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Wow, Echo! That is great news! It must have felt so good to be validated like this, and to know you can go forward from here. I'm really happy for you. And who knows how many other of his (present and future) patients you've helped by speaking out and influencing him to learn how to handle transference issues. Good job! 
SG
SG
Hi Echo,
That's awesome! It was very brave of you to speak up like that and I'm very impressed that your T did the work he needed to do to be able to help you heal. The fact that he was willing to admit to you that he felt like he messed up and that he values you as a patient because you challenge him are much more important qualities then what he knows about any one subject or problem. The relationship is solid and that is the most important part.
And I don't think you need to worry about him reading here. The similarities spring from the fact that he's telling the truth! So no worries! Although I'm flattered that you think I would be quotable.
AG
That's awesome! It was very brave of you to speak up like that and I'm very impressed that your T did the work he needed to do to be able to help you heal. The fact that he was willing to admit to you that he felt like he messed up and that he values you as a patient because you challenge him are much more important qualities then what he knows about any one subject or problem. The relationship is solid and that is the most important part.
And I don't think you need to worry about him reading here. The similarities spring from the fact that he's telling the truth! So no worries! Although I'm flattered that you think I would be quotable.
AG
Echo, thanks for updating us and sharing your good news! I think you are awesome for being strong enough to speak your mind to your T, all 3 times! It is reassuring that he was willing to take your criticism non-defensively and learn from it, because now you know it is also safe to be honest with him in the future. And now you've helped him to not only better help you, but others as well. Good for you!!!
Good for you!!!
Hi echo
Best of luck with your new beggining with your T! It's good that things are taking better shape and you don't have be in pain and try to get him out of your head.
What happens next? I suppose that next the therapy takes on life of its own. I think things are getting more interesting next. Well, if living through your emotions and crying your eyes out (that's what I do) can be called interesting.
Anyway, good luck with your sessions. Keep posting with what happens next, cause I'm also kind of curious (if you don't mind)
Best of luck with your new beggining with your T! It's good that things are taking better shape and you don't have be in pain and try to get him out of your head.
What happens next? I suppose that next the therapy takes on life of its own. I think things are getting more interesting next. Well, if living through your emotions and crying your eyes out (that's what I do) can be called interesting.
Anyway, good luck with your sessions. Keep posting with what happens next, cause I'm also kind of curious (if you don't mind)
Sorry Echo, I have been quite all over the shop recently and have missed out on posting here.
I'm so so happy for you and I am in utter awe of your bravery. It was so much more than I could do. Please keep us updated on how it goes but you've probably taught your T a lot through your strength and I hope he can continue learning from you and you him.
I'm so so happy for you and I am in utter awe of your bravery. It was so much more than I could do. Please keep us updated on how it goes but you've probably taught your T a lot through your strength and I hope he can continue learning from you and you him.
HB... welcome back. You have been missed! Hope all is well with you and you are all settled in again.
Echo...I'm glad you vented here because we do understand exactly how you are feeling. My T and I have so much in common and we have some wonderful conversations and I am so drawn to him. Now, that is not to say the he self-discloses to me, unless it's strictly related to my therapy and my benefit but I do know a lot about him. I am eternally frustrated that I did not meet him somewhere else in life, while in school, or at a cafe, or even the grocery store... but I didn't. And I often wonder if I had met him in those venues...would I have been so attracted to him? He is not my usual type that I fall for and so I have to think some of this is because of therapy. Because of the very intimate nature of therapy and of my being safe enough with him to tell him things I have never told anyone. And because I am his sole focus for those hours it makes everything, all my emotions and feelings, much more intense. I often wish we could be together in some alternate world so that it would not hurt anyone in this world, or cause him to violate his principles/morals. But alas, this cannot happen. What I try to do is find some peace and acceptance with all of my feelings for him, knowing that what he gives me is so much more than anyone ever has and that the time I DO have with him is very very special. I have his undivided attention. Most times this helps me to accept this situation. The one thing that I cannot accept at this point in therapy, is that one day ... eventually, I will have to leave him and not see him anymore. And that right now feels like death.
Don't know if I helped you but I think just writing and talking about it does make you feel somewhat better. There really is no magic answer. If there was, someone on here would know about it.
Hang in there.
TN
Echo...I'm glad you vented here because we do understand exactly how you are feeling. My T and I have so much in common and we have some wonderful conversations and I am so drawn to him. Now, that is not to say the he self-discloses to me, unless it's strictly related to my therapy and my benefit but I do know a lot about him. I am eternally frustrated that I did not meet him somewhere else in life, while in school, or at a cafe, or even the grocery store... but I didn't. And I often wonder if I had met him in those venues...would I have been so attracted to him? He is not my usual type that I fall for and so I have to think some of this is because of therapy. Because of the very intimate nature of therapy and of my being safe enough with him to tell him things I have never told anyone. And because I am his sole focus for those hours it makes everything, all my emotions and feelings, much more intense. I often wish we could be together in some alternate world so that it would not hurt anyone in this world, or cause him to violate his principles/morals. But alas, this cannot happen. What I try to do is find some peace and acceptance with all of my feelings for him, knowing that what he gives me is so much more than anyone ever has and that the time I DO have with him is very very special. I have his undivided attention. Most times this helps me to accept this situation. The one thing that I cannot accept at this point in therapy, is that one day ... eventually, I will have to leave him and not see him anymore. And that right now feels like death.
Don't know if I helped you but I think just writing and talking about it does make you feel somewhat better. There really is no magic answer. If there was, someone on here would know about it.
Hang in there.
TN
Hi Echo... I'm so glad that your session went well and that you wrote things down and shared them with your T! That is a huge step and you should be very proud of yourself. Most of us have those same feelings. I'm always telling my T that I know that he's sick of me, that I'm his "impossible" patient, that he wishes I could just go away, that I'm too much trouble etc. He just smiles at me and tells me that I'm very good at deciding for him how he feels LOL! And, of course, he assures me that none of this is true.
Those of us with disorganized attachment are always looking for ways and reasons to run from our Ts while at the same time longing for intimacy and closeness. This comes from having an abusive background where we cannot turn to our attachment figures because these are the very people who frighten us or appear frightened by our needs and so as children we run from them while at the same time needing them to survive. It's a horrible bind to be in and we take this into our therapy relationship with a T who becomes our attachment figure. Of course these behaviors are not necessary or productive in therapy but that is not so easy to change. I'm always looking for reasons to run away from my T and it happens when I feel like we are really getting closer or getting closer to some trauma from the past.
But each time I stay and face things and we talk about my impulses to run it gets a tiny bit easier for the next time. And in receiving a totally different reaction from my T than the one I got as a child helps to change those old tapes that are looping constantly in my head.
And you are definitely on the right track with your T. Good for you.
TN
Those of us with disorganized attachment are always looking for ways and reasons to run from our Ts while at the same time longing for intimacy and closeness. This comes from having an abusive background where we cannot turn to our attachment figures because these are the very people who frighten us or appear frightened by our needs and so as children we run from them while at the same time needing them to survive. It's a horrible bind to be in and we take this into our therapy relationship with a T who becomes our attachment figure. Of course these behaviors are not necessary or productive in therapy but that is not so easy to change. I'm always looking for reasons to run away from my T and it happens when I feel like we are really getting closer or getting closer to some trauma from the past.
But each time I stay and face things and we talk about my impulses to run it gets a tiny bit easier for the next time. And in receiving a totally different reaction from my T than the one I got as a child helps to change those old tapes that are looping constantly in my head.
And you are definitely on the right track with your T. Good for you.
