(((GE)))
Thanks for understanding and I apologize if I misunderstood what you wrote.
quote:True, that is common, however the time between sessions is much reduced as patients are typically seen 3-5 times a week. Waiting two days to talk with T is a whole lot different than waiting seven days.
RT...this is an extremely valid point. And part of why my T (who is psychoanalytically trained)offers outside contact. He says in the old days a T would see a patient 3-5 times a week and today that is once or maybe twice a week so if a patient needs some connecting contact, he has no issue with it. And BTW, my T is in his 50's and allows email, phone calls and on occassion will text.
And TAS.... I know I am very blessed to have a T who allows this. I always tell him when I count my blessings I count him twice. I hope you can find a new T who allows the contact you feel is necessary for you to move forward in your work. I, myself, would not have been able to work with a T who didn't allow this extra contact.
TN
TAS - Didn't you have outside contact before, then it changed? I'm confused why your T would say it's an across the board thing, or try to justify no outside contact with an excuse about other Ts if he used to? I'm sorry this is so difficult, TAS, and I hope you can find a T who is more inline with what you need.
That said...
I really agree with what GreenEyes said here. My T has a crazy strict (comparatively) out of session contact policy - but she and I work with it so well that I feel very blessed, attended to, and have grown.
If a client has a difficulty with outside contact (for example, stalking, going to a T's home or interacting with Ts outside of the office in an inappropriate (in their opinion) way, contacting in excessive amounts, being dysregulated by the contact, etc) assistance should be warranted. So if you're going to your Ts house... should they give you a key? If you're out of your mind with a panic attack waiting for a response you did or didn't ask for should the T... come to your house next time? If you have a neglectful past should a T be up waiting to call you as soon as that 3am e-mail comes in? If someone is unhappy with a boundary and is convinced they need something should a T just change to their whim (some do, some don't)? I think... no and think the examples are sort of equally extreme.
I've experienced a T taking a form of contact away from me. It sucks every day. It hurts everyday. I'm dealing with the fall out every day even if I don't see her. It broke my heart and rippled through all the relationships I have. It was legitimately hurting me though - logically I can see it. Emotionally? I don't think I ever will. I work with what I've got, and it still works.. and still hurts - even if I "quality" for it with past abuse, desires or needs, neglect, etc.
I feel like Ts who don't allow contact are being made to look like cruel bad guys... we have a niche market on this board (generally people with attachment issues, contact/touch issues, etc) and some clients probably don't even have out of session contact on their radar. It doesn't mean they have different trauma or need more or less than anyone here.
That said...
quote:Personally I think there's a need for flexibility that doesn't encourage unhealthy dependency or stifle growth and maturity and avoids unhelpful re-enactments and maoeuvres that undermine the therapy. Its a hard balance to get right and mistakes do happen.
quote:think what a good T does is allow space for all of the patient's feelings yet doesn't give something that either a) undermines the therapy or b) interferes with the patients ability to grow. Its like a good parent who listens to their child's feelings, validates and accepts them, yet doesn't let them do things that compromise their welfare.
I really agree with what GreenEyes said here. My T has a crazy strict (comparatively) out of session contact policy - but she and I work with it so well that I feel very blessed, attended to, and have grown.
If a client has a difficulty with outside contact (for example, stalking, going to a T's home or interacting with Ts outside of the office in an inappropriate (in their opinion) way, contacting in excessive amounts, being dysregulated by the contact, etc) assistance should be warranted. So if you're going to your Ts house... should they give you a key? If you're out of your mind with a panic attack waiting for a response you did or didn't ask for should the T... come to your house next time? If you have a neglectful past should a T be up waiting to call you as soon as that 3am e-mail comes in? If someone is unhappy with a boundary and is convinced they need something should a T just change to their whim (some do, some don't)? I think... no and think the examples are sort of equally extreme.
I've experienced a T taking a form of contact away from me. It sucks every day. It hurts everyday. I'm dealing with the fall out every day even if I don't see her. It broke my heart and rippled through all the relationships I have. It was legitimately hurting me though - logically I can see it. Emotionally? I don't think I ever will. I work with what I've got, and it still works.. and still hurts - even if I "quality" for it with past abuse, desires or needs, neglect, etc.
I feel like Ts who don't allow contact are being made to look like cruel bad guys... we have a niche market on this board (generally people with attachment issues, contact/touch issues, etc) and some clients probably don't even have out of session contact on their radar. It doesn't mean they have different trauma or need more or less than anyone here.
Honestly, Green Eyes, I feel as if I can not tackle what I need to without knowing I can touch base...such as a text saying, 'Touching Base' and him replying, 'I'm here.'
I am not talking about long drawn out conversations...etc. This is so difficult because when I start to think about it...I get so confused.
Yesterday, during the final session, after he said, "I will not reconsider." My brain literally shut off and I started getting really hot. I said, "I can't think right now and I am so hot." He said, "What are you feeling right now?" I said, "I don't know. I truly don't."
He pointed out the a/c was on 73...and he thought what I was feeling was contributing to me being hot. I told him I couldn't even think. I didn't know what I was feeling.
