I responded to you in the "Say Anything" column, but I did want to let you know here that I am sending my hopes that you and T make some contact before you leave. I hope that he calls and helps to straighten some of this out, since it did seem very insensitive that he ended your session in this manner knowing that you'd be gone for two weeks.

I'm in my own "I hate therapy" mode right now and feel like giving up. The pain of it all makes it so hard to bear sometimes. BUT, I try to think of the future when I feel better and am able to fly on my own.

Incognito, I do wish for you a peaceful break where you will be able to rest assured that it will all work out in the end (even though it's sometimes hard to see it that way now). (HUGS)

DF,

Don't be sorry. I loved your post because I no how much you've struggled in the past with negative transference with your reg T and I know how much is going on in your life right now. I'm so happy your session went well. Reading about it was inspiring even though it was also painful.

The silence was triggered by a really serious session before I left on my first vacation and an email I sent following it up and by the fact that I'm stressed and exhausted by how much I have to do before I leave. I also felt really relaxed and good for most of last week and I realized that therapy is the cause of a lot of my stress at least that is what it seemed last week.

I did tell him I thought he didn't care and he said nothing and then said we'll pick it up in 2 weeks. To be fair to him I told him at our last session that I thought he cared about everyone and he didn't care about me personally and that it hurt. He answered me then by saying it is both I care about people and I care about you. He said it is personal to both of us. So maybe he didn't think he had to reply today but it has just left me so bereft that I tried everything to contact him and I'm writing an email I'm considering sending to his email address that goes directly to his cell phone instead of his office but I've never done that before except when he has told me to use it when he is on vacation and he won't be in his office. I've never tried to contact him outside his office hours before. I can't text (don't know his cell phone). I will get phone calls and emails where I am going but right now I'm on the phone to the airline trying to see if I can change my flight to thursday but still send my husband and kids tomorrow.

Of course I'm not sure if that is a good idea because I don't even know if I want or could get another session before thursday and I'm afraid I just want to be alone so I can do something to stop hurting so much. The truth is I think that is the only way to really resolve this. I think my T understands me but we are stuck and he is willing to try things if I suggest them but not any other way and when I'm silent he just waits. I can't try new things then and I guess he is just waiting for me to do something different and I can't. So it is really my fault anyway.

thanks for the reply I'm totally dysfunctional right now. I should be packing and I've spent the last 3 hours crying in my bed with my laptop.

Hi incognito...they are calling me for dinner so I have only a minute...

I am so sorry that you had to end your session in that way. Do you think you felt blocked because you were so nervous about leaving him for 2 weeks? Are you sure this is how it played out... it sounds rather harsh what he said and he has been such a good T all along that I'm frankly surprised to hear this. Did you tape the session?

I know he didn't reassure you and you needed that badly so he messed up there. But I do believe that he cares about you. What made you ask him that question? Why were you doubting his care... did he do something?

I have really never said that to my current T. He tells me he has come to care for me a great deal and I just accept it. I don't want to doubt it. He acts like he cares, in the way a therapist can care. He is always there, he is consistent, he listens, he returns my calls and emails, he fits me in his schedule when it's tight due to time off and so I believe him.

It is hard at times to accept that he is ONLY my T and I can't have more than that in my life. It was worse with oldT because he acted so inconsistent that I was always worried about our relationship. Maybe I just learned to expect less in therapy... not sure.

I would try as much as possible to contact him to get some resolution before you leave. I'm sorry for your pain right now. I hope you mange to arrange that phone session.

I don't want you to be in a crash or for something to happen to you. I would definitely miss you around here.

lots of hugs and a good and safe trip
TN

Incognito,

I'm so sorry you had such an awful session. I had a horrible one as well so I can really relate.

No advice, but I hope that things get resolved.

(((hugs)))

thank you for understanding and wishing me well brokenillusions I'm glad your T got back to you and it helped a little. Therapy sucks might be my new mantra.

TN, thanks for your reply. I'm sure part of my being blocked has to do with my vacation because I am going to a wedding and going to see a lot of my family. We just totally missed each other today and when I did try and tell him how badly I felt he deflected it. Like when I said I felt like therapy wasn't helping because all I was doing was crying silently he answered with but sometimes it helps which leaves me with nothing to say we are both right. I wish I could just learn to believe him he cares and that is the end of it. Maybe I am just too damaged to believe it or maybe I have to learn to expect less in therapy. I think my T does all those things and I still doubt him. I don't know whether sending an email to his phone address is too much.

