(((Liese)))



What you just said resonated with me so much that I started tearing up (not a common thing for me). I'm in the middle of it to, so I don't have the perspective to really advise, but I understand how you feel. I think, maybe, it would be helpful to hear from others further down the line or out the other side (as much as anyone is ever "out"). But, I can offer big hugs to you.

((Liese))

Trauma processing is a cruel and difficult process - you've incredibly brave to be facing your past and trying to work through it. In my experience it feels wretched going through it because processing it also means calling up those emotions from the past (maybe at the time of the trauma you felt/said the same things to yourself as you are now) - the challenge is to keep going with the crazy hope that this time it will end differently... and it will... you and your T have a great working relationship.

It takes a long time but you won't be "vibrating" forever there is another side and people make it there - they often make it only to turn their hand around and help someone else up an you're already doing that in your life right now. You've made progress and will again ((hug)) I'm so sorry!!

((((Liese)))))

One day, one day it will feel a lot different. It might take months, years, whatever. But it will. It has to. Otherwise, why would we subject ourselves to the torture that is therapy?!

A friend recently commented that "We don't need *easy*, we just need *possible*" This work isn't easy, but as there are people out there who have made it through trauma work... I know it's possible.

(And I'm saying this as much for you and anyone else to read as I am to remind myself of the same stuff...)

Hi Liese darling,

I am so ill-equipped to offer any kind of advice, as I am new-ish to therapy and haven't experienced being on "the other side" of what brought me to therapy. All I can do is walk along side you, giving you lots of cyber-hugs!

The experiences of fellow users on this board have given me tremendous hope. For me, that has been reason enough to stick with it.

effed

(((Liese)))

I can relate so much to how you are feeling right now. I think it is incredible that you feel like you could talk about anything with your T if you knew he was receptive and I think it is brave that you told him that. I'm heartened to hear how much you can trust your T. I think that trust will help you get through trauma processing with your T. Unfortunately I don't know how it works.

I've talked about my traumatic childhood multiple times with my T but each time it is different. Just today my T told me he thought we needed to talk about my childhood some more. I said I thought that was all we ever talked about and it is always going on in my mind. Later I wrote him an email saying that I couldn't tell if I was "grieving" what happened to me and what I didn't have in a healthy healing way or is I was wallowing in the pain and never going to change anything and blame my childhood for all the things I do wrong. I bet that sounds familiar.

I hope there is a way through for all of us.

YAKU, CAT, R2G, EFFED, INCOGNITO,

Thanks guys. It sounds like you can all relate. Sometimes I just feel like I'm making excuses for myself, just trying to justif why I haven't been more successful in so many areas in life. Like, maybe I was just born this way. Maybe this IS my full potential.

My T said something today that is kind of knocking my socks off. I had been attributing something to my trauma that he, if I understood him correctly, attributed to my H. Like, as if my reaction to my H was normal while I was blaming myself and my sensitivity because of my trauma. It's kind of making my head spin. Does that make sense?

Liese

P.S. I'm editing this to add that my T talks about my sensitivity as if it is a good thing. He also thinks I'm very compassionate. I just thought I'd share that because we all seem to struggle with feeling like we are "too" sensitive but T makes it sound like something good and special.

Liese,

Liese, I loved reading about how comfortable you are about talking with your T. I am at that place too and it feels good.

I don't think I can relate to be honest. Well maybe I do and I don't realise it. My T and I haven't really done anything trauma related - I haven't spoken past what happened 6 months ago. I have just had a calm few days - first time in 10 months I guess where I have felt a calmness. Today with T - the stuff she was talking about was foreign to me - I felt that I didn't need to go back to her and I couldn't remember ever having any problems. Days ago I was brain crazy and desperate to be near her to feel safe and today - I felt invincible and protected in a cocoon. When she mentioned talking about childhood stuff - I just kept thinking that I didn't need to do it and I was making it up and I would be fine.

But then - I would be a person who never deals with the issues - and as you say I would still be the same person with the same problems.

I don't know. This feeling CALM crap - has me rattled - I don't know how to react to it. Weird.

Anyway Liese - stick with it. Little bit by little bit. There is nothing with you - you are reacting to a tough and painful situation - as AG says we never deliberately want to go to painful places, but we know we have to a bit when we process trauma.

quote:

But you know what? I'm still the same person with the same problems. I'm still not sure I'll ever be able to be intimate with anyone again. I'm not sure I'll ever be able to be close emotionally with anyone again.

Hi Liese,

I struggle with this too and I'm not sure I have any insightful answers for you. I often wonder if I will ever feel like other "normal" people feel about things. And especially after what happened with oldT I struggle so much with developing a close relationship with my current T. I want to, yet something always seems to derail my best intentions and it feels like trudging uphill with ten thousands pounds on my back.

