Hi Itshardtosay,
Welcome to the forums! Sorry I didn't say hi sooner, I just got off an insane work schedule and I'm afraid I've been MIA for a month.

I really related to your question because I've had a very long, very difficult relationship with my anger. I was sexually (and possibly physically) abused by my alcoholic father and in my family he was the only one allowed to get angry. And when he was angry, it almost always resulted in violence with the people and/or things around him getting hurt.

Getting angry when I was a child drew the kind of attention you just didn't want, so I learned not to get angry. But there was so much to get angry about, enraged even. I wasn't getting what I needed, I was neglected by one parent and being overstimulated by the other with my boundaries constantly being violated. There was every reason in the world to get angry, but it was an incredibly dangerous thing to do. So, my solution was to surround my anger with fear. Fear of what I would do if I let it out, who I would hurt, and the biggie, the belief that I would become my father. For the longest time, I perceived anger and violence to be synomynous until finally my T explained it so that I understood the difference. That you can get angry and express it without getting violent.

It makes sense to me that when the anger leaks out, you want to cut. You have no way to handle the anger and turning on yourself in order to express it probably seems like the safest way to handle it.

This is going to sound a little weird (of course that's normal for me ) but one of the most comforting things my T has ever said to me was that if he needed to he would call the police if I got out of control when I was angry, but he wouldn't be scared and he would make sure that neither of us was harmed. (Don't get me wrong, I've never come anywhere near making that necessary but at the time I was feeling really scared that expressing my rage would get out of control and I would hurt someone.)

OK, your questions. Allowing the rage to come up and be present was a long process for me and I had to learn three very important things before I could allow that to happen. The first was that I was angry. I could always be hurt, BUT I was never angry. I participated in a group therapy session of 15 weeks and there was another woman in the group who was ALWAYS angry but could NEVER express hurt, although it was obvious to everyone else that she was in a great deal of pain. Watching her allowed me to see, with the help of one of the facilitator's, that I was just as angry but was as incapable of expressing or acknowledging it as she was of her pain. When I realized that I fled from therapy. Disappeared on my T at that time with no explanation. A few years down the road I started to have anger problems with my children and was terrified I would start abusing them and she thankfully took me back. I literally called her and said "I found my anger, now what the hell do I do with it?" The second thing was doing enough work in therapy to actually realize that I had a right to be angry. That what was done to me was worthy of being angry about and that I was worthwhile enough that I could be angry about what happened. And I had to learn that anger was just another emotion. That my deep fear of anger wasn't based on reality, it was based on an outdated (but reasonable at the time) survival strategy, which was no longer valid or necessary. The last part was accomplished with a tremendous amount of input and patience on the part of my present T. There have been times where he has practically begged me to express my anger at him. His steadiness in telling me that anger was an emotion like any other and it was safe to express it to him has made a huge difference.

How do you make sure it doesn't get out of control? Find a safe place to express it and a safe person to express it to. I'm not sure about your background, but I know one of my problems was that I had never been taught to handle anger in a healthy manner, I had only seen violence and uncontrolled behavior. Getting angry with my T, and in his office, was where I have learned that I can express it without doing any of the things I fear. But a big part of that has been him welcoming my anger and letting me know that he had boundaries. Screaming was fine, using appallingly bad language was ok , but if I started to damage anything in the office or endangered myself or him, he would call for help. But even then, he made very clear, he wouldn't be scared, he would just do what was necessary to make sure we were safe. His assurances freed me up to express it knowing that I may not have felt like I could control it, but he would "contain" it and make sure it didn't get out of control.

How does the anger lessen and heal? I would say there are two stages to this. It is incredibly healing to just finally express the anger, to be able to express it and have someone hear you, understand it, and reflect back to you that the anger is justified and reasonable. There is a relief to finally being able to express it. And once it's expressed, at least in my case, I move beyond it to the pain and loss I felt over what happened that made me angry. Grieving that loss, and expressing the anger clears out space inside (I don't know how to put it any clearer) for things other than anger and frees up the energy you've been using to hold it in. And it relieves the pressure on the rage that's still there, making it less scary to let out more because it feels less and less likes its going to explode because its not under as high a pressure.

