Hi Spagirl,

I'll take a try at it. First let me say that I up until 40 had basically been alone all the time. Lived alone, worked alone, driving truck solo, so was alone almost all the time and I was so very lonely all the time as it sounds like you are. The only time I interacted with anyone was when I had my hour break with the guys in the lunchroom.It all nearly did me in but I finally put an ad in a singles paper and found someone. We were together, married for 8 years. He was completely wrong for me but at least I was not alone!!!I have a very nice son by him who is fairly normal, surprisingly.

Anyway, long story short, I met another man while at work and we were together for 2 years, spent every weekend together and then married. We have been married for 12 years now and we have issues; that is why I am here. I am in "like" with my P but that is another story...

The point of my life story is if I could find 2, I feel like you could also do it.

I probably wouldn't do the personals ads again, although I got at least 75 replies and they all were very nice men. Nope, I probably would do it again. There are a lot of men out there just waiting for a nice lady like you. All you have to do is find each other.
Have you though about some of the online dating type places? They have an excellent track record of successes.

Also, think of things you are interested in; reading? join a book club. Working out? join a fitness club, have a dog? join a training class. Drive a car? sign up for a class on fixing it... The opportunities are endless.

If I, ( a formerly incredibly shy female) could find 2 guys to marry, one at 40 and the other at 52, I am sure you could do even better than I did. I think most stats are against older single women marrying but go for it anyway!!!

RE: the MD you were/are interested in. It kind of sounds as if there is some interest on his side but I think there are probably some regulations against them having a relationship with patients like there are about P's and T's having something with their patients.

Now, go out and find some nice guys. Try the grocery store; ask that guy standing over there how he fixes artichokes...

GOOD LUCK. And, be careful, just as there are lots of nice guys out there; there are also lots of jerks and worse.

Write back if you like. I will be here for moral support and your cheering section.

I'll be thinking of you, Lorena

Hi Spa Girl,

Nice to meet you, and welcome back. I’m new here since the last time you posted. How do you cure loneliness is not a small question...it’s like how do we solve world hunger, or establish world peace. It’s huge. I love Lorena’s ideas and I think she’s absolutely right. Ultimately to cure loneliness, or at least lessen it, we have to go out and try to make the connections we want. But it can be so hard to do that, especially when we try and fail.

And it sounds like that’s what happened with your doctor. You were connecting so well, the connection was building up momentum, which led to expectations for more...and now the bottom fell through. OUCH. I really get that feeling of getting your hopes up, and then being disappointed. I’m really sorry you’re hurting right now.

So loneliness, for me, involves having the expectation of a connection with someone else, and not having that expectation met, or having the connection lost. It’s wanting something I can’t have. On the one hand, I really enjoy solitude...I never have a problem finding something to do when I’m alone. I don’t feel lonely because I’m not expecting connection. But I feel lonely in a group of people if I want to connect and for some reason I can’t. I feel lonely more often since I’ve been married than I did when I was single because I want to connect with my husband, but we don’t connect well. I’ve been feeling really lonely lately because I thought I was building a connection with my T, but that just suffered a fatal disruption and now I’m questioning whether it was even real.

And even though I like solitude, too much of it can cause a loneliness of its own because I’m not getting the limbic regulation and resonance I need from others. Others on this board have posted about how we are created for relationships and how important it is to make connections with others at a “limbic” or emotional level. But I fear attachment because I fear the horrid pain of abandonment and rejection (it never seems to heal once it happens), so I have a strong tendency to avoid the connections I need – I am a champion isolator (I'm also especially good at fantasizing about the connections I'd like to have, which can sometimes make reality even lonelier). Now, I don’t ever get “too much” solitude anymore since I got married and had kids , but when I was single I would periodically break down and cry for no other reason than I just didn’t feel “real”. Looking back, I think my self-imposed isolation sometimes put me in a state of limbic starvation. Now, when I’m not connecting with my family, which I’m afraid is much of the time, my loneliness is more like a limbic dissonance or noise that I want to run away from – leading to more isolation and loneliness. It’s a vicious cycle.

One thing that seems to work even better than seeking a connection for myself, is to try to think of someone else’s needs and do something for them. Unfortunately I don’t think of this solution as often as I should. But when I do, it takes me out of myself and I forget about my loneliness for a little while. And if I’m lucky, I might even make a connection. But if I don’t, that’s okay because I wasn’t expecting one. But at least it relieves my loneliness for a little while.

