Hi AG,

I am just wondering why you think it would be a bad idea to see your T. Why should the relationship be so forbidden? I know you ended therapy. But I don't see what's so bad about going back in once in a while. It just seems to me that change doesn't have to be so hard if you allow yourself to go back to where you came from. Like going back to visit your parents when you go away to college. The first long stretch is the hardest but then once you see you can go back and forth and touch base, staying at college becomes easier and easier.

I almost think you're causing yourself more pain by judging your need to touch base with him. It seems totally reasonable to me that you'd want to go see him. You were feeling needy when you were sick and now you feel needy because you want to go see your T. And you're denying yourself that. I, for one, think it's okay to go see him. But then again, I have no idea what I'm talking about since I haven't faced the end of therapy yet. It just doesn't seem like there could be a downside or that there would be anything wrong about going back in to touch base.


I hope I didn't say the wrong thing. I know you're afraid that you'll have to start the grieving process all over again.

Hope I didn't confuse you.

(((((HUGS)))))

Liese

AG... it is absolutely a loss... a huge loss and I totally understand how much you miss him and even his socks. Gosh, even "I" miss him and I never sat in a room with him and poured my heart out to him. I'm glad you decided to post and let us know how you are struggling with missing that connection you had with him and that lovely hour where you had his focus on you and just you. Of course you are going to miss that and the wonderful man who was always there for you. And yes, we all know you can stand on your own and do this yourself but it would be okay to go check in with him. Sort of refuel for the next leg of your journey.

But I also understand that you are worried that if you see him and then leave again you will start the grief all over again and you will feel that you have somehow gone backwards in the process. But remember therapy is not linear... and I would guess neither is termination! It does not make you a failure or too needy or weak to want to sit and talk with your wonderful T to find direction for the next part of your life or just to find the clarity you need to get past this bump in the road.

It's really okay. Don't be too hard on yourself. Sending you hugs.

TN

Missing him hugely deeply, is normal.
So maybe you could go see him once a month or once every two months, a sort of transition time?
then you don't have to hurt so much with the missing?
glad you are feeling a bit better, sounds like you have been having a hard time.

Hugs for you AG. I think you need all the warmth and positive input you can from wherever you can best find it, in this time of recovering from a shocker of an illness.

The mourning still makes sense. If you had completed a very significant, closely collaborative work project with a colleague and then shifted into a lunch-once-a-month phase you might feel something like that. Not silly, but who cares if it is? It's just what you feel.

love,
Jones

Hi AG,

Am glad to hear that you have mostly recovered from your illness…it sounded really nasty. It’s totally understandable that feeling this way would bring up lots of feelings and it is great that you were able to reach out and call your T.

quote:

Which feels a little silly honestly, because he's there, I can email, I can call so why all the mourning?

I think you yourself answer this when you say,
"The relationship I had with my T was just incredibly deep and intimate and I miss, so much, having that hour that I could sit and be connected to someone else, and know I was being clearly seen, and what was seen was accepted and even embraced”

An email in no way makes up for the loss of the relationship you have described here.

I can understand your hesitation about whether to go back or not and I am not sure if it is because of the same reasons that I too worried about and I don’t know if this is of any help but when I chose to go back it really was very hard knowing it was only for the one session and that I couldn’t really invest myself fully back into the relationship. I think I did feel worse about it for a time afterwards but ultimately it really helped me to know exactly what I wanted and I think the hurt and longing I felt after this one session enabled me to get in touch with my true feelings around the whole situation which made me feel a lot stronger.

So I am going to quote what you said to me when I was having a difficult time making up my mind:

quote:

we always have to make decisions based on what we know at the time and on whatever level of self-understanding we're experiencing, so in this case there isn't so much a right or wrong, as you deciding what is best for you under these circumstances

I really miss my T too so know how hard it is…am sending you many comforting hugs.

Butterfly

Dear AG, i hear you. My heart goes out to you. Oh, indeed you have ALL my sympathy. Nothing`s like missing someone that deep, is it.. Its like a physical ache somewhere in the chest(?). Its always there. I remember you postet another thread a while ago - where you were debating whether or not to call your T- and i remember i adviced you to call him. When i read this i had the same reaction; i felt the same urge to tell you sort of the same thing; GO SEE your T!!

quote:

I actually am considering going back to see him for just one appt mainly because I am struggling with some decisions about where I want to put my energy these days and it just feels like being able to talk it out with him would really lend me some clarity. But I am also really worried that it's not a good thing to do. So I keep bouncing back and forth.

quote:

The bouncing back and forth are understandable ambivalence, AG. Obviously seing him again would probably be so nice in meny ways and he would help you gain the clarity you seek now.
I was wondering why you are worried its not a good thing to see him for one appt.? What would be the hardest part about it? Do you imagine your T would be dissapointed of you, for still needing him for one appt.? (If yes- drop that thought! If no, bear over with me!) I could think of a fiew things that would have been my reasons to not go, -my pride and my stubborness etc, yet i am not sure thats your reasons or hesitations here..

