Stoppers - sounds like you aren't moving forward with this T - for whatever the reasons are. Is the impasse going to stay? Is it because you are avoiding? Is it because she is not listening / doing her share of work / empathic ?

Even if you are avoiding - you might be able to go to a new T who you feel listens to you and you are better linked in.

You said you the common denominator in your failed therapy attempts - can you talk to her about this. Ask her just she think it is working? Get her to give you some feedback on what she thinks is the problem. If she says that everything is perfect and you are doing beautifully etc - then maybe she is the problem - she should be able to reflect and give some useful feedback.

If it were me - I would be trying something new. You have given this relationship a really good try.

Don't look at each therapist as a failed attempt though - you are always learning and developing.

Thanks SD. I have intermittently tried others this year-about 14 altogether, and i fully believe they are all alike. Or i relate to them all alike. This one is not especially nice or warm or anything which is good for me.the problem is probably that i do mot trust the whole profession,and am totally unclear about how to know if anything is happening or not,or if I am doing it correctly. Which it appears I am not.I mention this every week. i think she is just as frustrated as I am.

Hi Stoppers,

It is very frustrating when you are obviously trying so hard, and feeling like you're not getting anywhere with therapy. Question for you: When you say you're "crazy", what do you mean? What brought you to therapy and what are you looking to get out of it? How do you want things to be when you are "done"? I know those are hard questions to answer - the answers might not be complete right now, and they might even change as therapy progresses - but my answers to those questions at any given time are what kind of guide me as to whether or not therapy is "working" and what I'm looking for from my T, and whether or not they are a good fit.

SG

Thanks sg. I suppose depression and unjustified anxiety that I was no longer able to hide is why i decided to try therapy again. I was becoming obviously paralyzed with fear over the possibility of making even minor fixable mistakes, coming into contact with any sort of authority, etc. And all for no rational reason. Knowing it is irrational does not help, which i find very irritating.

It seems I am so bad at this that it doesn't even make sense to others.

Hi Stoppers,

Not at all!! Sorry this is so frustrating for you. I want to ask you something, but I want to give you some background first. When I first started therapy, in addition to the attachment issue that brought me to therapy in the first place, I also described several times how I always felt anxious and sad to one degree or another...that it waxed and waned but never completely went away. For whatever reason, though, I was never "officially" diagnosed with anxiety or depression (I guess I didn't answer the questions the "right" way). I finally found a therapist who seemed to understand what I was talking about regarding the attachment issue...but even after working with her for two years, I STILL felt anxious and sad much of the time, so I finally decided to try antidepressants (which I had actually asked for a year and a half prior to this, but kept putting off). And it really seems to help tone down that constant background sadness and anxiety. And makes it easier to implement some of the suggestions that have come up in therapy.

So, based on my experience, my question is, have you tried antidepressants? If not, maybe it would help you like it's helped me. Just an idea

Hug,
SG

Hi Stoppers

I don't think I'm going to be able to help but something you said about doing it "right" really resonates with me. I was obsessed about getting it "right" in therapy. My therapist repeatedly assured me that there is no right or wrong. I would be convinced that I was always messing it up. Or occasionally I'd blame her incompetence! Either way, I was convinced that there was a right way and we just weren't doing it.

Anyway, I suppose what I'm getting at is that one of my issues is a fear of making mistakes and therapy really brought this to light for me. Perhaps this is a situation when there isn't a right way to do it but only a place to be yourself, however that manifests in each session?

I was also convinced that I had to "do" something to make myself better. I think it was somewhere on this website that I read that it is "being" in therapy and opening up and being present with another person that is healing rather than "doing".

I don't know if this helps. These might not be issues for you as they are for me (although I recognise a lot of what you say) and maybe your therapist isn't the right fit for you. Do you sometimes leave sessions feeling warm, like something has shifted or can you see concrete changes and improvements in yourself? Do you look forward to going (even if there's also fear about opening up)? Do you think about what your therapist would say when you are in difficult situations or find yourself wanting to talk to her? These would all be indications to me that the relationship is helpful. Without these, I would wonder if the fit is right.

Good luck with working through it. Have you raised your concerns with her?

Oh, and I was seeing the same therapist for nearly 3 years and I felt confused and frustrated like you for probably the first two years and never got over the doing it right thing. This is meant to be reassuring rather than freak you out. You're not crazy. Cos if you are, then I must be too!

SG - thanks. Meds have been suggested but I am very reluctant to take them for many reasons. I know they can work but still want to keep slogging through without them. Right now I am trying a great deal of exercise to boost endorphins. Mine does wax and wane without completely disappearing.

