((((JM))))

I just want you to know I am here with you. It seems unfair there was no warning that therapy would uncover so much pain and sadness. I try and take inspiration from those people who have had success in their therapy because I know I don't feel like I have yet.

No it isn't fair and I am sorry that it isn't, for you and for me and for everyone else here who struggles so hard to just have a normal life. I am so sorry that you are having such a difficult time and have been unable to get enough relief through your connection with your T. I would say I have about a 50/50 chance of feeling better after a phone call with my T. Since the odds aren't great I don't always call when I probably should because if the call doesn't help then what? It is so hard to be alone with your pain and frightening but the worse you feel the harder it is to reach out - to anyone. Such a sick joke of the universe. It isn't fair that bad things happen to innocent children who have no control and only want to trust and be loved. It isn't fair that the sh(*)t that happened to us so many years ago still hurts us and frightens us and keeps us prisoner. And it certainly isn't fair that this one person with whom you have finally learned to trust and depend on and be totally vulnerable with is not a mother, lover or friend.

As you can probably tell, I don't get it either JM and I am a bit disillusioned with the system myself. It seems the harder I work in therapy the more pain I feel and this is supposed to be a good thing? I keep hearing that it will be and I'll be a better person for it so this is what I hang onto. Someday, somehow I will be happy I am me or at least content. I won't be terrified to meet people or interview for a job or even look in the mirror. I envy my friends who grew up in "functional" families and have always, for the most part, liked themselves. We will too someday it is just a lot harder to learn how now that we are older. Like learning a new language I guess. Kids can soak it in but most adults need to practice it over and over and over again - well at least I do. And our T's are certainly good at dealing with the repetition, falls, and reluctance. I don't know anyone else in my life who would ever be that patient or even interested in the process.

I really hope my post doesn't make you feel worse. I do hope you can find some peace soon. Big hugs ((JM))

JM -

I have thought the very same thing. I wonder why I ever confided in my son's T. I wonder why I didn't just keep everything bottled inside like I've been doing for so many years. I know now why it's been such a long time since I confided in someone, because it has never worked out and always ended in pain and misunderstanding.

You are dealing with more than anyone should ever have to deal with. But you know what - you're doing it. You are dealing with it with your T, and you're coming here and sharing it with us. You are so courageous and let me tell you, it's contagious. Since I have hardly any memories from my childhood, I'm pretty sure I'm following the same path as you and those memories will come back to me. I'm not looking forward to it, but I think it's inevitable. When I think about quitting before the real painful stuff starts, I read a post from you and see your courage despite how difficult it can be, and it gives me what I need to keep going. I really want to thank you for that.

River, I think you summed it up very well:

quote:

I keep hearing that it will be and I'll be a better person for it so this is what I hang onto. Someday, somehow I will be happy I am me or at least content. I won't be terrified to meet people or interview for a job or even look in the mirror. I envy my friends who grew up in "functional" families and have always, for the most part, liked themselves. We will too someday it is just a lot harder to learn how now that we are older.

I really hope you find some relief soon. We all care about you here, you are important to us, and we want things to be better for you.

OW

JM

I am so sorry that you are feeling like this. It just doesn't seem fair that when we get that little bit of relief, and we feel what happy feels like, and we think we are better, then we fall into the pain and darkness all over again. It feels like we will never be whole or healed or happy or whatever we think peace will be. It's not fair -- it sucks!!!

But JM, we are all here for you and for each other. I don't think that anyone in my life, except maybe my T, knows what it feels like for me. But I know that everyone here knows what it feels like. And I know that when you feel empathy for me, and you tell me that I will be ok, that your words are not just empty gibberish. That you are saying those words because you have been there. I value that.

As awful as this is for you right now, I know you have the courage to make it through. You have done it before. I sometimes think that I would be better off if I were still walking through life with the blinders on, but I know that I can not return to the way things were before I started therapy. I know that 3 years seems like a long time to not be done yet, I have been doing this for over 2 years and I'm really not done yet!

Please try to think of all your cyber-friends circled around you, and helping to hold you up. As a group, we are strong. Let us be there for you. Relief will come in time.

PL

That was really beautiful HB. You don't need a helmet, you need a Pulitzer.

This is pure poetry:

quote:

This moment of hopelessness is extraordinarily powerful, because as we drop the fairy tale we so desperately want to believe in, reality sneaks in, naked and in all its glory. The moment we begin to accept the reality of our pain - and when i say accept i don't mean pretend that it is okay so it goes away quicker - i mean feel our heart break open in the despair that this is our life, that is when we find the joy, the beauty and most importantly the healing.