I am glad you reached out here,- yes, here on forum we knows how deep and significant that relationship is, and at least we have an idea of how much grief and feeling of loss not seing your T anymore naturally causes. Of course you really miss him.
And again- my (humble) appeal to you, is that you should go and see your T again. Maybe it would be the best gift you can give yourself right now?

Get well. Hugs and all my sympathy, (btw whatever you decide i am supporting you!)

(((((((((( AG ))))))))))))

I'm so sorry you are missing your T so much, and brought into painful focus by having been seriously ill for such a long time - a state that has obviously brought up issues of having to be 'useful' or 'productive' to be accepted and loved. That alone sounds like reason enough to go see T and talk about things...

What struck me the most though has been an apparent to me (but may not actually exist!) sense that you are operating from a 'should'. That you 'should' struggle on with your feelings of missing T, and deal with any and all issues that are coming up for you without 'giving in' and going back to see T. Almost as if it's something required of you precisely because you want to see T - the old self denial thing as being good for you.

If there is a should operating, then I'd say, go and see him. If on the other hand you genuinely feel that it would be counterproductive to see him, that's something else. I'm just wondering if your ambivalence about making an appointment to see him in person is to do with your feeling that you would then somehow have 'failed' in your therapeutic task of healing? Obviously only you know your motives and feelings and fears - but I have to say if I were in your place, I'd be making that appointment!

Hugs and good wishes to you AG.

LL

(((((AG))))

i can't type so much right now - so please excuse the bluntness and poor typing of this.

this is very very different than ending with a T and ending therapy in general - but my g-ma died 3 months ago, and there's been no memorial or funeral. i've come to realize how important grief is, as well as sharing that grief and being able to do something to honor who i miss. when t relationships end, it's hard because while people understand grief with so many other kinds of relationships ending (even break-ups) it's hard to explain that kind of bond with a T to those who haven't been through it.

I'm so sorry you have been so sick and it makes a lot of sense that you would miss and want the comfort of your T. That makes so much sense.

i don't have any advice or anything. just glad you are reaching out and sharing your grief. it's painful when other's can't understand what it's like to end a relationship like one with a T.

many hugs,
jane

AG,

Big hugs go out to you right now. I sense both your strength and desire to move on and continue to grow as well as your intense longing to connect with T. I admire how strong you were to end your therapy and to not cave in to communicating with your T every time the desire eats away at you. I hope to be at that very place myself some day. It is a true sign of growth and independence.

I would encourage you to not make an appointment to see T just yet. Perhaps in your mind you can bargain with yourself...like tell yourself that if you are still feeling the same way on Feb. 1, you can contact T. But try to work through the feelings of loss and missing him in the meantime. You can always go back if needed, but now is the time to push yourself outside of your comfort zone. Sit with these emotions for a while and see what happens. I think you will find that you will be okay...you are stronger than even you realize.

In the meantime, we are all here for you and you do not have bear the burden of this loss alone.

Hey Monte - just want to say stand proud in your minority! We love ya and we ain't got the guns out.

AG
This is one of those deliciously murky kind of situations that we hate so much. I have been like a ping pong ball trying to figure out how to respond, i agree with every single post, those that are saying go for it and those saying hang on a moment. It is the same old , 'which one is it?', pattern and maybe now is the time to remember that there is simply no right or wrong answer.

I figure it is a win / win situation either way. You contact T and feel better so you win, or you don't and cope on your own and feel good, so all you have to do is to know whether you most want to be happy about being cared for or if you prefer being happy about being independent.

Listen to your heart, my dear friend, it is immmeasurably wise incredibly kind and extraordinarily generous and it truly knows what you need most. Either way you'll always be more than fine.

Love
Pan

Hi All,
Thank you so much for all of your thoughtful replies, your insight, your support and the hugs. I really do appreciate everyone being there for me.

quote:

I really appreciate your honesty about missing your T.

DF, thank you for that, but who would have believed me if I said different? But seriously, I appreciate all the reassurance (from everyone!) that it's ok to come here and talk about how I'm feeling.

quote:

Did you and your T talk about.. .how to find that same intimacy outside of/after therapy?

Not triggering at all, DF, glad you asked. We did discuss it. I actually asked him near the end if he had relationships outside of therapy that were as intimate. He actually looked startled for a sec, but told me yes, he did, but they were very rare. The truth is, that our culture does not place a really high premimum on having that kind of extended face to face time with other people, so it takes a consciousl effort to create that in my "outside" life. I have it in pieces with a number of people, but it's the combo of all his knowledge as well as being face to face, and in all fairness, the fact that he's focused only on my needs, that makes for such a difficult to replace situtation. But I do feel confident that he taught me enough about moving closer and making my needs known that it's going to happen. I think one of the reasons I fear going back is that I'll stop looking for it outside.

quote:

I understand you wanting to see your T again for some decision help and not being sure if that is a good or bad idea, etc. Is that something reasonable to email or call your T about to ask if what he'd recommend (to see him or not...? or would that not work?).

