dear ow, i don't really have anything useful to contribute but i just wanted to let you know i'll be thinking of you.

(((OW))) (((OW))) (((OW)))

I am so sorry your dad hurt you and your sister like that. He was wrong to do that and you have every right to cry and grieve as much as you need to. Expressing it and giving it a voice is very important to learning how to cope and to heal.

My dad is an alcoholic too, but I no longer link the alcoholism as an excuse for his bad behavior. His bad behavior was more of a crutch for his drinking and it certainly enabled his behavior, but that is where it ends in my book anyway.

I am glad that you feel like you can share OW and that you can give yourself the needed expression you deserve. No one can ever take your voice away from you again.
JM

Thank you HB, SongBird and JM -

I felt relief just putting it out there, so it wasn't just trapped in my head anymore, and your responses gave me even more comfort.

JM - I totally get what you're saying and I try not to make it an excuse for what he did, too. The dichotomy of who he was is hard for me to understand sometimes. He was a great guy and everybody loved him, especially us. He was kind, hard-working, and loving. But, when he drank (which was almost always towards the end of his life, I was in junior high at the time), he sexually abused us. (There was no beating or physical abuse on his part, that was left up to my grandmother, who we also lived with at the time.) I'm sure he knew, when he was sober, what he had done, and he chose to drink again and again and again. I know he is completely responsible for what happened. The hardest part is hearing family talk about what a great guy he was and completely ignoring the fact that he did what he did to us. No one will talk about it. When I tried (and I used to a lot) they would just say they forgot about it or they didn't know much about it anyway except what my grandma had told them.

If I keep writing, I think I may find that anger I'm looking for. I don't think that's a good idea here at work, so maybe I'll stop for awhile.

OW

(((((((((OW))))))))))))

I'm sorry I missed this last night before I went to bed. I'm so sorry. I was also abused by my dad (also a very charming man when sober) so I know the kind of emotional complications which arise in the relationship. There's never anything simple about our relationships with them. Sometimes I think it would just be easier if I could just hate him, but it's not that cut and dried. I'm really glad that you came here and were able to talk about it.

I wish I had something insightful or wise to say but I am in the midst of struggling with this myself and am at a loss for words right now. But I wanted you to know you were heard. That it is a big deal and I know what it did to you but that you are working to heal it and you will. I am so glad that you have found the strength to face it so that you can come out on the other side.

AG

You're right, AG it would be a lot easier if I could just hate him. I don't remember any of the abuse, or really anything from my childhood except a fragment here and there. Maybe it would be easier if I could remember, maybe it would be harder.

Nothing insightful or wise is necessary, I don't know if any of that would help anyway. It's just good to know you understand my feelings (although I hate the reason you do understand) and my need to just talk about it. I hope you find relief from your struggle too.

OW

OW...I'm sorry you are suffering. I don't really know what to say but I wanted to let you know that I was thinking of you and hope with your T's help you will eventually find some peace for yourself.

TN

OHHHH...crap....

My dad's BD is Tuesday...ruh..roh. I guess I'd better get a card in the mail or I'll have to risk that phone call. Right now...not really something I want to deal with. I went to see him last year at this time...it was a big BD bash, his 80th.
That was part of what started my current decompensation. So...hmmm...best to nip that in the bud, I think.
*revving up my printer to make a card...right now!*
What to say....what to say.... YIKES...I'm feeling scared.

OK...so it's been a week...and today is my father's BD. He has already called me, but I had to ignore the call. I have to see my T in an hour and the last time he called before a session. I didn't make it to the session. YIKES that cost me a bundle!!! You can't just miss a 2 hour session without it hitting you smack in the wallet!
Now what the frak am I going to do? I'll have to call him back sometime today...hmmmm...

SD

Call him after your session! Maybe work on some strategies with your T before you leave!?! Or, maybe call him WHILE your with your T... then you can have support and have a reason to get off the phone! Plus, she will see how you handle it and can be there for you after the call.