I just wanted to let all of you know that i keep reading and re-reading your posts. I want to reply but I don't have the strength right now, I hope you all understand. The pain is so intense that I am completely drained. All I can do is sleep today. I am grieving and I am hurting very deeply. I know it is all about my past and much less about my T than it feels right now. I may try to get into see her before Wednesday if I don't feel better by tomorrow. I am grateful once again for all your support.
I cling to every line I read.
JM

You are in my prayers JM.

JM

All I can say is that I hope things get better for you. If you think that seeing your T sooner will help relieve the pain, then call her. She is a wonderful T and she will at least be able to share in your pain. And, hopefully give you some comfort.

None of this is easy, is it? I am thinking of you and hoping for relief soon.

PL

Hummingbird, River was right that was pure poetry and a perfect description of what needs to happen.

JM and River, I really do understand how you're feeling, its a place I've been in many times. But you will not be left in darkness and in pain. There really is another side and you'll reach it. You both are too strong and courageous and determined to not heal. The Shadow will pass.

I want to share a passage from the "The Return of the King" the third book in the Lord of the Rings trilogy. I loved this book before I even realized why. The thought of facing an insurmountable evil and beyond all hope, defeating it, appealed to me for some reason. This passage has always meant so much to me because it's something I so deeply believe and I wanted to offer it in hope that it will provide some comfort and hope.

Sam and Frodo are crawling slowly through Mordor never believing that they'll live through it but determined to keep going. Frodo is sleeping and Sam gets up to stay awake while keeping watch

quote:

Frodo sighed and was asleep almost before the words were spoken. Sam struggled with his own weariness, and he took Frodo's hand; and there he sat silent till deep night fell. Then at last, to keep himself awake, he crawled from the hiding-place and looked out. The land seemed full of creaking and cracking and sly noises, but there was no sound of voice or of foot. Far above the Ephel Duath in the West the night-sky was still dim and pale. There, peeping amoung the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing; there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach. His song in the Tower had been defiance rather than hope; for then he was thinking of himself. Now, for a moment, his own fate, and even his master's, ceased to trouble him. He crawled back into the brambles adn laid himself by Frodo's side, and putting away all fear he cast himself into a deep untroubled sleep.

HB:
AWESOME!!
I totally agree. As painful as it is, that's just how it HAS to happen, or we just stay stuck in that perpetual motion machine!!!
JM:
I have felt EXACTLY the way you described in your post--like I might be getting better for a day or 2, then, BAM! It all blows up again and I feel so hopeless and like what's the use? I even told my hubby that one day, that I don't know why I even bother trying, because it always seems like 1 step forward then 2 steps back. BUT.............
Then I get another "good" day and I make some more progress and, somehow(and I totally don't know how it happened), I had enough "good" days to get myself "back." I know none of that probably made any sense to you.
I am sorry you are feeling so bad. Just hang in there and keep trying. I never thought I would get back where I am emotionally, but, somehow I did. I know my T helped alot. And I was totally skeptical of the whole counseling concept when I first went in---heck, even after I'd been a "regular" for some time. LOL. But now I realize what a HUGE and WONDERFUL impact it/he had on my life,and, consequently, my family's life. I have heard you speak about your daughter on here. I know she must look up to you alot, and rightly so, from what I gather from your posts. So, continue the good example and take good care of yourself!You are on the right track! You are worth every effort to find your happiness in your life!!

AJB, I keep hoping to experience the permanance that you now know. It is encouraging to see that it does happen. But it is so frustrating to go through the continuous ups and downs, sometimes it feels like it will never end.

Speaking of never ending; will I ever learn?? I called T yesterday asking for another appt (hoping for today) She returned my call this morning and is not in the office today and doesn't have any openings until Thurs, so I declined and said I will see how I am doing at our regular appt on Wed. But when she asked how I was doing at the beginning of the conversation, I just groaned "ok." And she left it there even though I know it was not believable. I should have said "well not too good, you got a minute?" But part of me feels like I have been calling too much lately and I know that phone calls often are unsatisfying so I let it go. Now I feel upset that she didn't see through that and "baby me" I guess. I am such a loser!
JM

Gosh JM, wanting to have someone care enough to listen deeper than the surface and want to meet our needs, yeah, that sounds like a loser.

DO NOT MAKE ME GET THE HTML SLAPPER! I'm tired and I don't feel like digging through the virtual closet right now, it's a mess!

AG

quote:

wanting to have someone care enough to listen deeper than the surface and want to meet our needs, yeah, that sounds like a loser.

OK AG...now you're starting to _sound_ like my T! Slap that!

Oh and BTW AG;
I've been meaning to talk to you about the looks of that closet!

JM,

I wonder how often Ts do this because they want us to vocalize our needs, and how often they do this 'cause they're hearing what they want to hear.

JM

Are we seeing that sense of humor starting to slip out just a bit? Oh yeah, I can see it! It's lookin' good!