I am lost. I have lost two years. I tried my best but it didn't work out. I stated honestly what I needed only to be told I don't need it. He doesn't think it is in my best interest.
Liese: Thank you. It is tough. I am trying to look at this objectively, honestly, though, I can't keep asking him for something he isn't willing to give. It makes me childlike and only would become frustrating to him.
Thank you for the information you posted...I will definitely be reading over it
Erica: It definitely hits a sensitive place when I read of clients who get to touch base with their Therapist. I wish I had that. But, I don't and don't know if I can proceed.
Thank you for thinking of me and replying
TN: I do envy the relationship you have with your T. I am glad for you though Thank you.
Catalyst: I did have outside contact, and then he decided it wasn't in my best interest. He did tell me he doesn't have outside contact with anyone but he thought at the time, it might help with therapy, etc.
Are you still with the T. who took a form of contact away? How did you work through it?
I am hoping I will feel differently...just is not happening for me.
Thank you for your reply!
T.
I am not talking about long drawn out conversations...etc. This is so difficult because when I start to think about it...I get so confused.
Yesterday, during the final session, after he said, "I will not reconsider." My brain literally shut off and I started getting really hot. I said, "I can't think right now and I am so hot." He said, "What are you feeling right now?" I said, "I don't know. I truly don't."
He pointed out the a/c was on 73...and he thought what I was feeling was contributing to me being hot. I told him I couldn't even think. I didn't know what I was feeling.
I am lost. I have lost two years. I tried my best but it didn't work out. I stated honestly what I needed only to be told I don't need it. He doesn't think it is in my best interest.
Liese: Thank you. It is tough. I am trying to look at this objectively, honestly, though, I can't keep asking him for something he isn't willing to give. It makes me childlike and only would become frustrating to him.
Thank you for the information you posted...I will definitely be reading over it
Erica: It definitely hits a sensitive place when I read of clients who get to touch base with their Therapist. I wish I had that. But, I don't and don't know if I can proceed.
Thank you for thinking of me and replying
TN: I do envy the relationship you have with your T. I am glad for you though
Thank you.Catalyst: I did have outside contact, and then he decided it wasn't in my best interest. He did tell me he doesn't have outside contact with anyone but he thought at the time, it might help with therapy, etc.
Are you still with the T. who took a form of contact away? How did you work through it?
I am hoping I will feel differently...just is not happening for me.
Thank you for your reply!
T.
quote:Yesterday, during the final session, after he said, "I will not reconsider." My brain literally shut off and I started getting really hot. I said, "I can't think right now and I am so hot." He said, "What are you feeling right now?" I said, "I don't know. I truly don't."
It's looking a lot like anger Tas. It can cause a lot of confusion.
(((TAS)))
You did NOT lose 2 years. Either way, you will learn and grow from the experience. I am sure of it.
You did NOT lose 2 years. Either way, you will learn and grow from the experience. I am sure of it.
Muff,
In that moment, I laid my head down, it was feeling so heavy. It was hurting horribly and I was being completely honest with him. I truly didn't know. I wish I knew, as for myself, I don't go near a...., I avoid even saying it.
As I was typing this, about my head hurting, etc. That would happen often while as a child. My head would hurt so horribly and I would just cry. I couldn't hold it up. I couldn't bear noise. It was awful.
Thank you for replying. It is definitely something to consider
Liese: You are right.
In that moment, I laid my head down, it was feeling so heavy. It was hurting horribly and I was being completely honest with him. I truly didn't know. I wish I knew, as for myself, I don't go near a...., I avoid even saying it.
As I was typing this, about my head hurting, etc. That would happen often while as a child. My head would hurt so horribly and I would just cry. I couldn't hold it up. I couldn't bear noise. It was awful.
Thank you for replying. It is definitely something to consider
Liese: You are right.
Ah yes, the headache is one of the best ways brain will distract from feeling anger. I still take a couple of pain killers before a session to prevent THE headache.
It might be worth noting here Tas, the only time I ever walked out on a session was when I felt the way you did. I couldn't cope with THAT feeling. I ran. And when I got home, I rang T and told him what he was waiting to hear. I was angry.
There are safer words like; hurt/ frustrated/ annoyed/peeved/pissed off etc. It all spells pain.
It might be worth noting here Tas, the only time I ever walked out on a session was when I felt the way you did. I couldn't cope with THAT feeling. I ran. And when I got home, I rang T and told him what he was waiting to hear. I was angry.
There are safer words like; hurt/ frustrated/ annoyed/peeved/pissed off etc. It all spells pain.
Hi TAS,
I still see her, but with rarity. There were some abuses in the relationship that left little room for repair and the contact loss was and is a central issue (though that wasn't the abusive part). Do you know why your T first offered contact, and then why he no longer found it fit for you to? That's what my concern is, if you see another T for example, what if the same thing happens again And... could you bring it up to another T w/o fear of losing contact w/ them? Maybe whatever happened for either his reasons, or reasons he'd say were in your best interest of your therapy is something to look at. It would suck if another T did the same thing. The pain of having something and it being taken away is beyond words, I empathize deeply.