BWWWWAAAHHHAAAHHHAAAAA. Tee hee. Giggle. Sorry, DF. My T is the king of the "typical therapist turn it around answer" and the last thing in the world he will do is tell me what to do. He just tell me I don't need to be scared of what I do either way. I understand why several people have suggested that as a possible solution. And I really do appreciate you listening and responding. Thank you.

TN,
Thank you for acknowledging the depth of the loss. I'm sorry you miss him too! Although it warmed my heart to read that. And thank you for the reminder that therapy (and evidently termination) is NOT linear. That is a truth I know deep down in my bones, but failed to apply to this situation. And hey, I could get on board with looking at him as a gas station.

I really appreciate your generosity in supporting me in this knowing that you are dealing with your own deep loss. (((TN))))


MH,
I really liked what you said about knowing it on a gut level. Part of me almost wants to just go back to get it over with so to speak. The longer I don't go, the bigger a deal it will be. And although I may not always feel that way, I really do know that it perfectly ok, and in some circumstances, a good thing to go back. So if I return and can see it's really ok, it will stop being this major deal and I'll have more room to move. I also definitely appreciate the comparsion to kids going off to college (and don't worry, I think of my kids, not MY experience. I ran and didn't really look back. )

quote:

I think whatever you decide to do, no one here will be judging you either way.

Thank you for that MH, it really does help immensely to know that no one will judge me here and I also appreciate everyone providing their input but also recognizing that it's my decision. And it won't end in pain, it already hasn't. Even with the grief, there is still so much gratitude for what I learned and for the relationship and its presence in my life. Pain along the way is just life. But now I know how to handle the pain, a not small gift.


Jones,
I liked you analogy to a project with a collegue. I have been in that position and had to deal with sadness afterwards and was perfectly ok with that. Really helps to put into perspective.

Monte,
No shooting here!! I really appreciate you saying what you did, even though it was running against the grain when you posted (you picked up some similar opinions along the way ). It was a very thoughtful reply and I appreciate you taking the time to put it out there. And it helped so much, as you articulated the fear I was feeling but couldn't really describe what I was afraid of. It's the worry that I am interfering with, and only prolonging, a necessary grieving process. That going back now is only putting off the inevitable. It was very helpful to hear about your experience with your kid and is very helpful input while wrestling with what I want to do. And weirdly enough, I do understand I can do this either way and I'll be ok.


Hi Butterfly,
Your whole post reminded me of a favorite saying of mine: "Lord, make my words soft and sweet because I may have to eat them tomorrow."

Reading my own words about what the relationship meant, did kind of lend a "d'oh" quality to why it would hurt, thank you. I also appreciate that what you say is coming from direct experience with the situation, and I appreciate you being willing to be so open to help me. I was happy to hear that in the end, it was a good decision. And the reminder that there is no right or wrong, just deciding what I think is best now, knowing I can handle the consequences either way.

Froggy,
Thank you for all of your compassion. A physical ache somewhere in the chest describes it exactly. Sometimes it takes my breath away. But in between bouts I feel fine. But then I have always grieved in waves.

And I think you summed up my ambivalence very nicely. This is an extension of that difficulty you run into when healing. What's your stuff and what's the truth? Is it my difficulty in reaching out for help that is getting in the way? Or is not going really the best way to handle this right now? One of the things I have appreciated about reading everyone's replies is getting different perspectives from other people in order to help me sort through that. And again, I appreciate hearing that it's ok no matter what I decide.

LL,
Oh dear, how embarrassing, someone saw my "should" hanging out. I think alot of what you said about the shoulds was spot on and certainly good food for thought. Because I know what I would say to someone wrestling with a "should." Thank you for so gently pointing that out.


LadyGrey,
Thank you so much, I've really been enjoying reading your posts. I also appreciate you being clear with your thoughts. What you said has definitely been part of my thinking. I've actually used the AA approach of 24 hours. You don't try to do it all at once, just get through the next day. And so far it's been pretty effective. I think what's different now is that in addition to the pain, there's been some struggle from getting triggered and I'm not sure if I need help with it or not. I also appreciate your belief in me and the reminder I don't have to do this alone. And that you didn't leave Monte hanging out there all alone.

Blanket Girl,
It wasn't a preachy post at all, your care came through in every sentence. What you said about being cared for in the here and now hit me pretty square between the eyes. The best way to put it is that I picked up a lot of protectiveness of me in your post, and it was really nice to hear.

Oh, and don't think about the end until you're ready. I certainly didn't. It's hard enough then, it will keep.