Thank you for telling us what happened and for putting your question out there. I look forward to reading others’ answers on this. And please keep us updated on how you are doing.

Take care,
strummergirl

WOW! Those are both two really good replies. We seem to be going through the same things.


It is the lack of connection that makes going out so lonely. I do have the propensity to lock myself in my cave from time to time. But this year I made a pledge that I would get out and socialize more - not to meet a man, but simply to get out and have some fun. I found a Meetup group of over-40, single people who shared that same intention, so I joined (and I am, historically, NOT a group joiner). We did a lot of fun activities this summer, but as the events progressed I became more and more bored. I wasn't connecting to anyone. It's really dull going out to sit and watch TV as the people around you continue to drink and laugh, but no one is talking to you. So I went home. I am going to one more event soon. It's a trivia night, so I figure, at least it will be more active.

Lorena, I'm glad that you had success with the online thing. I have been involved with all of them for well over a decade, and nothing ever comes of it (e-Harmony, Match.com, OKCupid, Chemistry.com, etc.). It gets so pathetic, that I have to stop trying. I think E-Harmony finally said I was "unmatchable". It speaks to what Strummergirl says about hopes, and expectations, and wanting a connection; then the disappointment when none of that happens. That is EXACTLY what the problem is with my crush that developed into deeper feelings.

I was very cautious about allowing myself to think of him as more than a crush, because I wasn't sure if he was married or not. I've been down that road before - the last person I deeply cared for was married and it took me 15+ years to get over him. I don't have that kind of time to waste anymore. In fact, even though my Mother told me he [the Dr.] was married, I corrected her and said with all confidence, "He was married. He's divorced now. IF he is married, he does a great job of hiding it." Gosh I hate it when Mom is right.

You are so right about the momentum. After all the bad experiences I have had with men - ever since the first boyfriend at 18 who cheated on me, in front of me, and tried to lie to me about what I had just seen - to the last attempt at online dating with a guy I normally would never have considered (looks/background/personality), but at this point I'm willing to give anything a try -- I have been VERY reluctant to delve into a real, deep, relationship (although that is what I want more than anything). Men, typically scare the hell out of me. Meeting that last online guy for our first date took all my nerve. But it went smoothly, so my confidence grew and we had a few more (platonic) dinner dates until he just sort of fizzled. But with the doctor, it was a different story.

I first met him many years ago when he was my Mother's doctor. He walked into the room to check on her after surgery and I took one look at him and went "WHOA! WHOis THAT? Whammo! Fast forward to last year and it was still intense and exciting seeing him. At first I would just make jokes about having a sexy doctor, and frankly, enjoyed the fun of it all (not in front of him, of course, just to myself and maybe a few other people). Then as we have spent more time together, each visit I'm hooked a little more. He seems to like me. Comments like "You look pretty today." He came up behind me once and said, "You have BEAUTIFUL hair" then made a sexy little grunt. I mean, my straight-dar is out of whack, but isn't that flirting? He is very quick witted, smart and funny and I so enjoyed getting back to work to brag on him. It felt good. I wrote of how he has made it through my armored guards and is now melting my mortar. If I'm not careful, he will be in the castle soon and I will be VULNERABLE - Watch Out! All of this would be terrific news had he been single, or hell, separated even, I can wait! But now all that hope, excitement and possibility has come to a screeching HALT! It's devastating. I don't meet people who excite me. I was telling my friend how he is the first person since the main one in 1988 (the "married" one, of course) that I've been this interested in - that's over 20 years ago!!! I have felt nothing for no one for 20-YEARS!!! Now I have to go back into my cave and forget about the whole idea of possibility. I was so looking forward to the day when one of us got the courage to ask the other one out, and the potential in that moment. I envisioned going to sleep with him, waking up with him, discovering what he drinks in the morning, does he eat sushi, of not being alone for the first time ever, of potential ... of hope. Who will I conjure up at night? Whose face will I look for in every car that passes? Who will I think of when I window shop and see shirts that he would like? When I see a bird, or a butterfly, or a flower, or am out in nature taking a walk, who will I think of?

As I have obsessed over this loss all week, the thoughts that come to mind are: "Why?" Why has he never once mentioned being married? Every sentence is first person: "Idrove to Chicago. I had salad last night. I...." Never "We" or "my wife and I". Why did he, during one phone conversation, mention his EX-wife? He could have said, "My first wife" or something else to indicate that he was actually married now to another woman. I would like to believe that he is a saint, but he is a MAN, so it has recently come to mind that maybe he never mentioned it because he likes women thinking he's available. Maybe his doctor's ego is so huge that he gets his kicks out of having a wife at home and girls swooning over him all day at work. I thought that after 20-years my instincts would have improved. That's all we have, our thoughts, our feelings, our instincts, our common sense. Well, why then, if my intention is to develop a healthy, harmonious, coupling with a SINGLE, STRAIGHT man, does my entire being lead me to another dead end???

