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Hi all! It's a long time since i've been around here on forum, and even longer since i wrote anything here myself. Most of you guys are new to me, (nice to meet you all) and some of you guys i know from before. It`s so nice to see you again. Ehm... i never really thought i`d ever write her again, but here i am, at least for now, because i am so bothered and sad about something in my therapy.

So, I've been going in therapy (psychoanalysis 3 times pr week) for almost 4 years now with my lovley, steady, old T. (startet mainly because i was depressed) He has been my light and my rock - and also the "source" of lots of frustration and grief. It's been a great - and very difficult- jearney, with lots of paternal and erotic transference involved, all the way. Still is. (lol this was my attempt to give a "short background" about my story Big Grin )

ANYWAY : allthoug i am getting quite used to the ups and downs in therapy, i am having a very difficult time right now - the last month actually - because i feel like i am loosing contact with my dear T.
At first i blamed T for being sort of distant, tired and more silent (more than usual anyway) than before. That it was "weird" to be there. Like he just lost a bit interest in me and/or is tired of me. What he SAYS is that he doesent feel distant at all, and that he feels that he is the same as always. I cant really tell whether it is me, or him, or both of us that is "different". Its confusing.
In yesterdays session i told him the nights dream where i appear to be a rebellious and difficult child (the way i was in fact!) and where i enter his office and is "acting out" and he respond by holding me (litterally) - and it feels so good and safe. Almost as if we were close again and there was nothing "wrong" with our contact at all. I felt so reliefed when i woke up, but it boothers me that it was "only" a dream and it is not even reflecting the reality of how i feel about therapy these days. Rather the opposite!- that my "difficult and childlike" behaviour is pushing him away. That the distance grows when i am like "this". He`s respond to the dream though, was that i am, he suggested, "glad that he holds me/ loves me, even though i feel that i am difficult and bad" (!)But i dont FEEL that at all. It was a dream scenario i WISHED would happen, not a description of how it actually IS.

Problem also, seem to be that i dont feel able to change this thing. I go in to see him, and all i feel is these growing rebellious/needy/difficult-child feelings, and its like i push him away deliberatley, and still something inside me is screaming: "hold me! love me!" but what i am actually doing is only provocing the opposite reaction from him. Confused Frowner I make him silent and mayby angry. At least annoyed. And i cant really blame him, if he feels that way.
So, why the heck cant i controll this impuls to push him away when i need him the most??
Now this has happened before, and it always worked out one way or another eventually, but i am so confused that it`s happending again now, after such a long good period. Espescially because I dont GET IT, why i do this, and where these feelings comes from, and i really hate that i have "the power" to push him away. It actually makes me angry that he allows me to do that, and seemingly without recognizing what is happening in the room. And i am a little afraid to talk to him about all this furhter now, as i normally always will do, because i am scared that it will push him even further away. That he gets tired of what must feel like i am complaining about him... Eeker

I just miss him so badly right now and all i seem to do is destroying the precious vercontact. Frowner
Thanks for reading. I will be very thankful for any input on this (and sorry for my bad english, i am out of training!)

ps: I forgot a bag with a painting that i made at his office yesterday, and it`s so obvious that i "forgot" it, because the painting was ment as a gift for him. At least i fantasied about giving it to him. But i am too emberrassed to ever give him any gifts at all. So i texted him and just said i forgot my bag there and if he could just keep it until i see him again in a few days.. i am so stupid.
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(((((( Froggles )))))) !!!!!!!!!!!!! How so very nice to see you posting here again though I’m sorry the reason you are back is a painful one

quote:
I cant really tell whether it is me, or him, or both of us that is "different". Its confusing.


It’s interesting that your T claims that he is no different from usual (quite openly stating thereby that something in YOU has changed, that YOUR perceptions are faulty and that you are possibly projecting or imputing to him your own feelings.) He may well be right, but it must be undermining your faith and trust in him to be made to feel like you don’t know what your own feelings are telling you, and that you are wrong. That would bother me I must say.

On the other hand, could he be right? Do you think you might be experiencing as coming from him your own dissatisfaction and boredom with therapy? If you look deeply enough into your own motives, you might be able to say more surely one way or the other. Though I expect you've already thought very deeply and very hard about this already, otherwise you wouldn't be posting here, sorry if I'm stating the obvious.

quote:
It was a dream scenario i WISHED would happen, not a description of how it actually IS.