June,
Funny I think he's perfect too. Thank you for the kind words about him. As far as asking him, see my first response to DF. The truth is that my T will be absolutely fine with me coming in or not coming in. Rat bastard. I joke, but it was really difficult not having him tell me what to do at the beginning of our relationship but in the end I was SO grateful for that restraint. The only way for me to actually learn what I wanted was to NOT know what he wanted. I had been basing my desires and needs on other people's my whole life and it was a hard habit to break. So I'm reasonably sure he won't shift at this point.

And thank you for the reminder that love is a good thing. And a healthy response.

Pan,
I am so glad you posted and saved me the trouble of writing a summary, that was VERY considerate of you.

quote:

This is one of those deliciously murky kind of situations that we hate so much.

Had to laugh when I read this out loud as that is EXACTLY it! I still prefer crystal-clear, black and white, thank you very much (even if I am painfully aware of how rarely that actually happens in life.)

quote:

I have been like a ping pong ball trying to figure out how to respond, i agree with every single post, those that are saying go for it and those saying hang on a moment. It is the same old , 'which one is it?', pattern and maybe now is the time to remember that there is simply no right or wrong answer.

That really describes how I felt reading everyone's responses. There were thoughtful points and good arguments made for both courses of action. Which is helpful in and of itself, since if a good argument can be made for either side, that tells there isn't a right or wrong answer as you pointed out. Although I REALLY appreciate it that you went on with your lovely optimism to see this as a win/win. Thank you for your confidence in me. (((((Pan)))))

Thank you all again, I'm going to sit with all this. But either way, it is SO good to know I am not alone and that I have people who care about me who understand what I'm feeling. You are all the best.

love, AG

Hi AG,

Loved reading everyone's responses. The different perspectives were very interesting. I loved Monte's story about her kids. That was especially illuminating. I guess what is still nagging at me, though and I'm struggling to articulate this, is in my mind the only really permanent loss is death. Why impose something on this relationship that doesn't have to be there? Yes, the relationship has changed. Yes, you want to learn how to do this thing called life on your own. It's time to move on. And I would say no to going back to see him if in your heart you believe you are going back because you do not want to try to apply what you have learned to the real world. I don't know enough about loss to know how damaging it would be for you to go back. Would it prevent you from moving on?

If you had won the parent lottery and then you grew up and life was great. Your parents would still be involved in your life until death but just in a different way. I guess that's what I'm trying to compare it to.

I'm also glad you were able to share it with us. Of course, I dread my own ending with my T but just keep getting in deeper and deeper. YIKES!!! Let us know how you are doing and what you decide. Of course, only if you want to.

HUGS,

Liese

Liese,

I like your point about imposing something on the relationship that doesn't need to be there. I can see where you are coming from. I guess my thought is that seeing T now might make things harder. But this is just an assumption on my part, not anything based on fact. Perhaps I am wrong and it will alleviate the feelings of loss and sadness. It is so hard to predict how things are going to feel. If only there were a mathematical formula to follow to arrive at a definite outcome! Life would be soooo much easier!

Hi DF,

What does your T mean by that? Actually, that if and when we all successfully finish therapy we will be unable to find people in the real world to connect to? That sounds GRIM!!!

"I actually am considering going back to see him for just one appt mainly because I am struggling with some decisions about where I want to put my energy these days and it just feels like being able to talk it out with him would really lend me some clarity. But I am also really worried that it's not a good thing to do. So I keep bouncing back and forth."

Hi AG...Just thought I'd pop in- and I saw your thread here. I'm so sorry that you have been so sick, suffering so much- and mssing your T makes pain uncomforted. I like so much that the general consensus seem to be- ala Pan- that there is no right or wrong answer. It's true, that there is no morally or definitively, cognitively, right or wrong in this decision- But that is not to minimize that it really is a dilemma. It seems to me, that you have choice between two sets of consequences- you already know what those are-you've face them before, in your termination phase, and now they are coming back again in slightly different form, in this new phase of your grieving- so you just have to pick which set of consequences are preferable to *you* and in this sense- there is no right or wrong answer. But I think, there is probably a right or wrong answer *for you.* Otherwise there wouldn't be this discussion. What are the deep consequences of seeing him again, dearest AG? Would you be comfortable sharing those here? I am also wondering, what are the deep, AG consequences of *not* seeing him? And could you list those, perhaps- or share about the feelings around them a bit more?

Biggest hugs,

BB

**edited to say only if it is helpful for you to write about those ideas...of course**

Hi AG,

Coming in late as usual. I'm sorry you're feeling such intense longing for your T, but really, how can this not happen from time to time after all you'd been through together?

I'm curious to know if you are able to connect this longing to the longing and absence of the same things from your parents. Clearly, you long specifically for your T, but I wonder if you're able to also connect that up with what might be some original longings for your mom and dad.

This makes me wonder if it's actually possible to experience an original longing and, at the same time, identify it as being that.