Just some ideas. Good luck.

P.S.- calling when you KNOW he's busy and can't answer works for me sometimes! hehe

Hi CT...

That is a great idea. I wish it had been an option. But I didn't think about it...nor did my T. Hmmm.....I know she would love to have heard that conversation. It would have been a really strange one...I'm sure. So...anyway...I made the call...got voicemail. Normally this would be a good thing. However...I'm sure he will call me back, most likely at a time that is not convenient for me. So anxious waiting begins now. ick. Maybe my phone will die...before I do.

SD

Hey Soulful, Have you talked to your dad yet? How'd it go?

-CT

Well...hmmmm....

I can't really tell you how it went. ummm....
I talked to him for about the first 5 minutes and the call was logged as 27 minutes. So...I'm not sure what I said. He hasn't called back and I have not heard from his wife. So right now...I am assuming that I didn't say anything too egregious. Maybe I'll find out tomorrow.
You know it sucks when your T has to tell you about the phone call you made to your father.

SD

Oh SD, that must be very frustrating not to know. Is it likey that you will become more integrated and aware during switches? Does your father trigger this to occur or does this just happen?

My dad called while I was on the phone with my sister yesterday and I just let it go to vm. I'm just not up to dealing with him right now. A four hour phone conversation with my sister is enough for one day.:/

SD,
That has to be so disconcerting. My family is difficult enough to deal with when I know what I said.

AG

SD,
You have my empathy. I that must be very difficult to not remember a conversation. How does your T help you recall conversations? If that question is too personal, I apologize for asking and completely understand if you don't want to answer it.
Questing

SD, you gots DID?
samy

quote:

Originally posted by the dude:
SD, you gots DID?
samy

That would be an affirmative samy. Yes...I do. It's tough huh?

SD

quote:

Originally posted by Just Me:
Oh SD, that must be very frustrating not to know. Is it likey that you will become more integrated and aware during switches? Does your father trigger this to occur or does this just happen?

It is pretty frustrating...and make me feel pretty stupid sometimes.

It's likely that I will be more aware...if I can make it through my current crisis. Integration however is a somewhat different issue. Being more aware is co-consciousness...and integration is more of a single consciousness kind of thing. I don't see integration happening anytime real soon. And I'm not sure I really believe that can happen for me. Sometimes alters merge and act in harmony with one another...some can disappear for years only to re-emerge at any given time. Integration is the general goal for most. However I sometimes feel like it's just a carrot dangling in front of "this" jack asses nose.

SD

quote:

Originally posted by Questing:
SD,
You have my empathy. I that must be very difficult to not remember a conversation. How does your T help you recall conversations? If that question is too personal, I apologize for asking and completely understand if you don't want to answer it.
Questing

Not a problem Q...

My T extracts the information from the alter that talked to him by talking to that alter...and then relays it to me. Different T's use different techniques to make contact with alters...some use hypnosis...some just talk directly to the alter...in my case I just let go of control, stop suppressing and see who shows up to chat. *chuckling* It is something I had to learn to do in lieu of a specific triggering event. Very early on...we used sodium amytal...to ease the transition.
I experience it as "dark time" something like a nap...without the rest. And sometimes (as in this time) they do not want to cooperate and will not "front" (meaning come out and reveal.) If that continues...it's possible that I may never know. It depends on whether or not it was a traumatic trigger or someone else that just wanted to say hi. I have an alter that protects my father's image (stores all the memories of the good father that I love.) This is usually termed a father introject.
I suspect it was probably that alter that spoke to my father. But he did not want to talk about it...at least not today. He is pretty resistant to therapy...as he is constantly being bombarded by the ugliness of the realities of the other alters, who challenge his beliefs. He's tricky to work with...because he listens most of the time and will hurt me if he is offended by whatever we are saying. He is modeled after my father so does not see this as abuse. My father is most likely dissociative himself. There are 2 other alters that may have talked to him...and if that is the case it is only a matter of time...and they will tell my T what was said...they may also tell my T what my "introject" said, if they were present. I suspect that they were. I get a sense about it...or a sensation.

