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So, I have been texting with T since last night's late session and have emailed him more details on how the transference stuff is basically taking over my life and also how counseling has opened the door to behaviors that never happened before, because my old (and granted broken) coping mechanisms allowed me to at least be functional for everyone else, even if I was hurting badly deep down in some place that I would not even allow myself to touch.

He texted me back this afternoon, saying, "Yaku. What do you think about having a time to talk by phone today or Thur or Fri? There would be no fee for the call and we can pre-schedule a time. It would be to address some of the complex issues coming up for you right now." INSTANT FREAK OUT!

On the one hand, it would be very good to be able to talk to T in between sessions with how I have been struggling so much. I need to know the game plan or what other support might help me...something beyond, "What would it be like to trust God with [pick an issue] and bring it into the light to be made clean?" I guess, what I mean, is short term support while I am building long term skills (and I do see him helping me with the latter). H was very angry at me today, because my harming has gotten worse (he saw new bruises) and he feels like I'm not doing what it takes to get better and not able to do the things that work for him (um, duh, just because the "two became one," doesn't mean I had a personality transplant). He yelled at me and started speeding in the car and slammed the door and was generally an @$$. He doesn't get how I can be self-aware, but unable to fix things at the same time and is rushing me, considering telling me to switch Ts, etc. He's tired from overworking, but I feel like I need to get better soon or it's going to start affecting my marriage, which is still healing from the crap we went through last year.

On the other hand, it takes so much concentration to talk to T in person, when he is five feet away. I feel so ungrounded by him being even that distance, I can't imagine I could ever do a phone call. The only time I ever have was when his texts weren't going through and he needed to tell me my appointment time. And talking to him for 30 seconds threw me into a huge anxiety attack. I told him that it sounded good, but I was panicking just thinking about it and that it would probably mean an even larger burden on him than usual to keep me from silence. I let him know we do need to figure out how to stabilize me at least a bit if I'm going to stick with counseling (and about H's impatience). And I told him he shouldn't have to do it for free, but that I couldn't afford to pay him. Frowner I'm still waiting to hear back.

Any input on how to do an effective phone session? Especially from those who already struggle to talk in person!!! How do I keep myself from freaking out? I am thinking of asking my husband to take my daughter out and my sister to not be in the house, because I don't think I can do it if anyone is around at all. Also, I think I would want to do it from the chair in my bedroom (it's where I feel least exposed), but H has acted weird before when I sent a scheduling question to T while sitting in bed. Yes, H sounds like a total jerk, but he can also be very wise, supportive and caring in a hit-and-run sort of way.

PS - Also, is it just me, or does "complex" sound like code for, "You're so effed up and I'm not sure I can help you!"?
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Yaku,
I do phone sessions with T1. Some things that help me are to be alone as you mentioned, to find a comfortable place where I feel safe (which is usually my bed), and to light a candle to help me relax a little.

There are times when it is silent on the phone and that can be awkward but it helps to have an object to look at to distract myself for a few seconds to work through the silence. and other times, when I can't bear the silence anymore, I will either say something about what I am thinking or ask T1 what she is thinking or what she thinks about what I just said.

And I'm sure that your T would be understanding if you find that the phone session is just to much to bear and you need to get off the phone. don't be afraid to tell him if that is that is the case.
Yaku-
quote:
Any input on how to do an effective phone session? Especially from those who already struggle to talk in person!!!

For me, I can never talk about anything besides surface stuff on the phone. I don’t feel safe not being able to see T’s face, and my T is more professional on the phone and he doesn’t give any of the warmth and care that he does in session. You’re T might be totally different though, and you might find that he seems more caring over the phone, I don’t know! I don’t have any real advice because I haven’t been able to make phone sessions work for me (nor have I tried, since I love talking to T face to face). Oh, and like DF said, I would ask how long you have at the beginning. My T will offer free phone sessions which we schedule for a specific time if we miss a session, and those last for about 30-35 mins, but if I just call him and need to talk he limits those calls to 15 mins max.
quote:
H was very angry at me today, because my harming has gotten worse (he saw new bruises) and he feels like I'm not doing what it takes to get better and not able to do the things that work for him