I still see her, but with rarity. There were some abuses in the relationship that left little room for repair and the contact loss was and is a central issue (though that wasn't the abusive part). Do you know why your T first offered contact, and then why he no longer found it fit for you to? That's what my concern is, if you see another T for example, what if the same thing happens again
And... could you bring it up to another T w/o fear of losing contact w/ them? Maybe whatever happened for either his reasons, or reasons he'd say were in your best interest of your therapy is something to look at. It would suck if another T did the same thing. The pain of having something and it being taken away is beyond words, I empathize deeply. Muff: I normally start not feeling well the day before my appt and I also take painkillers because I get the headaches...they haven't been working as well...I have been coming home and going to bed...There have been several times I have tried to leave early and he will say...your appt is until 2:50...I just want to get away.
I had not made the connection between emotion and the headaches. I just wasn't feeling good.
I don't know what TO DO with this boundary. It is like my brain has completely disconnected. It matters not that he is available one hour a week when I can't be reassured of his presence during the week.
Catalyst: He took it away because he felt it wasn't helping me contain the emotions, etc. So, I guess no contact is supposed to help me with that...
The kicker today was I called the Therapist I discussed this with a couple of weeks ago. I wanted to discuss this with her. She said for me to wait through this week and make an appt in two weeks. I really needed to talk about this and she said she wanted to see how I got through this week and call her if I needed to. So, I got off the phone and cried. I guess it wasn't important enough.
Thanks Catalyst
Tas, my wee one would shack up on T's door step 24/7 if she could, but adult me says that would not be a good look. This boundary thing is a real bugger, but I see it as a must! T is also saying, you can do/fend for yourself, like the birds have to when they get kicked out of the nest. They 'know'when their chicks are ready to fly. Like birds, T's know when we are ready to cope without them between sessions. If that makes sense?
The fear of anger prior to sessions can play havoc on poor brain. She doesnt like it one bit.
Your T is waiting...................
The fear of anger prior to sessions can play havoc on poor brain. She doesnt like it one bit.
Your T is waiting...................
I also have very strange reactions to anger. It immediately turns into something else, such that I don't even realize I'm angry. Lately, I can actually feel it for a tiny bit of time and communicate it to safe others, like my T. He gets so excited, lol.
I get bad headaches when I am dissociating pretty badly, and it coincides with me not being aware of feelings, thoughts, traumatic stuff that was coming up. I can relate to how bad it feels. I'm not huge on using even OTC painkillers, but even when I've tried, it hasn't really worked...
I know it wasn't about contact, but I have had my T offer me something, see that it was way over-activating me (especially disorganized attachment dilemmas) and making it harder to contain, and him taking it away. I know I've told you about it already, but just wanted to remind you that a lot of us know how crappy that sort of change feels. It doesn't mean they don't care. It just means they're doing what they think is best. Sometimes they're right and sometimes they're wrong. I wonder, if it is a thing that he has never offered to someone else and he tried it out to see if it would help in your case, if he was surprised and unprepared for the effects it would have.
I do think he cares. I know it's hard to believe it. But, if Boo were to be certain that there was something she needed/wanting from me and I deeply considered it and still believed it wasn't in her best interest as she grows, I would empathize with her feelings of disappointment, but I still wouldn't give it to her. As painful as it might be, and as many past disappointments as it might trigger me to face, I hope my T loves me in that sort of way. That said, I do think he could do that without invalidating what you need. I really don't see much other options than either to push through and examine this pain your in with him or try to find a therapist who is a better fit.
I'm sorry you're stuck in such a difficult position.
I get bad headaches when I am dissociating pretty badly, and it coincides with me not being aware of feelings, thoughts, traumatic stuff that was coming up. I can relate to how bad it feels. I'm not huge on using even OTC painkillers, but even when I've tried, it hasn't really worked...
I know it wasn't about contact, but I have had my T offer me something, see that it was way over-activating me (especially disorganized attachment dilemmas) and making it harder to contain, and him taking it away. I know I've told you about it already, but just wanted to remind you that a lot of us know how crappy that sort of change feels. It doesn't mean they don't care. It just means they're doing what they think is best. Sometimes they're right and sometimes they're wrong. I wonder, if it is a thing that he has never offered to someone else and he tried it out to see if it would help in your case, if he was surprised and unprepared for the effects it would have.
I do think he cares. I know it's hard to believe it. But, if Boo were to be certain that there was something she needed/wanting from me and I deeply considered it and still believed it wasn't in her best interest as she grows, I would empathize with her feelings of disappointment, but I still wouldn't give it to her. As painful as it might be, and as many past disappointments as it might trigger me to face, I hope my T loves me in that sort of way. That said, I do think he could do that without invalidating what you need. I really don't see much other options than either to push through and examine this pain your in with him or try to find a therapist who is a better fit.
I'm sorry you're stuck in such a difficult position.
Muff: I truly don't want to be around him all the time...I can't seem to grasp he is still 'here' when he is not...I am hurting and I don't believe I know what I am going to do...one of the things I didn't like is he said.when he goes on vacation I could not schedule a session when he returned...If he is gone on the Wednesday I am normally scheduled and he is back in the office on Saturday, he will not.allow me to come in on any other day except on Wednesday at normally scheduled time. I am trying.to understand. That is just mean.