BG- thanks.I have brought it up and she keeps saying that she thinks there is progress overall but cannot articulate to me what it would be in any way I understand. I do not feel like it is a we are in this together situation. She keeps telling me I do not trust her or the process and she is correct about that. I do not. The problem is I don't dislike her, I just don't trust her. All I really want is for her to admit she was wrong and apologize and then we could move on. Instead it is at best a false apology from her as in "I am sorry you reacted that way when I..." rather than what I consider to be the correct way which is "I am sorry I ... when I know how much it upsets you." I really think I am defective because of how much that bothers me.

Tygr thanks.

quote:

o you sometimes leave sessions feeling warm, like something has shifted or can you see concrete changes and improvements in yourself? Do you look forward to going (even if there's also fear about opening up)? Do you think about what your therapist would say when you are in difficult situations or find yourself wanting to talk to her?

No I do not to all but the wanting to talk to her and that is only because I feel a great need to clear up what I think she has wrong. I want to present evidence to refute her.

It seems like t and I are in two different worlds when we try to discuss what happened in the previous appointment. We never agree on what occurred. I kind of want to tape the appointments as evidence to prove who is right. Even if it was her, then I could relax and not feel lied to.

Hiya, stoppers...I'm so sorry to hear that you are still having such a struggle with therapy causing so much pain.. I wanted to mention, that you say that you are paralyzed with fear about making even minor, fixable mistakes. Clearly, this has become a strong issue with you even within the therapy itself, which is supposed to be helping that symptom, not adding to it...poor you! It feels like a catch 22..but there is a way out. I suspect that the way out is to do something incredibly difficult, and put aside your own interpretations of what is happening in the therapy (that you are screwing it up, doing it wrong, and it's the T's fault for not explaining in linear fashion, what you are doing wrong) and instead just try, to give your T an honest hearing. Therapy is primarily about letting emotions out. There is no linear way to do that...you just have to talk about what is bugging you. In your case, your T's are bugging you, so that's a good place to start, hey? Seems like a lot of transference maybe going on in your therapy relationships- possibly. It's possible that it's transference, plain and simple, and that's why you find yourself caught in this dynamic over and again with each therapist. Authority, you say, is a recipe for anxiety and paralysis, as well as the fear of making even fixable mistakes. I relate. Both situations abound in therapy, so it makes sense that it would be causing your symptoms to be worse. You could just try to "throw some mud on the wall." What I want to call your attention to, is that you say that your fear is irrational. I'm wondering what your T says about it being "irrational?'" Assuming that you have brought this issue up with your T, does she try to relate your fear to the past, and help you to understand that this pattern is not irrational or something wrong with you, but rather a logical response to past events in your life? And is that where you are hitting a roadblock? I'm not saying that your situation is definable by me- of course not- but I'm just trying to give you some stuff to think about that might move things in the right direction towards healing-maybe. Speaking from experience, letting go of denial is one of the most painful and difficult processes- it wouldn't surprise me if your fear was based in some kind of reality that hurts badly to look into, so maybe- it's possible that it could be the T isn't saying it gently enough for you to be able to hear it since the pain is so deep. So, more transference. It could be.
I really feel for you- I think you may have more success if you focus on your feelings in everyday life that occurred during the week, than on the transference. It takes a pretty special T to be able to handle strong negative transference, without taking it personally- really it does. I do not think very many are up to that task, from my own very limited experience with the same type of problem.

Keep talking!

Hugs,

BB

Thanks BB - I agree there is probably some negative transference going on - but if the t really screws up - why is it transference and not just that they screwed up? It is not always transference -sometimes they really do make mistakes. I just want an admission and an apology. It seems like I am always rolling over and letting her win, but I get nothing out of it.

Stoppers,

I just finished reading "Trauma and the Avoidant Client: Attachment-Based Strategies for Healing" by Robert Muller.

It's written for therapists, and I somewhat felt like I was eavesdropping on stuff I shouldn't know, but it helped me a bit. Mostly it helped me to understand that there are people out there like me who avoid/dismiss/deflect/minimize/resist/struggle/etc but there are ways for therapists to reach us.

I don't know if it would help you at all but it might be worth taking a look at and if you like your therapist and want to continue working with her maybe you could suggest she get a copy (hard copy or Kindle version available from Amazon) and read it.

Hemlock thanks - I have read that book. I don't think it will help this situation but I will ask if she has read it. I think I must keep going back to her because I am now just some sort of masochist.