I’m concerned for you Frowner. Have you and your T discussed other coping mechanisms? Before therapy my coping mechanisms were mainly self-harm, and shoplifting. One of the first things we worked on in therapy (besides building our relationship of course) was learning new coping skills and ridding old addictions. T would suggest general ones, but I found ones that worked for me on my own. I’m so grateful for all of that because I don’t know what I would have done if we had jumped into any trauma or deeper issues without having any coping mechanisms to calm me down if I'm feeling activated or overwhelmed with everything coming up in therapy. Does T know your harming has gotten worse?

Mac
Ugh, I never thought of how long. I kind of just assumed shorter than a normal session, but longer than a brief conversation. I'm assuming pre-scheduled means he will tell me when he plans to call and for how long. He goes over pretty consistently (he always starts my session late, so I know it isn't just with me). In fact, he would have gone over last night, but I had recently expressed my guilt/shame for taking too much of his time. One time when we were really getting into some of my bad thoughts and I was feeling like I should go, he said he'd rather be there all night and know I was able to leave feeling safe. It's stuff like that which makes all this transference and attachment stuff go crazy!!!

Mac - TRIGGER for SI/etc.?
Harming never happened before I started counseling. I did struggle with suicidal thoughts as a teen and again for one year in college, but I never acted out at all. Since therapy has me feeling completely deconstructed, I've had a few episode of "testing" or "gesturing" with those impulses, and started hitting myself, some scratching, biting, burning, but mostly hitting. My previous coping mechanisms was complete self-denial and not allowing myself to feel anything I considered unhelpful. So once T got me connecting with my feelings (at least the ones in the present, because I still feel nothing about my past), I started having these weird acting out episodes, where I have thoughts and urges that don't feel like they're coming from me. Then either I do them or they pass after a while and I go back to feeling normal and feel stupid and ridiculous and don't understand why I was inclined to do it. My texting him is that way too. Anyway, yeah, T has been told it has been escalating. It's not really physically dangerous to me at this point, but it's obviously disturbing, especially to H, because he thinks if I can't control this impulse now and it gets worse, what about my more dangerous impulses. H knows I have felt "in danger" a few times, but I never told him specifically what the testing/gesturing stuff was, because he would freak out (scared, not violent or anything) and make it worse.
Yaku-
So it sounds like you’ve replaced self-denial with self-harm to cope when disturbing feelings? That’s why I was wondering if you and your T have gone over healthier alternatives. It’s kinda like you’ve replaced one unhealthy coping mechanism with another. Both self-denial and self-harm are ways of burring and punishing yourself for feelings that tough to deal with. Of course, this is just how I see it from the outside looking in, and I could be totally wrong here.

quote:
I started having these weird acting out episodes, where I have thoughts and urges that don't feel like they're coming from me.

This would be where healthy coping mechanisms would come into play. When these episodes happen you could journal, go for a walk, make a cup of tea, meditate, practice mindfulness, do an art project or anything creative- any of those, and many many other things, would be a healthy way to express these urges and feelings, instead of punishing yourself for them, or burring them down.

Mac
I don't know how to explain it, but I usually don't feel able to negotiate alternatives with myself. I feel no inclination to avoid both emotionally and physically abuse myself. It's like yelling/berating/taunting that I can't consciously shut out, although sometimes it does go away on its own (I guess usually when I'm distracted). But yes, T has made such suggestions as walking and prayer/meditation and I journal and write poetry on my own. Luckily, it doesn't seem to happen when I am fully engaged (or when others are around), so I am trying to keep busy/scheduled, more social, involved at church, etc. Unluckily, once I am alone and processing, it is usually more intense if I have been keeping too occupied (avoiding as another failed strategy I guess). Journaling is also an avoidance, because I switch to intellectualizing. Anyway, I'm hoping he gives me a more specific strategy.
Yaku,

The phonecalls are definitely different but maybe if you express that it will be awkward for you, T can help you???

