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I feel a lot better since my session this afternoon. Last night I wrote my T the most honest email I could. I told him that I thought he had avoided talking about touch when following up on my request that he sit closer to me and that I thought he did that because he didn't want to say No touch explicitly. I told him that there was a part of me that wanted him to comfort me by touching me when I'm really upset during a session. I told him I was ashamed and confused by that feeling and so I tried not to talk about it but it hadn't gone away. I admitted I felt rejected by him even though I hadn't forced the conversation until he said no. He replied at lunch today telling me it would be a good thing to talk about. I was so nervous before my session I couldn't eat and I developed a tic in my eyelid. I almost couldn't go to my session.

When I did my T was his usual calm self. I even made a joke about the fact that there was two boxes of Kleenex and asked him if he was expecting me to cry a lot. T talked to me about the difficulties involved in the kind of touch I was describing, the difficulties with safety and boundaries and how it could be misunderstood etc etc and I was sitting there squeezing myself with my arms and staring at the floor and walls. I was disappointed because I really wanted to talk about my feelings around touch before he told me his 'rules' but I couldn't speak. Then T told me he didn't have any firm rules about touch like that because he could see it might be helpful or not depending on the situation and he asked me for my thoughts. I was so surprised.

I still couldn't express myself. I had trouble talking about touch. All of a sudden I couldn't feel anything. I didn't seem to matter to me at all. The wish that he would come closer and comfort me seemed to be gone. I kept trying to talk about my feelings and thoughts but it was too confusing and I couldn't put a coherent sentence together. T told me he wanted me to realize that it was okay to talk about the subject of touch and comfort and that it was a normal expression of care, that I hadn't asked for something too extreme or unreasonable.

I'm confused by the desire because it isn't always there. There is no way I could go to my T and argue that he should comfort me by touching me because I'm not sure that I do. In some ways I feel like the desire for that comes from a part of me that I'm not always in touch with or aware of. I managed to share some of that confusion and admit that I was judging myself harshly for my feelings (and my dreams but I didn't tell him about them). He told me that he didn't think the self-judgement was ever helpful but he wasn't surprised it was confusing me. He told me he thought touch was a multi-layered topic that was an attempt to feel connected to him even when I was upset so that I could feel like he cared for me. He also thought it had to do with a deep-seated need for assurance that hadn't been met very often and was probably linked to some very old pain which is why I had so much trouble expressing anything verbally. That really resonated with me even though I was pretty dissociated and detached. As we ended my T told me that he thought it was an important topic to explore whether or not we ever acted on what we discussed.

Since my session I've felt so relieved. I know it probably doesn't sound like much considering how little I managed to say and feel during the session but it was a big step forward for me. I was able to tell my T what I wanted even if I couldn't be sure I still wanted it. He talked about touch with me. I know he understands that it is important to me and some of the reasons why. He was able to put some words to my experience when all I could feel was confused and distracted. It was hard for me to keep hold of the topic if that makes sense. I'm sure we will be able to talk about it again because he was open to talking and possibly even to allowing comfort touch. Also I didn't even use one tissue.
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quote:
I'm confused by the desire because it isn't always there. There is no way I could go to my T and argue that he should comfort me by touching me because I'm not sure that I do. In some ways I feel like the desire for that comes from a part of me that I'm not always in touch with or aware of.



First, incognito... bravo to you for being so courageous in addressing this topic again after all the starts and stops in trying to get to it. What you wrote above resonated with me because as you know I am also struggling with the touch issue. And like you I also wonder if I really want it or maybe I just want it sometimes and not other times. What confuses me further is that I did have it with oldT who would give me a hug if I asked after a session but during sessions and processing there was no touch. So I still don't know how that would work for me. I didn't feel I needed a hug during a session but maybe a touch of my hand or arm to know he was there and to ground me in some way. Not sure and like you I just really wanted to talk about it not act on it immediately. It's still a work in progress for me and T.

