LG, this is so timely.

I shared some of my BIG fears with my T last week, including exactly this situation - that she'd terminate before I was ready. She's never *promised* that she wouldn't do that, but she's said that she wouldn't be leaving me any time soon, she's in it for the long haul, and so on.

What I want (and need) is something in writing, an agreement of sorts, that our work together will terminate when we both mutually agree it is time. I literally want her to say "I will not terminate you, no matter what you say or do. When you are ready to leave, we will work together to ensure that it is positive, and if you ever want to return, my door will always be open."

I can dream, right?!

DF,

I'm right there with you on the "yes, she's said this but I don't know yet how it will play out". I guess I should have added that as an option to the poll, lol.

R2G,
I like the idea of getting something in writing. I've gotten in text form and voicemail form that I can go back and replay or look at, but I think what you are referring to is a contract of sorts. That would really nice to have. But on the flip side, I would not want my T to be bound by contract, but would prefer to know that they are my T because they continue to choose to be. I would feel better knowing that although they have the option of terminating my therapy, they won't because they meant it when they said they won't terminate my therapy.

T2 has not told me that she will never terminate my therapy and oddly, I worry far less about her terminating my therapy. I think it has more to do with how much I love T1 though rather than any lack of promises that I would perceive as false assurances.

T has told me repeatedly that she will not give up on me and that we are in this together. She has said that the absolute LAST thing she would want is an abrupt, unplanned, unwanted termination and to know that if that ever happened it would only be because of circumstances well beyond her control and that I could rest assured that she didn't want that (illness or death is what she was talking about here).

I really don't think T would terminate me, but I constantly worry about something happening to her to cause an unplanned ending.

Oooh, LG, I would love to have it via text or on my voicemail! Voicemail would be great, as if I felt anxious, I could play it. Don't need a contract, per say, just something that I can use to reassure myself when I freak out (which I am currently doing, as I realized I have 4 more sessions left before a two week break - yikes!)

STRM,

Sometimes, when I am believing that T1 will never terminate with me, I wonder how the therapy will ever end then. Death came to mind and I though oh dear god. What would be worse? T1 dying or T1 terminating with me? I honestly don't know. I've become so freaked out by the idea of her sudden death that I've actually asked her how I will be notified if/when she dies. Gosh, she must think I'm so crazy!! She gave me a name of a colleague who will notify me if something were to happen. I sort of want to enter that colleagues phone number into my phone so that I know to NEVER answer the phone should that number pop up on my phone!

quote:

What I want (and need) is something in writing, an agreement of sorts, that our work together will terminate when we both mutually agree it is time. I literally want her to say "I will not terminate you, no matter what you say or do. When you are ready to leave, we will work together to ensure that it is positive, and if you ever want to return, my door will always be open."

Having it in writing is not worth the ink it takes to print it out. I had this in writing from my oldT... numerous times in emails. He wrote "I promise to be there, not matter what, and if at any point things seem to be not going well, we will fix it" and then he wrote "if you are worried about any rejection, you can forget about it because it will never happen".

Yeah we see how well that all worked. It does not matter so much what they say but what they do and how they behave. A T can say anything they want and then change their mind. I don't want to scare anyone with discussing what happened to me I just want to make you aware to be on the lookout for red flags instead of hanging onto promises that may or may not be empty ones.

If your T is over their head and not skilled or knowledgeable in the type of issues you have, that is a red flag. Inconsistency or sloppy boundaries is a red flag. Enmeshment is one. Catching them in lies is a biggie too.

My current T will never promise to never terminate me but he tells me he does not terminate patients, they leave when they are ready. He tells me things to look out for within our relationship that should be warnings to me. He also wants me to be able to take him in as much as I can in case something terrible or unforeseen should ever happen to him (okay that part freaks me out a little) I will be able to keep him internalized within me.

Admittedly, I am very skeptical of any T who would promise anything any more, but at least I have learned a lot and my current T is helping me recognize when relationships are failing so I don't stay in them and can leave in order to protect myself.