Trust is a biggie in this area of allowing intimacy. My past experiences have all turned out so horrible and of course I'm afraid that will happen again. As far as emotional regulation, I saw real progress in that last year with oldT until he destroyed everything. I don't know if it's possible to achieve again but at least I caught a glimmer of how it feels and I'm trying to work my way back there again.

So, no answers but I do want you know that I understand the frustration and wanted you to know I was listening.

Hugs
TN

Liese -

Both my Ts talk about being "sensitive" as a good and special quality. I'm glad your T does too (as, being sensitive myself, I know it helps to hear - and it's true).

quote:

In order to heal you must do the very things that every fiber of your being is screaming you should not do. Move closer, open up, allow the feelings you've held down so long to surface.

AG, I do remember you saying this before about moving closer. It's so confusing to me because of my feelings for my T. I just couldn't imagine opening up to him the way I need to if I didn't have all these feelings for him. To me, they go hand in hand.

I just hope through this process that I develop a true sense of self. That's really what's missing. Will that happen through this process?

I'm so stressed right now but it's coming out through my skin in the form of a rash instead of being able to express it verbally.

"In order to heal you must do the very things that every fiber of your being is screaming you should not do. Move closer, open up, allow the feelings you've held down so long to surface."

I hope so AG. I just feel like I keep making excuses for myself as a human being. AG, thanks for responding. I hope I don't sound like I don't appreciate your response. Just feeling a bit gloomy about the process I guess.

(((NINN))))

Thanks for the big hug.

((((SOMEDAYS))))

Thanks for replying even though you can't really relate.

"I felt that I didn't need to go back to her and I couldn't remember ever having any problems.

This really made me laugh because I can't tell you how many times I have felt like that in therapy. I'd think to myself, why the heck am I here? I could skip out of here today and never come back.

"When she mentioned talking about childhood stuff - I just kept thinking that I didn't need to do it and I was making it up and I would be fine. "

My T doesn't "DO" childhood but he's doing it for me because I need it. I don't think he likes the "blame" angle but I told him I'm not blaming. I need to do this to develop some sense of myself. He agrees now. The thing is, is that my niece is in college right now and having a first year like I did my first year of college. It's so easy for me to look at her and understand why she is struggling because her life has been really unstable and traumatic.

But when I look back at my life, I supposedly had the "perfect" family. I went to Catholic school and we went to church every Sunday. I was the one who was unhappy, supposedly. As long as they could keep up the farce that everything was okay, I guess. It's a total mind game and mind screw. But at the end of the day, it was what it was, right? It's over and it's what I am forging from this day on that matters. And sometimes I get so scared that I don't know what to do.

(((((TN)))))

"I struggle with this too and I'm not sure I have any insightful answers for you. I often wonder if I will ever feel like other "normal" people feel about things."

TN, I wish I knew what normal people felt. And so, this is a good time to talk about .....

((((KANSAS))))


nor·mal
   [nawr-muhl] Show IPA

adjective
1.
conforming to the standard or the common type; usual; not abnormal; regular; natural.

Well, I guess conforming isn't always a positive thing, right?

2.
serving to establish a standard.

I don't think I am standard. Wish I was more standard.

3.
Psychology .
a.
approximately average in any psychological trait, as intelligence, personality, or emotional adjustment.

I guess it could be a good thing NOT to be average. Although I fear I am below average in my emotional adjustment.

b.
free from any mental disorder; sane.

This is the question.

4.
Biology, Medicine/Medical .
a.
free from any infection or other form of disease or malformation, or from experimental therapy or manipulation.

I think I am free from infection or other form of disease or malformation (except mental) but not sure I am free from experimental therapy. LOL!

b.
of natural occurrence.

I did occur naturally, to my knowledge.

Kansas, thanks for telling me to look it up. It gave me a laugh.

(((((CAT)))))

Glad your T tells you that also. I had another T who told me I was too sensitive. Not a good thing. And my family, of course, too. If only they had given me a hug once in a while and told me that they loved me, maybe it would have all turned out differently. Or maybe not.

I guess it doesn't really matter if I am normal or not. I just want to feel good about myself. I don't understand relationships. I don't understand life. I love the "wrong" way. I love "too" much. I get "too" attached.





Liese

quote:

My T said something today that is kind of knocking my socks off. I had been attributing something to my trauma that he, if I understood him correctly, attributed to my H. Like, as if my reaction to my H was normal while I was blaming myself and my sensitivity because of my trauma. It's kind of making my head spin. Does that make sense?

this completely makes sense to me. My T said something like that to me recently. I thought I was "overreacting" and being "too" sensitive about a boundary thing with my roommate. I thought I was just triggered because of past trauma about boundaries. My T said trauma or not, my reaction was very reasonable and normal - and even a good reaction to have.