I wondered if I was imprinted as a baby? My Mom and Dad had a tumultuous relationship, one where she swears he had girlfriends. Did I, as a child, translate what I heard as "Being married causes yelling and pain, but being the girlfriend - the other woman - sounds like a lot more fun."? Is that why, despite all my efforts, I am only attracted to the married man, the unavailable???

Has 20+ years of solitary confinement made me crazy? I'm beginning to believe that we were planted here by aliens, and like we watch TV for entertainment, they watch us. It's one big joke and someone somewhere is getting a huge laugh off our misery. "Ha Ha. We got her that close and she really thought things were going to change for the better then, whoosh, we pull the rug out from under her - ha ha ha ha ha!" Cruel Joke.

I mentioned him to a male client and without even knowing the who I was referring to, the client said, "Don't get your hopes up." I thought, "No, I WANT to get my hopes up". He was right, though. I wanted so badly for the thoughts in my head to be true, that I allowed myself to feel again: to care again. I should have known better.

Was this just the case of a flirty, jokester guy who I took too seriously? Did I make this whole thing up?

Hi Spagirl,

(((Spagirl)))

I send you lots of hugs...

I feel your sadness. I wish I could help you find your soulmate. I am sure there is one out there for you. I will try again since I zeroed out the last time.

Now, I don't want you to take this the wrong way because it is certainly meant in a kindly way but sometimes when someone is wanting something really badly, they come off as really being needy or desperate and lots of the time, men or women will be turned off immediately by that and overlook the best thing that could ever happen to them.
I am going to feel absolutely terrible if you took that the wrong way as it was not meant to make you feel badly.

That having been said, I would just concentrate on going out and having fun and not looking to find a potential mate. I had to force myself to do that. I was the shyest person in the world ( when I was a kid, and someone came to our house, I would hide in the backyard, now that is shy..) and now, since I pushed myself to do it, I can walk up to any man and talk to him about anything.

Try to find some interest you are very passionate about; politics, animals needing homes,tutoring kids who need some help, football, anything... When you are passionate about something (anything) you become a more interesting person. I could see some really nice guy thinking "Hmmm she could be passionate in all facets of her life". and "She looks like someone I would like to get to know better". That really sounds simplistic and stupid, I know.

Just don't sit at home waiting for Prince Charming to show up and sweep you off your feet. You have to go out and do the meeting on your own.

Good Luck and remember when you are not looking for it, sometimes when you least expect it; it finds you... Lorena

quote:

Originally posted by SpaGirl:
I wanted so badly for the thoughts in my head to be true, that I allowed myself to feel again: to care again. I should have known better.

Was this just the case of a flirty, jokester guy who I took too seriously? Did I make this whole thing up?

(((((SpaGirl)))))

Been there, done that, I'm there again right now. Pining after an old BF from 25+ years ago is what got me into therapy a year and a half ago. Other than my husband, I never had another serious relationship. Just lots of worshiping from afar in my 20's. The other reason I'm in therapy is to try to improve my marriage, because I married a man who I do not feel a natural connection to, and after 10 years of white-knuckling it, something's gotta give.

quote:

I wondered if I was imprinted as a baby?

Had to laugh at that one...I've wondered EXACTLY the same thing many times about myself.

The last eight months of therapy motivated me to read a lot of books about psychology, and something called transference, and attachment. Members of this board have explained (better than I can here) how attachment injuries when we're very young can set up patterns of attachment later on. Longing for men we can't get doesn't really have anything to do with them; it's a longing for something else, something we didn't get as children. Looking at our feelings for the therapist within the context and boundaries of therapy, with a therapist who can stay neutral, not take the feelings personally, but help guide us back to where these feelings are coming from, can allow us to process it, grieve it, so we don't have that yearning anymore. At least that is my understanding...Attachment Girl, True North, and others on this board have explained it from their experience and if you haven't already, I strongly encourage you to read through some of their posts that explain this.

