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Well today I finally got in to see NewT and my head is just spinning. I am still struggling with having no connection with him. I think I've figured out that we do connect in a left brain type way... in that we can discuss things on an intellectual level. He is quite smart and VERY experienced clinically and I know he respects my knowledge as a patient. BUT... I don't NEED a left brain connection with someone I need a RIGHT brain, limbic and emotional connection with my T. That is what I found so healing about my work with oldT. And it was not something I had to "work" on developing with him it was just "there". I go in circles trying to explain this to others and I get so frustrated because it feels like I'm crazy and this was all in my head and I imagined it and I'm just being difficult by saying that I don't feel this with newT. And it makes me so angry at my oldT because he felt that if I had this connection and attachment to him it means that I can have it with anyone. That is so untrue!

What I need is to know that someone FEELS my stuff, my issues and my hurt. Not that they can digest it on an intellectual level and spit out some theory to me about why it's this way or that way blah blah blah. I need to SEE the emotional reaction of the T to what I'm talking about. New T does roll his eyes occassionally or crack a joke but I don't FEEL it. Actually, I don't feel anything but pain and fear. If I'm not crying from the overwhelming pain I'm terrified of everything and anything.

Tonight I felt very unsafe and I wanted to sit closer to the door of his office. In fact, I was already crying in the waiting room. I tried out the couch near the door but it was so darn uncomfortable I could not stay there. So I moved back to my chair and closed the blinds... too bright and too distracting looking outside. By the time he walked in I was looking down and crying and trying to get a grip on myself so I could talk. He said by the look of your head so down I guess you are not doing too well. I said to him I'm alive that's about all I can say.

I told him I had a really bad week and was doing a lot of crying. He seems to want me to get in touch with my anger at what my oldT did to me. I just cannot do that. Anger is so dangerous. And I just feel more hurt and confused than angry. I did tell him that I was angry at him for not being my oldT. I have already told him I don't like his office (which is a perfectly nice office) because it's not like oldT's office. Everytime I walk in there it is like having to face the abandonment all over again. I realize all over again that I'm forced to be there and not where I want/need to be. I can't help it. I just cannot turn off these feelings like a switch.

So he told me I have to work on me and decide to move on and I can't do it. I told him this and he said I CAN do it but I just don't want to. And so I said I cannot do this and maybe I don't want to but that is just how it is. He said he would accept that I'm not ready to. Again I asked him why he would take me as a patient since I'm not going to be easy and he smiled at that and said I would get a regular appt soon and that he was working on it and that he would offer me an additional one if he can find time in the week (cancellation I guess). This is still so hard for me not having access to therapy when I need it. I told him I was there because I didn't have any place else to go. And I also told him I feel like a freak because I can't find anything out there on the net about this type of situation where a patient is abandoned, turned over to the police and then cut off, banished like they did not exist. How can I not feel like I've done something terrible if my T called the police on me?

Of course he keeps telling me it is nothing to do with me but all to do with the way my old T screwed everything up in the worst possible way. I cannot accept that and I don't know why. It was my fault for not just driving way from the office that day. I ruined everything and I cannot stop blaming myself for how bad things turned out. I made so many wrong choices and decisions.

I was mostly talking to the floor and new T kinda yelled at me that he needed me to look at him and that he needed eye contact. I never had a problem with eye contact with oldT... I LOVED looking at him. We had very strong, intense eye contact and this was part of the right brain healing that I could FEEL happening inside of me. I don't look at newT because he is not oldT and I try to fool myself I guess if I don't actually "see" him I can pretent it's not him. You see how insane I have become? I have never felt so close to absolute "madness" as I have in these past weeks. It's like I'm losing who I was, I'm losing any sense of my identity as a person.

I told newT that I was so sad at losing my therapy and what and who I had become... the new part of me that was taking shape from being in the care of oldT. My sister says that new part of me is now in the deep freeze. I don't agree. I know it's there and if ever I feel it I reject it and have been working really hard to abandon that part of me because I HATE that part of me because that part of me caused my T to reject me. Any reminder or hint of who I was with him I need to kill off because the pain of it is intolerable. I cannot bear it. I asked newT how a person can be in so much pain and still be alive? I cannot even begin to explain to him how much I detest myself for what I allowed to happen to me. I told him if I was just some stupid, uneducated, unmotivated client I would still be there with my T. None of this would have happened. I cannot even go near any thoughts of anything good that happened to me with my oldT because I just break down and fall to pieces.