My T says sensitivity is a good thing too. There are lots of people on boh sides of the sensitivity spectrum. I thought I was really messed up for being so sensitive, but my T is constantly pointing out how it helps me see and notice things that others often miss.

I don't know about people being born more senstive or not (nature vs nurture debate). Trauma can sometimes *seem* to dull people's reactions, at least on the "outside," or it seems to make lots of people more "sensitive." According to my mother, I was born a very sensitive baby. I'm hesitant to say this next part... but I'm going to carefully risk it anyhow. My brother says my sensitivity is why the same traumatic events affected me differently than it affected him. He is EXTREMELY adamant that even though he is "less sensitive," it DID NOT impact him less, it didn't hurt him less. My family is pretty messed up, so I dunno how much stock I put in any of what my mother and brother say, but, my brother said I was the first to see when there was a problem, and also the first to get help... while everyone else just kept on hurting and hurting, and ended up much worse off in the end than I did. My brother is a lot more "successful" in the typical definitions of the word than me, so I don't know that I fully understand what he is getting at... and sometimes, I start to think he has it easier - heck, I get downright jealous of him. But then I just spend time with him, and he's so honest with me, that it is really easy to see he really doesn't have it any easier. He hurts a lot too, sometimes even more than me, because he can get "by" in a way that seems "better."

My father is very "successful" in life by many people's standards, and is one of the most miserable people I have ever met. He is a downright tortured soul that hurts other people out of his numbed out pain.

My brother says my senstivity has made me a kind aunt to his little girl, and sweet to his wife, in the middle of an extended family where people are not very attuned to the needs of others.

Still, I have hated being so sensitive for as long as I can remember. It's only been in therapy that I have seen how it can actually be helpful and a good thing - and it feels like someone turns my world upside down when I begin to see something I have never liked about me and always seens as a weakness, as something that could actually be a strength.

imagine that. sensitivity as a strength. but it's true. I see that in you.

I can also say that as I heal, in bits and pieces, my sensitivity becomes less of something that just drags me down into deep despair, but becomes more of a helpful tool. It changes. It's like I get what I have been needing, so my sensitivity shifts... I dunno how to explain...

I don't think you love in a "wrong" way... you love the way you do because you do, because it's how you learned to connect to people. I dunno that I would call it wrong or right, but I totally get the desire to want it to be different. In time, the way you and I connect and love, it will keep changing. It will probably end up different than either of us thought it would be - and probably much better.

I feel like a failure a lot. My life has not turned out how it was supposed to. I feel so stuck sometimes - and I work SO hard to get unstuck, and half the time, I'm just all the more stuck, feeling even more like a failure. So I can really relate to that sense of feeling like you just are not who you want to be.

But I see such beauty in you and your journey... I dunno that either of us will be "normal" - the more I spend with people in different walks of life, the less I have any idea what normal even is... but at the same time, I totally get what you mean - to be what we've wanted to be. To be more whole. More healed. More accepting of yourself. I fully believe you will get there. I really really do.

keep at the good fight to heal,
~ jane

(((((JANE)))))

What a beautiful and honest post. It touched me in a deep way and made me cry. I'm so glad you have such a nice supportive brother. What a gift, a breath of fresh air.

Everything you said really resonated with me. Thanks for posting, Jane.

I feel like I am twisting and turning emotionally. It reminds me of when I was 9 months pregnant and the little ones would move inside my belly, trying to stretch. I suppose that's a good thing. Sometimes I really do think there is a happy, playful child in there that wants to come out and have fun. But someone else is holding her down and she is afraid. She wants to love but is afraid.



Liese

I had my session today. I had a big freak out last Thursday. T calmed me down. I went back today and told him that I just got scared. That the only thing I see coming out of therapy is heartache and loss. And that maybe the best thing for me to do is to leave and grieve and get on with my life. He disagreed.

We had just started talking about some really difficult stuff before my freakout so I can't help but wonder if that is the reason I want to run. I'm not sure if I'm afraid of working through this stuff? Or getting closer with T? Maybe it's safe to love T because I can't have him? I would probably never fall in love with someone who was actually available!!!

He was so kind and gentle. He told me that it won't end in heartache and loss. Or something like that. He made it sound like he's really there for me, really in it for as long as I need him. He's probably thinking that eventually, I will come to an acceptance of things and my feelings for him will "morph" into something else.

I told him that I was afraid that I'd never be able to be close to anyone ever again. He said that he can't say one way or another. But that we were going to keep working on it and keep working through stuff.