Just wondering about the transference that you mentioned above and how it's taking over your life. I struggle understanding transference and sometimes am not sure if what I am experiencing now with my T is just something I really need now, and that it's not only something I didn't get in the past and wanted. Does that make sense? Like he IS for sure giving you something that you need, maybe never got from your parents, maybe don't get from your H and never even knew it was missing from your life. And, now that he's giving it to you, first of all it's frightening because you feel so out of control but it also feels so darn good because you need it right now?????? Just wondering if it is really transference or an emotional need that you have that never got met???? I guess that's what I'm trying to say. Does that make sense? Or am I totally missing it????
Hi, Yaku- sorry about my little freakout earlier. I'm fine, and I'm sorry for dropping that on you when you are having a little freakout of your own. I hope you are feeling a bit better at this moment.

I wanted to tell you about phone sessions. I had a lot of them with my T. It was very nice, very intimate, I used to get up very early because of the time difference and chat with him on the phone for one and sometimes two hours, once a month. For me the phone was very very nice, but- it was the way I started off- mind you- I had never seen my T's face. After about a year of this we moved to the video conferencing, and the first time I saw T's face was quite a strange experience, but that is for another thread. I will say that we had one more phone session after some long months of video conference, because I was having too hard a time talking and T thought the phone might be easier for me. and at *that* point, it was very, very difficult for me. I wouldn't go back to that now, unless it was for short contact in between sessions. I would rather see his face, if it's for a session. I hope this can give you some sense, or idea of what it is like. It can be easier to talk sometimes when their face isn't visible, for some people, and I suppose at the beginning that was probably crucial for me. It's quite possible that it may be for you as well, if you are having some complex stuff going on and finding it difficult to connect. I hope so much you are doing ok, and keeping yourself safe.

Again- please accept my apologies- it was no big deal. big hugs,

BB
BG - Thanks for the advice. I plan on it...but since I said, "Sounds good" with all my caveats, he hasn't texted back to set up a time. Frowner

Monte - Thanks. Yeah, I'm hoping to get feedback, but he doesn't often give it to me, because of my people-pleasing. We both have agreed I will probably try to live up to his expectations if he tells me too much information about the strategy. I don't really internalize it enough to learn from it. I just do what I think I'm supposed to. It's a real problem.

quote:
Like he IS for sure giving you something that you need, maybe never got from your parents, maybe don't get from your H and never even knew it was missing from your life. And, now that he's giving it to you, first of all it's frightening because you feel so out of control but it also feels so darn good because you need it right now?????? Just wondering if it is really transference or an emotional need that you have that never got met????


Liese - yes and no. Yes to almost everything, except I was always aware of it. I've been having transference issues since at least my early teens, wanting older male figures to care for me in a parental way. Usually teachers or mentors. But, I never let myself get close to them. With him, I got close to him and THEN the transference started and I was in it before I knew it. So, I am just wanting him to take care of me and touch base with me all the time and reassure me and be there for me constantly. It literally hurts to only see him one hour a week and my whole week in between is spent both eagerly awaiting and dreading the moment when I see him again, because I know he cannot or will not give me what I want, which is a replacement for that abandonment and a safe parent instead of an abuser/manipulator. He can't be my parent and there are invisible boundaries everywhere, but I don't know where they are. And everytime he is nice to me, it gives me this ache inside, which I objectively knows is an aching for something in the past, but it doesn't feel like it, because it honestly feels like I could give a $#!+ about not having a connection with my parents. The thing that lets me know it is transference is my whole set of projections I have where I assume he is thinking things about me that I were said by my emotionally abusive mother or that he wants to get rid of me (she used to kick me out) or will disappear suddenly (as my Dad did). So, I have a whole set of expectations that go along with seeing him as a parental figure that get constantly projected onto him and it takes all my power to deny them. I have a whole description of what I've been experiencing with him that I can send you PM if you want to know what transference is like for me right now. Just let me know.