I thought that was the kind of therapy my ex-T was doing with me, but something went wrong and it turned into a reenactment of the same old patterns. It was my old BF all over again...looking back, I'm pretty sure he is the same "type" of guy I'm always enchanted by: flirty, funny, intelligent, charming...he sounds just like your doc. When I described on this board what happened with my ex-T, the general impression I got back is that he was enjoying my attention to him. This means he was taking my feelings personally. The right thing to do in that case is transfer the patient to another T, which he did, although he did it badly, so badly that now I'm not even sure he was doing therapy when he was asking me about transference. Still, it's better than the alternative, which is where the T takes advantage of the patient's feelings and, well, you can just imagine. The worst thing that happened is that I didn't get the healing I was hoping for, the help for my marriage (which is what we went for originally) got pushed back even farther, and all my old hurts got triggered, again. I think my ex-T might even BE one of those aliens you mentioned. (Now that I think about it, he DID say he was a Trekkie...hmmm...)

Your doctor is in the same type of unequal relationship with you, and from your account, it sounds like he was enjoying your attention, too. His not mentioning his wife sets off a red flag for me. He may very well enjoy letting women think he's available, and the attention he gets. After what just happened with my ex-T, everything in me is screaming, RUN. Fast. It's not real. I'm so sorry you are hurting, and disappointed...but I'm also glad you didn't get hurt worse. One thing I'm slowly waking up to is that there's never a happy ending when there's red flags like this.

The accounts on this board have given me the hope that I can find a T who can help me heal the longing, wherever its coming from, so I can be free to love my husband the way he deserves. I don't know if your patterns or feelings are coming from the same place, but they sure sound familiar to me. I hope you can find some freedom from them, too.

Take care,
strummergirl

quote:

Originally posted by strummergirl:
But I fear attachment because I fear the horrid pain of abandonment and rejection (it never seems to heal once it happens), so I have a strong tendency to avoid the connections I need – I am a champion isolator (I'm also especially good at fantasizing about the connections I'd like to have, which can sometimes make reality even lonelier). Now, I don’t ever get “too much” solitude anymore since I got married and had kids , but when I was single I would periodically break down and cry for no other reason than I just didn’t feel “real”. Looking back, I think my self-imposed isolation sometimes put me in a state of limbic starvation. Now, when I’m not connecting with my family, which I’m afraid is much of the time, my loneliness is more like a limbic dissonance or noise that I want to run away from – leading to more isolation and loneliness. It’s a vicious cycle.

I'm very new here, and so right now I'm just trying to get a feel for this forum. I'm not real good at talking (or typing) in the same words for what I am thinking, but just reading this paragraph, but WOW.. this sounded so familiar to how I feel most of the time, with the exception to the part of the husband and kids....

But the whole thing, the fantasizing about the connections you would like to have, the part about just breaking down and crying. I tend to hold most of my emotions in, but over the last few months its been harder and harder for me to do.

But this really describes how I feel so much of the time, its kind of scary... this is how I feel, but just haven't been able to express in my own words.

Hi Spagirl,
It's good to hear from you again, although I'm not happy about the reason. I'm sorry about the way you're feeling, loneliness can be so difficult to handle. Although I agree with SG, some of the worst loneliness I have experienced is within my marriage because once you're married you're not supposed to be lonely anymore right? It turned out for me, that I was unconsciously holding my distance from everyone because being close in relationship when I was small and my relationship template was being set up, led to pain, confusion and grief. So on a very deep primitive level - certainly not a conscious one - I decided that I need to keep my distant from everyone. But as humans, we need connection. We actually have an open physiological system so that when we're in contact with other human beings, our physiological systems interact. Human babies will die for lack of contact. So we get caught in an impossible bind. Driven to seek connection while our mind screams at us that we are doing something truly dangerous and life-threatening.

I'm going to comment on some of the stuff that you said, but I know I don't know you that well so I could be totally off base, you'll have to decide if what I'm saying is correct and/or helpful.

What I hear when I read your posts is a very strong independent woman who has prided herself on not having to depend on anyone. Maybe because a long time ago you learned just how badly that worked out. And although I completely understand and sympathize with your loneliness and know that you're consciously trying to do all kinds of things, including joining groups you're not all that enthusiastic about, it's not working because on an unconscious level you've decided you can't get close. That the only kind of men to whom you find yourself attracted are married because it's safer that way. It's a lot harder to move closer to someone who's not available. Please understand, I don't think you're doing this consciously, I think you're being driven by things you learned a long time ago and aren't aware that you even operating on these precepts. And the reason you keep picking these men? I think you probably put your finger on it in talking about your parents. The book, the General Theory of Love talks about our inability to "see" people who are good for us, if we experienced something else when we were small. I have included a quote below that I think might apply here.