We talked about our problems last year. He said he was trying to fit me into a box. And I asked him what kind of box? And he said, it was too simplistic. That I'm deep and a thinker. And that I push him to think. That he sees that I have many interests and passions in life and that not that many people who come to see him do.

It made me feel like he actually really appreciates who I am as a human being. Somehow my pathology challenges him. It felt nice. I'd like to return the favor and show him how much I can grow. How strong I can really be. I'd like to make him proud of me. Maybe I can finally make someone proud. Wouldn't that be nice.

quote:

That he sees that I have many interests and passions in life and that not that many people who come to see him do.

My T asked me last week if I had any passions and she said that most people don't. I know I do have passions but I'm afraid of talking about them.

quote:

I'd like to make him proud of me. Maybe I can finally make someone proud. Wouldn't that be nice.

I don't know if I could say I'm proud of you, but I admire you, and if I were your T I know I would be very proud of you already.

((((BLT))))

When I first went to this T, I told him that I didn't have any dreams. He said that was okay, that some people don't. I felt so relieved when he said that. Slowly, the dreams came back. I had to allow myself to have them. So I understand what you mean when you say you are afraid to talk about them. You will when you are ready. Thanks for saying those nice things about me. That was sweet. You are my reflecting mirror. (See Vanishing Self.) I will reflect back to you. I think it was so great that you were able to pick yourself up and leave your OldT. Not sure I could have done it. I know it was hard but you made the best of it.

HUGS,

Liese

(((XOXO)))

"That was really warm and encouraging...and a great example of the 'other side' of the therapeutic relationship-mutality. It takes a lot of hard work to get to this point. Keep up the good work. "

Thanks! That was really nice to hear. It's nice to hear that this roller coaster ride I'm on might actually be taking me to a destination instead of just up and down, up and down.

xoxoxox

Liese

Liese,

quote:

Glad your T tells you that also. I had another T who told me I was too sensitive. Not a good thing. And my family, of course, too. If only they had given me a hug once in a while and told me that they loved me, maybe it would have all turned out differently. Or maybe not.

Thank you for posting this!!! This is exactly what has happened to me- with my family in the past, and now my T. It is NOT helping me. I was feeling so much worse, but in reading this post, I'm feeling a good bit better. The shame is not as intense. I wish I could offer something better, but hopefully it helps you to know that you are helping me a great deal.

quote:

We talked about our problems last year. He said he was trying to fit me into a box. And I asked him what kind of box? And he said, it was too simplistic. That I'm deep and a thinker. And that I push him to think. That he sees that I have many interests and passions in life and that not that many people who come to see him do.

Thank youx10!

This is exactly what I am experiencing right now, but my T doesn't seem to get this yet. I feel like I'm being put into a box. However, I'm hoping to get past it. Otherwise, I will end up an even worse cynic than I already am.

Keep us posted on the ride and where it takes you, and thanks so much for being here!

((((((number9)))))

I am sorry that your t is telling you that you are too sensitive. It doesn't help. I have four kids. All of them have their own sensitivities. I just see it as their own personal boundaries and I teach them to respect that in themselves. I don't want them to ever feel like they have to compromise because someone else is uncomfortable with their boundaries. But beyond that, if I have to give constructive criticism, I make sure they know I love them too and they just don't hear all the time "brush your teeth" or whatever.

I also think If they FEEL loved, that they are axtually less sensitive. I also think being playful with them is important. They also need to learn when people are being passive aggressive with them or sarcastic. There is just so much there.

I am not the perfect mother but I would never tell any of my kids that they are too sensitive. Even if they really being overly sensitive it would seem to me that it would have to be worked out.

All of that being said, because of my past, there are things that I am perhaps overly sensitive to. I am sensitive to signs of rejection and abandonment. But I know it and am learning when it is my stuff versus someone else's. I am also learning how to read people better and understand emotions better.

Hope this helps you feel a little better

Hugs
Liese

((((((JANEDOE))))))

So many points you have made here Liese, moved me.

I came from what appeared a nice family. Catholic schools, doing well, nice girls, nice boy friends - but inside me is a wailing hurting small child.

It is sometimes hard to truly believe that what I am inside is not just crazy. BUt my T has helped me see that there is a reason for every single one of my feelings and I too have bought the outside package of our 'nice' family. It was a family with mega emotional difficulties and hidden traumas - but a family very good at believing its own story of being 'okay'. I believed it too.

I too was labeled too sensitive. No one ever tried to find out WHY.

Now I am finding out WHY.

And my sensitivity works exceedingly well for me in the work I do, where I have to read people well respond fast and kindly,

I am sending encouragement and also hugs, sorry for coming rather late to this thread, I have been having an intense few weeks myself.