Yep! Generally a session after I disclose "too much" or get, as my T will say, "too close" (my greatest fear in life is intimacy or being seen). I usually found/find something to push away. It does get better. I can relate to the frustration

Veryhopeful,

Constantly! Therapy has been an intricate dance of moving closer, getting scared, moving away, moving in closer, getting scared, etc. I am amazed at my creativity in finding reasons to move away. There are a couple of posts on my blog you might find helpful:

Disorganized Attachment or Why You Think You’re Crazy But Really Aren’t

Wanted, not needed, to go

It's pretty normal behavior for people who have experienced neglect or abuse at the hands of their early caregivers.

AG

Veryhopeful,

I think this is where my "defensiveness" during therapy comes into play. I think it is, indeed, a coping mechanism I acquired in order to shut out things or not let people in. Of course, this defensiveness has only been since I've seen this third T--who has a different approach and tends to "challenge" me more than the other two T's--to the point, I think, of pushing my buttons. Of course, he thinks I have anger issues because I never express anger. So, maybe in a way, this defensiveness is a form of anger beginning to blossom, I don't know. But yes, I definately can relate to this and I think it's my way of pushing away, also. It does drive me crazy because I feel bad for the way I acted, wondering if I'm the worst patient ever that sits on that couch. However, T filled out a survey recently and reported, get this, that I was "Cooperative and highly motivated." So, maybe that's just my perception of how I'm doing in therapy. Who knows...I guess they have seen just about everything!

For what it's worth...

LJB

(((VH)))I so can relate to what you are saying. I get so afraid of getting too close and trusting my T, its been a real struggle for me. I was at the point where I was so angry at my T because I was starting to trust him more, that I was trying to deliberately anger him so he would terminate me. I thought that would solve the problem because I am so fearful of closeness and trust toward him. It makes me crazy going back and forth with my feelings about this. Recently I made a lot of progress trusting him and finally telling him. Who knows what will happen with my thinking next week. Give yourself a lot of time, and don't push yourself about this. The more your T proves him or herself to you, the more you will take this in and deal with it in a positive manner. Remember "baby steps".

Well, I'm glad I am not alone with this issue. Your responses were very helpful. AG, I've been reading your work for quite a while. I found you through this site last year. I really enjoy your writings. FYI to all...T says anger is often used to cover for fear. That's why men are more inclined to get mad; fear is scary to most men and they will avoid it. I am a female who tends uses anger to mask fear and right now I hate my T and am never going back.I want to move closer to him but, I can't. I am convinced he is going to get me to a point where he can be my soft place to fall and then BOOM...he will leave me high and dry like everyone else in my life. My husband is going through a round of cancer treatment (he is doing well) but it's been for the last three weeks. Our families offer zero support and we lack good friends. Long story short, I, as the wife have to remain calm for my husband's benefit and have NO one to share any of this with. Two weeks ago I fell apart in T's office, not planning on sharing any of how alone I am feeling. He is aware how alone I am and said "you have me". I really don't "have him". He is not mine. I said "I can't call you when I want". He's not really "there" for me. What is he supposed to say? He has a very close family; which makes me feel more awful. What crushed me yesterday was when I emailed him and asked him if I could call him for 5 minutes if I needed; out of shear desperation, he said yes but, he is busy for big parts of this weekend and to leave a voicemail and he would call back.....I hear that as..."I'm going to be really busy, try not to call". So F--k him. I just replied ok, have a good weekend and he did not respond back. I thought he would have a least said good luck at the hospital or have a good Easter...Nothing! Am I being overly sensitive?

Me too. I do it all the time. It has been talked about in therapy. I would like to think at the time it is an affective way to operate but it isn't. My T hasn't gone anywhere thankfully. She knows the dance well.

(((Very Hopeful)))

I understand the anger; it's perfectly normal. In addition to the typical trauma dynamic, it sounds like you're facing a really stressful time in which you need extra support.

Your T is there for you. However, he alone can't fill all the holes in your support system. Since he is such an important person to you, this fact makes you angry. You are directing your general anger at having insufficient support toward your T. But for him to attempt to be your sole support would be unfair to you both. He would get burned out and you wouldn't reach out to others who can offer richer relationships. I know it's still terribly painful, though, to not have him when you want him.

When your T said he'd be busy this weekend, I don't think he was discouraging you from calling. I think he was giving you a heads up so if you got his answering machine, you wouldn't think he was avoiding you.

I hope this helps.

Affinity, your response did help me a lot. I emailed him and he basically said what you wrote. I could tell he was angry with me letting me know he does not measure up to my standard. I told him it is more of a desire that is impossible to fulfill; much like what was not received growing up. We cleared things up and, you're correct....it still is very painful not having him right in front of me. This is the part I despise about therapy. Like it is "real" but, not really "real". Makes me crazy!!

Veryhopeful,
FWIW, any time I talk to my T, I call his answering service and leave a message, then he calls me back. I actually find it comforting because 1) I don't feel so much like I am intruding since contact with his service is already a given and 2) I trust that he is calling back when it also fits his needs. So I don't worry about interrupting something important.

One of the difficult lessons of childhood, as we grow, is to learn that not only are people separate from us, they have their own needs and priorities and we cannot always come first with them (although in a perfect world, there should have been a time where we came pretty close to being their highest priority). Even people who love us, including "good enough" parents, have to attend to other things in our lives. Part of someone going away and coming back, is that we learn to trust they are "there" even when we can't see them. And just because they have other things to attend to does not make us unimportant.