TN
Hi Echo,
I'm glad things are going a lot better for you...it's so nice to hear. I really hope it continues.
As for the father/transference issue...been there, done that, got the tshirt! It's an ongoing issue and it drives me mad too as I do see the connection emotionally but it's too hard to look at it. Plus the confusion of sexual attraction with childhood needs is just so hard to understand. I wish I could be left to my fantasies too.
Best of luck anyway and keep us updated
Mrs. P
I'm glad things are going a lot better for you...it's so nice to hear. I really hope it continues.
As for the father/transference issue...been there, done that, got the tshirt! It's an ongoing issue and it drives me mad too as I do see the connection emotionally but it's too hard to look at it. Plus the confusion of sexual attraction with childhood needs is just so hard to understand. I wish I could be left to my fantasies too.
Best of luck anyway and keep us updated
Mrs. P
Echo, I'm going to preface my remarks with the warning that you should take what I post next with a grain of salt since I am apparently quite delusional lately. But my suspicious mind would tell me that you didn't do anything wrong and it was your P who wasn't completely present for you. He started out the session looking like he'd been weeping. Maybe he had a difficult time pulling himself out of that emotion to really focus on you. That might also explain why he was just parroting you. Just one possible explanation, anyway. Hey, they're human too, unfortunately. You just might not have gotten your money's worth this session.
Hi Echo... sorry I haven't been around much lately, trying to work on some of my own issues with my T. But here are some of my thoughts about your session.
Men, in general, feel like they always have to "solve" our problems. They seem to believe that we are looking for specific solutions when what we really need is understanding, comfort, support and an empathic ear. We need to be heard and we need to feel that they hear us. Your T seemed to be upset about something before you arrived (you said he looked like he'd been crying) so I doubt this had anything to do with your behavior. Perhaps he was feeling inadequate to help you in the way he wants to. I know my T struggles with this because he is not used to dealing with trauma patients and at times I know he is at a loss of what to do for me or how to help me through something. What I find is that when he is just being himself (empathic, caring, kind, funny) that is all I need to help me. But I know he feels like he should be doing something more and that's when things between us break down. He starts moving around and trying things that make me feel like I'm in session with someone I don't even know! I keep reminding him that I need him to stay still while "I" move around (within the therapy) so that I can depend on him to be there and be consistent when I need him.
And I, too, have experienced those session that just seem to be "off" in some way. As if we are misattuned or disconnected somehow. This has always been temporary for me. But if it happens again or if you feel that he is not being attuned to your needs then you should talk to him about it and explain how you feel if you can.
I will tell you though that I offer a lot of feedback to my T... mostly because I know that he feels some frustration at not being more helpful to me. So I tell him what works, what I like and how I feel when he does certain things and what I need to feel better. Our relationship is quite collaborative. I bring him books and articles and we discuss them. I know it's supposed to be all about me and it is... just in a different way.
If your T is not experienced in treating patients with your specific issues, he may be feeling uncertain as to how to proceed and if he's a good, ethical and caring T he may be quite worried about inadvertently hurting you or causing you harm in some way and that's why he wants you to tell him what works for you.
I see this as being about him just having an off day and I'm pretty sure your next session will go differently. We all have our insecure moments because we are human and I think he was just having one of those days.
TN
Men, in general, feel like they always have to "solve" our problems. They seem to believe that we are looking for specific solutions when what we really need is understanding, comfort, support and an empathic ear. We need to be heard and we need to feel that they hear us. Your T seemed to be upset about something before you arrived (you said he looked like he'd been crying) so I doubt this had anything to do with your behavior. Perhaps he was feeling inadequate to help you in the way he wants to. I know my T struggles with this because he is not used to dealing with trauma patients and at times I know he is at a loss of what to do for me or how to help me through something. What I find is that when he is just being himself (empathic, caring, kind, funny) that is all I need to help me. But I know he feels like he should be doing something more and that's when things between us break down. He starts moving around and trying things that make me feel like I'm in session with someone I don't even know! I keep reminding him that I need him to stay still while "I" move around (within the therapy) so that I can depend on him to be there and be consistent when I need him.
And I, too, have experienced those session that just seem to be "off" in some way. As if we are misattuned or disconnected somehow. This has always been temporary for me. But if it happens again or if you feel that he is not being attuned to your needs then you should talk to him about it and explain how you feel if you can.
I will tell you though that I offer a lot of feedback to my T... mostly because I know that he feels some frustration at not being more helpful to me. So I tell him what works, what I like and how I feel when he does certain things and what I need to feel better. Our relationship is quite collaborative. I bring him books and articles and we discuss them. I know it's supposed to be all about me and it is... just in a different way.
If your T is not experienced in treating patients with your specific issues, he may be feeling uncertain as to how to proceed and if he's a good, ethical and caring T he may be quite worried about inadvertently hurting you or causing you harm in some way and that's why he wants you to tell him what works for you.
I see this as being about him just having an off day and I'm pretty sure your next session will go differently. We all have our insecure moments because we are human and I think he was just having one of those days.
TN
Echo, just wanted to say that aside from the stuff with your T - I'm really sorry about what you are going through with your husband. It sounds awful - and like a serious 'issue'. I'm also sorry that your T didn't focus on it more, or help you to focus on it more (if that is deep down what you needed). I think if that was going on for me and my T wanted a whole lot of feedback about the session or her methods, I'd be p'ed off.
here's the thing, though... if what I was originally trying to deal with was an issue that I would rather 'switch off' on (and what you describe with your husband WOULD be for me), I'd probably let the distracting happen or encourage it (yup, for sure!). And then end up thinking about that a lot instead of thinking about the issue.
I really apologise if that's not what's going on with you - it may not be at all. But if it is, well, I hear you, and I am sorry that you are in the kind of pain that makes you want to avoid.
I don't have an experience of 'erotic transference' with a therapist myself. But unfortunately I have lots of experience with erotic transference with other people in my life. It is really closely connected to my desire to avoid and numb out things that are hurting me. Desire works great that way!! I can just conjure up an image and it floods me with lovely endorphins. Or nut away at the problems of this lovely endorphin-filled 'other' relationship. All-consuming, but meanwhile, the other problems....
Take care.
J
here's the thing, though... if what I was originally trying to deal with was an issue that I would rather 'switch off' on (and what you describe with your husband WOULD be for me), I'd probably let the distracting happen or encourage it (yup, for sure!). And then end up thinking about that a lot instead of thinking about the issue.
I really apologise if that's not what's going on with you - it may not be at all. But if it is, well, I hear you, and I am sorry that you are in the kind of pain that makes you want to avoid.
I don't have an experience of 'erotic transference' with a therapist myself. But unfortunately I have lots of experience with erotic transference with other people in my life. It is really closely connected to my desire to avoid and numb out things that are hurting me. Desire works great that way!! I can just conjure up an image and it floods me with lovely endorphins. Or nut away at the problems of this lovely endorphin-filled 'other' relationship. All-consuming, but meanwhile, the other problems....
Take care.
J
Echo in answer to your question....I never give him feedback in the same session. I'm too activated to even think straight usually! I will typically give him feedback in the next session, or some session later. I may give it to him via an email as well. For what it's worth, my T has no experience either with the erotic transference issue and we had a major disruption when I tried to tell him some of my feelings. I think he got scared and felt totally out of his element and became very defensive. I confronted him on it and we worked it out ... although it took time. It's not resolved by any means and I still have not told him the depth of my feelings for him but for now I think he's more comfortable chalking it up to "parental" feelings and my attachment issue and not as a love/erotic transference. So for now I'm going with that while I work on other issues.