Because I am a host or executive alter...I am somewhat protected by an amnesic barrier. It is the only way I can continue to function and be "somewhat" sane in affect. This barrier is a bit translucent in that I can often hear conversations...disagreements...and misc. other phenomena. Or I can feel when an alter is "fronting" and asking me to take a step back. If a trauma trigger is hit, then I usually feel nothing and the alter that can best deal with the situation will take over. It's normal for me...but I know it is not for mono-minded people. That was a hard realization for me to absorb but I'm over it and understand it. I often wish for what I do not have...what I perceive to be a simpler life. It may not be true. I can't know that.

I know this all sounds pretty whacked...but there are very good reasons why I function this way. So far...I haven't found any two multiples that function in the same way. Similarities...yes...sameness...no. It is a unique (albeit odd) disorder so there is no specific formula for treating it. Everyone just sorta 'flys by the seat of their pants' and hopes for the best. Some T's are more intuitive or have skill sets that are more effective than others...and there are some hospitals that utilize specialized units for dissociative disorders.

The lack of sameness among multiples is what raises suspicion and causes people to doubt that this disorder really exists. I gave up trying to convince anyone...a long time ago. They see it...or they don't. I guess maybe it's like believing in God. "For those that believe no explanation is necessary. For those that don't - none is possible."


Diagnostics are getting better...MRI's are showing some similar patterns in DID cases...but not always specific to DID...results can run the gamut of dissociative disorders.

So...did that more than answer your question? LOL....sorry...I ramble.

SD

SD,
Thank you. Yes, it did answer my question. However, now I have more questions. LOL! Do you find when something stressful happens that you have to process the "multiple" reactions of your different alters? And if you have to make a big decision, do you have to check in with everyone to make the best possible choice for everyone? I have known other people with DID. And I don't think it's "whacked". Thank you for sharing you experiences and knowledge with me.
Q

Q... ~the only thing that you can't question...is that you must question everything~
LOL...Aren't questions the essence of life? If we all had all the answers...what would be the purpose?
Watch out here...I could go all Zen on you.

In my case...it depends on what the stressor is. If it is a simple trigger...like the smell of motor oil...or fabric softener, the sound of breaking glass, or being in a crowd of people. Then I can usually process that, identify where it is coming from, acknowledge it and soothe it. If not...then it is shunted off to an alter, that is better equipped emotionally, physically, or mentally to deal with it. From there...it can be split further if necessary.
I am protected from the stimulus until I can cope again. In that situation...I will have to try to process the entire experience over again, piece by piece, and reassemble it without the stressor being present. I may have to work on it over and over before I can assimilate it all into a coherent experience, and understand it as a whole memory and "own" it. Once I reclaim that whole memory, I integrate it into my timeline, and the alters let go of their pieces. My timeline is full of holes...I just try to be the best "file clerk" that I can be.
I believe that the process of taking these burdens from the alters will eventually get them closer to integrating. (Whatever that means.) Some of them believe they will die, so they resist...some believe they will go to sleep and are grateful and more than ready to "lay down their burdens." Some believe they will go on without having to deal with the experiences that created them. I don't know what will happen to me.

It is possible that I have a "tracer" alter (some would call a "core" personality) that has a complete timeline. But as of this writing, I am not sure I have one. There are some indications that I may have a split core but at this time I cannot confirm that either.

There have been times when I could check in with different clusters of alters, or a single alter and get a response. But for the most part they make the decisions....I just run the "dog and pony" show. (You know...dogs and ponies have minds of their own and don't always perform as you might like them to....*chuckling*)

What I find most challenging is trying to figure out what personality disorders...my "personalities" have. LOL Now that is complex chaos.