(((STRM))) I'm sorry that you can relate to the horrible session. Therapy sucks... I hope the next one is better and you continue to have the strength and determination to keep trying.

I did it I sent a horribly honest, angry, and mean email to my T at both his office and phone addresses. I told him I was angry at him for today's session, for letting me sit and cry in silence even though we've talked about how much that hurts me, for getting to walk away after a session like today and feeling fine. I told him I would trade everything I've learned in therapy and every good moment in the future to stop this pain now and that is why I've given up and I just realized that I didn't tell him I wanted to talk to him which is how my email started and it ended with me furious so now I'm guessing he won't call when he reads it anyway.

I sorry to be so negative, I feel like I'm losing it.

incognito... I know it's hard to articulate what we need when we need it. Maybe you could follow up that phone email with a P.S. and say, "T I'm hurt and scared and I just really want to know you are there for me". Because I can guess that this is what you need to know.

FWIW... last Thursday when I hid under my blanket and sat there crying and sobbing my T just sat there pretty silently and let me cry. At first when I just cried w/o the blanket and wearing my sunglasses he asked me to take them off and look at him. I refused. Then he asked me how I would feel if he was sitting there wearing sunglasses with a blanket over his head while I was trying to talk to him... and well... the idea of that was so funny I just cracked up despite myself and I snaked out a hand for a tissue and then took off the blanket and the sunglasses because they got all foggy. I told him my glasses got foggy and he laughed and then we both smiled at each other.

I then told him that I did really want to talk to him but that I felt that I didn't want him to see me and then that led to a productive session.

The thing is that I wanted that connection with him bad enough to come out from under the blanket. I took that risk to reach out to him and if I can do it then you can too. You are NOT too damaged at all. You are just scared... but if you can find the courage to do it just once, then it gets easier and easier because i know your T will meet you with kindness.

Take a crazy risk and just tell him that you need him and need him to be there for you and that you need to hear his voice and you want to have that telephone session to get you through those 2 weeks. Tell him what you want and I'm sure it will work out so much better for you.

I'm sorry the family trip has you so stressed. I think that you were blocked and maybe he was trying not to stir things up and instead caused the opposite to happen.

I wish you a good trip and I hope you connect with your T at some point and it eases your mind. Hang in there incognito. I know you can do this.

TN

((((INCOGNITO))))

I am so sorry your session really sucked but I'm really glad you reached out to your T and you are trying to resolve this before you go. I also have trouble believing my T cares and have trouble taking in that care. There's something in me that fights it tooth and nail so I can totally relate.

I hit that "you don't care about me" wall with my T many times. Actually I've been stuck there for about a year. Always looking for proof that he cares and signs that he doesn't. It's maddening. Actually I was there again this weekend and it hurt so much that I just told myself that I can't do this anymore to myself. I'm hurting myself too much. It would be easier to trust, to just believe that he cares. He's shown me in so many ways.

Can you think of ways your T has shown you he cares? Are you pulling away because you are afraid of something? Almost like, you know you are going to be away again, so why get attached? It sounds like this push-pull towards and away from intimacy.

I hope he gets back to you tonight or tomorrow and that you can find some peace before you go away.

xoxoxo

Liese

((Incognito)).

I glad you sent the email, even if it was an angry one. I would send a followup one saying that you need his support more than ever and that you are hurting really badly.

Hope he calls.

My T replied to my email with an email tonight. The first time he written me after hours. He told me that he thought his comment about let's pick that up in two weeks expressed the irony of the inadequacy of the response. He told me that feeling stuck is not the same as being unable to move forward. He also thinks that feeling stuck and unable to talk is a deep seated fear and not just a reaction to the present. He told me tries to think of ways to ask and pose questions to help me talk. He told me isn't hopeless though he knows how frustrated I feel. He also told me he had the phone session on his schedule if I was still willing to do it. I wrote back saying I would rather do a session sooner or not at all and I wasn't sure which.

DF, I think deep down I think he cares but it doesn't make a difference to my ability to talk and his ability to break through my silences. I'm not sure there is anything I need from him to feel better or at least nothing I could put into words.

Thanks TN. I'm not sure I have the courage to keep doing it. I've done it before but it hasn't gotten noticeably easier. I was stressed and upset and we got nowhere. I think he is there for me as much as he can be but it doesn't seem to be enough for me or something.

Thanks Liese, You are right I know he cares at least as much as a T can. He tries and he is always understanding. I don't always get things the way he means them or he doesn't always get what I mean but I don't think it is on purpose or because he doesn't listen. Maybe I am afraid of something but I don't know what. I feel lost in my feelings.