quote:

"Zeroing in on how to love goes hand in hand with whom. A baby strives to tune in with his parents, but he cannot judge their goodness. He attaches to whoever is there, with the unconditional fixity we profess to require of later attachments: for better or worse; for richer, for poorer; in sickness and in health. Attachment is not a critic; a child adores his mother's face, and he runs to her whether she is pretty or plain. And he prefers the emotional patterns of the family he knows, regardless of its objective merits. As an adult his heart will lean toward these outlines. The closer a potential mate matches his prototypes, the more enticed and entranced he will be -- the more he will feel that here, at last, with this person, he belongs."
[SNIP}
"A relationship that strays from one's prototype is limbically equivalent to isolation. Loneliness outweighs most pain. These two facts collude to produce one of love's common and initially baffling quirks: most people will choose misery with a partner their limbic brain recognizes over the stagnant pleasure of a "nice" relationship with someone their attachment mechanisms cannot detect."

Forgive me, I can't remember if you're going to therapy right now, but if I was to offer a solution, it would be to find a good therapist who has experience with attachment issues. You need to find someone who will allow you move close in relationship and watch what happens and what you do, so you can understand what you do, why you do it and be able to change what you want to change. I think one of the main points of therapy is to "re-wire" your limbic brain and attachment mechanisms through your relationship with your T so that a healthy relationship, someone who can provide what you need and you be able to receive it, is "visible" to you and feels like home. I don't think there's a problem with the person you are, I think there's a problem with what you were taught about relationships and how they work and what happens to you if you're in one.

AG

Some good news, I am cursed for all eternity, just as I suspected. I mean that with a sense of humor, even if it doesn't read that way.

This has been HELL week. I woke up today with a fresh mind - gone are the romantic dreams - I awake alive in my singledom. Kittens and pillows forever!!! Unfortunately, what many of you are saying is ringing true. I'm wired wrong. I WAS imprinted as a child, and yes, we CAN blame our parents for EVERYTHING! (lol)

See, not only did daddie and mommie fight all the time, they were a mess waaaay before I ever got here. And, at the age of 3.5 daddie and mommie were separated and daddie got drunk and decided to kill mommie (and me and granny and himself, apparently) but mommie shot him first - right through the brain - third eye, if I'm not mistaken. Wheeeeeee! What a wonderful start to a new life! So glad I dropped everything to come here.

And, yes, I have taken thousands of hours of therapy with a huge selection of therapists, starting in my teenage years when the court made me and my mom and step-dad go to counseling after my step-dad followed me down the street and beat the crap out of me in front of my whole neighborhood kids! Of course step-dad never went to therapy (and was never punished for beating a CHILD - he had $$$$$ - with money you can do whatever you want.), and mom only stayed for as long as we were talking about how I had ruined her marriage. As soon as the debate turned to what part she plays in all this, she literally got up, and walked out never to return! How's that for family support? And ever since, I have sought help from one person or another, finally realizing that I am smart enough to figure this out without them - and get it right better than all of them. So for a million hours I have taken the time to sit and think, and meditate, and take country drives, and talk endlessly to the few people who will hear me, (not any family members, of course - HA!) and eventually come to some enlightened insights that help me to understand how things work.

Back to Dr. Sugar Britches. So that's all it was, huh? My need to find daddy again??? Even though consciously I took my time, cautiously entering into the world of love only when I saw it was safe ... all the while he was going home to his WIFE and KIDS??? This is the THIRD time my subconscious has tricked me. First with Mr. 1988, second with someone insignificant, but a crazy story, and now Him. Third strike, and you're OUT. The next time I "feel" something, I MUST ignore it. Remember that I am one of the damned and that hope and love don't enter my realm.

[quote]"Zeroing in on how to love goes hand in hand with whom. A baby strives to tune in with his parents, but he cannot judge their goodness. He attaches to whoever is there, with the unconditional fixity we profess to require of later attachments: for better or worse; for richer, for poorer; in sickness and in health. Attachment is not a critic; a child adores his mother's face, and he runs to her whether she is pretty or plain. And he prefers the emotional patterns of the family he knows, regardless of its objective merits. As an adult his heart will lean toward these outlines. The closer a potential mate matches his prototypes, the more enticed and entranced he will be -- the more he will feel that here, at last, with this person, he belongs."


