((((((( Incognito )))))))

I'm SO sorry to hear how this session went. I can feel your distress and fear and doubt and shame and I wish I could find something comforting to say. About the only positive thing I can think of is that your T does not seem to be negatively affected by anything that is coming up in sessions, and it doesn't sound as if he deliberately poked and prodded at you to make you feel bad.

It does sound though as if he's not properly aware of the effect that some of the things he says has on you, and that you're still floundering in the inability to fully trust him and maybe what you need to agree with him is that you both slow down a bit and focus on better trust building. Bringing in those games was a wonderful idea and it's a shame you weren't able to suggest it right at the start of the session. I hope you feel ok enough to try again with the games next session.

Sorry this is a bit of a lame reply, just wanted to send you some hugs and lots of sympathy.

LL

(((((INCOGNITO)))))

I think it's so great that you brought in the games to try to lighten up the heavy stuff. It's such a great idea and so brave. I keep wanting to bring in a blanket because I feel so exposed and sometimes cold in therapy but I still can't do it. Sometimes I think I should just ask him and then bring in a blanket next session. So I admire your bravery there.


I want to ask you a question. Is this new for T that he's been initiating conversations about the hard stuff? I'm wondering how you feel when he brings things up like that? Sometimes I wish my T would push me more by bringing things up. But sometimes I think I might feel traumatized because he would be taking control about an area of my life that I had very little control over. And I wonder if I might feel victimized again. Of course, that wouldn't be his intention. But I do worry about it. I'm wondering how you feel about it? On the one hand, happy that he is pushing? On the other hand, it's all still so sensitive and raw that you feel too exposed and out of control?

Okay, so here's my theory. He's using prolonged exposure. You are avoiding the mental contents because of how you feel about what he is bringing up. But he's bringing it up to expose you to the thoughts and feelings and so that over time, you will be able to handle talking about them so that in the end you will feel less ashamed about it all. And you will learn from him that it is not shameful because as you said, he can still shake your hand even though you feel so ashamed.

He's doesn't feel like you are disgusting. He doesn't feel that way at all. You ARENT'T disgusting.

xoxo

Love,

Liese

I've tried to post from my phone and lost the posts. Thanks for your support.
I am trying to stay present and safe. I don't want to walk into a bus either. I've probably made my T seem callous but it is complicated and I appreciate what he was trying to show me even though it is hard for me right now.

I'm away from a computer today because a friend and I are traveling to a nearby city to see a sold out performance of Jesus Christ superstar which finishes here in Canada this week and is going to broadway next march. It was hard to get tickets and I've been really looking forward to it. I'm glad I'm not having my typical day.

(((((incognito)))))

Oh man, that emotional ambush of his was not playing fair. The board games and candy should have been a big enough hint to him that you really weren't ready to talk about it. I'm glad you were able to tell him that you didn't want to talk about it, but of course, once the subject was brought up, even if you stopped talking about it you would still be thinking about it. It's not like you would be able to go back and play games at that point.

I think your T totally misread the situation, but I don't think he did it out of malice or to try to drive you away. And even though you are feeling really awful right now, maybe it will turn out to be OK in the long run. Because now you know how he feels. That he doesn't think you are disgusting. That although you feel ashamed, he doesn't think you've done anything shameful. And even though you said that you didn't believe him, I hope that a part of you at least does believe him.

((incognito))

Sorry to hear about your rough session with T.

I agree with Liese, it was totally brave what you did and I just love that you showed up with games in hand. I think that really is sweet and shows T how you are really wanting to connect on another level.

--Brokes

Hi, Incog- I think the games idea was a great one- I'm sorry to hear that it didn't work out properly...that sucks.

fwiw, Cowboy did the same thing to me last week, and we had a pretty crummy session, and I almost quit. I just hate it when he brings up this humiliating (and also odd form of SI) and talks about it like it is no big deal- in *****ing detail. It is shameful, humiliating and embarassing. But I know that it needs to be discussed, so in one way, I am so grateful for him pushing me. I might not have the courage otherwise. shining a light on things that are difficult and that we prefer to keep hidden is really the only way to heal them, IMO. So just know- that even though it was awful, and you have every right to be po'd at him- the truth of the matter is that he was trying to help you. He was so clumsy! I'm sure that if he knew, he would be really sorry it hurt you so much. He really sounds so nice, incog- he seems sweet, and caring, and gentle, and also tough as nails. It will be ok. Just keep on bringing those painful feelings to him, and letting the light shine on them, even though it hurts just awfully- that is where the healing lies. It really will be ok. I am very impressed with you, that you continue in the face of so many obstacles...as someone wise said on another thread somewhere- "it's a bit like Frodo with that blasted ring!"