Today was one year of that session where I told my T that I wished I had grown up with a Dad like him and he looked at me seriously and said "you are". Those were the most powerful words he had ever spoken to me. I don't think if he had ever said I love you it would have been more powerful than those words. During that same session I told him he was awesome and he told me no YOU are awesome. I think I floated around for weeks from that and I can still hear him say those words to me but now they just cause me horrible grief and the realization of all that was lost to me. Taken away from me.

I finally just said to newT that I needed him to call old T and ask him for a few meetings so I can process what happened to us. New T said we would probably not get the meetings. My T would say too much time has passed or offer other excuses. So I told newT that he could either meet with me and settle things peacefully or talk to me in court. NewT seemed pleased that I said this... maybe he thinks this is how I am feeling my anger...? Who knows?? And so he said if I signed a release he would write my oldT a letter requesting my file (which I expressed concern about) and also some "transition" meetings. He said he didn't think oldT would want to meet with him as he would not be like D and sit there like a stone.

So he is going to send a letter and then if he does not hear anything he will follow up with a phone call. I really cannot imagine how oldT can ignore another professional and colleague in his request to help a patient. I really don't want to file a complaint or suit and would rather we work this out amicably and end up in a peaceful resolution. I know it would help me in my future therapy.

NewT is nice and helpful and supportive in some ways. He is the best I could hope for in my area. He is great on paper. I just wish I could FEEL something when I'm in session with him. And I wish I would feel a little bit better after a session. I don't. I just sit in the parking lot and cry then go home and make believe that I care that I'm alive.

So that's the update.
TN
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so feel for you.
really hard
so much grief still there and will be around for a while.
I like how New T is prepared to write and talk to old T and sees how badly you are have been treated.
My psychologist said he could not and would not comment on my old C because she is a colleague. Frowner He said I could 'talk about her' though.
Sigh.
I have to remind myself many many times a day that there are better people, better T's than the C I had, even though my younger self is more attached to her than anyone - I have to really work at this, otherwise I am going to cause myself unnecessary anguish.
I like your fighting spirit when you talk about seeing him in court, that's such a strong energy. He was SO WRONG.
Keep posting as we all want to know how you are doing.
I still like the sound of your new T. He sounds so competent.
That was beautiful, dragonfly .... written from the heart by someone who has been there and got through to the other side ....

I remember when I started with my new T, I spent a lot of time complaining about my old T and didn't feel the connection to new T either ... I didn't understand why things went so wrong between me and old T ..... and as usual, I blamed myself for things not working out ..... If only I had twisted myself this way or that way .... or I had done cartwheels or backwalkovers or pleased her in some way that I hadn't been able to ... I know I could figure it all out, just where I went wrong, if she gave me the chance ..... Confused what did I do wrong?

She didn't call the police on me ... but she did tell me I could never call her again .... OMG ... was I such a bad person? What the heck did I do to warrant such bad treatment? I'm going to therapy, for C's sake, trying to sort myself out and that's a good thing but now I am a criminal or almost? Was I that despicable? Thankfully for me, I had new T already ... and I didn't care if new T was an axe murderer, I was sooooo scared that I wasn't going anywhere ....

New T let me talk about her but I definitely sensed it was interfering with my connection with him ... and at some point, I had to let her go and let it go .... I've since come to realize that the Kubler-Ross 5 stages of grief apply to every loss, large and small, not just death .... even when I tell my kids no, they can't have candy ... at first they are in denial and then they get angry and finally when they get to acceptance, they move on ... and the harder I stick to my boundaries, the faster they go over it .... If I vascilate, they will try to take advantage of my weakness ... and I'm not doing them any favors by offering them hope ..... It's cruel ....

Anyway, I do see now why things didn't work out between me and old T .... I did really like her and wanted to please her but in some ways, thought she was ridiculous and couldn't really get her ... ... I wasn't being honest with my feelings abour her being ridiculous ... I just wanted to please her .... and she was pushing me too hard .... I think she identified with me from the things she has said .... and her boundaries were loose, loose, loose .... she didn't manage the transference stuff and so when I left her, I couldn't separate the pain from her ... So it wasn't about all me after all .... It was a combination of things .... the way she related to me, the way I related to her .... and maybe you will find that too TN someday ... maybe it's not all clear to you now .... why things didn't work ... or maybe it is .... but maybe someday you will be able to stop blaming yourself ..... Because you weren't the only one in the room ... there were two of you ....

we don't always know what's going on in other people's heads .... they don't always know what's going on in their heads ... actually, probably most of the time, they don't know what's going on in their heads ... and so even if they tell you what they think is going on in their heads, they may not be being honest .... and so, the only thing that really works is to be tuned into ourselves ... this is my current thinking ....and let other people worry about themselves .... and if they are mad at me but I know i didn't do anything wrong .... I have to let them worry about their anger .... and try not to be too angry in my interactions with others .... (I have to work on not being too rude to people because I think I always approach a new situation with the expectation that they will not like me and we all know about the self-fulfilling prophesies) When I can let go of trying to control other people, it feels so damn good ... like a huge weight lifted off my shoulders!!!!