Anonymously: Thank you. It is difficult but I am trying to trust him. I don't think I am going to be able to go back. What will I say and honestly, what is the point?
Thank you for your kind words and sincere empathy. I appreciate each of you.
From my heart,
T.
Anonymously: Thank you.
It is difficult but I am trying to trust him. I don't think I am going to be able to go back. What will I say and honestly, what is the point?Thank you for your kind words and sincere empathy. I appreciate each of you.
From my heart,
T.
Wee Tas has no concept of time. Waiting can be unbearable when she needs to speak and feel. Comfort her all you can Tas. You have brought her this far; on the brink of release. You cant turn your back on her need to vent now.
Muff: Thank you.
What would you do?
T .
What would you do?
T .
What I am doing now Tas, waiting.
Would you go back? Even if you disagree so strongly?
I have disagreed strongly about many things T has said and done Tas. That is the beauty of therapy. We speak about how we feel, and feel it, in so
doing we become more REAL/visible to ourselves and others.
My answer is absolutely.
doing we become more REAL/visible to ourselves and others.
My answer is absolutely.
Tas I wish I knew what was going on in your T's head. And of course I can understand it all feels like a massive rejection.
I guess what you're really face to face with is whether you can trust him. Two years is a reasonable amount of time to start getting an idea of whether a T is trustworthy or not. If you reflect back on your relationship, it might be interesting for you to consider whether this is someone who behaves in a trustworthy way.
The rigidity with respect to appointments is a harder one for me to understand. I guess a T might consider this if they can see that they are working with a patient who gets very dysregulated and therefore needs a very firm holding environment with incredible predictability.
It sounds like you were enraged and extremely dysregulated yesterday when your T refused to reconsider. And of course you have every right to be - he's not giving you something you think is vital to your survival.
From where I sit there is nothing you can do about the boundary. The feelings of rage, humiliation, vulnerability and powerlessness that it provokes can be enormous because it reminds us of a time when those who were in a position of power misused it and we suffered tremendously as a result.
And Tas, if this is someone you can trust and work with, then I would go back. Every time you go back and he is there, little one inside starts to gradually believe with more and more certainty that T will be there when he says he will.
My love and thoughts are with you xx
I guess what you're really face to face with is whether you can trust him. Two years is a reasonable amount of time to start getting an idea of whether a T is trustworthy or not. If you reflect back on your relationship, it might be interesting for you to consider whether this is someone who behaves in a trustworthy way.
The rigidity with respect to appointments is a harder one for me to understand. I guess a T might consider this if they can see that they are working with a patient who gets very dysregulated and therefore needs a very firm holding environment with incredible predictability.
It sounds like you were enraged and extremely dysregulated yesterday when your T refused to reconsider. And of course you have every right to be - he's not giving you something you think is vital to your survival.
From where I sit there is nothing you can do about the boundary. The feelings of rage, humiliation, vulnerability and powerlessness that it provokes can be enormous because it reminds us of a time when those who were in a position of power misused it and we suffered tremendously as a result.
And Tas, if this is someone you can trust and work with, then I would go back. Every time you go back and he is there, little one inside starts to gradually believe with more and more certainty that T will be there when he says he will.
My love and thoughts are with you xx
(((TAS)))
So hard. I hope he indeed knows what he is doing and is doing the right thing but it also could be that he simply can't give you what you need and finds it easier to get out of a sticky situation by telling you you don't need it. If you can go back you may be able to work through something pretty monumental (kind of like digging a tunnel through a mountain of granite) or you could find a way around the mountain via a different T. Not an easy decision and which ever you choose is still you choosing to go forward towards healing and being a better you.
So hard. I hope he indeed knows what he is doing and is doing the right thing but it also could be that he simply can't give you what you need and finds it easier to get out of a sticky situation by telling you you don't need it. If you can go back you may be able to work through something pretty monumental (kind of like digging a tunnel through a mountain of granite) or you could find a way around the mountain via a different T. Not an easy decision and which ever you choose is still you choosing to go forward towards healing and being a better you.
Muff: I guess I don't see the point in going and talking about something that is not going to change. Honestly, I feel hopeless and helpless. I can't change it so why talk about it and why PAY someone to talk about something they are not willing to change?
Green Eyes: If I am not able to regulate my feelings easily, etc. then that means I have to pay for it? He may as well be saying, "Since you can't handle the emotions, you can not contact me and this is the only appointment time, I will not offer any other time to you."
Essentially, I am paying for the way I am. That is exactly what it comes down to. I certainly didn't ask to be the way I am, even though I am working on it. So, once again, someone made a decision and I have to pick up the pieces.
Honestly, I don't know how I "felt" emotionally but I do know physically I was not doing so great. When he refused to reconsider, I actually felt something break away within my brain...some sort of explosion and I couldn't think.
I am not going Wednesday because I will just go in and tell him I don't know what to say. That is the truth. I truly don't. It would not make a difference because he has the upper hand.
Thank you for your encouragement. I appreciate it very much.
River: Thank you for replying Definitely not an easy situation. I think he honestly got the result he wanted. He knew I wouldn't be able to bear it and would leave. And I am leaving.