It is the middle of the night here and I've got my husband and kids packed for the flight tomorrow. I've got less than 5 hours until we leave for the airport and I've done nothing for myself. I'm not sure what to do but thanks for listening to me today.

thanks for your thoughts SomeDays. He did email. I'm not sure when I will get to talk to him. I hope by next monday I won't feel the need to.

((((((INCOGNITO)))))

I'm so glad T got back to you by email and that he had the phone session already scheduled. My T has always seemed kind of one-dimensional to me. I don't get much of a glimpse into who he is. How do I really know he cares just because he says he does? Should I just trust that he cares just because he says he does? We've had a lot of conversations about how will I know he cares and how can I just trust that he cares because he says he does ... but since then, he has shown me in different ways ... moved appointments around for me, accommodated me in different ways, made me feel important.

And, maybe you are stuck and maybe your not. Maybe this is something you really need to work on. You really need to FEEL that your T cares. Afterall, you are opening up your heart and soul to this man.

I don't think it's a bad question at all to ask: How do I know that YOU care about ME?

(((((INcOGNITO)))))) The timing really stinks with your trip and all. What did you do? Did you postpone your flight for a day?

Incognito,

I'm glad that your T got back to you. I'm sorry that the timing is so bad and that now you are facing a two week break. I'm glad that you still have the phone session scheduled. I hope that goes well.

quote:

He told me that feeling stuck is not the same as being unable to move forward.

This is interesting. This is exactly what my session was about yesterday and the disconnect with T except she equated my feeling stuck with NOT moving forward and it resulted in a horrible session between us. I'm sorry that you are feeling stuck and having doubts about the whole process. I can certainly relate. ((((hugs))))

I hope despite all of this that you have a wonderful trip with your family.

((((Incognito))))

I am SO sorry! I know how awful that silence must have felt...and to add the distance of being away for another two weeks on top of that, with all of this left unresolved...I am so sorry.

I'm glad to hear that he emailed about the phone appointment. What are you thinking you will do if he says he cannot schedule it sooner? Will you keep the Monday appointment or cancel it?

I do not understand his comment about his comment expressing the inadequacy of the response. Which response is her referring to? His lack of response to you commenting he doesn't care about you? I don't understand where he is finding the irony here.

((((INCOGNITO)))))

I agree with what LG said about his explanation re: his, we'll pick this up in two weeks, comment. It was a joke he only shared with himself. He certainly could have added. I'm sorry that we can't continue this now and that we have to wait two weeks. I know it's going to be really hard for you. I just don't get why T's can't pad things a liltte more. It seems it would prevent so many misunderstandings.

xoxoxo

Liese

my update for today...

I went on my trip. I couldn`t get my flight changed easily and still make the wedding on Saturday. I slept about 3 restless hours and then left. My T wrote me back this morning and offered me tomorrow morning for 45min or my regular appointment in the evening. Unfortunately I am in a different time zone so the later time would be dinner time and the morning is going to be pretty early. At first I just replied I would have liked to have talked to you (because I was angry he emailed me and didn`t call, I`m so petty) but I just got here and told him I would take the morning appointment.

Liese, I think when I`m rational I know he cares about me because while he very rarely says it he has done lots of things over the years that show it and I can`t seem to believe it when I am sitting in his office feeling like I can`t talk and I`m alone.

STRM, I think he meant it as feeling stuck doesn`t mean I won`t be able to move forward in future sessions. More like it is a feeling not a permament state. I think he would agree I was stuck yesterday but that feeling stuck and alone usually leads me to talk about quitting therapy. I keep struggling with what my therapy has been like. Is it a series of stuck moments punctuated by breakthrough moments where I feel understood and get freed up enough to talk a little more freely and feel connected which is I think what my T would argue. I sometimes feel like I keep getting stuck at the same place and then my attachment and fear of failure leads me to go away and create the belief that he understands and cares and allows me to talk about some things that aren`t as difficult as the stuck stuff so I`m afraid I can`t ever deal with the stuck stuff with T and I keep crashing into it and then veering off to another subject and then crashing into it again...repeat and if I was smart I would quit instead of keep doing the same thing because it will never work.

LG, thanks for understanding. He can schedule it sooner and I hope it helps me get some resolution. I think sitting on it until Monday would be hard and make this vacatioon incredibly difficult. I have noticed his odd sense of irony or humour in the past and yes I really didn`t hear it the way he says he meant it.