These things are difficult enough to learn as a child; as an adult, it's really painful. And there is an inherent ambiguity to the therapeutic relationship which makes it difficult to trust in its reality. But it is real and like all healthy relationships there are boundaries. They're just weirder in therapy. And think of it this way, you may only get your T for that hour a week, but for that hour, you are focused on and listened to in a way we rarely experience elsewhere. I know it can be unspeakably painful to run up against not being able to know them fully and share their life in the way family and friends are able to, but I think we get the best of them, without the downside of them being irritated or grumpy or scared or selfish. We see them at their most ideal.

Glad that you were able to work this through.

AG

AG, I haven't really worked it through. I am actually not sure I ever will. I want from him something that is not possible and that is why I always want to quit. Loss has been a constant in my life. I want what I did not get growing up; sincere attachment. I suffered severe deprivation, emotionally. People think that's not a big deal because you cannot "see" it but it is kind of like slowly starving to death. Having him come into my life; allowing that, was a massive step for me (had his phone number in my wallet for 10 years). It bothers me that he is so important to me and I am not to him or that is what I feel. I want to believe he cares but something deep inside won't allow it. I'm petrified he will leave too and then I would die. Therapy is the most insane set up and it's making me crazy!! I did talk with him about his relationship with his anaylst when he was training. He saw him three times a week for five years!! Three decades later he is still in contact with him. He made it clear I will always be allowed to contact him, which is a comfort for sure. Thank you so much for your input. I feel all these comments are very beneficial and you all understand the pain that runs very deep. Thank you!!!

I so relate to that feeling of starvation. I once wrote in my journal that longing for my T was like starving to death at the cellular level and having to eat sand for sustenance. But it that feeling motivated me to push on and work on our connection. Maybe you can't fully trust your T today. That's ok. But trust is something you can work on. As it gets stronger, and as you heal, the intensity of the longing will decrease.

I'm very glad my words helped.

Affinity, your post made me laugh (about the sand) and as much as I always want to quit....I always show up...even he said "you're never late....never!!". I do push on because deep in my heart I know it is the right thing to do. Trusting him is a severe issue. The parental and sibling trusts were massively violated....big. And, I throw a lot of that sh-t back on him. He is teaching me so much I've never learned (that's why I love him so much and try my hardest to run away at the same time). I just spoke with him. I need to actually hear the sound of his voice to know he is not "they" who mistreated me. You know, I thought joining this message board was "stupid"; it is not. It has helped me so much and I really appreciate everyone's authenticity and feedback even though we are all "invisible"!! Oh, and I cannot wait for the day were the longing I so suffer from begins to diminish. It is agony at times.

AG, fantastic article you wrote on disorganized attachment. EXACTLY how I feel. Just tried to bolt from session today and decided that is EXACTLY where I need to go.

Thank you so much!

VH,
Thanks so much! Really glad you found it helpful, that's actually one of the two most popular posts on my blog. It can feel so confusing while you're living it out but seen in the right context the behavior makes perfect sense.

AG

Actually having a major breakdown about this today. The post was very comforting to know someone else really knows what this feels like. The intensity can be so overwhelming. I hope I make progress today with him. I want him to "live" in my house with me. How will I ever get through this! I want to bang my head against the proverbial wall! What's the other popular post?

quote:

I suffered severe deprivation [and depression], emotionally. People think that's not a big deal because you cannot "see" it but it is kind of like slowly starving to death.

Yes.

Red, how did you come up with that name?

Which name?

"Red Tomato"

I think it was the name of a record label, and I liked how it sounded. Interestingly, I don't like tomatoes. Maybe that's a conversation with T.

VH,
This is tough stuff to work through. You have to keep going back, time and time again to discuss the feelings and keep working through them, and going to the actual source of the grief and feeling it and expressing it. The feelings do eventually lessen in intensity and get in the way less frequently but I do remember feeling like it was going to kill me at times the pain was so bad.

The other really popular post is my post on Erotic Transference. I also think you might find How do I fill the Void? and Therapy isn't enough helpful if you haven't read them yet.

Hang in there!

AG

AG, I made some real progress Tuesday from a lingering situation about another client who was given "my" long-standing appt time (3years). Reading your piece on insecure attachment prompted me to do more research. That is a major root issue of mine and it is extremely difficult to work through. I have a terrible time accepting this man really cares for me and will leave me and that fear turns to anger rapidly because that's what I know. But, looking at all the evidence, he REALLY cares; and I mean REALLY! We discovered that my massive negative reaction (huge) sprung from "primal" sibling rivalry with a major dose of infantile stuff attached. I am six out of nine children (7 girls, 2 boys) so no one got any individual nurturing.....ever. When my "replacement" came I thought T liked her more, pushed me to the side, she's better than me, she's more important. I went completely insane. Then I realized I had six females to contend with to garner any attention from my father (who I was petrified of). And this new female is replacing me!!! Now I understand the silent dynamic that catapulted my reaction and will begin to work it through. Some of the most random and unexpected and painful things we go through in therapy turn out to be "corner turners" and major times of serious growth and healing. Whew!!! Sorry for rambling.

VH,
You're not rambling, you're doing really good work. This is an excellent example of how to use what arises in the here and now relationship with your T and trace it back to understand the roots of the behavior and your beliefs. It is how we bring our unconscious into consciousness so we can change.

AG

AG, thanks. It does feel really good when another piece of the puzzled fits. Then last night I have the worst dream about T. Everything I've thought he was....he was not. One of those dreams where it was SO real. Now I must convince myself "it was only a bad dream". Thanks for the other recommended posts of yours. I've already read some of them. Very good.