I hope you're feeling better today, and in general.

Best,
Russ

Update: I emailed my T to ask for an appointment and got an email back that he's on vacation right now but will set up something when I come back. He seemed very comfortable with it. I want to thank everyone again for your input. Those discussions and thinking about them really helped me to clarify my thinking and come to a decision. More about that below in my response to BB.

quote:

If only there were a mathematical formula to follow to arrive at a definite outcome! Life would be soooo much easier!

LadyGrey, you have no idea how deeply I agree with you there.

DF, it was a good question to have to think about and answer. It's funny but when I'm wrestling with my emotions but stop to answer that kind of question, it brings back so much of what I learned because I trying to put it into words, and that always brings comfort.

quote:

What does your T mean by that? Actually, that if and when we all successfully finish therapy we will be unable to find people in the real world to connect to? That sounds GRIM!!!

Hi Beebs,
It's good to "see" you, thanks for venturing out of lurkdom to reply.

quote:

What are the deep consequences of seeing him again, dearest AG? Would you be comfortable sharing those here? I am also wondering, what are the deep, AG consequences of *not* seeing him? And could you list those, perhaps- or share about the feelings around them a bit more?

I have a confession to make, I emailed my T to ask for an appointment before I read your post. And then kind of kicked myself because I thought these were excellent questions. So I'm going to answer them anyway (there's still time to change my mind, we haven't set up an appt yet.) Thank you for asking them as I thought they were very insightful questions to ask.

The deep consequences of seeing my T: The joy of being somewhere and with someone with whom I feel safe, understood, accepted and valued. That NEVER gets old. I have also found myself struggling at times to hang onto to what I've learned and apply as I go along and at times have found myself a little confused. It feels like being able to talk to him about what its been like will help me find clarity and make the way forward clearer. I always feel clearer about things after talking to my T. There are some projects I'm thinking of getting involved in, but are debating when and how, and my T intimately knows both my strengths, weaknesses and unconscious motivations. I know he won't tell me what to do, but I also know he is very skillful at asking the right questions so that I can find my own answer that is true to who I am. And I'm homesick and it would be a relief to be with him for a little while and interrupt the intense sense of loss. A respite along the way. It also feels like I have been out exploring and I need to return to my safe base to talk about the exploration, share my triumphs, and be reassured about my ability to be out there. But I will also experience once again the pain of being with someone whom I love so deeply but cannot fully know. And at the end of the appointment, I will have to leave, which will once again put the fact that therapy is all there is (which is an incredible abundance mind you) right square in my consciousness. And I know it will hurt. I think it will be more than bearable and become easy to live with, but it will always be a loss not being able to have more with my T. And it may be that seeing him now may be an interruption of a necessary mourning process and will set me back and only prolong that process and being a healthy human being I don't want to have to be in more pain than necessary. And being painfully honest, BB, I want my T to be proud of me (silly, actually since he already is), maybe a better way to put it is that I want to do him proud. And that to go back is to somehow let him down. I don't believe that last one is the truth, that he will feel let down, but emotionally, I know that drive to "get it right" is very powerful for me.

The deep consequences of not seeing my T: I miss him very badly at times and that pain can become intense, and start to interfere with my sense of connection and trust in the relationship. I fear the grief of the loss overwhelming my sense of all the good that came out of the relationship and I don't want to lose it. There are times when not having the clear reflection that my T provided can make me feel invisible and very alone. I fear disappearing somehow or losing the person I became in his office. But this was a fear that we discussed alot when I was leaving, and I do know it's a fear and not the truth. But again, the feelings can be strong. It may be that I really do need to check in right now, that I need that touchstone and if I don't go I could making things more difficult for myself without any need to. Again, being healthy, I don't want to experience more pain than I have to. My wanting not to go could just be another manifestation of my fear of needing anyone or admitting that I'm needy (rather than a healthy independence, a pathological one) and therefore, I would be missing a chance to reinforce my skills at reaching out, that leaning on my T is the right thing to do. I really enjoy just being with my T and I worry that I am denying this to myself out of a misplaced unconscious belief that I don't deserve good things. On the other hand, that not seeing my T will reinforce my new skills, allow me to move more quickly through the grief, strengthen my confidence in doing this on my own and allow me to grow by stretching beyond what is comfortable for me.

In the end, BB, I realized that there was really no way of actually being sure of any of this or of the "right" thing to do. So in the end, my memory of the good results of moving closer placed against my rising sense of inner chaos tipped me toward choosing to go back. But I am trying to do so mindfully, paying attention to how I feel and what the fall out is, so that I can decide if this was helpful or harmful and learn from it so I can know better what to do next time. I remembered the most important of the lessons my T taught me which is that I can face and overcome whatever comes my way. So if this turns out well, it will be really helpful in the short run and if it turns out badly, I can handle that, and it will turn out well in the long run. Everything will be ok in the end.