Answering this, in this way, makes it sounds like, this neat straight forward, do step one, then step two, then step three and you'll be fine. The truth is, it was a long, difficult, messy and seriously confusing process (read some of my past posts) and very cyclical in nature. I have to keep cycling back to the same territory but experiencing and processing more of my buried feelings each time. But its more than worth it. It was an amazing feeling the first time I was able to get angry at something my father did without first getting angry at myself and my T. (He has borne up under a lot of undeserved anger from me and has never gotten defensive which has been a tremendous help in allowing me to feel safe expressing it.)

I hope some of this might help.

AG

Wow, thanks for your reply. I'm going to read
this again tomorrow when I'm supposed to be working I also see my therapist tomorrow after work ...and anger is what i need to talk to her about.

I'll talk to you again soon.
It's getting late,

Itshardtosay

Itshardtosay-
First of all, welcome to the boards. I'm glad you've found this place and I hope you find it beneficial.

quote:

Anger is sitting behind a wall in me. It's unseen. But I think it's there because I can feel the pressure. I also think I'm terrified of it.

My therapist thinks I'm exerting an equally strong force to keep the rage contained. She said that I am unusually kind and compassionate to others for someone who's been thru so much....and that concerns her.

Sometimes some of it leaks around my barrier and when it does, I get urges to cut me.

Your comments above struck me. I also struggle with anger- accepting it, feeling it, being afraid of it, etc. I also used to be a cutter. Plus, I have heard my T say something similar to me about the amount of energy I am using to keep my emotions at bay/improperly contained.

I don't have specific answers to your questions, as I am still pretty new at working with my anger, but I can tell you what I have learned thus far. When I used to cut, it was because the amount of emotions/feelings inside me bubbled over my threshold. Growing up, my mother was the only person allowed to be angry- when anyone else got angry, they were excluded, talked about, yelled at, made fun of and hated-- unless you were feeling anger in accordance with my mother, then it was different and okay.

Needless to say, I didn't EVER express anger toward/in the presence of my mother. I held it all inside of me, fearing I would be like her if I ever let it out. But as a teenager, I was getting angrier and angrier and I had nowhere to put it. It kept building and building inside of me until I began cutting. It was the only way I knew to get any of those "bad" feelings out without being hated by my mother. Plus, I knew it wasn't safe to express these emotions to anyone esle. I used cutting for the next several years whenever I got angry. And if I was angry and couldn't cut right then, I had severe anxiety until I could cut.

I managed to get my cutting under control when I moved out of my house and began to get help from a T and a mentor. The first step for me was learning how to express any emotion verbally. Even the, I still had strong urges to cut, and still do at times, but with my current T, we are working on something that I find really helpful. She says that anger isn't what makes me want to cut, but it is the tension from the anger that does. She has taught (is teaching) me to separate the tension of the anger from the feelings that spark it. She also wants me to do physical activity to release that tension so i don't feel that restless need to take it out on myself. After the tension dissipates/gets released, the feeling is what is left over, and it is MUCH easier to talk about what upset me and why.

Lastly, the important thing to remember, something that AG said, is that these coping mechanisms we learned (hiding anger, running from it, fearing it, taking it out on ourselves) were ways we protected ourselves from unsafe situations as children. The problem is that we are safe now, but haven't changed how we are acting/coping. We aren't bad for not developing healthy expressions of anger... we are actually quite remarkable for devising schemes in which to keep ourselves safe. Now, with our T's we have to grieve all that we lost and learn to express all that emotion we've held back for so long. And we have to learn new ways to keep ourselves safe that apply to and work for our current situations. Hope your session goes well tomorrow.

-CT

I suffer from anger to. My T tells me as long as I vent it in a constructive way it's okay. When my anger gets out of control, I go outside and kick the fence or exercise very intensely and it helps. She told me with anger, there is way over to the right that is a little irritated and way over to the left is rage. She said the only reason to be way over to the left is if a loved one or yourself is in danger or being threatend. Like your child for example. She taught me that whenever start to get angry, examine the evidence. Why am I getting angry? How did it start. A good example, is I sent a fax and my T did not call me back until the next week. I started to get angry then I slowed down and examined the evidence. She could be out of the office, a family problem, there could be a number of reasons why she did not call. When I realized she was not ignoring me she may just not have gotten the message yet, my anger subsided. It turns out, she was out of the office. She also taught me to do mood monitoring. When you get up assess your mood from one to ten and put down how you are feeling at that moment. Monitor it throughout the day and keep track of it. Eventually, you will see a pattern of your anger start to develop. Then you can work on those times when you are mostly getting angry and why.I think anger is the hardest thing to work on. I stated therapy over a year ago. My friends and few trusted family members say I am not the same person I was a year ago. My anger is a lot better. Hang in there. If you stick to it and really work on it, you will see results in yourself. Gee for a college student, I sure can't spell sometimes. LOL.