This is a very hard quesition as it involves trust and I think it varies in each individual therapeutic relationship.

Just my 2 cents
TN

TN,

I was hoping you would weigh in on this. It was specifically things your T promised you that I came across in an old thread that had me spinning about the very same things my T1 says to me.


I am wondering though, what sort of lies did you catch your T in? (only if you are comfortable sharing of course).

I voted "yes and they broke their word", even though he never said that he would never terminate, but did say things like that he will be there till i'm ready to leave... i had even asked him what would happen if i moved or had to switch therapists and he still said he would be there for me with as much outside contact as i need... He did break his promises, but it's okay now. I know how sorry he is and our relationship is not only back to where it was at our best, but also much more honest and real now.

Yes and then mine left.

My T has said and or texted:

-He won't leave me.

-He'll never send me away. He never has done so with a client and can't even imagine a scenario in which he would.

-I will be the one who decides if/when I'm ready to leave. He won't push me out.

I mostly believe him. His boundaries could use some more transparency, but he seems very honest and humble. Still, part of me is certain that I'll be too much some day. Then again, based on my own opinion, that would have been months ago!

LG
My T never flat out promised because he knew there were things out of his control (no one can promise not to die for instance) but he did reassure on a regular basis that he wasn't planning on going anywhere. He also very clearly told me on number of occasions that I was welcome to come see him as long as I wanted to, he would never ask me to leave and I would never be sent away(I had that one in writing.). He also told me that it was OK to discuss any and all of my feelings in his office.

He carried through on every one of these promises. But he was also very patient with the fact that I didn't trust any of it until he demonstrated the truth of all those statements over the long haul.

Oh and he promised to never lie to me, and as far as I know he never broke that one either. He's a quite extraordinary human being.

I told my T one day that I was scared she was going to tell me I couldn't come anymore. She asked me if I had another T tell me that. I told her no (I've not had any other Ts). She said she has heard of other Ts doing that. She said, "I don't tell my clients that." Then she started talking about "some people" and "your best interests"....I wasn't following, I was so stuck on 'okay, she wasn't going to tell me I couldn't come anymore.' That day I talked about it I was terrified. I went through three sessions in a row where I was terrified of abandonment. I told her that I was terrified of "the end" (when I wouldn't see her anymore). I told her I wanted, so many times in the past months, early on, to quit coming because it was only going to get harder to quit going. She asked me if I was feeling like she was abandoning me and I said, "Yes." She said, "Then it is too soon." "Won't I always feel like that, at the end?" "No," she said. I guess I must have finally either (1) trusted her or (2) believed her or (3) both, because after three sessions of fear of abandonment, I moved on. I have huge fear of abandonment issues.... I've been with her 11.5 months.

quote:

I am wondering though, what sort of lies did you catch your T in? (only if you are comfortable sharing of course).

LG... well I guess right now I feel like my entire therapy was a lie. He lied about those very things I quoted above. He said I was not overwhelmng, he told me he would never lie to me, not even to make me feel better, he said he would not let me drown, he said he could never imagine getting angry with me, he said I could forget about him ever asking me to leave, because that would never happen, and on July 6th I called him on the phone and point blank asked him if he was going to terminate me and his answer was "no, not at all". Five weeks later he abandoned me.

So I am left believing that everything was a lie and it's very painful to have this belief because I worked really hard in therapy and was as open and honest about everything. Oh yeah, he made me promise to bring him all my feelings and that it was okay to talk about anything in there and that I was safe. Right. He could not handle my feelings at all. So how can I believe anything that happened in there? I am left not knowing who I am or what I did and whatever good came from that therapy I have to push away and disavow because I hate that person who got terminated. So I am left in some limbo world of not being able to acknowledge who I was becoming in those 3 years of therapy and trying to forget or abandon that person as well.

I know my T is trying really hard to get me to see I was not to blame and that the good things I accomplished and the person I was becoming was MY work and that I should acknowledge it and accept it and not reject it. But it's a long hard slog to that place and I'm not sure I will ever get there.