Russ,
Always good to hear from you, sooner or later.

quote:

I'm curious to know if you are able to connect this longing to the longing and absence of the same things from your parents. Clearly, you long specifically for your T, but I wonder if you're able to also connect that up with what might be some original longings for your mom and dad.

The answer for me is a definite yes. The only way I can describe it is that I will get hit with the grief of missing my T and what I can't have with him, and as I let the feelings in and feel them I can sometimes find relief fairly quickly, while at other times, the sense of grief and pain can get really deep. As I move through my feelings, I realize that the loss of seeing my T and having that connection reverberates with the grief of what I didn't get from my parents. Which makes the intensity very high and brings back some of the feelings of despair and abandonment. But those were feelings I visited with my T and learned to recognize. So when I hit that intensity, I can internally acknowledge "oh yes, that is the pain surrounding what I didn't get from mom and dad. But I've dealt with that and don't have to dwell on it anymore" and that allows me to move away from the that part of the pain. I'm sorry Russ, this is a really inadequate explanation of what it's like. It's as much a "felt" process as it is a cognitive one and very much one I learned from feeling this stuff in the presence of my T and having him help me to regulate and move through it. It's implicit learning and therefore very difficult to describe. But bottom line, I really can recognize when the old stuff rises up and experience an original longing and, at the same time, identify it as being that.

And thanks, I am still on the mend and guarding my energy, but am feeling much, much better.

AG

quote:

The deep consequences of not seeing my T: I miss him very badly at times and that pain can become intense, and start to interfere with my sense of connection and trust in the relationship. I fear the grief of the loss overwhelming my sense of all the good that came out of the relationship and I don't want to lose it.

I love what you wrote here. It makes so much sense. Originally I said I didn't think you should contact T just yet, but after reading this, I change my stance on that. I can see how it would be important to touch base every once in a while to reconnect as a reminder of the solidity of that relationship. If you are anything like me, when we are away from people for a while, the relationship changes in my mind and I start making the relationship bad, even if it was left on good terms. So reconnecting is vital to keeping the relationship "real" in my head, if that makes sense.

quote:

It may be that I really do need to check in right now, that I need that touchstone and if I don't go I could making things more difficult for myself without any need to. Again, being healthy, I don't want to experience more pain than I have to. My wanting not to go could just be another manifestation of my fear of needing anyone or admitting that I'm needy (rather than a healthy independence, a pathological one) and therefore, I would be missing a chance to reinforce my skills at reaching out, that leaning on my T is the right thing to do.

Dear ((AG))
This feels to me so *normal* - like a youngster who has left home and is spreading its wings and learning to become an independent adult but occasionally needing to go back home for a *top up* of confidence, love etc My feeling fwiw, is maybe let go of the *thinking/over thinking* and go with your *gut feelings* and enjoy meeting up again with your beloved T
Morgs

Hi AG

Long long time since I signed in here and I've missed your contributions. I've kept browsing but not signed in but I can totally identify with your dilemma so I had to post.
I said goodbye to my T in May last year and spent months grieving as you describe and in the quandary you describe. In August I contacted him to say that I had things to say and like your T he was totally cool with this. I also saw him in November. So far so good just to pick up the pieces with him and he agreed that there was no point in talking to anybody else about things that related to my missing him. So far so good but just last week I put an 'emergency'call into him and met him. I was personally very disappointed in myself for having to do this but he wasn't and I'm seeing him this week to follow up but the change is that there is a tacit understanding between us that this will not be a prolonged number of sessions. I look at it like an 'after sales service'.

So! My experience would indicate that you should go for it. Your T sounds a lot like mine. I should tell you all that I've been with my T on and off for 15 years - not sure if that helps anybody but there have been periods of 4 to 5 years in there where I had no contact at all and lived to tell the tale. This time was differnt though as we were much closer.

Not to make it sound simplistic - I still agonise over 'will I / won't I' all the time but somehow have managed to live to tell the tale each time.

Wishing you all the best
Lady

HI AG,

Really appreciate you taking the time to share your struggle with us. It was all very heartfelt and real, which of course makes it beautiful. I have faith that you will make the right decision for you. And, as lady of shallot has shown us all here, it can be done and there is no shame in going home. You've done a great job thus far.

Best and biggest hugs,

Liese

quote:

Originally I said I didn't think you should contact T just yet, but after reading this, I change my stance on that. I can see how it would be important to touch base every once in a while to reconnect as a reminder of the solidity of that relationship. If you are anything like me, when we are away from people for a while, the relationship changes in my mind and I start making the relationship bad, even if it was left on good terms. So reconnecting is vital to keeping the relationship "real" in my head, if that makes sense.

LG,
That makes total sense to me, you described what I was talking about. It was actually a relief to know someone else feels that way, I appreciate you understanding. That's it, if I've managed to convince you, I'm going. I'm still waiting to hear back about an appt, but he was on vacation until today, so I'm assuming I won't hear back from him until Monday. He's never very fast moving on non-emergency stuff and I did make it clear it wasn't urgent.