If I were you I'd tell him that I would be able to email my thoughts/feedback to him once you had time to process what happened in the session. Immediate feedback is pretty hard to give in a therapy situation.
TN
If I were you I'd tell him that I would be able to email my thoughts/feedback to him once you had time to process what happened in the session. Immediate feedback is pretty hard to give in a therapy situation.
TN
Hi Echo,
On the one hand I'm so sorry that you are feeling so awful. On the other hand it sounds like the things you are recognizing in yourself are just so valuable.
This
and this
seem like they are powerful recognitions. They make me wonder - what would you do or say if you weren't worried about what he thinks of you? If you could be truly yourself?
I also wonder if transferring to someone else is what you feel is right for you? And if it is, does the impetus need to come from him? You seem to have a really clear idea of what is going on in the therapy, and it seems like you have felt several steps ahead of him at a few points. You seem to me to be right on the money with the "misconstruing" issue, and that makes me wonder if you are getting as much value as you could from this relationship.
I've been in therapy before where I felt like I was running rings around my T (she just didn't seem to GET the significance of stuff). In a way it was kind of useful still - just to be able to talk and let off steam. Now I think at a deeper level it reinforced my feeling that no one else can help me, I have to do everything myself.
I wonder what would have happened if I had had someone beside me who was really able to guide ME at that time, rather than me having to second guess everything & get it all right. I feel more like I have that now, and it feels much more healing.
Anyway, again I hope I'm not too far off on a tangent in relation to what you're saying. Ultimately I want to say you are worth a really strong, robust therapeutic relationship, especially when you are going through such heavy stuff. I hope that IF it's not available from your current P, that you will seek it out elsewhere.
J
ps I really hope you start feeling better soon.
On the one hand I'm so sorry that you are feeling so awful. On the other hand it sounds like the things you are recognizing in yourself are just so valuable.
This
quote:But now I know that it is me trying to do everything right for another person, thinking I can somehow make them love me if only I'm good enough...
and this
quote:Some of it is great material and has been rubbing off on me, but as long as I'm worrying about what he thinks of me, I'm never going to be honest about who I really am and I'm never going to get anywhere with this.
seem like they are powerful recognitions. They make me wonder - what would you do or say if you weren't worried about what he thinks of you? If you could be truly yourself?
I also wonder if transferring to someone else is what you feel is right for you? And if it is, does the impetus need to come from him? You seem to have a really clear idea of what is going on in the therapy, and it seems like you have felt several steps ahead of him at a few points. You seem to me to be right on the money with the "misconstruing" issue, and that makes me wonder if you are getting as much value as you could from this relationship.
I've been in therapy before where I felt like I was running rings around my T (she just didn't seem to GET the significance of stuff). In a way it was kind of useful still - just to be able to talk and let off steam. Now I think at a deeper level it reinforced my feeling that no one else can help me, I have to do everything myself.
I wonder what would have happened if I had had someone beside me who was really able to guide ME at that time, rather than me having to second guess everything & get it all right. I feel more like I have that now, and it feels much more healing.
Anyway, again I hope I'm not too far off on a tangent in relation to what you're saying. Ultimately I want to say you are worth a really strong, robust therapeutic relationship, especially when you are going through such heavy stuff. I hope that IF it's not available from your current P, that you will seek it out elsewhere.
J
ps I really hope you start feeling better soon.
echo, is it possible that you are feeling that way because you can't really bring your feelings to the session?
I understand that he didn't want to leave you alone after things between you and him got a bit more complicated than any of you expected. I understand that you are trying to get on with the therapy despite the "complication" but your therapy apparently is not about what happened between you and your T? It's has it's own agenda that you were going/hoping to complete.
Is it possible that it is so difficult now because you can't tell how you feel and what you would want from him, because it is/it seems not appropriate? You know that you can't go there and tell him how you love him, because you don't know how he will handle it?
I know that it is so hard to talk about love (transference, whatever) that is in general (or is supposed to be) one-sided. I'm still struggling a lot with it. Today I was rather staying not too close to my feelings. But to experience the acceptance of these feelings does change the shape of things. I know if I had to hide my feelings during the therapy I would feel humiliated and worthless, and wouldn't know what to do, to do things right.
I hope you won't give up completely on therapy, but will seek for somebody that can put things straight.
By the way, knowing that I may not express myself gently enough, I hope you don't find my reply upsetting.
Take care...
I understand that he didn't want to leave you alone after things between you and him got a bit more complicated than any of you expected. I understand that you are trying to get on with the therapy despite the "complication" but your therapy apparently is not about what happened between you and your T? It's has it's own agenda that you were going/hoping to complete.
Is it possible that it is so difficult now because you can't tell how you feel and what you would want from him, because it is/it seems not appropriate? You know that you can't go there and tell him how you love him, because you don't know how he will handle it?
I know that it is so hard to talk about love (transference, whatever) that is in general (or is supposed to be) one-sided. I'm still struggling a lot with it. Today I was rather staying not too close to my feelings. But to experience the acceptance of these feelings does change the shape of things. I know if I had to hide my feelings during the therapy I would feel humiliated and worthless, and wouldn't know what to do, to do things right.
I hope you won't give up completely on therapy, but will seek for somebody that can put things straight.
By the way, knowing that I may not express myself gently enough, I hope you don't find my reply upsetting.
Take care...
quote:Lastly, I need to figure out how to answer his question, "What do you need from me? How can I help you?" I have no idea on that one, since everything that pops into my head is wildly inappropriate.
Echo, sorry but you made me smile with this statement as I feel the same way so much of the time. It's hard sometimes to sit across from him and focus on my issues while I have this huge, intense love for him surging through my veins. Alas, there is not much choice... boundaries and all!
FWIW, my T also gets all teary at times and we end up passing the tissue box back and forth. I really don't mind it as it just tells me that he has real empathy for me and he HEARS/FEELS what I am telling him. It also tells me he is a sensitive person who cares about people and wants to help. I think if he sat there blankly stone-faced it would upset me way more.
And while I do worry what he thinks of me, for some reason that happens once I LEAVE the session and not while I'm there. Maybe because I am so focused on what I want to say to him and because I trust him more and more. It takes a really long time to develop trust for a person who has had a trauma background. It happens when it is the right time. I just keep testing and testing my T to see if he judges me in any way and I have never found even a smidge of evidence that he does and so I venture telling him more and more.
I know how hard this is but I think you need to give yourself some time. How long have you been seeing him? As for the feedback...just tell him that question really bothers you and you'd prefer if he didn't ask or if you could just email your thoughts to him.
I'm glad that you decided to hang in there with therapy and give it more time.
TN
Hi Echo - mercifully enough for the client population in my region, I am not a therapist. I've just spent enough time obsessively trying to figure out my own issues that I might sound like it occasionally - when I have the benefit of calm reflection on someone else's situation via a messageboard.
I'm glad the PMS has lifted to leave you feeling easier. I ride that hormone train too, and I swear, every month it's like it's never happened before. I think the hormones have some special amnesiac quality that lets me forget that is making everything else worse. But then on the other hand, sometimes that is what's necessary to push me out of avoidance with stuff.
Hope you get your appointment soon!
J
I'm glad the PMS has lifted to leave you feeling easier. I ride that hormone train too, and I swear, every month it's like it's never happened before. I think the hormones have some special amnesiac quality that lets me forget that is making everything else worse. But then on the other hand, sometimes that is what's necessary to push me out of avoidance with stuff.
Hope you get your appointment soon!
J
quote:He's like a big cuddly exorcist.
ROTFLMAO!!!!