Time will pass and I will find my bearings.
T.
PS. Yes, it seems I have encountered some granite. Not easy work. Hope you are doing well
Green Eyes: If I am not able to regulate my feelings easily, etc. then that means I have to pay for it? He may as well be saying, "Since you can't handle the emotions, you can not contact me and this is the only appointment time, I will not offer any other time to you."
Essentially, I am paying for the way I am. That is exactly what it comes down to. I certainly didn't ask to be the way I am, even though I am working on it. So, once again, someone made a decision and I have to pick up the pieces.
Honestly, I don't know how I "felt" emotionally but I do know physically I was not doing so great. When he refused to reconsider, I actually felt something break away within my brain...some sort of explosion and I couldn't think.
I am not going Wednesday because I will just go in and tell him I don't know what to say. That is the truth. I truly don't. It would not make a difference because he has the upper hand.
Thank you for your encouragement. I appreciate it very much.
River: Thank you for replying
Definitely not an easy situation. I think he honestly got the result he wanted. He knew I wouldn't be able to bear it and would leave. And I am leaving. Time will pass and I will find my bearings.
T.PS. Yes, it seems I have encountered some granite. Not easy work. Hope you are doing well
quote:(((TAS)))
You did NOT lose 2 years. Either way, you will learn and grow from the experience. I am sure of it.
I completely agree with this. Tas, after I ended with my T of on and off therapy for 10 years, I felt like it was such a waste. I felt also like she took everything with her that was any good part of me or anything we had worked on.
The truth is that she does not have that much power. She is not a God.
I have a new T now. It took me quite some time to find her. The change was good (I can see now after several months).
I don't see anything wrong with you looking for a new T. Can you find one and maybe see both T's for awhile until you figure out what is best?
Thinking of you,
Thank you Kmay I am definitely working on that...the counselor I did say about this while Therapist was on vacation suggested I not see her until after a week had passed and see how I got through with no contact...I felt rejected and got off the phone and cried.
I am glad you are having success with your new T. I think it is wonderful
I just can't see clearly right now and am extremely confused.
Thank you for the encouragement
T.
I am definitely working on that...the counselor I did say about this while Therapist was on vacation suggested I not see her until after a week had passed and see how I got through with no contact...I felt rejected and got off the phone and cried.I am glad you are having success with your new T. I think it is wonderful
I just can't see clearly right now and am extremely confused.
Thank you for the encouragement
T.
TAS, can I ask if you like your T? I think a lot can be clarified and worked through if a foundation of basic liking and respect is there. After all, at the end of the day, it is the relationship that heals.
I don't think there's a whole lot my T could do or change (within an ethically acceptable range) that would be a deal breaker for me, because I do like her and see her as a positive in my life. I don't think she's perfect or that our relationship is. . . but it provides a framework for me to grow and heal.
I'm curious for your thoughts on this. Do you think you have a good working alliance with your T, beneath all the stress about contact issues, or do you feel that is lacking? Do you *want* a good working alliance with your T, or would you feel relief and/or happiness at the thought of moving on?
I know it is rarely an either/or thing so sorry if these questions seem to over simplify the issues. I just wondered if thinking about them could maybe help clarify things for you.
Sorry things have been so tough.
I don't think there's a whole lot my T could do or change (within an ethically acceptable range) that would be a deal breaker for me, because I do like her and see her as a positive in my life. I don't think she's perfect or that our relationship is. . . but it provides a framework for me to grow and heal.
I'm curious for your thoughts on this. Do you think you have a good working alliance with your T, beneath all the stress about contact issues, or do you feel that is lacking? Do you *want* a good working alliance with your T, or would you feel relief and/or happiness at the thought of moving on?
I know it is rarely an either/or thing so sorry if these questions seem to over simplify the issues. I just wondered if thinking about them could maybe help clarify things for you.
Sorry things have been so tough.
This is the thing, HIC, I don't know. I feel relief when I don't have to see him but I think it is because of the sh** I am dealing with. Maybe I confuse liking him with not liking going to therapy, I don't know. I do feel very confused by all of this. I want to like him...has he helped me? yes...but I am not sure if my hesitancy to leave is because I don't want him to feel bad about it not working out or because I truly feel he is helping me.
If I was overjoyed to see him every week, I could work through the no contact issue, I believe.
This is what I am trying to sort out...Do I like him enough to keep seeing him? Honestly, I don't know. Has he helped me? Yes. Have we had some contentious times? Hell, yes. I am always fighting from allowing anyone to get close. I can see the relation to my past. I am trying to protect myself.
When I started texting him, I trusted when he replied he knew what he was doing. I trusted him. To have this taken away now, when I feel I need it, is extremely difficult.
WHO uses the word 'comply'? That is exactly what he said when I said I have to consider changing Therapists. He said, "You need to comply."
I know myself. I am extremely private. I have worked very hard to even reveal what I have, which is very little. I know how I see things, how I perceive them is not his doing.
I am confused and I don't even know what to say to him if I should go back. I am sure there are other people he can work more easily with and won't place that demand on his time.
I feel everything is ruined. Everything.