Liese, I wish he would have added I`m sorry. I think he feels like he keeps reassuring me he isn`t going anywhere and he is willing to work with me and therefore he doesn`t need to say it.

I will update again when I can. Especially if I can manage to do my phone session tomorrow.

incognito... I'm glad you have been able to work through this disruption with your T. You deserve praise for reaching out and making your needs known and your T has been very responsive.

You are really working well together despite how you feel right now.

Enjoy the trip and I wish you a good phone session when that happens for you.

TN

Incognito,

I think sometimes people make bad jokes when they are feeling helpless or inadequate. Maybe he made the joke to compensate for what he realized was a mistake on his part for not responding with immediacy when you needed to hear that he cares about you.

I hope you have a good time on your trip and are able to resolve things with T when you talk.

I had my phone session this morning. I was worried I was going to oversleep but of course I woke 2 hours early and then dozed. I was treated to some terrible dreams including one where I couldn't remember T's phone number and I couldn't find it in my book and another where the phone rang and rang and he didn't answer but luckily none of that happened.

We had a shorter session which he told me about when he booked it. We talked about how hard it was to get on the plane and the difficulties the family part of the trip is causing me. Then we switched to therapy and our relationship. It was a little easier on the phone to discuss the fact that during the session I often feel like he doesn't care and that is really upsetting and that later I "remember" that he does. I admitted that I'm worried that I create that feeling because I'm so desperate for it. He told me he didn't think that was true because sometimes I feel that he cares and that even when I think he doesn't some of it gets through because we stay with it. He thinks we have to keep chipping away at that fear.

He suggested that we walk around the block during a session because I often feel physically paralyzed during a session like that like I'm afraid to move or speak and I've talked about moving around but I can't seem to do it when I get like that. That was a surprise.

He also normalized that need for being cared for and loved and told me it was healthy and reasonable. I told him that I worry that I won't be able to talk about the difficult and important things for me ever and that my fears keep changing. Like I used to worry that he was going to stop seeing me if he didn't answer and email or phone call and that he didn't care about me and now I worry that even though he responds he wishes he didn't have to or that he cares about me because he cares about everyone and not about me personally. He said maybe I was just getting clearer on what my worries were. I felt better just getting some of my fears out and it was easier to do it on the phone.

I managed to ask him if he was angry that I emailed him on the address that goes to his phone to contact him after his office hours and he said no and I believed him (I'm writing this so I can remind myself of that fact when I start to doubt that later). We booked a phone session for next monday and then I'll have nine day break while we are both on vacation.

Thanks for all the support. I wanted to let you know how it worked out in case it helps anyone else to hear about it.

((((INCOGNIT)))))

When I read the title of the thread, I got really worried. But your latest post sounds so terrific. I am glad that things worked out!!!

Enjoy the wedding and the rest of your vacation.

xoxox

Liese

quote:

I managed to ask him if he was angry that I emailed him on the address that goes to his phone to contact him after his office hours and he said no and I believed him (I'm writing this so I can remind myself of that fact when I start to doubt that later).

Incognito... I love this part and if you don't remind yourself I will remind you!

I'm so glad that you had a pretty good phone session and came away feeling better. It seemed that you addressed a lot of stuff in a short time. Your T has been very responsive to you and those are not the actions of someone who doesn't care for or about you. I know that is so hard to take in for you. I know because I struggle with it too. Last night I was convinced my T was abandoning me. Sometimes our past gets so mixed up with our Ts that it's hard to separate the two and it causes problems for us.

I guess that is why we are here for each other to remind each other that we are doing good work and our Ts really do care and if we look at their actions we can see that care.

Have a wonderful time on your vacation.

Hugs
TN

((((IG)))))

I am glad that you were able to talk with T, that you were able to feel cared for, and that you are feeling more secure within the relationship. So glad he was able to fit you in sooner so you didnt have to stress about this your entire vacation. What a load off your shoulders now!

This was a lovely resolution, I am really glad you posted it. This is super positive.

(((Incognito)))

I am SO happy that your phone session went well. I am sure that was a HUGE relief; especially after the dreams you were having beforehand--you can definitely tell that there was a lot of anxiety there.

Your T sounds like he does care for you in a good way. I like hearing about everyone's resolutions, and it does help. Sometimes when I feel so disconnected with T, I read everyone Else's posts and start to feel a little better.

I like that you wrote out your feelings about the session and now you can go back and remind yourself of that feeling. I do agree with TN! If you forget some of this, we will remind you.

BI