Funny...and true. They really do bring out the demons, don't they? You have a delightfully "wicked" sense of humor, Echo. I love it. Although...I am sorry for the reason behind it. That was really inconsiderate of him and I hope you get a chance to tell him how you feel about it when he comes back.
SG
Hi echo -
Just need to preface this with the fact that the holiday season (and a persistently screaming toddler downstairs) are making me really irritable! And when I read about your T messing around the appointment date like this, I feel grumpy!
I certainly hope he's not baiting you. If you get something therapeutic out of learning how to identify and say how you feel about it, then that's awesome, but it's also your hard work in difficult circumstances. It seems to me that if he was trying to set you up like that, that would NOT be therapeutic, but really manipulative. Heaven knows there's enough stuff to react to in therapy without manufactured inconsistencies.
Maybe he just forgot to adjust his mental routine. If so, that seems like an error. Forgivable, but still an error. If my T made that error I would feel misled and abandoned and mad and all kinds of stuff. (Hmm, do you reckon this is triggering my own issues?
).
I don't know, I'm not trying to make you feel worse about it!! I just kind of want to say that you DO have a right to feel mad about it and to expect better from him.
I'm experimenting at the moment with letting my anger power positive stuff (work, laps in the pool etc) & letting it connect me to what is important to me. It's kind of a scary process and I really don't have a handle on it yet - but it's less scary ultimately than some of the insidious ways that it has been creeping out of me when I don't attend to it.
So yeah, I'm really sorry this has happened and that it will be a while before you can sort it out with him, it really does suck. But I hope that if you do feel mad you can go with it in ways that work for you.
Take care,
Jones
Just need to preface this with the fact that the holiday season (and a persistently screaming toddler downstairs) are making me really irritable! And when I read about your T messing around the appointment date like this, I feel grumpy!
quote:Oh well, guess this just sets me up for another opportunity to tell him how I feel about something. Maybe he's baiting me. He knows I hate giving any kind of criticism.
I certainly hope he's not baiting you. If you get something therapeutic out of learning how to identify and say how you feel about it, then that's awesome, but it's also your hard work in difficult circumstances. It seems to me that if he was trying to set you up like that, that would NOT be therapeutic, but really manipulative. Heaven knows there's enough stuff to react to in therapy without manufactured inconsistencies.
Maybe he just forgot to adjust his mental routine. If so, that seems like an error. Forgivable, but still an error. If my T made that error I would feel misled and abandoned and mad and all kinds of stuff. (Hmm, do you reckon this is triggering my own issues?
). I don't know, I'm not trying to make you feel worse about it!! I just kind of want to say that you DO have a right to feel mad about it and to expect better from him.
I'm experimenting at the moment with letting my anger power positive stuff (work, laps in the pool etc) & letting it connect me to what is important to me. It's kind of a scary process and I really don't have a handle on it yet - but it's less scary ultimately than some of the insidious ways that it has been creeping out of me when I don't attend to it.
So yeah, I'm really sorry this has happened and that it will be a while before you can sort it out with him, it really does suck. But I hope that if you do feel mad you can go with it in ways that work for you.
Take care,
Jones
Hi Echo...I'm sorry your T mishandled his holiday absence in the way that he did. He should have given you fair warning and then prepared you for his absence, making sure you were okay. I was so angry with my T when I found out he was going away that I accused him of not wanting to tell me and avoiding the issue because he did not want to deal with the fallout (i.e., my feeling abandoned, hurt, rejected and angry). I told him he couldn't be bothered to deal with my feelings. He denied this chalking it up to "last minute decisions" to leave town. And when I asked him when he was coming back he could not tell me. THAT fills me with confidence. My greatest fear is that he is not coming back for some reason (yes, I know this is irrational) and if he had a return date it would help me feel more secure but nooooo..... he does not have one or won't tell me.
Considering that the Christmas/New Year's holidays are rife with triggers and so many people get depressed during this time it seems like an odd time for all Ts and Ps to chose to go away on vacation. I don't think my T can even find someone to cover for him because every other T is also on vacation!
Sorry I'm just venting here. What I would suggest is that you tell your T about how you felt with finding out he was on vacation when you called to set up an appointment. Tell him you would prefer some notice and time to discuss his absences BEFORE he leaves.
In the meantime, we are at least lucky to have this place to come to and meet together and vent, console and support each other in their absence.
TN
Considering that the Christmas/New Year's holidays are rife with triggers and so many people get depressed during this time it seems like an odd time for all Ts and Ps to chose to go away on vacation. I don't think my T can even find someone to cover for him because every other T is also on vacation!
Sorry I'm just venting here. What I would suggest is that you tell your T about how you felt with finding out he was on vacation when you called to set up an appointment. Tell him you would prefer some notice and time to discuss his absences BEFORE he leaves.
In the meantime, we are at least lucky to have this place to come to and meet together and vent, console and support each other in their absence.
TN
TN,
I wholeheartedly agree. And TN, I think it's awful that your own T has not given you a return date! What is WRONG with these people?!
It feels DIFFERENT when these "details" are taken care of. It feels like the T understands what you have on the line in therapy. We all deserve that.
Crotchety Jones.
quote:He should have given you fair warning and then prepared you for his absence, making sure you were okay.
I wholeheartedly agree. And TN, I think it's awful that your own T has not given you a return date! What is WRONG with these people?!
It feels DIFFERENT when these "details" are taken care of. It feels like the T understands what you have on the line in therapy. We all deserve that.
Crotchety Jones.
quote:Here's a funny observation my friend made to me: He is my "rebound man". I'm working out all my messed up relationship issues on him. He's like a big cuddly exorcist. LOL.
I understand that how the bloody thing works(the therapy), doesn't it?
I see/think of all the men I ever loved, starting from my father, ending with my exboyfriend. All these men and feelings haunt me so there is my T-exorcit. Hopefully the demons will not defeat him and he won't join the crowd.
echo, hopefully there is some explanation for your T's not letting you know he's going away. Maybe something came up, that he couldn't be in and had to leave it to his secretary. You just need to find out when he's back.
Ah, you see there is my issue coming up - not to blame him (the loved-one), there must be some reason... aaahhh...
quote:The thing I am having the most difficulty with in therapy right now is my feelings for him. It doesn't feel like some psychological transference thing - it feels like I am in love with him. And I know "everyone" feels this way, so it's not "real"... but I WANT HIM anyway. It hurts. And all I can think is that the only way out of this is to quit and wait to get over it. But I don't want to quit! It's the only "happy" thing I have going right now. He's just so sweet and kind and handsome...
Hi echo,
yeah, depression... I havent felt it for a while but I remember how bad it feels.
You said that your feelings don't seem to be transference, but love and that that kind of thing is not real... It is real. Why would that be not real? You don't pretend to be in love, so it is real. That's what you feel. It's a fact isn't it?
I feel very much in love with my T and it is true and real. I want him, perhaps it is not overwhelming yet, but I don't know how far it will go.
I'm sorry that it hurts you. I don't know if quiting could really help and who knows how much time you would have to wait to get over it completely. Could you talk to him about how you feel? Could you perhaps see somebody else who could help you to go through it (if not him)?
P.S. I'm really glad that days are getting longer again... fed up with darkness and cold.
quote:I don't know if I could ever be totally honest with him and say the only reason I keep going back to therapy is because I'm in love with him. That makes it sound like I'm not getting anything out of the actual therapy, which isn't true.
Me too. My oldP often asks why I keep going back. It is because I have this really strong attachment to him that I am not ready to let go of. The therapy itself is pretty crap most of the time. He started off in the beginning by saying that I could trust him and that he would never reject or abandon me and he has repeatedly rejected me, ended, let me go back, been cold and just basically made me feel like I am too demanding and just a hopeless case.