It is funny. As I was trying to understand "why do I like this guy?", I thought about it and some interesting things came to mind. He reminds me of my MOTHER. (uh-oh.) But, he also reminds me of myself --- and isn't that what this is all about? Just like the quote above, we seek the familiar. Good or bad. If it smells like us, we relate to it, and we want to be near it. I allowed myself to feel for him, to care about his well-being, to worry about him being okay, because he was like ME.

Aren't our brains just marvelous places???

It's exhausting.

Spagirl,
I can not begin to tell you how sorry I am for what happened to you. You're childhood makes my sound like a lovely Sunday afternoon picnic in the park and I didn't think that was possible. You were abandoned in so many ways. I can understand why you're so angry about it.

I also want to apologize if what I said made it worse. I was honestly trying to help but fear I didn't do a good job listening to you and then it felt like I handed you platitudes which just exacerbated the problem. I'm really sorry. I know this is not simple problem nor are there any easy answers. And I really know that you were very careful about what you were doing, it was obvious with your story, that you paid a great deal of attention to make sure that he wasn't married and this wasn't just in your head (which I don't believe it was, I think he was responding and flirting with you).

And I understand you're impulse to just not feel, to give up and not come back out, but I hope that's not what you do, as I think you deserve a full life not to be one of the damned.

Again, I'm sorry for all the pain you're in. It seems beyond human endurance.

AG

Thanks.

And, you didn't say anything to offend. In fact, this has been the most helpful.

It still sucks. Wanting and not having. But, that's life.

The flirting was fun. Just wish I could have taken it seriously. I'm so over being alone.

I was so looking forward ... to Him.

((((((SpaGirl))))))

The pain you described from your childhood is overwhelming. And it sounds like you've already thought well beyond everything I threw out there. I am sorry if what I said sounded condescending or thoughtless. I wish I could be of more help, but I'm feeling much of the same things you are right now. I hear a LOT of my own confusion and pain in what you are saying. All I can say is that I've been drawing some strength and hope from those on these boards who have found some solutions in their own lives to some of the same problems I've had.

You are obviously a very strong, bright, insightful, intelligent woman with a lot to give, and you deserve to have someone in your life who can give back to you. I hope you stick around, and don't give up.

SG

Guys I wish you wouldn't apologize. You are helping me deal with this. We all hear what we need to hear, and strummergirl you have hit the nail on the head. Luckily, I am feeling a bit stronger tonight, and your words have helped me get there.

Love is tough. I, for one, can't figure it out. I'm complicated and this situation is complicated. Who knows IF he is feeling ANYTHING toward me??? But what I can deal with are MY feelings and look into why they are there; analyze my thoughts; and see if some enlightenment can come out of this.

The same client who last said, "Don't get your hopes up." just left today saying, "Things change." Well, if we believe that change is possible, isn't that having hope?

I have so much more I want to say about this, but I am so tired of writing. I have written, and thought, and cried all week, and I just want a time out.

I will post some more and maybe we, together, can figure out the truth of what is happening.

But, please, no more apologies. Your words and your experiences mean a lot to me.

Sorry!

I know, I know, just hand you the HTML slapper!

(Thanks for the reassurance, and I'm glad to know it's helping.)

Woke up today dreaming of Him, then remembered I was FREE today, and I was going for a little "clear my mind" hike at a place I've never been to before. I also remembered the nice voice of the guy at the hiking store who told me of it. His voice was so welcoming, I switched my dreams to finding a man who was SINGLE and AVAILABLE!!! When I wrote "the list", I thought I had clearly stated no married men - no men with girlfriends - no gays, etc. So, now, I will (must) meet someone who is eco-friendly, loves nature, has my sense of humor, lights up when I come into the room, is the right height, size and style, is quick-witted and fun, and whom I find sexy. Ah, yeah, I thought I just did that! (tears) ....

My hurt is turning into anger.


I gave more thought to WHY I didn't ask about his marital status earlier on, and I know why: I didn't want to know. I remember many months ago when I was trying to decipher his provocative comments and I asked a couple of people their opinion. Both of them posed the same question: "IF he is married, Would YOU?", and I said, honestly, "I don't know." Not "HELL NO! That goes against my principles!" or "Hell NO, I'm not a home wrecker." I said, "I don't know." And, frankly, I still don't. Keep in mind that he hasn't actually asked me on a date or even to see him outside the office. All of this is just me playing "what if". But why would I even consider something I know from personal experience to be majorly dangerous and hurtful? Because affairs are FUN. I never wanted to be married. My intention is to couple, like the film
Four Weddings and a Funeral, I'd like to be happily unmarried to the same person for the rest of our lives: wedded bliss without the crap and prison that comes with the contractual obligation.