BB - No, I am sorry. I had just read your post several minutes before and literally thought, "Make sure to post a trigger warning." I forgot. Frowner Thanks so much for your advice though. It kind of gives me an idea of what to expect.

Thanks again too all the people who replied earlier. I guess I feel like even though some pretty nasty stuff is going on, none of it has been harmful enough that I should need more support. My main concern is that I am so wrapped up in counseling, I have trouble thinking of other things and being there for other people to the degree they have come to expect (which, sure, was probably way over over-extended, but people are counting on me and I am failing!!!). But, that said, I feel like I *do* need more support. Like, if he was in my area, I would be asking if there was any way to do two sessions a week... Then, I feel like T probably thinks I am overreacting and exaggerating the problem and I just want to crawl in a hole and hide. Even when I have done testing/gesturing, I never thought those things were worthy of calling him about. I texted him, but sometimes it took days to report it, because it felt so melodramatic. I know that's not something to play around with, but I hate myself more feeling like I will be perceived as an attention-seeking manipulator than I have concern for my safety. That's lame, right? And so not cool, considering all the people who are counting on me to continue existing for the foreseeable future. Ugh, self-loathing, here we come! Mad
Yaku,

I would be open to hearing about your transference if you want to PM me about it. But only if you want to talk about it. No pressure. You are so on top of everything you are feeling and seem to know exactly where everything is coming from. It does sound like you could really benefit from going twice a week. I've never SH'd but since I started therapy, I can see why people do it. And, it's not about attention seeking at all. It's a coping mechanism. I could tell you not to be so hard on yourself but I know that wouldn't help.

((((HUGS)))))

Liese
Liese,

I will send you a PM eventually...but if I forget, please remind me. It will take a while to either write it up or look through my journal and find my entries on transference. H decided to stay home this week, and I have a feeling he'll get angry if I spend too much time journaling or going on forums instead of enjoying some time together.
quote:
H decided to stay home this week, and I have a feeling he'll get angry if I spend too much time journaling or going on forums instead of enjoying some time together.


yuck. I hate this place. H needing me and me having nothing to give him. H getting all yucky and clingy and mad at me for not giving to him. Me getting mad at H for getting mad. Me feeling unreasonable and selfish. H feeling superior and judgemental. yuck. Have you figured out a way to get past this awfulness? If you have, please, please, share it with me. I beg you.

BB
quote:
Originally posted by blackbird:
quote:
H decided to stay home this week, and I have a feeling he'll get angry if I spend too much time journaling or going on forums instead of enjoying some time together.


yuck. I hate this place. H needing me and me having nothing to give him. H getting all yucky and clingy and mad at me for not giving to him. Me getting mad at H for getting mad. Me feeling unreasonable and selfish. H feeling superior and judgemental. yuck. Have you figured out a way to get past this awfulness? If you have, please, please, share it with me. I beg you.

BB


BB,
The best way I've gotten through similar dynamics has been to distance myself and take care of my needs and not try to mend things. H needs to be the one to do the mending and only when he's ready. So in the meantime, do some things for yourself. When he sees that you value your well-being and are taking care of yourself, he will be more likely to follow suit.
BB - I have only been dealing with H being clingy for a few months...before that he happily ignored me or seemed to really have to make an effort to set aside time. So, for now, I am just trying to appreciate him wanting me, because it may go away. It's so hard right now, though. The more time we spend together, the more obvious it becomes that we're not in harmony. Part of that is my obsession with therapy. It's all I think about lately and he gets really frustrated when he can't "fix" my problems and I deny all his suggestions. But part of it is just that H, who loves me very much and really does seem to want to help, doesn't often treat me in a way that makes me feel accepted and "held" emotionally. And now T is starting to treat me in that sort of a way and it makes things with H seem inferior and unworthy of the effort I used to make...because I used to make at least 80% of the effort, and since I've scaled back, he is still learning how to do his part (also my fault there, because I robbed him of the responsibility for most of our relationship without him even realizing it). Also, as I begin to feel my emotions, how could the trauma from last year NOT distance me from him? And with my flashback intimacy experiences, how could I not recoil? So, I have no solution to offer. I am just trying to be OK that my trying is enough right now. And H seems to understand that after years of giving so much, I may need to just take care of myself for a bit (if I can even learn how to do it). And especially after this last year, where everyday together meant hating myself for not being good enough to have a solution that could heal everyone in my family...I just need the break. I just hope I don't get too attached to T in the meantime, because he is the only one who is tuned into me enough to understand (usually) what I am needing. -Yaku
Yaku,