Hi Echo,
I don't know for sure what you should do...but this really resonated with me:
I really do understand wanting to work through the feelings for your P. I still really wish I could have worked out my feelings for my former T with him, to find out what my feelings meant in the context of the therapy. I don't know if I could have left that relationship willingly, it would have been really hard, even though I wanted to bolt several times. It sounds like you are having a similar struggle with yourself, even though I know the situation isn't the same.
However, I must also say it is a RELIEF to be able to just talk to my current female T without the "distraction of attraction". Although it certainly isn't linear, I do seem to be making some progress. She said today that she's seeing more of my "heart". I told her about a friend of mine who generously shared her experiences with me this week, and largely because of that, how I was able to make several connections about what's been going on in my marriage. And I'm getting really fired up about what I want and don't want in a relationship, finally seeing that it's really not all my problems, but a combination of his and mine. I'm realizing I gave up way too many expectations of what I want in a relationship, and so has he. So I'm taking some actions to get us connecting, and I suspect things are about to get really, really messy for a while. But I am really ready, I'm so tired of accepting a dead relationship, anything has got to be better than this!
I don't know if I could have achieved this level of clarity about my marriage, while still being attracted to my T. There probably were important lessons to be learned with him...but maybe it just wasn't time for those lessons yet. Or maybe the lessons are to be learned from the way it didn't work out. Maybe it really would have been too much for me to deal with. I still don't have it all figured out (does that ever really happen?), but I can say for certain that I am grateful to be free of that kind of attraction right now.
It sounds like you are longing for the freedom to speak about the things you need to speak about. I can vouch for the fact that it feels pretty wonderful. So why not give it a try? Can you make a few appointments with a female T and see how it goes, independent of whether or not you go through with telling your P how you feel about him? I don't see how it can hurt...and you might find that your therapy takes off in a whole new direction!
Please keep us posted on how things are going, and on what you decide to do...
Take care,
SG
I don't know for sure what you should do...but this really resonated with me:
quote:Maybe if I had a female T I could feel comfortable talking these things out without worrying what the therapist thinks of me, or that I'm disappointing her by not coming to the "right" conclusion.
I really do understand wanting to work through the feelings for your P. I still really wish I could have worked out my feelings for my former T with him, to find out what my feelings meant in the context of the therapy. I don't know if I could have left that relationship willingly, it would have been really hard, even though I wanted to bolt several times. It sounds like you are having a similar struggle with yourself, even though I know the situation isn't the same.
However, I must also say it is a RELIEF to be able to just talk to my current female T without the "distraction of attraction". Although it certainly isn't linear, I do seem to be making some progress. She said today that she's seeing more of my "heart". I told her about a friend of mine who generously shared her experiences with me this week, and largely because of that, how I was able to make several connections about what's been going on in my marriage. And I'm getting really fired up about what I want and don't want in a relationship, finally seeing that it's really not all my problems, but a combination of his and mine. I'm realizing I gave up way too many expectations of what I want in a relationship, and so has he. So I'm taking some actions to get us connecting, and I suspect things are about to get really, really messy for a while. But I am really ready, I'm so tired of accepting a dead relationship, anything has got to be better than this!
I don't know if I could have achieved this level of clarity about my marriage, while still being attracted to my T. There probably were important lessons to be learned with him...but maybe it just wasn't time for those lessons yet. Or maybe the lessons are to be learned from the way it didn't work out. Maybe it really would have been too much for me to deal with. I still don't have it all figured out (does that ever really happen?), but I can say for certain that I am grateful to be free of that kind of attraction right now.
It sounds like you are longing for the freedom to speak about the things you need to speak about. I can vouch for the fact that it feels pretty wonderful. So why not give it a try? Can you make a few appointments with a female T and see how it goes, independent of whether or not you go through with telling your P how you feel about him? I don't see how it can hurt...and you might find that your therapy takes off in a whole new direction!
Please keep us posted on how things are going, and on what you decide to do...
Take care,
SG
echo, I think before you try out with a female shrink, maybe you should tell him what you've rehearsed and see... try again to bring out your feelings, just to know for sure. If it really, really doesn't work with him, then... gradually transfer to another T?
After all, there is nothing to loose at this point I suppose? It's been difficult enough, so... I really wish he was so accepting and caring about your feelings as you need.
As for the "distraction of attraction" (I like the way you put it SG) when I saw my T first time, I wished he was gay, so he would never ever noticed if I started to feel any attraction. Now I feel that it's good he's a guy, so I can finally address (and hopefully put behind me) my constant "search for a father".
After all, there is nothing to loose at this point I suppose? It's been difficult enough, so... I really wish he was so accepting and caring about your feelings as you need.
As for the "distraction of attraction" (I like the way you put it SG
) when I saw my T first time, I wished he was gay, so he would never ever noticed if I started to feel any attraction. Now I feel that it's good he's a guy, so I can finally address (and hopefully put behind me) my constant "search for a father".
Hi Echo,
We can't have you replying to your own posts, so I'm going to reply.
Yes what you say makes perfect sense. I needed (need) to talk about things like this too, and I always felt exactly the way you described. I think my former T felt uncomfortable, too. There were always a lot of silences like he didn't know what to say. I'm relieved not to have to deal with that too.
I don't know if that helps but I just wanted you to know that you're not alone.
SG
We can't have you replying to your own posts, so I'm going to reply.
Yes what you say makes perfect sense. I needed (need) to talk about things like this too, and I always felt exactly the way you described. I think my former T felt uncomfortable, too. There were always a lot of silences like he didn't know what to say. I'm relieved not to have to deal with that too.
I don't know if that helps but I just wanted you to know that you're not alone.
SG
Oh Echo....
I really really really feel for you. I have been there myself and still am depending on the day.
The thing is, it is your life and unless someone is being abused, it is not a bad thing to want to work on your marriage. It is his your T's job to support you in your feelings and help you make your own choices. I get that fear of disappointing him or of feeling foolish about telling him after you have said for so long that you were unhappy and/or leaving. It's hard. But, it is also hard to walk away from a marriage especially when there are young children. I believe our T's really want to see us grow and to live the the most rewarding lives we can and it must be difficult to see us in pain and staying in less than fulfilling relationships. But, hopefully they understand that we have to come to those decisions on our own, and we will if and when the time is right.
I really really really feel for you. I have been there myself and still am depending on the day.
The thing is, it is your life and unless someone is being abused, it is not a bad thing to want to work on your marriage. It is his your T's job to support you in your feelings and help you make your own choices. I get that fear of disappointing him or of feeling foolish about telling him after you have said for so long that you were unhappy and/or leaving. It's hard. But, it is also hard to walk away from a marriage especially when there are young children. I believe our T's really want to see us grow and to live the the most rewarding lives we can and it must be difficult to see us in pain and staying in less than fulfilling relationships. But, hopefully they understand that we have to come to those decisions on our own, and we will if and when the time is right.
Hey Echo... I've been following along and wanted to say a few things that struck me about your post(s):
Personally, I'd rather not troubleshoot my sex life AT ALL (:P), but I get what you're saying! With the feelings you have for him, it could be pretty awkward if he doesn't handle it well.