PL

quote:

OK AG...now you're starting to _sound_ like my T!

What a lovely compliment JM!

Hey, respect the closet! I know its a mess but I know how to find everything in it.

(OMINOUS MUSIC) Including the HTML slapper, so behave!

Wynne,
I think sometimes its a combo. I think when a T is overloaded and trying to get a lot done they're just as prone as other people to take a surface answer at face value if it makes things easier. What we should probably be impressed with is how well they CAN look below the surface when they're applying themselves. Communicating with my T outside of therapy can be a disaster (I'm going through appt hell even as I type) but in session, I swear it's like the man can read my mind. Sometimes he knows what I'm thinking before I do.

Hey, speaking of Ts (like we talk about anything else ) How goes the search?

AG

Oh, alternate funny answer! (You always think of the best lines too late!)

You just don't like the closet because I can find the HTML slapper and you can't! Nah nah!

(I didn't say it was mature!)

Wynne, I was wondering the same thing. But she has warned me that she cannot be as attuned to me over the phone even though she says she'd like to be. But how much is it that she is waiting for me to vocalize my needs I wonder, but if it is deliberate I think it's cruel to do over the phone and when they know how much we depend on them for a brief connection and reassurance. So I sorta think she just has to make herself trust her clients to say what they need to say over the phone and she will pick bones and analyze in session to beat a dead horse.

PL, I suppose a little humor is returning. You think that's really a good thing though? LOL My heart is still aching though.

AG, I always save the best for last. AND
Aw gosh, how cute, they're all in sync! LOL

JM

All kidding aside, I know the ache is still there. For me, it is always just below the surface. But, anytime we can get even a short break from it and a little relief, is hopefully a time when we can see that it is all worth it. It isn't easy, and sometimes we feel like someone chewed us up into bits and spit us out, but getting to the bottom of all our issues has to be wonderful. At least I keep clinging on to that thought, so that I have a reason for letting myself go through so much pain.

I don't think your T deliberately shined you on. I know that my T really tunes into my body language and seems to know how I am feeling before I even open up my mouth. That is hard to do over the phone. Hopefully you will have a really good session on Wednesday and you will feel some relief.

PL

Well, guess who just called me a few minutes ago to tell me she had a cancellation for tomorrow? You'll never guess in a million years.

Dilemma: I accepted the appointment so quickly that I forgot to realize that it is not as urgent as it was this morning and now I almost feel like talking about it will be futile. It sure didn't feel that way yesterday or this morning, but now the feelings calm down and as I always do I tend to question the significance of what I was feeling and minnimize them until they rear their ugly head again. It's like you say PL, it is always just below the surface anyway. So now I wonder, should I go or call her back and cancel? Why should this be so complicated?

Ever notice that Transference starts with T? It's also a 4 letter word x 3! (unless I spelled it wrong) AAAGH!

quote:

It sure didn't feel that way yesterday or this morning, but now the feelings calm down and as I always do I tend to question the significance of what I was feeling and minnimize them until they rear their ugly head again.

JM

Can I ever relate to this!!! I have been having my ups and downs this weekend and I have almost called my T about 10 times. But then I think, what can she do about it over the phone anyway? And, she'll probably think I am just overreacting. Truth be told, I know she would be understanding and tell me that I have every right to be anxious. But, I always have that little fear of what she thinks of me. We have had that conversation many times so she knows. We will probably have that conversation tomorrow I suspect.

I think you should go tomorrow. What you have been feeling is very significant and very painful. Your T cares a lot for you, and she must have sensed that this is a big deal for you. Otherwise, she would not have called you when she got a cancellation. That's just my 2 cents. You have to do what feels right for you. Hope it all gets better quickly.

PL

1. I should have never started therapy- it hurts and its confusing and I want it to stop. I am stuck in hell?????

I am glad I started therapy, because I am stronger than I was. Hold way more knowledge/understanding than I had...=) I am strong and smart and can get through this.. I am not a quitter and there is NO going back! I am working my way OUT of hell



2.I wish I never met my therapist- because the fear of loosing her scares me to death!

I am SO happy/thankful to have her, because she is a great guide and she lets my find my own way. She doesn't show me the way, because she doesn't know MY way anymore than I do! Only I have the answers.... Everything happens for a reason! I am learning about transference and PTSD ect ect within this relationship. I have also taken out some toxic people from my life..


3.I wander if my therapist is bad or if I am the bad one

My therapist didn't ruin my life or make me feel all these neg. feelings. I have had them long before I have known her. I am glad I have to her help me work through it and understand it... No one is bad.... the people who hurt me are bad!



4.Did my therapist/therapy ruin my life....???

Nope my life was like this WAY before I met her or started working on this bull crap...