SD

SD,
Thanks for sharing so much about youself and your experiences with DID. How many personalities are you aware of? I think everyone has some sort of personality disorder or strong traits...just not so many housed in one body! We would all be boring, bland, and the same without some sort of disorder.
Q

It is very difficult to assign a number to what I have going on. I can say that I have 7 distinct and different alters, that are functional. But we have identified close to 20. Some alters...have parts...or fragments. But since they cannot function independently I'm not sure I would call them alters. As to the question of my awareness of them. I am not really very aware of them, I have been previously...but it is just not happening right now. The decompensation that I have been experiencing for the last year has strengthened the amnesic barrier and the alters are currently excluding me from their processes. In the last year, I have had more fragmentation. So...I am re-mapping my system right now, this is a very difficult process since I am not in a position to really know much. I take my best guess and hope that my T can fill in the blanks and find some answers. I also have to ask my friends and family what they are observing...which is painful, humiliating and embarrassing.

Lately I've been experiencing alot of depersonalization. A sense of being totally unreal. It's quite disconcerting and I have to be very careful when I am out in the real world. Intellectually I know what is real and what is not...but on a feeling level...I am quite removed. (It's like being stuck in a really weird video game.)

This weekend has been very difficult...we'll see what happens tomorrow in my session. I have a great deal of anxiety before my sessions, because I never know what is going to happen, or how I am going to deal with it after I leave.
Arrrrggghhhh....

SD

quote:

What I find most challenging is trying to figure out what personality disorders...my "personalities" have. LOL Now that is complex chaos.

SD,
This sounds tiring! I get exhausted with what I have to deal with. It doeosn't sound like you get much rest from the chaos. I suppose we all have difficult aspects to handle with whatever "disorders" each of us might have. I am noticing a lot of unpredictability and major mood swings that I feel so uncontrolled over. I'm back to the whole diagnosis thing, Do I want to know, do I not want to know. I mean obviously I am "unofficially DDNOS" and my alters are clammering lately. I have some I don't like. I admit I know next to nothing about this disorder and I am resisting learning too much because my T doesn't want me to feel locked into the stigma of any given label. If I were DID or something that required meds she would probably have to tell me. But at this point I am trying to do things her way. Meanwhile I like to get to know more about my friends here and my heart goes out to their unique struggles, but mostly I admire the strength you (and everyone else) possess.

Thank you for sharing so deeply with us.
JM

SD,
I'm amazed at how well you know yourself even while you're in the process of "restructuring". This may be a novice idea or you may already do this; Do you and your other "alters" write in a journal to keep up with what is going on with one another? The people I know who struggle with DID have told me writing in a journal allows them SOMETIMES to understand what's going on inside without have to deal with asking family what they are "observing".

Depersonalizating IS something that I understand from personal experience. It is very weird to have reality twist. For me, the room suddenly tips and distorts....it reminds me of the batman tv show from the 60's.

I sincerely hope your therapy session goes well today and you get some answers. I have one too. Just breathe.
Questing

quote:

Do I want to know, do I not want to know. I mean obviously I am "unofficially DDNOS" and my alters are clammering lately. I have some I don't like. I admit I know next to nothing about this disorder and I am resisting learning too much because my T doesn't want me to feel locked into the stigma of any given label. If I were DID or something that required meds she would probably have to tell me. But at this point I am trying to do things her way. Meanwhile I like to get to know more about my friends here and my heart goes out to their unique struggles, but mostly I admire the strength you (and everyone else) possess.

Thank you for sharing so deeply with us.
JM

Hi JM....thank you...and your welcome.

There is some amazing strength and compassion here. It's nice to have a place to express our difficulties and get good feedback. Between sessions this is very therapeutic and it's very helpful to get feedback about sessions too.
I don't think my struggles are much different than anyone else's I have a couple of added complications (the worst part of that being that I can't remember chit)...but I struggle with the same emotions, thoughts and insecurities that everyone else does.