Yes. But you can do it. (((((((echo)))))))
I really like SG's term "distraction of attraction"... attraction is definitely distracting, but I will say, if your t can be boundaried and responsible, it's worth working through. I know you know that... but I also hear you saying you feel stuck... in a hamster wheel so to speak, and it isn't going anywhere. When i was stuck obsessing about my t all the time, I finally broke down and told her... in explicit detail... we were then able to really delve into why, what it meant, how it may or may not be a pattern, etc. But I had to bring it up every time. It didn't just carry over from session to session, she let me direct it... and it's at the point now where sometimes I just say "I've been thinking about you all the time again" and she'll say "More than usual?" and we'll just causally launch into a conversation about it. It wasn't always that easy to bring it up, so I used to write and write and write to her about it... actual letters that I gave to her. Have you considered writing out, point by point, what your issues are for your t? i know he's aware of what's going on, but if he's like most t's, he may be waiting on you to keep bringing it up.
The other thing I think I have to mention here- what enabled me to talk about this all with my t- is that she has never waivered. She's never reacted TO ME. I could throw something at her (well, I actually did once lol!) and she'd just say "so why did you decide to do that?" in her same therapist-y voice. I've often said that the only thing that allows me to go with the flow and bounce around the room like a bouncy ball is the fact that I know she's going to stay ever so still. If your t has truly given you reason to think that he will react to you- that he won't contain your stuff well- then I think seeing a female t may be a good option. You may even bring that up to him... that you'd like to try talking to a female t and you are wondering if he has any recommendations. idk if that's reasonable, but just a thought.
Have you mentioned this to him? That you're unsure if he's suggesting divorce because it's what worked for him? he may being trying to support you, but he may have too much of himself in the room on this one. BTW, i dont think it's anything to be ashamed of that you'd like to work on your marriage. Why should that disappoint him? If he's "worth his salt" (isn't that what you say AG??) then he should be able to say, ok, why do you think you've changed your mind and go from there. Also, IMO, I don't think you need to decide what you're going to do before you start working! I think it's perfectly acceptable to say I don't know what the future of my marriage looks like, but i don't have enough information to decide right now.
Yep, it sure does! I understand the whole fishing thing, and I avoid it too, but I don't think it's his job to refute your fears... he should be there to explore why you're afraid, you know? You have to decide that you will be okay with or without your husband, and I hope your t knows that it's a greater gift to you if he helps you answer your own questions.
I guess I'll end there... but I just want you to know that you have my support. I definitely think being really straightforward in your next session will behoove you, but I don't think considering a female t would be a bad thing either. Maybe you can do BOTH! What i really think you're coming up against is needing to advocate for yourself, and ask for what you need. i think you're scared of what your t will think if you do/say something he won't like... but I guess i wonder what he would think if he knew you were miserably stewing all alone?
-CT
quote:The LAST thing I need to hear is my P attempting to trouble-shoot my (non-existant)sex life. No thank you!)
Personally, I'd rather not troubleshoot my sex life AT ALL (:P), but I get what you're saying! With the feelings you have for him, it could be pretty awkward if he doesn't handle it well.
quote:This is going to hurt like hell, isn't it?
Yes. But you can do it. (((((((echo)))))))
I really like SG's term "distraction of attraction"... attraction is definitely distracting, but I will say, if your t can be boundaried and responsible, it's worth working through. I know you know that... but I also hear you saying you feel stuck... in a hamster wheel so to speak, and it isn't going anywhere. When i was stuck obsessing about my t all the time, I finally broke down and told her... in explicit detail... we were then able to really delve into why, what it meant, how it may or may not be a pattern, etc. But I had to bring it up every time. It didn't just carry over from session to session, she let me direct it... and it's at the point now where sometimes I just say "I've been thinking about you all the time again" and she'll say "More than usual?" and we'll just causally launch into a conversation about it. It wasn't always that easy to bring it up, so I used to write and write and write to her about it... actual letters that I gave to her. Have you considered writing out, point by point, what your issues are for your t? i know he's aware of what's going on, but if he's like most t's, he may be waiting on you to keep bringing it up.
The other thing I think I have to mention here- what enabled me to talk about this all with my t- is that she has never waivered. She's never reacted TO ME. I could throw something at her (well, I actually did once lol!) and she'd just say "so why did you decide to do that?" in her same therapist-y voice. I've often said that the only thing that allows me to go with the flow and bounce around the room like a bouncy ball is the fact that I know she's going to stay ever so still. If your t has truly given you reason to think that he will react to you- that he won't contain your stuff well- then I think seeing a female t may be a good option. You may even bring that up to him... that you'd like to try talking to a female t and you are wondering if he has any recommendations. idk if that's reasonable, but just a thought.
quote:I don't think his intent is anything malicious, I really think his heart is in the right place and he wants what's best for me, but I also think his personal life (of which I am vaguely aware) is coloring his outlook on troubled marriages right now and he just thinks everyone should get divorced, and live happily ever after co-parenting with their ex-spouse.
Have you mentioned this to him? That you're unsure if he's suggesting divorce because it's what worked for him? he may being trying to support you, but he may have too much of himself in the room on this one. BTW, i dont think it's anything to be ashamed of that you'd like to work on your marriage. Why should that disappoint him? If he's "worth his salt" (isn't that what you say AG??) then he should be able to say, ok, why do you think you've changed your mind and go from there. Also, IMO, I don't think you need to decide what you're going to do before you start working! I think it's perfectly acceptable to say I don't know what the future of my marriage looks like, but i don't have enough information to decide right now.
quote:Does this make any sense?
Yep, it sure does! I understand the whole fishing thing, and I avoid it too, but I don't think it's his job to refute your fears... he should be there to explore why you're afraid, you know? You have to decide that you will be okay with or without your husband, and I hope your t knows that it's a greater gift to you if he helps you answer your own questions.
I guess I'll end there... but I just want you to know that you have my support. I definitely think being really straightforward in your next session will behoove you, but I don't think considering a female t would be a bad thing either. Maybe you can do BOTH! What i really think you're coming up against is needing to advocate for yourself, and ask for what you need. i think you're scared of what your t will think if you do/say something he won't like... but I guess i wonder what he would think if he knew you were miserably stewing all alone?
-CT
Whoa Echo-
I have just read your complete thread-start to finish.
Since it is almost midnight, and i have work tomorrow, i will comment tomorrow.
We do have some things in common, and that is scary for you.
Night!
I have just read your complete thread-start to finish.
Since it is almost midnight, and i have work tomorrow, i will comment tomorrow.
We do have some things in common, and that is scary for you.
Night!
Hi there Echo how are you doing? I notice you’ve deleted posts on your Shopping for a T thread so wondered how that search is going? Did you get to meet with the flaky T who messed up your appointment in the end? I’m guessing things aren’t going too well on that front so if you don’t want to say anything that’s ok I’m just asking in case you DO want to talk about it and could do with some encouragement. (For what it’s worth I’ve gone into shut down mode because of the unbelievable crap I’m running into meeting with new Ts - it’s not only frustrating but very very painful.)
Aside from that I really do hope you are ok :hug:
Lamplighter
Aside from that I really do hope you are ok :hug:
Lamplighter
Hi LL and Echo,
I am rather late to the board on this one, but I just wanted to let you know that my heart goes out to you both. Problems with T can just add to the burdens in life. It is difficult because there is where we go to find solace.
I too have some of the same issues with my T, but- and I could be wrong on this- I believe our spiritual differences, now not really addressed much, have caused a break down. And yet- he is the most amazing man I have ever met. Maybe I have that "worship thy T" complex adding to the mix, IDK.
He says that we have addressed his anger toward me, and I say we have not- and if we go near the subject- it leads to a very bad session- like last time. So now I feel like I can not talk to him as I once did.
As I read this and the other threads by you too- in your search for a new T, I wonder if that is in my future. It makes me so, so sad just to think of it, and yet I don't yet know if I will continue to grow with him.