DF,
Loved what you said about your relationships changing because you've changed and become capable of going deeper. I've experienced a lot of shifting in many of my relationships as I've grown in therapy. And I do have closer, deeper, more intimate relationships now then I've ever been able to have before. The real me is front and center so much more often now and I have a consistent sense of self, if that makes sense. Thanks for wishing me well in the session, DF.

quote:

maybe let go of the *thinking/over thinking* and go with your *gut feelings* and enjoy meeting up again with your beloved T

Morgs,
That, my dear, sounds like EXCELLENT advice! You kind of caught my tendency to over think things, huh? LOL I'm already feeling better just anticipating seeing him again. Feels easier to breathe. So I'm just oing to listen to you and try and enjoy this. Thanks.

LOS!!!!!! It is SO good to hear from you, I have missed you and often wondered how you are doing! Thank you for taking the time to respond to this. I do remember you going in and out of treatment with you T and I remember how deep and important the relationship is for you. Thank you for sharing your experience as it encourages me that what I'm doing can be done, so to speak. And I agree with what you said about knowing it won't be a prolonged number of sessions. This honestly feels like I just want to go in for one session, to touch base and process some of what happened since I've left and then go back out and continue to experience life on my own. The best analogy I can think of is skipping a flat stone over the surface of a still lake. It touches down so briefly on the surface of the water, then shoots off again into flight. I'm hoping that's what I'll do.

And it was comforting to know you've survived long gaps. I will live! And it was very generous of you to admit that you can still agnoise over the will I/ won't I as I can feel quite stupid about making such a big deal of this.

It was really wonderful to hear from you! I'm glad that you are holding up in your own goodbye.

(((((LOS)))))))

AG

AG,

I'm sorry I didn't respond to this sooner, but I'm glad to see that you've resolved this in your mind and reached out for what you need. I hope you hear from your T soon and that meeting up with him again settles things back down and that you get what you need from the session.

Keep us posted!

AG,

Never too much detail. Always wonderful to read your posts and everyone elses.

Liese

You know what i find startling, i left regular therapy about 2 years ago and for the first year i had regular adhoc sessions with my T and it never occurred to me to be disappointed in myself or feel that i was letting myself down in any way.

I felt like i was applying what i had learnt and that my T was there to help me get back on my feet and make sure i was doing it right and not falling back into old patterns. My ego must be the size of a small country because it simply never occurred to me that my T's sole purpose might not be to make my life better.

And even now that i don't need him to keep my balance so much anymore i still check in every few months just because he is important to me and i miss him and i love talking to him and knowing he is alright. Am i doing this wrong?????
I feel like there is some manual somewhere that just wasn't given to me...

And AG if just having contact with your T has made you breathe easier then best you check in with him more regularly to keep that chest of yours open and clear.

I am so glad you have struggled with something so important and come out the other side. This IS life after therapy AG, it is all in the figuring it out for yourself. IMHO the only difference between us is that the figuring it out in my little 'way of the world according to Pan' doesn't have to exclude your T. In fact it is so much richer for having your T in it.

Pan

quote:

I felt like i was applying what i had learnt and that my T was there to help me get back on my feet and make sure i was doing it right and not falling back into old patterns. My ego must be the size of a small country because it simply never occurred to me that my T's sole purpose might not be to make my life better.

Pan,
That is NOT a large ego, it's a very healthy attitude which is just another of your wonderful attributes I envy. I would kill to be able to say so freely:

quote:

And even now that i don't need him to keep my balance so much anymore i still check in every few months just because he is important to me and i miss him and i love talking to him and knowing he is alright. Am i doing this wrong?????

No, I think you're doing it absolutely right and I wish I could just see it this way instead of struggling to have it be ok that I miss him and love talking to him and knowing he's alright. When I hear you saying it, it seems very natural and reasonable.

The truth is that one of the major themes of my work with my T was moving closer in relationship, and learning it was ok to have needs and to try to get them met and to ask other people to help fulfill my needs. I still have a pretty strong system in place that whispers down deep "you have to do this alone. You shouldn't have needs. If you do, don't you dare make them known. The only way to not be sent away is to NOT have any needs." You get the trend. In the end, realizing this can be such a strong set of beliefs (despite knowing cognitively that they are NOT true) is what tilted me towards going. I know how far over into "do it on your own" my bias is, so I figured if I felt like I was teetering-tottering back and forth on what to do, then going was a good idea. I'm much better at telling other people to do this stuff, than I am at doing myself.

Thank you, Pan, this just made me feel a whole lot better and peaceful about my decision. I like the 'way of the world according to Pan.'