I understand where you are with the diagnosis part. And you should listen to your T, the stigma of having a label is hard to overcome. But there are some people that say that the first step in overcoming a mental illness is in naming it. (Does that sound familiar or what?) LOL....just like AA.... I guess that may make us all...MIA???

The DDNOS category is pretty vague...I think it benefits some to stay with that as no one really knows what it means. Even T's don't have a handle on NOS!!! It is a catch all diagnosis...if no one can figure out where you fit in the dissociative spectrum...that label works. It is really up to you...and your gut feeling about how you want to proceed and what feels accurate to you. No T (in their right mind) will suggest you are a multiple or have DID. There is WAY too much baggage with false memory syndrome. Eventually you will know what is right for you. The treatment plan is a bit different but that is the only thing that differentiates.
I have a friend who wrote a book titled Not Otherwise Specified. Her name is Leah Peterson...if you want to check it out. She has always kept the DDNOS designation, at least as far as I know.

About meds. I'm pretty sure that you were not being specific to DID. But meds will not really work for DID or DDNOS...except to relieve some of the symptoms. There is no pill that will supress it, control it or take it away. (hmmm...I must have tried them all by now...*chuckling*.) An anti-depressant may help...and sometimes an anti-psychotic will help with disorganized thinking. But in general...the side effects suck and the meds sometimes mask what we are truly thinking and feeling. I've been on an anti-depressant for years...but recently stopped taking it. I didn't think it was really working for me...and it was making my headaches worse. It's hard to tell when you just feel numb. I am on an anti-psychotic at the present time, because my mind is so chaotic and I think so quickly that sometimes I speak in word salad. It helps to slow my thinking down so that I can process some of it and actually make sense when I speak.
If I can get to the feeling part of this again...I may need that anti-depressant...but for right now...it's just better not to have migraines. Meds also help me get some sleep, being constantly activated and hyper-vigilant can make you pretty crazy.

Anyway...I hope I haven't shared too much. I did feel a bit vulnerable and I am no expert on anyone but me. And that too is doubtful. But secrets are ruining my life so I'm putting it out there. I believe in the synchronicity of life...everything happens for a reason. It is the reasons we seek that prompt us to ask the hard questions and make us willing to hear the hard answers.

(((JM))) As AG says: "Everything will be ok in the end. If it's not ok, it's not the end." We'll know when it's OK...and then we'll get some sleep!

SD

quote:

Do you and your other "alters" write in a journal to keep up with what is going on with one another?

I do keep a journal...for years. Although I have had times when I've had a book burning party. I always have one around for alters that do not use the computer, and it does help especially with the very young/little ones...but I'm sick of toting it around with me...with a laptop, a bunch of pencils, crayons, markers and sketch books...it's breaking my shoulders! I use a flight case sometimes...but feel a bit like a pharmaceutical rep when I'm walking around the hospital with it.

quote:

I sincerely hope your therapy session goes well today and you get some answers. I have one too. Just breathe.
Questing

The session today...well...I'm still breathing. I have to pay careful attention to it...or I will pass out. I think AG has that problem too.

I really don't like grocery stores...or shopping in general, too much stimulus for me. One day I woke up on the floor of the local grocery with people standing around me and paramedics coming in the door to haul my foolish butt out. I talked them out of it by asking them for some orange juice. LOL...(at least it was handy!)

Anyway...the session was ok...but I do have session lag. At least I remember leaving this one...even though the entire 2 hours was pretty chaotic. It seems like my T is actually trying to put some control measures in place...but it also seems like I am teaching again. *sigh* I suppose...there is a good "reason."

To bring the thread back around. I have not heard from my father again. My sister went to visit him last weekend and reports that he only remembers what is happening for a day or so. Which of course made me laugh and say: "I wish I were that lucky." Another one of life's little ironies. And the synchronicity of it all. *chuckling*

SD