For what it is worth- my T uses the practices of Carl Rogers in his methods. I find this approach of nurturing and loving to be so incredibly healing, but perhaps this could lead to some transference, as I have felt so closely held and comforted in dealing with the pain of my past.
I wish you both God's grace on your journey for a new T.
I am rather late to the board on this one, but I just wanted to let you know that my heart goes out to you both. Problems with T can just add to the burdens in life. It is difficult because there is where we go to find solace.
I too have some of the same issues with my T, but- and I could be wrong on this- I believe our spiritual differences, now not really addressed much, have caused a break down. And yet- he is the most amazing man I have ever met. Maybe I have that "worship thy T" complex adding to the mix, IDK.
He says that we have addressed his anger toward me, and I say we have not- and if we go near the subject- it leads to a very bad session- like last time. So now I feel like I can not talk to him as I once did.
As I read this and the other threads by you too- in your search for a new T, I wonder if that is in my future. It makes me so, so sad just to think of it, and yet I don't yet know if I will continue to grow with him.
For what it is worth- my T uses the practices of Carl Rogers in his methods. I find this approach of nurturing and loving to be so incredibly healing, but perhaps this could lead to some transference, as I have felt so closely held and comforted in dealing with the pain of my past.
I wish you both God's grace on your journey for a new T.
Mayo thanks so much for the kind words. I’d have to say that looking for a new T is horrendous - but maybe not everyone would have the same problems I’m running into - it’s perfectly possible to go out and find the perfect T straight away (as Ultraviolet just explained)!
I’ve decided a big part of the problem is being an old hand at therapy - even if a client has had only the one therapeutic relationship it opens up their eyes to what could and should be available from therapy (as well as what shouldn’t!) so we’re no longer the wide eyed naïve in awe of a therapist’s professionalism type client so tend to see faults and failings a whole lot more quickly.
You’ve probably already had loads of advice about the discord between you and your T but I’m going to risk repeating it - it sounds like you have a really good thing going with him and that the anger he won’t explain centring around spirituality IS an ongoing issue for you - and rather than letting it freak you out with fears of having to go out and find another T (in my opinion now something to be avoided if at all possible) you find some way of getting him to resolve it with you. I know for me something like that would fester away underneath all the time and I’d just HAVE to resolve it one way or another.
As your T sounds person-centred (Rogerian approach) that means YOU are the entire centre and focus of the therapy so it should be perfectly possible for him to recognize and acknowledge how something that he has said/done would affect you, and to resolve it with you. I do so hope you can sort it out because my thinking now is that if you’ve got a good T - hold onto him!
And Echo, hope you are hanging in there too! (by which I mean I hope you are getting somewhere in your new T search)
Lamplighter
I’ve decided a big part of the problem is being an old hand at therapy - even if a client has had only the one therapeutic relationship it opens up their eyes to what could and should be available from therapy (as well as what shouldn’t!) so we’re no longer the wide eyed naïve in awe of a therapist’s professionalism type client so tend to see faults and failings a whole lot more quickly.
You’ve probably already had loads of advice about the discord between you and your T but I’m going to risk repeating it - it sounds like you have a really good thing going with him and that the anger he won’t explain centring around spirituality IS an ongoing issue for you - and rather than letting it freak you out with fears of having to go out and find another T (in my opinion now something to be avoided if at all possible) you find some way of getting him to resolve it with you. I know for me something like that would fester away underneath all the time and I’d just HAVE to resolve it one way or another.
As your T sounds person-centred (Rogerian approach) that means YOU are the entire centre and focus of the therapy so it should be perfectly possible for him to recognize and acknowledge how something that he has said/done would affect you, and to resolve it with you. I do so hope you can sort it out because my thinking now is that if you’ve got a good T - hold onto him!
And Echo, hope you are hanging in there too! (by which I mean I hope you are getting somewhere in your new T search)
Lamplighter
Lamplighter-
I hope you are right. I am taking your advice and the advice given to me here.- and trying to stick it out.
I switched to a different office- same T, (marvelous place- but that is for a different post) and we actually made some headway. I was able to be a bit more upfront with our break down, and he admitted the whole thing was basically him, and that I triggered some little boy stuff in him, and that he is deeply addressing some of his own issues as they pertain to anger.
I was able to tell him that I was deeply frightened by his anger, and felt very rejected. He assured me that I was taking responsibility for something that was his stuff, and not mine at all. I could link that to my fathers anger fits that always frightened me, but were not my fault( know that in my head, but still working on that in the little girls heart)
He was very patient and kind, but there still exists a fear on my part. And we have not had any good spiritual discussions yet. I am not comfortable with that yet.
There is something I don't get though, everytime I have seen him since the bad time - he always mentions- that he is surprised that I came back, and he did not think I would, or he mentions the time I said that I was going to take a break for a while- because my husband lost his job- but he says it like I was saying that I was quitting therapy. He mentioned that clients usually don't just stop coming (I never said that), and that they usually extend time between visits, then slowly taper off. He brings this stuff up every time. It is clearly him, because I am surprised at his interpretation of things, and I have no idea why he is saying it. Do you or anyone else have any thoughts on this? Regarding the hugs, he must have sensed something in that last hug (where things changed midstream for me from being almost numb- or at least a benign hug to something extremely powerful for me- obviously my transference stuff) because we don't hug any more. In fact, there is no touch at all, and maybe that is for the best right now.
His Milford office- his real office is 100 times better than the other stale office I had been going to. So now- I am Wednesday at 4 instead of Monday at 5- at his wonderfully amazing office.
I hope you are right. I am taking your advice and the advice given to me here.- and trying to stick it out.
I switched to a different office- same T, (marvelous place- but that is for a different post) and we actually made some headway. I was able to be a bit more upfront with our break down, and he admitted the whole thing was basically him, and that I triggered some little boy stuff in him, and that he is deeply addressing some of his own issues as they pertain to anger.
I was able to tell him that I was deeply frightened by his anger, and felt very rejected. He assured me that I was taking responsibility for something that was his stuff, and not mine at all. I could link that to my fathers anger fits that always frightened me, but were not my fault( know that in my head, but still working on that in the little girls heart)
He was very patient and kind, but there still exists a fear on my part. And we have not had any good spiritual discussions yet. I am not comfortable with that yet.
There is something I don't get though, everytime I have seen him since the bad time - he always mentions- that he is surprised that I came back, and he did not think I would, or he mentions the time I said that I was going to take a break for a while- because my husband lost his job- but he says it like I was saying that I was quitting therapy. He mentioned that clients usually don't just stop coming (I never said that), and that they usually extend time between visits, then slowly taper off. He brings this stuff up every time. It is clearly him, because I am surprised at his interpretation of things, and I have no idea why he is saying it. Do you or anyone else have any thoughts on this? Regarding the hugs, he must have sensed something in that last hug (where things changed midstream for me from being almost numb- or at least a benign hug to something extremely powerful for me- obviously my transference stuff) because we don't hug any more. In fact, there is no touch at all, and maybe that is for the best right now.
His Milford office- his real office is 100 times better than the other stale office I had been going to. So now- I am Wednesday at 4 instead of Monday at 5- at his wonderfully amazing office.
Thank you LL and everyone.
Without you (plural) I would have given up on therapy. I can see that a repair might be possible. Might?
Without you (plural) I would have given up on therapy. I can see that a repair might be possible. Might?
Hi Monte,
Thanks for that.
Let me back up some- to show how perfect this office is for me.