Also wanted to add TN .... don't be so hard on yourself ... in terms of expecting a new connection right away .... it's not going to happen that fast .... and that's okay ... be okay with yourself where you are .... or try to ... I know the pain is intolerable .... Hope you find some peace today .... Smiler
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quote:
I was so pissed off at the end on last week i wrote a really stroppy no holds barred letter to faith.In it i let out every emotion and feeling that i have held in over the last 3 or so months...and god did i feel better for doing it i think i was so worried about losing her or losing any chance of going back to work with her again or losing her love for me that i kept my mouth shut.....i realised that that is what i did with my parents ,that actually this was different, she had hurt me terribly and done some ridiculous things and i told her so......do you know what she did? she text me and asked me if i wanted to see her...............today i am seeing her


Draggers thank you so much for coming on and writing this long and informative post to me. I am honored. And at least I'm relieved to know that things are going well for you.

What I quoted above is the difference between Faith and my oldT. She is willing to see you to have contact with you and even though you wrote her a stroppy letter (I'm not sure what this means but I think it means "angry" or "upset"??) she still had the guts to text you and offer a meeting. You have a choice. I don't have a choice nor has my letter to him ever responded to. And it was not an angry letter just a long discussion of my thoughts and how I connected things to the abrupt termination. Even NewT was impressed by my lack of threats and accusations and that I was perfectly reasonable. But he is still non-responsive to me. Maybe I should have written an angry, hateful letter to him. I don't know anymore what to do or how to survive this.

I am glad you can see Faith and I hope you come and tell us about it. I am not upset by what you wrote to me and it's all perfectly sensible and logical but the problem is that my emotions and feelings about myself and what happened are not so logical at all. Maybe I'm blocking anything positive from NewT because he is not oldT and I cannot let go. I know if feel unsafe ALL the time and therapy is not making me feel better. It makes me feel worse because I have to face talking to a stranger when I want warm fuzzy oldT who already knows about me and my history. I don't want to do this again... I really don't. This was not in the plan. The plan was to do it ONCE and be done with it. I don't want to go through all that agonizing about what to tell him and when and if I can trust him etc.

And I'm not getting any emotional right brain feeling attunement from him. I'm angry at him for asking me to look at him. I don't want to look at him I'd rather look at the rug right now. I want to pretend he is someone else. So when he told me to look at him I looked at him without seeing him at all... I just had my eyes in his general direction but maybe I was sort of dissociating because I know I didn't see him in any way that registered in my brain. In fact, I cannot even recall what he looks like. Have no idea what color he was wearing.

And so today I faxed him the Consent to Release information so he can get my file and speak to oldT. Then I freaked out because I don't want him to read my file without me checking it out first. There are things I don't want him to k now until "I" decide he is allowed to know and if he earns my trust then maybe he will know. And maybe I don't want to stay in therapy and will work through some grief and then leave anyway so why does he need to know this stuff. I just want my file because I want to see it for myself.

And so I wrote him a really angry email and told him all of this plus I told him that he needs to know upfront what he is dealing with and then I told him every awful thing I could think of about me and how hostile, damaged, defective, hateful, mistrusting, over emotional, demanding, overwhelming and angry I am. I warned him that I will test him to his limits and then some and I will try to make him terminate me like oldT did because I am too much for any T to want to have as a patient. I told him that my intelligence has turned into a curse instead of protection and that instead of protecting me my knowledge condems me. And he needs to tell me now if I am scaring him because I cannot do this again. So I am allowing him to stop this therapy right here.

I just got a response from his cell phone saying he got the email and fax and will respond to it in the morning. Guess he was going home now. Great...

Wanted to thank everyone else who responded. I'm so depressing I actually am shocked anyone even reads my threads. I know I'd avoid me like the plague or worse...