I didn't mean to make this thread about my saga. I do apologize if I'm triggering anyone, but most of you know the story by now anyway. Evidently, this traumatic experience did not make me give up on therapy itself but I have been very very careful about trusting anyone, even a T and not sure I will ever really trust my T now, even though he probably is very trustworthy. I know that I am blessed to have found him.

TN

I have been told by one of mine that she will not kick me out. I have not asked the other one, but the other gave list of things like physical assault, stalking and payment as types of rules when I asked. My first T, over 25 years ago, terminated me as being an awful client but a good person so we went hiking for many years after she ended therapy with me until she moved out of state.

quote:

Where is the 'Yes, but I don't believe them' option? Hehe. I couldn't say Yes and they kept their word because... I'm not done therapy yet so I really don't know if she will or not.

Ditto to this. My T has promised me she won't leave me, that I will be the one who chooses to leave when I am ready, and that I don't have to leave until then. But on the other hand, I know that eventually she is going to retire...so I don't think she can really keep this promise.

Yes, and she broke her word and terminated me

she said she wouldn't. Over and over she reassured me she was there for me.

she said "I've never terminated a client before, I just can't see doing that".

she said just because we disagree doesn't mean she'd stop loving me or wanting me there.

she told me to trust her

she couldn't understand why I never believed her


as she was terminating me she said "I was ready to be in it forever, but I just can't"

and then it was over

I'm very sorry Forlorn. It hurts to remember all the broken promises. It just hurts.

Sending you hugs
TN

Mine did. and he kept his promise, but kind of just stopped meeting me where I needed him to so that I would leave on my own.

My T has said I am not going anywhere. I have told my T about my fear of not telling me the truth and my T has verbally promised me that I should not worry.

I did have a 6 month contract with my T in writing that I wrote, with an agreement of staying with the T and trying to trust my T.I also had in there that I would not SU and work with her. My T agreed to trust me when I said I was fine and not jump to the conclusion that I was not and call the police on me(I had one incident with her on this and it REALLY upset me). My T signed the contract too.

Problem now is that the 6month contract ended last week,right at her vacation time and I would not agree to sign another one with her.That is why she wanted my husband at the last session to make sure he understood my situation .

I told her I was done with T but so she would leave me alone I agreed to schedule an appt. on the 27th but I am not sure if I will go.

LW

I had a small rupture with T1 over the weekend and skipped my therapy yesterday and today. She texted me tonight,

T1: "Do you want to talk tomorrow at 1pm?"

me: I am scared to. I'm worried you are going to terminate my therapy when we talk.

T1: I won't. I promise. I'm not punitive.

me: Ok. I don't totally believe you, but ok we can talk tomorrow.

T1: I wouldn't do that to you.

me: That's what people say right before they do the one thing they promised never to do.

T1: I hope that someday, you will believe me. I will never terminate your therapy and I will never give up on you.



So, I guess time will tell if she is telling the truth. She hasn't terminated my therapy so far in all of the years I've worked with her. But I fear that someday, those words will only come to haunt me.

quote:

Originally posted by permafrost:

I did vote Yes and they broke their word because I was not ready to leave. But it wasn't exactly a "get out, I don't want to see you anymore". She did say she doesn't recommend me staying and did say it would be difficult to get more sessions from the insurance. She denied having said she didn't recommend staying, but I know that it would have been no problem to get more sessions.

It was mixed messages I got from her so my situation is not black & white.

You certainly did get mixed messages from her. I feel like she is one of those people who finds loopholes to get out of their word. I'm sorry you were victim to that, PF.

quote:

He's been careful not to promise what he can't promise -- to always be there. This actually makes me trust him more, not less

BG, I know exactly what you mean about not getting promises being more comforting to you. My T2 doesn't give promises and in a way, its sort of reassuring. I guess perhaps because if and when she does term me, I won't look back at broken promises and feel betrayed. Whereas if T1 were to term me after all of her promises...I'd be so crushed and it would really affect my ability to believe anything anyone promises to me in the future.