Proof positive that the only person who can truly interpret a dream is the dreamer themself. It’s the feeling tone of a dream that conveys its meaning, and the way you’re describing this one, it really does sound like the thing you are wanting from therapy and your T rather than a reflection of external reality.

quote:
It actually makes me angry that he allows me to do that,


I am guessing that a lot of what is going on in your therapy currently is clear in this little sentence. Think, rebellious child, needing to express anger and rage but equally needing T to be steady and loving. That sounds quite normal to me actually Smiler. And I’m sure your T understands what’s going on too, though he’s obviously not behaving in the way that you would like him to. Frog I really don’t think you need to be afraid of alienating your T by telling him all about these feelings or even by acting out some of the rebellious ones, I think he will be the same steady T you’ve experienced all of these four years. (Gosh is it really four years?????)

quote:
I make him silent and mayby angry. At least annoyed. And i cant really blame him, if he feels that way.


The thing is, HE says he is NOT angry or annoyed or bored. So it really does sound like you are projecting your own fears, some sort of enactment or unconscious transference going on here?

I am sorry though that this is happening, like you I’d have thought that by this time in the therapy all those ‘phases’ and transferences and enactments would have been done with. I guess there is more stuff coming up from the depths of your psyche that needs dealing with before you’re finally done with therapy. Good news in that it keeps you seeing him for longer Smiler not so good news because it’s making you so unhappy.

I hope you are able to talk to him about all this, and that he shows he hasn’t changed at all.

Big big hugs to you Frog Hug two Hug two

LL
ugh.. i delited my first reply, so, here we go again!


((((((Blanket Girl)))))

thank you for that warm welcome! It`s so nice to see you again too! It helps to be reminded that all this stuff is just normal, and probably just another phase in therapy that will pass. And i am glad you suggest that T is not the one who is bored. Not sure if i am bored either, but definitly frustratied. Lol, yeah - the "wanting more" is definitly a core thing here. Sometimes i think i grow younger in therapy- not older- i feel like a 6 year old these days. Give me another year and i have turned into a 4 year old Big Grin
Hope you`re doing good BG- glad to see that you`re the Co-moderator here now. I`m sure forum is in good hands!

Dearst Lamps! How lovely to see you again! Thank you so much for all your comments and insight. Much appreaciated. As usual...
Yeah, it`s true i should look deeply into my own motives here. Having done that the last couple of days i think both you and BG are right about suggesting that this is projecting stuff. That does makes sense. I even hope it is true, because I really hate it when T says things i cant believe. So, in this case i really want to believe him when he says he`feels the same as always.

oh- i loved that you said i dont have to be afraid of alienating him. Lol- i love the IDEA of it anyway! Hmmmm... but the fact that he is still there, proves that he does handle this "rebellious" phases of mine though... He really is a steady T, isnt he?
I just hate that i have all these childish impulses that needs to be "acted out" in that room. Gosh- how simple it would be to do therapy if the past could just remain past, and not continue to influence the present moment that much... Brick wall
Lol- i guess that`s what therapy is all about though.

Having thought more about all this i do think that part of these turbulence is due to the fact that T will be seing my parents tomorrow also. They will meet on a conferance, and I tend to feel very moody and - yeah- a bit childish- when they meet. It`s OK, and the professional boundaries are intact, but i do think the transference stuff increases when T and parents meet. A bit out of controll i guess. Interesting that when my "transference" goes wild- i tend to become a rebellious and diffivcult child. Of all things! Go figure!

Anyway; I`will see T in a couple of days and right now i dunno what kind of session that will be. I guess i will talk to him about these things. Allthough i struggle to see how that would give me any "satisfaction" and the closeness i really need from him now Confused

Thanks again for your inputs! Dunno if i`ll stick around much though. But it was really nice to stop by here again! Smiler
Hello again Froggles Wink

I know you've been writing little posts on various threads about how your sessions have been going, but I thought I'd bump this thread to ask you how you are and to update us here on your next session (tomorrow?).

Only if you want to of course! Sometimes it's easier to just write a couple of sentences on a thread where you don't have to keep replying to responses. I guess I'm just nosey and want to know more about how you are doing. Smiler

So whether you write more here or not, wanted to send you some hugs and good wishes Hug two

LL
Hi there nigeldaniel! Welcome How nice to meet you, and thanks for your thoughts! It did turn out that you were right about T not being bored of me. I am amazed at how often i seem to be *sure* of that even though my experience tells me otherwise... It`s exhausting, really. Will be looking forwared to see you post something here if you want to! Thanks again for dropping in here!

Dear Lamps, - I did not see this message until today! Thanks for checkin`in with me Smiler It`s really sweet of you to be "nosey" (lol) as you call it! Yeah- as you`ve noticed i have posted a bit about how my last sessions went on other threads, and i guess the good news is that T and i connected again in yesterdays session and he did manage to reassure me that he was not bothered of me, nor that he`s lost interest in me. Alot of important stuff came up in that conversation (yeah- it was more like a conversation really!) that i still keep processing. He asked me whether it could be a change in me in regards to what i feel about him, and whether my very strong idealization of him (not his words!) perhaps have changed since i first saw him. - And further he also asked whether this change includes that i get more frustraited and angry and dissapointed with him due to this...