If I was overjoyed to see him every week, I could work through the no contact issue, I believe.
This is what I am trying to sort out...Do I like him enough to keep seeing him? Honestly, I don't know. Has he helped me? Yes. Have we had some contentious times? Hell, yes. I am always fighting from allowing anyone to get close. I can see the relation to my past. I am trying to protect myself.
When I started texting him, I trusted when he replied he knew what he was doing. I trusted him. To have this taken away now, when I feel I need it, is extremely difficult.
WHO uses the word 'comply'? That is exactly what he said when I said I have to consider changing Therapists. He said, "You need to comply."
I know myself. I am extremely private. I have worked very hard to even reveal what I have, which is very little. I know how I see things, how I perceive them is not his doing.
I am confused and I don't even know what to say to him if I should go back. I am sure there are other people he can work more easily with and won't place that demand on his time.
I feel everything is ruined. Everything.
quote:Maybe I confuse liking him with not liking going to therapy
Hello! That one rings a bell with me
I would be so far away from a therapist who told me I "needed to comply" so fast that they would spin around.
Therapists can take care of themselves. I hope no one keeps going to a therapist because of how not going might make a therapist feel.
Therapists can take care of themselves. I hope no one keeps going to a therapist because of how not going might make a therapist feel.
quote:WHO uses the word 'comply'? That is exactly what he said when I said I have to consider changing Therapists. He said, "You need to comply."
Hi TAS,
I think it will work with this therapist only if the focus is moving through not getting what you want, rather than trying to get what you want, if that makes sense. It sounds like the other T you were trying to contact won't be super flexible is my suspicion. Notice that you automatically assumed that your issue 'wasn't important enough' because she wouldn't talk about it immediately over the phone as outside contact. That's an example of dysregulation due to contact... I think so anyway.
On the topic of 'comply' my T said that to me when I first started seeing her - maybe the first month or two. I wanted to punch her in to next week!! It was about my medications, and since I'd just been out of the hospital recently due to a suicide attempt (and having never met her before then).. it was the most ethical thing for her to do. Not only to protect herself, but also to protect me. I'm not sure if she would have suggested I go back to the hospital if I refused. She said I had to comply or could not see her. It took me a while to get over that... maybe 1.5yrs where I just felt she was going to coerce me in to EVERYTHING. She hasn't, and I've since worked through it with her, but I was furious for a while (a lot of it having to do with the fact I hate medicine in general).
Hope today feels more gently on you.
Tas, you don't even have to say anything. cry. scream. curse. rage. You are carrying so much pain inside that needs to come out for you to feel better. As Muff said so beautifully in another thread, emotions and venting come before understanding.
I'm going to be really detailed here Tas because I think its important when there's so much chaos and confusion inside.
The issues that are being provoked by this situation are not who you are. They are a result of what happened to you when you were growing up. It is not your fault and it is an extremely unfair burden you have been left with.
Have you thought that your T isn't providing you with the texting contact because he thinks it will get in the way and actually make you worse? I know its hard to believe that might be the case, when you're convinced this extra contact would make such a dramatic and positive difference.
Tas I had this really shameful realisation a few weeks ago when I was CONVINCED I knew exactly what I needed and my T was refusing to provide it. It was "how do I know what I need when nobody gave me what I needed growing up?" I could see I'd been carrying on with the strongest internal conviction that I knew what I needed to heal. I was dead wrong.
quote:If I am not able to regulate my feelings easily, etc. then that means I have to pay for it? He may as well be saying, "Since you can't handle the emotions, you can not contact me and this is the only appointment time, I will not offer any other time to you."
Essentially, I am paying for the way I am. That is exactly what it comes down to. I certainly didn't ask to be the way I am, even though I am working on it. So, once again, someone made a decision and I have to pick up the pieces.
I'm going to be really detailed here Tas because I think its important when there's so much chaos and confusion inside.
The issues that are being provoked by this situation are not who you are. They are a result of what happened to you when you were growing up. It is not your fault and it is an extremely unfair burden you have been left with.
Have you thought that your T isn't providing you with the texting contact because he thinks it will get in the way and actually make you worse? I know its hard to believe that might be the case, when you're convinced this extra contact would make such a dramatic and positive difference.
Tas I had this really shameful realisation a few weeks ago when I was CONVINCED I knew exactly what I needed and my T was refusing to provide it. It was "how do I know what I need when nobody gave me what I needed growing up?" I could see I'd been carrying on with the strongest internal conviction that I knew what I needed to heal. I was dead wrong.
quote:I think it will work with this therapist only if the focus is moving through not getting what you want, rather than trying to get what you want, if that makes sense. It sounds like the other T you were trying to contact won't be super flexible is my suspicion. Notice that you automatically assumed that your issue 'wasn't important enough' because she wouldn't talk about it immediately over the phone as outside contact. That's an example of dysregulation due to contact... I think so anyway.
Muff Thanks! I am still trying to sort that particular thought out...I feel as if everything is tangled up and I am having trouble separating what I need to...the fact from the fiction...and this is where my brain revolts...
Stoppers: I agree...my concern should be myself and what I need first...still learning that...there is just so much...ugh.