But I did want to mention that I think the need for touch and hugs comes from the inner child who was so deprived and abandoned way back then. That is the part of us that is hungry for the innocent touch of comfort and reassurance.

I am proud of you for hanging in there for this tough conversation. I for one plan to go back and address this with T on Thursday. I want to ask him... "so if you f'ed up the first conversation this is your second chance. What would you have talked with me about if you did it right?"

Oh and BTW, it would have been okay for you to use some tissues.

Hugs to you
TN
(((INCOGNITO))))

I too think you were really brave to push ahead with the topic even though your T didn't really seem to be encouraging the conversastion and you actually thought he was avoiding the conversation. Wow, and I can't believe you found out that he actually doesn't have hard and fast rules. My new line of thinking is that their job is to get us to verbalize our needs before they give in to us - even if they decide to meet a particular need - so that we can identify, verbalize and understand our needs in the future. It's a painful process to go through because their non-response often feels like they are denying us what we want. And, it's not always the case as you found out. Smiler

I've been thinking about touch all night because, well, I don't know if I've revealed this, but often what I long for (in the safety of my home) is for my T to sit next to me when I am distressed. It seems to magically disappear when I am *in session* and it IS very confusing.

I've been having powerful memories tonight of connecting with my Dad when we were in the car. He used to travel for a living and was on the road 50% of the time. He often used to take us on trips with him, especially in the summer.

So, back in the days before bucket seats, I would get to sit right up next to him while he drove. I think it was the only time I felt connected to him and felt safe. I also think it might have been the only time that I got that physical affection, that comforting, and attention as we would talk about maps and road signs, etc., which my Dad loved talking about. Those were the only happy and safe times in my childhood, being next to my Dad in the car.

I was wondering if it has anything to do with my desire and longings to have T sit next to me? It just feels so right, like I found the answer and I thought I'd throw that out there to you. I was so excited myself to have found a connection.

So happy for you that you were able to have that conversation with your T. Can you give me some of your bravery?

xoxoxo

Love,

Liese
Incognito - how BRAVE of you for discussing this and it went so well. Like you said - you two have opened the door in a caring and warm way to keep discussing this when the need arises again.

He was very astute in his comments about the topic being an attempt to feel connected to him even when you were upset. Makes me think what I do with my T to achieve this too. I tend to make sure things are in place just in case - although the touch one isn't one I use. Very interesting to think about.

How wonderful of him to reassure you that what you had asked of him was not unreasonable or bad.

I am really pleased for you, proud of you and inspired to do something brave also.

SD
(((Incognito))))

I admire your courage and willingness to talk to your T about a difficult topic.

Regarding your fleeting desire for touch in therapy, I think its completely normal to have a desire that is sometimes there and at other times not. In fact, it if were always there or never there, I would say that would be cause for concern.

I'm proud of you for working through this issue with T, even though it is uncomfortable to do so.
Hey Incognito that is great to hear that you are feeling better at the moment (you deserve a break in amongst all the pain you’ve been going through with T.)

And well done you for having the courage to bring up the touch issue. And that’s wonderful that your T has said that actually he doesn’t have firm rules about touch across the board but that it depends on individual situations. So he’s not saying NO as you feared, but he’s not saying oh ok here you are then either. I think he’s making it very safe for you to continue talking about it and thinking about it, so there’s no pressure on you to HAVE to seek touch just because you’ve asked about it.

It makes perfect sense too that one moment you have this need for touch and then it disappears and you wonder what’s going on. It’s not surprising either that the times you’d allow yourself to experience that need would be out of session, I’ve found that I’m much more in touch with deeper feelings and issues outside of session but that once I get in there, they just vanish. Something to do with defences and safety and it’s all very well my knowing how I feel and what I want but letting someone else see it!!!!