quote:

Originally posted by Itshardtosay:
My Questions are:

1. How do you allow this kind of rage to come up and be present?

2. How do I make sure it doesn't get out of control if I can access it?

2. How does the anger lessen, how do you heal this kind of rage?

Itshardtosay

Hi Itshardtosay,

In my case, having a therapist who makes you very, very angry in a way similar to how someone from your past did is one way of getting it to come up, for good or ill, I'm not sure yet.

As for not letting it get out of control, I think this is a question for your T. I tend to cry and swear a lot, but I don't throw or break things. I think I'm just getting started on my anger, so I don't know how you heal from it. I'm guessing it takes some time, and depends on you as an individual.

Not too long ago I was complaining that I couldn't get angry at my therapist. Now I'm seething with rage and hatred toward him, and it feels pretty awful, so it can be very difficult.

Please keep us posted on how you're doing.
Russ

Hi IHTS

In a way I have asked my P those same questions and never really got an answer from her other than I need to 'own' the feelings, and then 'feel' them. I still ask her "What is that supposed to mean", but in the end I still have no idea.

I have a lot of anger and hatred in me as well and I hide it well until I get to that certain point (like this morning), when I feel like I leave my body, and watch myself from the sidelines.

So I understand where you are coming from for sure. When I started to see my P I was having major uncontrollable bursts of anger and mostly my partner and my brother (he's mentally and physically handicapped) got the brunt of it. When I told my P that I had been rough with my brother when he would act out, and yelling at everyone for no reason she made me see that I was becoming my mother. When she pointed that out I had my first (and last so far) A-HA moment. I never want to be my mother! So I have learnt to take alot of deep breaths and keep my anger to myself when others are home. Which gives my partner the impression I am getting better .. not! I had always been the most easy going and happy person you could meet before I snapped my crayon last year But today I was alone and I was set off by 2 long days of dealing with Gov't things and education things. I could hardly breath I was so angry. I actually cried - outloud (which I have maybe done 2x in my life). Perhaps a good thing ~ some progress in being able to show feelings?! I'm happy to be able to go to the gym and take all of my anger out on the equipment there, and it makes me work much harder to get the mad out So I spent three hours there kicking my own ass. Benefits me at least one way. So that's how I deal with it.

As for lessening it or healing it - thats what you are seeing your T for. Talk about it and see where it takes you.

Sorry that no one really has any concrete answers for you, but aske your T the same questions and see what they have to say.

Holly

Hi everyone.....thanks for all of your replies. They are really informative...I haven't discussed my personal feeling of anger with many others or related it to my therapy so this is great. It is awful though, that you all have to deal with this stuff too.

I went to my appt yesterday after work and it was really...stupid.
I tried to keep her at bay, was thinking maybe she doesn't know what she's doing and what if she can't handle me and all I bring to this? All the time there, I was distracted. I listened to me talk, tried to make sense back to her when she spoke, and at the same time was paying rapt attention to my own internal dialogue and the kid inside emotionally reacting to the pain that was coming up. I told her I heard something going on inside and she quickly got very interested...wanted to know what was happening. Too scary. Whew... It seemed surreal and I shut her out. My adult body was a barrier with me peeking out of my eyes all the time with the goal of keeping her outside and the kid me inside where it's safe.

Today I faxed her a one page blurb on how I feel about going there. This is the beginning of my 4th month in therapy with her....the worst part of it is that she's a shrink (I strongly dislike Dr.'s) and her approach is psychoanalytic.....she doesn't say much just lets me talk. I get myself in deeper and deeper. I wonder if I can ever forgive her for being a shrink?

Tomorrow I go again. I get so embarrassed. Eye contact is hard to do...and I always seem to be wondering if this is really necessary! Then the anger leaks around that barrier again and I feel wacky and like self abusing. I guess I have stuff that won't go away with wishful thinking.

Russ, I found it interesting that you feel rage and seethe anger toward you therapist...wow. Do you think it's working, I mean is it a healing relationship or has something gone amiss? Is this the transference people talk about here happening toward him? I wonder how I would handle that? It sounds VERY difficult.

Thanks for sharing your experiences with me in the 5 replies above. How great is that!

IHTS