Catalyst: I think you are right...I want him to change his mind, though. I think I am right about this. He adamantly disagrees.
It's like I can see the writing on the wall. But I can't tell if it is my own stubbornness, my defenses, my 'you will not get to me' attitude...I feel I could see clearly if it was just one thing...my brain is overwhelmed and shutting off...
The funny thing is if anyone would ask me if I would recommend him, I would say yes. It seems odd for all the confusion I have about this.
I would GIVE ANYTHING to have a mother or father to call up and talk to about this...well, if I had them I wouldn't need a Therapist. This hurts like hell.
Thanks for your replies. You all are really helping me through a tough time. You have no idea how much this means to me.
Thanks! I am still trying to sort that particular thought out...I feel as if everything is tangled up and I am having trouble separating what I need to...the fact from the fiction...and this is where my brain revolts...Stoppers: I agree...my concern should be myself and what I need first...still learning that...there is just so much...ugh.
Catalyst: I think you are right...I want him to change his mind, though. I think I am right about this. He adamantly disagrees.
It's like I can see the writing on the wall. But I can't tell if it is my own stubbornness, my defenses, my 'you will not get to me' attitude...I feel I could see clearly if it was just one thing...my brain is overwhelmed and shutting off...
The funny thing is if anyone would ask me if I would recommend him, I would say yes. It seems odd for all the confusion I have about this.
I would GIVE ANYTHING to have a mother or father to call up and talk to about this...well, if I had them I wouldn't need a Therapist. This hurts like hell.
Thanks for your replies. You all are really helping me through a tough time. You have no idea how much this means to me.
quote:I would GIVE ANYTHING to have a mother or father to call up and talk to about this.
It is so much like a bad bad dream I cant wake up from. I could never connect with them.
"It sounds like the other T you were trying to contact won't be super flexible is my suspicion. Notice that you automatically assumed that your issue 'wasn't important enough' because she wouldn't talk about it immediately over the phone as outside contact. That's an example of dysregulation due to contact... I think so anyway."
Catalyst: I don't understand this, truly. I called her wanting to discuss this during an appointment and she said for me to wait two weeks before coming in to see her. I have to be honest. I reached out for help and the same thing happened to me again. The door was slammed in my face. I was left to deal with this ALONE and I am not sure how to do this. It seems when I say I need help, I don't get it. I don't readily admit I need help or guidance, I do it alone. For this very reason, when I do ask, say what I need, the Therapist changes his mind and then asks in the same breath, what are you feeling? SERIOUSLY, WTF.
I got upset because I felt the Therapist I called was pushing me away. I said I was struggling, it fell upon deaf ears.
Maybe I don't regulate my emotions well. I feel as if I am being punished. I don't like it. He knows this would be difficult for me, and yet he continues to insist upon this.
I think I am totally skewed right now, because the deeper I try to think about this, the more sideways I feel.
I tried reaching out to the second Therapist to discuss how it is I could be seeing this in a way that needs to be examined. I realize I am not seeing this as it is, in the here and now.
To be rebuffed and put off...it did feel as if I didn't matter.
These occurrences are just reiterating to me that it is better to go it alone. It is not showing me anything differently.
Thank you for replying. If this comes off as a little charged, it's not you. It's me and I do appreciate you T.
Catalyst: I don't understand this, truly. I called her wanting to discuss this during an appointment and she said for me to wait two weeks before coming in to see her. I have to be honest. I reached out for help and the same thing happened to me again. The door was slammed in my face. I was left to deal with this ALONE and I am not sure how to do this. It seems when I say I need help, I don't get it. I don't readily admit I need help or guidance, I do it alone. For this very reason, when I do ask, say what I need, the Therapist changes his mind and then asks in the same breath, what are you feeling? SERIOUSLY, WTF.
I got upset because I felt the Therapist I called was pushing me away. I said I was struggling, it fell upon deaf ears.
Maybe I don't regulate my emotions well. I feel as if I am being punished. I don't like it. He knows this would be difficult for me, and yet he continues to insist upon this.
I think I am totally skewed right now, because the deeper I try to think about this, the more sideways I feel.
I tried reaching out to the second Therapist to discuss how it is I could be seeing this in a way that needs to be examined. I realize I am not seeing this as it is, in the here and now.
To be rebuffed and put off...it did feel as if I didn't matter.
These occurrences are just reiterating to me that it is better to go it alone. It is not showing me anything differently.
Thank you for replying. If this comes off as a little charged, it's not you. It's me and I do appreciate you
T.
Green Eyes: How can someone outside of you know what you need more than you do and how can their assessment be more correct than your own?
Can you explain that a little more with the experience you had with your T? I understand we can be wrong sometimes about what we need...This one thing is all I have ever asked of him. I don't want anything else. Literally, it would just take not even 10 seconds to say, "I'm here." 20 seconds outside of session. I am not asking for minutes or hours.
T.
Can you explain that a little more with the experience you had with your T? I understand we can be wrong sometimes about what we need...This one thing is all I have ever asked of him. I don't want anything else. Literally, it would just take not even 10 seconds to say, "I'm here." 20 seconds outside of session. I am not asking for minutes or hours.