I know you’ve had a really hard time with therapy recently, but can I say that I really like what I hear of your T, he sounds like not only is he there for you, but that he really does understand where you’re at.

I am glad you’re feeling some relief and I think you achieved a big thing in your session Smiler

LL
Incognito - So brave of you to have this conversation. It is still terrifying to me to talk about touch, even though it's something T and I have been working with for a couple of months now and talking about a few months before that. I think it's great to take it very slow, just have the conversation. I definitely experience it as something that comes and goes. Or, sometimes I experience it as something that is desperately wanted and dreadfully repellant at the same time, just coming from two different places inside.

TN said:
quote:
But I did want to mention that I think the need for touch and hugs comes from the inner child who was so deprived and abandoned way back then. That is the part of us that is hungry for the innocent touch of comfort and reassurance.


...and Monte said:
quote:
My point is, just because you don't feel it doesn't mean it (the need) is not there...it's just out of sight at the time. The needy child is always there, she just needs encouragement and permission to come forward in session. This for me is still an ongoing battle.


And, I thought,

Little Yaku is ALWAYS there and ALWAYS needs that comfort and reassurance from T, but sometimes she is more buried than others or my anxiety about her needs forces them out of my awareness. My T has gotten very good at inviting her out in a way I can't seem to do myself. It helps that he is a silly, goofy, playful guy. He will come out into the lobby, tell me he has to take a bathroom break, but to "Go on in, the doctor is waiting," and will have the sock monkey I made him sitting on one of the chairs with his arms and legs crossed. Or, he will help pull LY's stuffed animals out of the backpack and hold them, play with them, use them to interact with her. It makes me feel like such an idiot sometimes, but lately he is getting a lot of direct interaction with her and I am getting out of the way without having to try so hard. But, it took SO much time and work and conversations with protective parts and angry parts who "don't need anybody," to get through to the work we're doing now and is only getting easier the last couple of weeks. I don't suspect it will stay easy either. But, none of that could have happened without having the terrifying sort of conversations that you're having with T now. Not saying anyone else's experience has to look like mine, which can be so humiliating to me at times. Just that you took a giant step forward in acknowledging the hurting child in there. Even if she wasn't there to tell your T how she feels about touch in this particular session, you are laying the groundwork for it to be less scary for her to do at another time.
Good job!!!
Thanks for the replies. I guess I'm the only one who thinks it is odd that I can wants rise up and disappear so suddenly. I"m not very aware or or sympathetic to my inner child. I'm feeling sad because my T cancelled my session tonight because he was sick. I know it isn't his fault he is sick and it is only the second time since I started seeing him that he has had to cancel because of illness but I"m still sad. I was hoping to be able to express a little more of my feelings and thoughts tonight. I usually email my T after my sessions and this time I didn't because I was hoping that I would be able to express my thoughts in person. Now Monday just feels so far away.

TN, good luck tomorrow with the touch conversation round 2. I will be thinking of you and checking for an update.

Liese, that is an interesting realization about your dad. I realized that both my parents are very physically affectionate with young children, babies, toddlers, early school age but not after that. I actually have no memories of being held or carried or hugged or cuddled but I don't have very many memories of my childhood at all.

SD, I'm glad if anything I said helped or inspired you in anyway. I hope that the brave thing you did turned out well.

Monte, I just want you to know that the stories you have shared about your therapy have really inspired me in a lot of ways. I haven't tried reading my T the things I write when I'm not in session because I'm afraid that would be too much but I'm thinking about it.

LG, thank you for the comments. It is nice to hear from you. I hope your life is going well.

LL, I think my T is very good. He is there for me most of the time, he is very non-defensive and accepting of anything I say, and he understands me and sometimes can express that so clearly I can understand me too.

Yaku, I'm glad your T is playful and connects with Little Yaku. Your T sounds wonderful. I'm sorry that you are struggling right now and I hope that things improve soon.

NInn, thank you for celebrating the achievement with me. Yay!

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