Well, that's all the blah I've got for now. If anybody has more tips on how to direct my love beams at the RIGHT person, let me know ... I'm off for a clear-thinking hike!



.

Spa Girl... I've been MIA lately because of family and work but I just wanted to say that I'm sorry you had such a miserable childhood filled with unspeakable trauma. And also that you are dealing with the heartbreak of finding out that Mr. MD was married.

FWIW...I feel that he enjoyed your attention and attraction to him and he did nothing to let you in on the fact that he was indeed "remarried". And he probably did enjoy your conversations and you. I really don't think that we have some built in intuition that attracts us to married and unavailable men I think we do have some unconscious drive to seek people who are not good for us because perhaps we feel that this is what we deserve. I know I have always done that. I'm learning in therapy where that all comes from.

I don't want to play T here but maybe you are feeling ambivalent about a really intimate relationship with someone and that shows in some way while you are participating in the activities you have chosen? Something to think about.

I have always met intersting guys on vacation. In fact, I met my husband on vacation. I guess it was because I was more open during those times and willing to connect. But also having a common interest can be a powerful way to make connections. Find something you love to do instead of something that you think will bring you into the company of single men. When you are involved in something you are passionate about it draws people to you and makes you more attractive to others. If you don't mind me asking do you have close girlfriends?

I do hope you enjoy your hike and that it helps to relax you and to bring things into focus for you. Please keep posting and let us know how you are doing.

TN

Thanks TN for your comments.

The hike did help clear my mind, but it didn't help my loneliness. The only real friend (not acquaintance) I have lives in the town where I went to hike, so I took him with me. At first I wanted a solitary hike, but realized that it might be smarter not being a woman alone at a place I'd never been to before. We had a good hike, and the strenuousness of getting to the top of the mountain did seem to detox some of my feelings away. When I got to the top, I asked for a moment of silence (he's a talker!) and I sent my prayers into the wind: "My mission remains the same. I want to couple with someone,happily, harmoniously, monogamously, etc. but I added WITHOUT causing harm or pain to anyone." It drifts in the wind now as we speak.

Then he and I went out to dinner. Fine enough, but I couldn't help feeling isolated again. I've known him for as long as I've been single [this time] - we met in 1991 and that last boyfriend ended in 1991 (I know what you're thinking and no, we aren't attracted to each other in that way --- and now, he's gay - another story that I've already written about), and for all of this time we have both been in the same situation: no significant others. Yes, of course, I leaned on him to be my surrogate, and over time he and I have been what only I call "best friends" - he doesn't believe in them - he's friends with everyone. But he does call me every day, so to me that's a best friend. HOWEVER ... he now has a "significant other" [see my other posts for all the gory details]. This person lives several hours away, and usually he drives there every weekend to see him, but currently his car is in the shop and so his weekend is free [insert me here].

So, yes, losing my best friend to another person has also really made me look at just how lonely I really am. Unlike him, I don't have a selection of people I call friends. And, yes, I have already done the "do what you love and love will find you" bit. It, also, didn't work. What I have to realize is what I realized this week. When I am down I listen to Sarah Brightman CD's. When I'm REALLY down, I listen to her sing in "Phantom of the Opera", which I did this week. And it hit me ... "I'm not Christine ... I'm the PHANTOM!!!" I'm the one who is cursed and damned. I'm the one who watches as my love goes off with their lover, and I go back down into the dungeon, where it's cold and dark. That's where I belong.

The sooner I come to terms with the facts that I was damned to a life alone way before I ever arrived on Earth, and to review my history with men and see how that can be nothing but true, starting with Daddy, continuing on with the first boyfriend, the first married man, all my million attempts at online dating, and now when I actually thought things were changing, only to find out the truth, that, no, there really isn't anyone out there for you. You can believe in unicorns all you like and you can spend your whole life looking for one, but they aren't real, they don't exist, and you will die still searching.

.

From the mouths of hummingbirds!

WOW! Finally somebody who doesnt' say, "Look on the bright side.", or "He's just around the next corner." (and I have to remind them that I'm on a CIRCLE! Your words were touching and refreshing. And I totally agree. 1. It does feel better to share with others and realize that we all feel a little alone - even with partners (sometimes worse with partners). 2. The BLACK is there for a reason - live in it and experience it, as long as it doesn't take you past death, then, there is light to follow (Yin/Yang - the circle - night becomes day). My "complaint", as it were, is not that I have trouble BEING alone, I've done that my entire life and I'm quite comfortable and happy with my own company. It's that successful partnering is the one thing I HAVEN'T been able to do (yet).