Big hugs,

Beebs

ps- even though I love your T- if he really ate candy while you were crying, than he deserves to perish in hell for all eternity.. (just kidding- but- really!!! )

((Incognito )) - you know what? I have seen this situation another way. I think your T knew exactly what he was doing and he chose the moment when you could use the board games to create a lighter-hearted environment for him to broach a really difficult subject.

I think he saw an opportunity and he took it, hoping that you would be open to talking about it whilst 'distracted' or using a different part of your brain by playing the board games.

Sure I think when you got upset he might have thought "oh shit" - but I think he took a calculated risk to help you talk about a really painful thing.

It was always going to be very difficult to talk about and I think he tried something different.

Anyway i hope a new day did bring some peace to you about it. Hope you are processing things ok.

SD

Hi incognito...I'm glad you are out today with a friend and doing something wonderful and fun. It's good to have a different kind of day sometimes and hopefully it will help you get some clarity and calm from yesterday.

I think you have a very good T and I think you know that too, otherwise you would have left him long ago. He does make mistakes at times like all Ts do... more like missteps or misjudgements than outright mistakes. I think he tripped over his feet yesterday but he righted himself and shook your hand and tried to make you understand that he did not think you were shameful or repulsive or any other bad thing that you think about yourself... cause he would be right. You are a wonderful, brave person who is very valued here. You work so hard in therapy that you are a shining example of how to do the work and not give up.

I wonder if your bringing the games in was part of you taking a chance to allow your little kid in the room with T and when that did not work out (due to him bringing up other subjects) your child was crushed and then you felt shame and that caused a chain reaction on top of the shame of the other topic and it just all went downhill from there.

I think it was a fabulous idea to bring in the games and I think you need to do it again and maybe talk about it with T first. Sometimes we try to do too much too fast. I am guilty of this quite often and then I get impatient with myself. I wish more Ts played games with their attachment injured patients. When my son was seeing oldT we would all play games occassionally in session. For my son it was an exercise in social skills and focus... but it ended up being very healing and nurturing to me and to my inner kid. I didn't even understand what was happening at the time but after a session where we all played together I would go home feeling different, calm, cared for. I so much would look forward to the times when oldT would invite us in for a game. So I do think you should bring them in again and see what happens.

I also know that shame is the worst of the emotions to deal with. It's so deep and frightening to us but I agree with Beebs that if left in the dark it just festers so we have to drag it all out into the light and talk about it so that is loses it's power over us. Eventually, we would hope that it resolves and goes away. I, myself, am still in the throes of lots of shame stuff so I don't have a lot of advice as to how to deal with it. I do know that John Bradshaw wrote a book Healing the Shame that Binds You which I do want to read. I'm reading his other book now called Homecoming. He write a lot about the inner child and how to heal it.

And so...please don't be too upset over the last session. Go back, talk it out, and see what comes of it. I know you always feel like you are doing this and it's not working but the very action of talking it out is helping you grow and heal and take care of your own needs.

Hope that helps. I'm thinking of you.

Edited to add: About running out of the school performance crying... I burst into tears during the Principal's open school night talk TWICE in 3 years. The last time I did that was a few weeks after my abandonment. I had just come from a session with "D" and was very fragile. I didn't leave but sat there with my sunglasses on in a totally dissociative state. I just wanted you to know that you are not alone in struggling through school events and that I know how that feels and the toll it takes on you. (((incognito))))

Hugs
TN

((((INCOGNITO)))))

Glad you are out having some fun. A great distraction after yesterday. And please promise to stay away from buses for a while.

Enjoy!

xoxo

Liese

Wow, incognito. That's quite story and I see what you mean about weird. I also understand why you are so upset.

That said, I admire your T's actions (for whatever reason he did them, other members have said great ideas). Your T had enough faith in his relationship with you to say what was on his mind. He also knows that NOTHING is worse for a client then watching them suffer, bound to shame that has kept them bound for their entire lives.

IC, I have been bound to shame my entire life. Yesterday, I finished the fifth session with my T on CSA, and its impact on decisions I've made and things I've done as an adult. Those things have haunted me with guilt and shame and have clouded ALL of my relationships with shame.

It's time to ease up on yourself, IC. It's time to tell him, because healing can only begin when someone bears witness. You are truly lucky to have a T that is so bold and so forthcoming with support. He knew what was in your mind about you and the "odd form of SI." He knows how freeing it will be to no longer be hiding it.

