because he had a real illness that prevented him from doing his work as a P. I imagine that for someone doing this work for so many years and caring about his patients it was incredibly hard for him to leave you, especially since he seemed so fond of you. I do believe that he had little choice in the matter.

Your voice here has been helpful to many, so keep sharing.

TN

quote:

you are getting fantastic insight from many wise women

I couldn't agree more, AG I'm so grateful to all the "wise women" of this board, including you. The way I've been feeling, any grace or strength coming through is largely "borrowed" from you all...but hopefully some of it will grow on me eventually Thank you for your reassurance and encouragement, especially with what you are going through right now. I'm always happy to see you posting and like others on the board have said, I miss you, but I know you'll be back stronger than ever. It helps me to know I am in your prayers...please know that you are in mine, too.

SG

Just wanted to say to Summer that I hope your appointment went well. I've gone about trying to meet up with a new T via email (basically because I don't have the confidence to ring up...how silly is that!) and I'm waiting on tenterhooks to get a response. I want it and I don't want it if you know what I mean. I'm still reeling from finishing up (funnily enough the first phrase that came to mind was "breaking up with my T"!) with my T.

And to SG, I want to wish you all the best with your work at the moment. You, as well as many others on this forum are so eloquent and open in sharing your experiences and I, for one, want to say a big thank you to you all. And I think your idea for sending a letter once you have "let go" is a really nice and positive idea

Hi Summer,

Forgive me...maybe you posted this but I can't recall...are you looking for a new P to replace your current T? Or to see concurrently with your T? Are there things that a P addresses that a T doesn't? I'm just asking for my own information - I've never seen a P but I might consider it if I knew more about the difference.

Earlier in this thread you said you hoped this P could help give you more insight into what happened with your ex-P.

quote:

"I knew him professionally but I was VERY surprised to hear what happened."

It certainly sounds like she could give you more insight into what happened. I'm wondering if she said this because she assumed you already knew. It would be a strange thing to say if she thought you didn't...in fact, it sounds like she might have been inviting you to talk about it. But now you are left hanging, again.

I'm sure it's really hard for you to decide what to do next. You could walk away, or you could go back and ask for more information. I can really feel your discouragement in how you said this:

quote:

I think it's time for me to find ways on my own to deal with it.

Would it be possible, and more helpful, to find a P who doesn't know your ex-P? If he had over 50 years experience (wow!) then I suppose it would be near impossible to find someone who doesn't.

I wish your T could be more help to you. I'm sorry this didn't go as well as you'd hoped. (((((Summer)))))

SG

Hi Summer.

it's interesting to hear about your relationships with your current P and T and how they vary from that of your ex-P. I think that is the main problem with close relationships with T/Ps-that it is so hard for others to measure up to them afterward. It can also be the case that what works for you was more in line with the way your ex-P worked than your current one. But I'm thinking it might be good to try out something new for a change, and it doesn't seem as if the current T is totally refusing the idea of renewing your prescription. Though I do get your frustration with the money issue. Recently I was ill and between that and getting my antidepressants updated I had to go to the doctor's 3 times in one week along with the cost of all the meds! Not fun. Or cheap!

I hope you can find the right balance. I have only every worked with counselors and recently, when my doctor was prescribing meds she asked me if I had ever been to a psychiatrist. Embarrassingly I barely knew the difference. So after googling it (the source of all info!) I see that a P is someone who can prescribe meds also. Though I'm still unsure about the difference between a T and a counsellor.

Good luck with the exercise anyway and let us know how you are getting on.

CL