T.
quote:How can someone outside of you know what you need more than you do
I believe I said that Tas, and the biggest thing I ever needed (and didnt know ) was to show the anger I held in for so long towards the injustice of not feeling loved. My T always knew that about me, well before I did. I was too afraid to feel that injustice, so I held all the pain in.
They 'see' us Tas, and that can be terrifying/threatening to our core. They know we are angry and that we dont want to know it. We have to own up to it Tas before the next step can be taken.
((TAS))
I guess, at this point, since he says there will be no reconsideration, if it were me, and I felt pretty convinced I could not work in that way, and he was asking me to "comply" (ugh, don't like the word, but my T would expect me to do that action in certain cases, probably like Cat's about things he saw as safety related)...
Since I'd invested years into the process, before I gave it up, I would give myself a trial period of trying things out completely my T's way, without fighting it. I don't mean not talking about the feelings that come up, but go in with no expectations that anything could ever change, show up to every appointment, do the work I've committed to do, don't cancel, don't contact when not permitted...experience my T's consistency of being there for the internal kid(s) when he promises without sabotaging their ability to connect by running and hiding. And, at the end of that trial, if it was still impossible for me to work that way, then find a new therapist, knowing that I had done my best to test out T's theory of what was best for me.
I can say that's what I would do, because it's kind of what I did do. Not about contact, but about the thing T offered and then withdrew (and eventually offered again several months later), because it was triggering me, just as having contact seemed to be doing with you (though, just like you, not having what was taken away was a different set of problems). I can say after several months of showing up consistently, trusting in my knowledge (rather than my activated, transference-based feelings) that my T was safe, despite not being perfect, exploring and expressing what was coming up for me...which was often bringing writings into sessions to go over together, I did feel I was able to process his withdrawal a good deal and find a way to keep working in that manner. It turned out our therapy relationship ended up shifting in an entirely different direction, because of my diagnosis...but, I would have never known where my therapy could have gone if I had fixed myself on fighting for what I felt made therapy bearable at the moment, rather than doing my best to work through the pain of that boundary shift.
I know it's horrible, but if you haven't fully given up on working with your T, the only thing I see you can do here is try to go forward in the way that he thinks is best and see if it has any possibility of working, and if it doesn't, to have confidence in the decision to move on, because you tested out his method of working with you.
I don't know if that's something you feel you can do, and I know it doesn't lessen the pain, but I hope whatever you decide, you ultimately are able to have confidence and no regrets.
Since I'd invested years into the process, before I gave it up, I would give myself a trial period of trying things out completely my T's way, without fighting it. I don't mean not talking about the feelings that come up, but go in with no expectations that anything could ever change, show up to every appointment, do the work I've committed to do, don't cancel, don't contact when not permitted...experience my T's consistency of being there for the internal kid(s) when he promises without sabotaging their ability to connect by running and hiding. And, at the end of that trial, if it was still impossible for me to work that way, then find a new therapist, knowing that I had done my best to test out T's theory of what was best for me.
I can say that's what I would do, because it's kind of what I did do. Not about contact, but about the thing T offered and then withdrew (and eventually offered again several months later), because it was triggering me, just as having contact seemed to be doing with you (though, just like you, not having what was taken away was a different set of problems). I can say after several months of showing up consistently, trusting in my knowledge (rather than my activated, transference-based feelings) that my T was safe, despite not being perfect, exploring and expressing what was coming up for me...which was often bringing writings into sessions to go over together, I did feel I was able to process his withdrawal a good deal and find a way to keep working in that manner. It turned out our therapy relationship ended up shifting in an entirely different direction, because of my diagnosis...but, I would have never known where my therapy could have gone if I had fixed myself on fighting for what I felt made therapy bearable at the moment, rather than doing my best to work through the pain of that boundary shift.
I know it's horrible, but if you haven't fully given up on working with your T, the only thing I see you can do here is try to go forward in the way that he thinks is best and see if it has any possibility of working, and if it doesn't, to have confidence in the decision to move on, because you tested out his method of working with you.
I don't know if that's something you feel you can do, and I know it doesn't lessen the pain, but I hope whatever you decide, you ultimately are able to have confidence and no regrets.
Thank you Muff and Blu.
Trying to smile through the tears.
T.
Trying to smile through the tears.
T.
Anonymously,
Thank you for being so thoughtful and applying at length. I am definitely taking in what you shared. Right now, I have no idea what I will do, although I am leaning towards cancelling. I honestly think I have completely shut down. I might just take a week off to see if I can gather myself before going back in.
You were brave to continue and trust your Therapist was working in your best interest. That took a lot to do that. Now that you are on the other side, you must be extremely glad you did that.
Thank you for being so thoughtful and applying at length. I am definitely taking in what you shared. Right now, I have no idea what I will do, although I am leaning towards cancelling. I honestly think I have completely shut down. I might just take a week off to see if I can gather myself before going back in.
You were brave to continue and trust your Therapist was working in your best interest. That took a lot to do that. Now that you are on the other side, you must be extremely glad you did that.
Your safe in the alone where no one, not even T can hurt you. But the pain is still there Tas.