TN
TN ..... TN ..... TN ..... where do I begin ??? Even though I wasn't terminated by my old T, she told me I could never call her again ..... I felt like such a criminal .... no one really has ever told me not to call them again ..(maybe they've avoided me but didn't tell me not to call them again) ... was she afraid of me???? I must be an awful awful person to have that done to me .....

But your T called the police on you ..... That is 10 times worse ..... and I'm sitting here thinking ... what is it with these therapists ..... why, when things terminate do they get sooooooooooo DRAMATIC! Mine old T was dramatic ... but yours???? Calling the police???????? And, so I started thinking that their behavior was indicative of whatever emotion they felt inside .... whatever negative emotion they were feeling .... fear??? and while mine expressed her fear on a scale from 1-10 as a 2 or a 3 but yours ... as a 10 .... and that says to me that he was really really afraid .... not of you .... but of HIMSELF .....
Liese... I know my oldT was dealing from a place of fear but not sure what the fear was. After all... HE had all the power and I had none. I was weak from surgery and grief just sitting in my car parked outside on the street and crying from the awful loss I just suffered. What was there to be so afraid of that he needed to call in a "higher authority"? Maybe he was afraid of how badly he screwed me over and that he pushed me into being suicidal? He never even asked me why I was crying or offered to talk to me to help me or calm me down. He rushed at me with a very angry look on his face and said "what's the problem here?" I immediately felt afraid of him and like I was in some really bad trouble with him. I knew I was not in any condition to drive and so that is why I was still parked outside. If I was truly suicidal I would have driven away and off a cliff or into a tree or something. I was just scared, sad and in pain. I needed my T to help me not to abdicate responsibility to the police.

And so I can't shake the feeling that I am so scary and overwhelming that I will destroy anyone who tries to help me. That I will destroy any relationship because I am so toxic. This has been my history. It has replayed over and over.

How long did you know your female T who told you that? I'm truly sorry you had to experience that from her and hear that you could not call her again. NewT says that unfortunately, most Ts have NO idea how to handle a graceful and compassionate termination. This is an area that is not addressed in school or training and certainly there is very little literature about it on the internet. It's like their dirty little secret... when things get tough, just abandon the patient, cut off all communication and hope they are so injured and destroyed they will never pursue further contact or initiate ethics charges. After all they have so many options and excuses to hide behind. It's he said/she said stuff and hard to prove and after all... it's the patient who is crazy right? That's why we are in therapy! They get off scott free from any ramifications and we are left damaged, wounded, and fearful.

TN
TN ... My guess is that your T had a lot of projection going on there ... it wasn't you who was dangerous, it was him .... I can't believe he came over to your car .... you were just sitting there .... You should have called the police on him !!!!!

It's so wierd that they don't spend time in school on termination ... It seems like it should be a huge part of their training ... from the terminations i've seen here on the forum, the T's have handled it more poorly than most people do in life ..... most people just avoid the end of a relationship .... these T's highlight it ... dramatize it ... make it so much more painful than it has to be .... I am just realizing how difficult therapy can really be ... and when you get involved with people's psyche's ..... not to mention the therapists psyche's .... gosh .. it's a disaster in the making ... I'm actually amazed that there are successful stories out there ...

As for your question about how long I had known her, I think I went to her for about 8 months .. maybe 4 months to start and then I stopped and then another four months ... I really fell for her .... was really entranced .... and she kept poking me, trying to get a reaction out of me .... and she made a comment about not being able to get a reaction out of me .... so in the end, when i started having panic attacks, I was really pissed off because I felt like she was screwing with my emotions and I quit therapy ... actually, i had talked to a mental health friend of mine and told her some of the things this woman did, and she told me she was way out of bounds ... and she gave me the name of my new T ... so I started with my new T before I left her ... actually had appointments with both of them on the same day .... after I left her .... I wrote her a really nasty letter ... I was sooooo pissed that she could play with my emotions like that .... and then she called me ... and she kept telling me, oh ... now I really see what your mother did to you ... and I'm like, no it's you bit**, you did this to me .... anyway, then ... she told me that I needed to find a therapist and I told her I already had and that's when she told me that this was a professional relationship and I was never ever to call her again and that I wasn't welcome in her office ever again .... I'm lucky I had new T already and distrusted her sooooo much that I never wanted to go back to her .... I realize now that she was probably scared that I was setting her up ... or something because it was after I told her I had a new T that she said what she said .. but for a long time, I really thought I was frightening .... (well I guess I was if she was afraid I was planning some kind of malpractice suit ... ) ...

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