I`ve been thinking about these questions all day. I went home starting to write a list over all the things that HAS changed during this 4 years with my relationship with T, and another list over all the things that`s still the same and pretty constant in our relationship. Lol, i am not the type to write list, so i guess it indicates that i am trying to get some controll over all this now.

Honestly though, it bothers me that T seem to believe that this "changes" could be positive. At least, (if i understood him correctly) if that means i`ll keep getting more and more frustraited with him due to the idealization fading away...

Maybe i should throw that question back at forum: Have any of you guys experiences with the idealization/positive transference fading away as the process goes on? If so, how did you deal with the "natural" dissapointment that T turned out to not be the one whom could "satisfy" all your needs?

I geuss what i am entering now is a kind of sadness to realize (veeery slowly) what are the limitations of this relationship... Confused
Hi Frog,
Glad that you're around again...I don't know if I've ever responded on your posts.

quote:
Have any of you guys experiences with the idealization/positive transference fading away as the process goes on? If so, how did you deal with the "natural" dissapointment that T turned out to not be the one whom could "satisfy" all your needs?
quote:


quote:
I geuss what i am entering now is a kind of sadness to realize (veeery slowly) what are the limitations of this relationship...
quote:

I am wondering about this with myself...considering cancelling my next appointment due to this. I think of it as my attachment stuff becoming less but the idealization stuff also which is also a pattern for me and feeling like this is no different than any other relationship with is naturally having me a bit dissapointed but also figuring this is where it turns and I reluctantly know I must get at what I said I didn't want in the first place "didn't want to be dependent" but it happened to a large degree anyways. Now I have to go figure out getting at self-reliance...not that I'm not but letting her help me. It's kind of a mystery now since no other therapy lasted this long due to moves or the therapist working towards his Phd and stuff in this therapy relationship is unfolding with staying with this one for so long this time. I feel your sadness...I feel the same lately.

On my T's side she hears me and is slowly not as concerned about me taking things out of context...that's what I feel is happening.

I hope that makes sense and might be relatable.

's
Hopeful
Thanks Hopeful- Yeah, i can relate to some parts, and i think your choice of word "unfolding" was very accurate and describes very well what`s going on... The relationship sure does unfolds as time goes by and you keep seeing your T.
I think it`s great that you are in a relationship that has lasted longer than the previous ones, at least you get the chance to work with stuff that comes with the process then, that did not accour in the shorter therapies. Who knows, maybe the "unfoldning" will hold a good and much easier bunch of feelings to come as well. In fact, i KNOW, some of this sadness will fade and turn into something else again, because it`s just another phase. It`s kind of a spiral to me, and things repeats in my therapy, such as this part now where i struggle with the dissapointment and sadness that i cant have all my needs met.
It will be worth it though, in the long run i have a deep trust in that it all will be worth it.
I am sorry you can relate to the sadness part though. I hope you do will go see your T even though you struggle with this now.
Have a good day!
Froggles I wish I had some experience of this to be able to respond to you. From the way you describe it, it sounds exactly like what you think it might be – a growing recognition of just how limited the therapeutic relationship really is, and how ‘human’ the therapist ultimately is.

That you’ve been seeing your P for four years now makes me think that you’re not actually idealizing him as such and so it’s not the inevitable disillusionment of discovering that your idol has feet of clay – I think you’ve probably already experienced that a long time ago. It’s probably more like a sense of continuing unmet needs in you that you’re beginning to suspect won’t ever be met, not by your P anyway. But this is just me guessing.

Maybe what P sees as positive in this, is the fact that you are beginning to grow away from him, finding that he’s not such a wonderful being after all and so you’re more inclined to go out in the real world to get more of your met? I can understand how that would make you feel sad, like you’ve lost something good and positive Frowner.

Interesting that you are aware of this being a circle, that you are repeating phases already experienced before – only I guess that this time there are significant differences?

I’m glad that your Friday session went well though and you came away feeling reassured about your connection with P, even if the message he’s giving makes you feel sad.

Hugs to you Frog Hug two

LL
Hi their Frog, how has the weekend been insofar. Cant think off much to say here as my own experience with therapy may not tally with others.
The only thing I can say is look at Dr's/Shrinks/Counsellor in the same way as we might look and talk to ordinary people. In other words they are no different than the rest off us. A university education and a title on the door does not mean they have super powers to deal with everthing. In short give them time to help you out with any new revelation and problems. In a month or so things may well look very different indeed. A bad patch [if I can call it that] well to my mind not last long. Providing off course we can get to the bottom off said bad patch. Right I well stop now or I well bore every one silly by going on and on and on and on .... Hi
PS dont make the mistake I made 6 months ago and stop talking to T and saying you are fine no problems. That well not get you far.
ND

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