Just over a yr. ago when I was in the trrows of anxiety, and in his rented office space in a different town, I told him how much I hated the office. - no room for people like me to walk around- pace... (anxiety was high, so for months I stood at the exit door). The window was blocked by a huge plant and a chair, while right outside the window was a gorgeous flowering tree - great for grounding. The artwork was bright colors, but mucky- no defined shapes- only leads to more confusion for people like me trying to figure things out. ( I ended up bringing a photography book of my own to look at when I spoke to him- beautiful desert scenes from the West. the room set up was all wrong. So he got up and said" how would you arrange it- lets move the furniture... He was serious! If I could have laughed, I would have.
Well his own office that he has had for many years- is quite exactly all of the things I needed. It is in a rambling old victorian house. You have to go in the back door- looks a bit scary actually- but once inside, head up a beautiful carpeted stairway- chinese design stair rumnner- intricate deep red with gold patterns. This is funny- and not sure why he had this but adorable- he had pieces of paper with his name on them and arrows leading clients to the waiting room. I felt like I was following the yellow brick road- many little turns. Once inside the waiting room- a guilt free library of neat books- take one- keep it or return, leave one if you would like... that sort of thing. Nice comfy chairs and thick soft bluish carpeting. Poetry on the walls- I forget what else. He came out and lead me to his office- down the hall- more twists and turns- big, big old door with brass door knob. Opening the door to his office- a HUGE room with a fire place, big comfy chairs with high sides- (just in case I need to hide, a big, soft plush couch, with wonderful pillows,phottography on the wall- (Ansel Adams) with clear well- defined lines. and Lots of other scenery type photography. Cool textured walls- of course the kid in me had to get up and touch them. gorgeous rugs over wonderful old hardwood floor, Flowering plants NOT in front of the large windows. Poetry, little dolls on the mantle- like 2 little rag dolls, High high textured ceilings, children's artwork on one wall. I could go on, but ... Needless to say I gave up -Monday at 5 to be a wed@4 in this office.
Thanks for that.
Let me back up some- to show how perfect this office is for me.
Just over a yr. ago when I was in the trrows of anxiety, and in his rented office space in a different town, I told him how much I hated the office. - no room for people like me to walk around- pace... (anxiety was high, so for months I stood at the exit door). The window was blocked by a huge plant and a chair, while right outside the window was a gorgeous flowering tree - great for grounding. The artwork was bright colors, but mucky- no defined shapes- only leads to more confusion for people like me trying to figure things out. ( I ended up bringing a photography book of my own to look at when I spoke to him- beautiful desert scenes from the West. the room set up was all wrong. So he got up and said" how would you arrange it- lets move the furniture... He was serious! If I could have laughed, I would have.
Well his own office that he has had for many years- is quite exactly all of the things I needed. It is in a rambling old victorian house. You have to go in the back door- looks a bit scary actually- but once inside, head up a beautiful carpeted stairway- chinese design stair rumnner- intricate deep red with gold patterns. This is funny- and not sure why he had this but adorable- he had pieces of paper with his name on them and arrows leading clients to the waiting room. I felt like I was following the yellow brick road- many little turns. Once inside the waiting room- a guilt free library of neat books- take one- keep it or return, leave one if you would like... that sort of thing. Nice comfy chairs and thick soft bluish carpeting. Poetry on the walls- I forget what else. He came out and lead me to his office- down the hall- more twists and turns- big, big old door with brass door knob. Opening the door to his office- a HUGE room with a fire place, big comfy chairs with high sides- (just in case I need to hide, a big, soft plush couch, with wonderful pillows,phottography on the wall- (Ansel Adams) with clear well- defined lines. and Lots of other scenery type photography. Cool textured walls- of course the kid in me had to get up and touch them. gorgeous rugs over wonderful old hardwood floor, Flowering plants NOT in front of the large windows. Poetry, little dolls on the mantle- like 2 little rag dolls, High high textured ceilings, children's artwork on one wall. I could go on, but ... Needless to say I gave up -Monday at 5 to be a wed@4 in this office.
Mayo
Wow - sounds amazing, love the sound of all of it, especially the chairs you can hide in and the pillows. Worth a change from Monday at 5 definitely
Monte, yes agreed, the room is so important for making you feel safe and relaxed. Have never tried pacing - my T would love that!- she is forever trying to unfreeze me to move anywhere, and we the space!
Mayo - in all of that perfection (sigh) has he still got a clock and a box of tissues?...
starfish
Wow - sounds amazing, love the sound of all of it, especially the chairs you can hide in and the pillows. Worth a change from Monday at 5 definitely
Monte, yes agreed, the room is so important for making you feel safe and relaxed. Have never tried pacing - my T would love that!- she is forever trying to unfreeze me to move anywhere, and we the space!
Mayo - in all of that perfection (sigh) has he still got a clock and a box of tissues?...
starfish
Mayo that office sounds heavenly. And so interesting. I would love it there too.
My T's office is in a 200 year old farmhouse which has this neat hidden circular stairway (with no railings) to a hidden upper room filled with toys for kids doing play therapy. He took me up there once to see it. I would love to do therapy up there but that staircase is really hard to manage in heels LOL! His own office has this huge fireplace decorated with the most interesting handmade tiles. The office itself is wonderful but the furnishing are just awful. His couch is so saggy and uncomfortable and the chair I sit in is a stiff Queen Anne style chair with little room to move around in. I'd love him to have a big, overstuffed arm chair that I could curl up into during those really hard sessions. There is also very little room to pace around. Sometimes I would really like to get up and walk around to settle my nerves. But I guess the most important and precious thing in that office is my wonderful, caring T and I wouldn't trade that for anything.
TN
My T's office is in a 200 year old farmhouse which has this neat hidden circular stairway (with no railings) to a hidden upper room filled with toys for kids doing play therapy. He took me up there once to see it. I would love to do therapy up there but that staircase is really hard to manage in heels LOL! His own office has this huge fireplace decorated with the most interesting handmade tiles. The office itself is wonderful but the furnishing are just awful. His couch is so saggy and uncomfortable and the chair I sit in is a stiff Queen Anne style chair with little room to move around in. I'd love him to have a big, overstuffed arm chair that I could curl up into during those really hard sessions. There is also very little room to pace around. Sometimes I would really like to get up and walk around to settle my nerves. But I guess the most important and precious thing in that office is my wonderful, caring T and I wouldn't trade that for anything.
TN
quote:Mayo - in all of that perfection (sigh) has he still got a clock and a box of tissues?...
Hi Starfish!
Yes, for the clock, and yes for the tissues, but I did not notice where the tissues were. The clock is a teeny-tiny thing that is discretely hidden next to a plant on the end table, next to a flowering plant. Tissues? IDK I have yet to cry. Sometimes I will get misty eyed, (like last time) but I still can't seem to shed those tears. This is a mystery. He said-last session that I am blocking; what is that exactly, and why would I do that? I thnk I will start a thread on that topic if there isn't one already.
Hi TN- a hidden upper room in an old farmhouse filled with toys sounds intriguing. Wow!
I am so glad for the extra room to move around. Sometimes I have to. In the old office- "the box" I could not walk around unless I paced back and forth right in front of him. That would never happen- so I stood by the door for months.
Maybe we can start a collection on line here- and buy new office furniture for your T.
Quote-But I guess the most important and precious thing in that office is my wonderful, caring T and I wouldn't trade that for anything.
Yeah, TN, aint it the truth.
quote:It would be so conducive to deep, meaningful, connecting conversation. Sounds like a perfect haven...only problem I could see is having to leave.
You are so right Monte- leaving is really hard. Now I imagine that after our time, he leaves to do errands- and he lets me stay for a while to take a nap. Ahhh...