AG

I emailed my T to ask for an appointment and he responded the next day to tell me he was on vacation (Of course I emailed him while he was on vacation ) and he would schedule the appointment when he returned. It was clear it was no problem; he sounded as he aways did. I love that man's consistency. I made it clear that it was no emergency, I was just looking for an appointment sometime in the next few weeks. Several days went by without hearing from him which is par for the course for my T for non-emergency communications, so I sent him a reminder email last night at 7:30 and got an email back at 9:30 with an appointment. I'm seeing him Tuesday, Feb 1st at 8:30 AM which was kind of cool, because insomuch as I had a regular appointment (which wasn't very ), that was my "normal" appointment. I'm nervous, but very happy to know I'll be seeing him. Now I'll just have to figure out how to fit everything I want to talk to him about into 50 mins...

Hi AG

SO happy to hear that you have a definite appointment with Sir T. And even nicer that you got in at your "regular" time. Hopefully that will help you feel a bit more grounded, kind of like you never really left, even as you are feeling excited at the same time. It makes me feel very happy to imagine you sitting across from your beloved T, smiling and talking animatedly about all that has transpired since you last met.

quote:

I'll be sure to let you know how it goes.

Can't wait!

quote:

Probably in way too much detail.

No such thing, lady!!

Hugs,
SG

Hi AG

Well done for making that move Like the others I love his constancy, even giving you that appointment time. He's taking it as quite a normal thing for you to do, so hold onto that when you start to feel as if you shouldn't have.

Can't wait to hear how it goes, I hope it's really helpful session for you,

starfish

Hi AG,

So glad T gave you your "regular" appointment. I love it!

Liese

I love the way he responded, giving you your time so matter of factly really.
I would be just enjoying the knowing that I would be seeing him, soon, if it was me.
I am so glad you are.
You can tell him we've all been missing him too!

Thanks June, I like him too. It wasn't so much unsettling that he was on vacation as I felt bad that even now when I'm not seeing him, I'm interrupting his vacation. But he explained to me once that vacation isn't about not talking to a patient for a few minutes or writing an email, it's about not having to always be in contact and always keeping a watch on his phone and beeper, so I'm not going to worry about it. And don't worry, I'm sure I'll talk about it.

SG,
How did you get a picture of me? I look exactly like that little yellow guy right down to the arm waving. Thanks for all your encouragement.

Starfish,
I appreciate the affirmation about the decision, I must admit that there is still some wavering going on, but it's getting pretty weak. And now you've given me something to hang on to, thank you.

Sadly, I'll be sure to let him know, it's such fun because when I tell him that stuff, he always blushes and squirms just a little in addition to being pleased.

Thanks everyone, I really do appreciate all the encouragement and understanding!

AG

Thanks for the encouragement June and Draggers, it really is wonderful to have the support.

That said, I just wanted to say that I'm feeling pretty activated and scared about going tomorrow, enough so that it's interfering with being able to respond to other people's posts right now. The closer the appointment gets, the more it's feeling like a bad idea. I have a whole avalanche of old bad message coming at me. In some ways, I'm really glad that I had to email him twice to get the appointment because it's making canceling feel like something really rude to do.

It's weird, because I know I'm going to go, and I know it's going to be alright, but that's not stopping me from being in a bit of a funk (and that despite several good friends working very hard to reassure me.) I really wish this just wouldn't be a big deal, you know? It doesn't feel like it should be. I hate having to remember to breathe.

And I know I'm not SUPPOSED to use the word, but I'm supposed to be over this now!! There, I said it!

AG

Oh, dearest AG - it's going to be ok. You are loved and you will be welcomed. I am pretty sure this is a good idea. Just let the feelings come.

Love,
Jones

So agree with Jonesy....AG you will be ok, but that's not to say it might not bring back some very good and some very difficult felings as you remember those good times with him. So be prepared for that, but also just refuel again and enjoy being in the company of one who knows you so well and really cares about how you are doing.

starfishy

Oh AG!!!! Will be thinking of you tomorrow!! I know you know this but I am going to remind you - it is GOOD to have needs and you DESERVE to have them met!!! Over the moon for you right now!!

Ditto what SB said! Good luck tomorrow, I'll be thinking of you!

Thank you Jones, starfish, seablue and STRM, it really helped to have your support. I think I finally connected what the fear was about. I am returning to my attachment figure after being out exploring and I am unsure what I will find. When I went towards my dad I never knew what I would get: the "good" daddy or the monster. So once again, my poor innocent T is having to bear the suspicion my father created. I actually think that, that for all my conscious reasons about going back, that unconsciously I'm going back to check that my secure base is still there, unchanged and trustworthy. Realizing this hasn't made the fear go away but it has made it easier to be push it further away and to be gentler with myself because I can understand why I would feel that fear.

I am so grateful to be able to come here and talk to people who can understand, thank you all again. I'll let you all know how it goes.

Seablue,
Thank you so much for posting. It's really good to "see" you here again!! I hope you are doing well.

AG