I understand your fear. Truly I do. It's been 24 hours since my appointment yesterday and I'm waiting to hear from my T with some words of affirmation to get me through the week. I told him exactly what I needed.

I have NEVER been as intimate with anyone as I was with my T over the past five sessions. Now, I need a connection from him. Otherwise, it's kind of like we had sex and he didn't call the next day.

Your T is inviting the connection with you. He knows what it will take for you to go to this place with you and he knows that you can handle it.

If you still feel that you're not ready, maybe you should talk to him about whether you are willing to give up this form of SI- whether you are willing to resolve the issue that drives the behavior. What is it protecting you/saving you from?

Go for it IC.

Incognito I’m glad you’re getting distracted tonight. I hope that by tomorrow the shame and the anger will have settled a bit and you’ll feel more able to think about the session objectively, and think about what you need to say next time. Hope you hang in there.

Sending you hugs (((( Incognito ))))

LL

Thanks for all the support. It felt great to get home and see so many posts. I had a good day, enjoyed the show, and spent 4 hours in a car with a very old friend who listened to my therapy woes and worries.

To clarify because I wasn't clear last night I brought the games but didn't tell my T about them and we didn't play them. I never got up the nerve and as the session progressed it seemed impossible to bring up the games. It wasn't until the last few minutes when I was really feeling this huge disparity between what I wanted the session to be like and what happened that I told him I had brought games to play.

DF, I wish I could have told my T I hoped he choked on the candy but when I'm triggered I freeze and saying anything is difficult. Yesterday was the first time I've raised my voice in a session. Also he did warn me that he was going to eat the candy. I think it has to do with how upset I was because I can remember the sound of the candy clearly but I can't remember what he said.

LL, thanks for the hugs. It was a very rough session and I'm still processing it but I feel better tonight and more like myself. I'm working hard on not thinking ahead and just dealing with what I am doing in the present because just thinking about going back on Monday causes my heart to start pounding and my breathing to speed up.

Liese, My T has rarely initiated a difficult conversation like this and usually stops talking if I say I don't want to talk about something. I think he did it in response to a lot of the things I have been telling him lately when I have accused him of avoiding things I want to talk about (not this actually) because he was uncomfortable and the fact that the last month or so I've spent a lot of time telling him (and you all) how painful therapy is for me. I can see that I have been struggling with having disclosed this and not feeling safe in therapy and in a odd way this might have been an attempt to show me it could be talked about and we would survive. I'm not sure if that is how it will turn out but I appreciate it.

Nannabee, he didn't see the games until the end. I struggle to believe what my T says and he tells me the same thing that some part of me must believe him because I keep working with him. When I was a child I couldn't really trust anyone in my family for a variety of different reasons but my mother in particular lives so completely in her own reality that I felt like she lied to me whenever it made things easier for her. The truth is she lies to herself as well and her lies change over time so her reality and the mine when I was a child was completely dependent on her mood. It was like trying to learn the rules of a game when the other person constantly changes them and then punishes you when you don't follow them.

BB, I'm sorry that you can relate to being that ashamed of yourself. I wonder if we are talking about the same thing (if I had more guts I'd PM you about it). I'm not sure that there is anyway to push me that isn't clumsy. My T is always telling me there is no easy way to talk about the things I have to talk about so waiting until it gets easy or smooth isn't helpful. I stamp my feet (metaphorically) and complain it should be easier, so far hasn't changed anything. He did eat candy while I cried and today he responded to my email telling me I wasn't disgusting and he doesn't eat when he feels disgusted. Sometimes I don't know whether to laugh or be offended when he says things like that.

SD, I think you are right and he was trying to talk about something that isn't ever going to be easy to talk about and something I am unlikely to discuss. I think he was trying something new.

TN,
You are right I brought in the games and hadn't talked to T about it because I was trying to do something different than just sit and feel paralyzed. I have no idea if he would be willing to play a game or do any of the other things people talk about like drawing or coloring and he gave me no hint when I told him about the games at the end of the session. I guess we can talk about it in the future. The falling to pieces in the school performance was surprising to me because I used to be able to keep it together in public but now I am finding it more difficult. It is probably a good thing because I'm less likely to push myself to do things and sometimes I just say no.

ND, I've been reading your posts and think it is amazing that you have been able to be so honest and open in processing your CSA in your recent sessions. I have CSA in my history but I approach it and feel ashamed and insecure about my T and therapy and then work through that and approach it again and say a little more and so on and so on. The processing is so slow. I hope your T calls you soon. I also think it is great that you can identify what you need your T and ask for it so clearly. I look forward to reading more about your therapy.