I'm a believer in Mr. Irony. Isn't it ironic that I am most of all a romantic, but I never have anyone to be romantic with. I work in a spa so I touch people every day and make their lives better because of my touch, but no one touches me. I think back on all the trips I've taken alone and for the most part they are romantic getaways - beautiful surroundings, luxury accommodations, succulent dinners, and me. Granted, each time I have IMAGINED someone there with me - a lover. And, because I'm nuts, I frequently take a photo of someone (different each time) and put it in the room so I have someone to "talk" to. [coo-koo] So my issue is with wanting someone beautiful to share these experiences with. I am actually human, believe it or not, and I WANT someone to kiss. I want to meet at my house for dinner after work on Friday, and settle in to cuddle. I want to wake up and have some wonderful person to kiss good morning. I want a vehicle for my love. As Ewan McGregor said in Moulin Rouge, "The greatest thing we'll ever learn is just to love and be loved in return." THAT is my mission.

.

The painful part is that I thought I was going in that direction with Herr Docteur. I was enjoying the slowness of getting to know him, layer by layer. I told you my initial reaction to him was "WAMMO!" Then it went into crush territory, progressed into something deeper that I labeled "fondness", and then I actually admitted to myself that I was "a little bit in love with him". BUT with my deep fear of "intimacy, etc." and with my logical mind, I couldn't act on it. When people would listen to me they'd all say, "Ask him out for coffee." But I would say, "I CAN'T." First of all my ego wouldn't let me. I mean, come on, men ask ME out, not the other way around. (Actually no one asks me out, but back in my 20's....) I told my friend that would be like asking someone who has a paralyzing fear of heights to bungee jump. Then it was the "I need him as my Dr., if he tells me "No" then what would I do"? I rationalized that he wasn't asking ME out because of the HIPPA or OSHA rules or something - he didn't want to be sued if I turned on him. As I said before, he does a great job of seeming unmarried - no ring, always talks in the first person, never talks of her or "we" or anything. For all I know, and with my horrible judgment on men, he could be f***ing everything in site (like the last married man of 1988.) Actually even yet another "getting divorced" man who is a friend of my friend. He was in the process of getting divorced and I stayed at his house for a night (platonically). He had one woman who he had just slept with leaving for the day and he was openly going to meet another woman for lunch and then sleep with her that night! All thanks to the Online Personals!!! I thought, "Stay away from this Hornet's nest of chaos. Another reason NOT to date - you never know who they're banging before they get to you!

Anyway ... I was gearing up for that first date with Him. I felt like he was coming to that point, as well. We seem very comfortable with each other, lingering in the conference room, talking about this and that. It was as though he was sizing me up, too. Maybe he also had a "fear of intimacy" as I do, and it took him this long to get up his nerve, as well?


What I still need translated are his Bucket List comments.

"I've been married twice - I'll NEVER do that again."
I say, "You've learned your lesson?"
He shakes his head, smiling and laughing and says, "No."

Then, after we get on to another topic, I say, "Let's get back to the marriage question".
"How many times have you been married?"
"Twice."
"How many times have you been divorced?"
"Once. I remarried."
"So ... you're separated???"
"I'm still married."

Not, "I'm married", but "I'm STILL married." as in he wishes he wasn't - or as in thank goodness I'm still married to the love of my life that I will never divorce because we are so bleeping happy?


Your thoughts on male translation???


.

Hello. Well, it's been over 2-weeks since learning The News and my hormones and humor have improved immensely! Thank Goodness. Your words and experiences have helped me feel less alone. My clients have also helped to greatly improve my attitude. Just yesterday, a regular came in and announced that she wants a divorce from her husband! I laughed and told her that she wasn't the first, she is actually third in line! She is the third client this year who has either already filed or who is debating - all of these people are in their late 30's to 44 (my age). What is going ON??? We've got a nearly 45-year old gay who is "in love" with a 20-year old boy who barely speaks English, and the hetero's are all wanting to be single, while I'm envying their partnerships, that I assumed were happy ones. I've realized that I'm not insane, but the world I'm living in IS! WHEW!!! So, last night I kept my promise and danced naked in the rain!!! (For the first time in MY LIFE, as well!) It was fun, let's do it again!

THANKS TO EVERYONE who pitched in when I was in such a DARK place. xoxoxox

.