So beautifully said. I was just wondering myself if therapy is interfering with my relationship with my H or if it is something that's necessary to go through if we're ever going to have a loving, intimate relationshp. Like you, I tended to do all the work and so my H never learned how to take care of his emotions and self-esteem. I just hope there is a light at the end of the tunnel!!!

HUGS

Liese
Yes, Liese is right- beautifully said. It will all work out in the long run. For now it's the acceptance of where we are at that's the task, and it seems like you are saying that is what you are working on. I'm sorry if my post came across unduly negative. I'm dealing with a lot of anger about my h, and it's just now starting to be something I'm seeing instead of suppressing, so I didn't mean to put my feelings onto you.

I've been thinking about bringing back an old thread about therapy and marriage, or starting a new one, just a place for people to put whatever their personal thoughts and feelings and experiences with the issue are.

hugs,

BB
BB - Nope, you weren't putting anything on me. I could only identify all that here, because I have already done so directly to T in a journal entry.


***UPDATE: TRIGGER WARNING ON PHONE SESSION STUFF***

I texted T to clarify in a less rambling manner that yes, I would like to talk on the phone. I followed suggestions to ask how long it would be, so I wouldn't feel ambushed and let him know I needed him to "play point guard" in the conversation (a term I came up with that we use sometimes). He said 50 minutes and he had things in mind to discuss. I then asked if it was OK if I didn't make it through the whole session (not that I plan to bail, but just in case I react badly). He said I have permission to bail, but didn't expect I would find it as hard as an office meeting. We set it for 9:30 or 10:00 tomorrow morning. Then he texted back that the discussion will be focusing on ways I can "dial back a bit so [I] don't have to feel so overwhelmed...(yes, [he has] been listening)." I thought it was cool that he was tuned in enough to know that him saying he had things "in mind" was freaking me out. I do hope he can help me dial back the transference stuff, but I'm thinking he just means my processing in general. I can't wait to talk to him, but I'm terrified! He's such a good T, but it doesn't seem to matter how good he is...I think I may just be too broken. I feel like I just can't do the things he has suggested to help slow things down before. Frowner We shall see. If it goes poorly, I will probably at least skip Monday if not quit. I need it to go well!
Hiya, Yaku...I'm really sorry. if you don't mind, can I explain something which I forgot, before? It's that, in no way do you have to put trigger warnings on this kind of thing, I personally don't think. You aren't discussing sensitive material or stuff that might put people in danger of quitting therapy or doing harm to themselves with the phone session stuff, and what happened was just my stuff, and the timing. I was a triggery mess when I posted that, normally I would have thought twice and not put it...at that point I should have left the board, because everything I was reading was doing that to me, so it's cool- really, and totally my responsibility to take care of myself by not reading if I'm in a state where I can't manage basic conversation. I hope we are cool? You didn't do anything wrong, it was just circumstances. But thanks for being so caring.

I hope you have a wonderful phone session with your T and that it is a peaceful time of connection. One thing that will be nice, is that you get to control the setting- you can sit where you are most comfortable, in the dark, light, in your jammies- however you want it! Smiler

Peace,

BB
Hey BB - Just trying to be sensitive. I know I don't have to, but I like taking care of others...I guess it's my thing. Big Grin

Anyway, yeah, I was hoping everyone could leave the house and I could sit in a chair or in bed in my room with a notebook and talk to him. But it sounds like H, my toddler, my sister and my infant nephew (who cries constantly) will all be home...so I am thinking I will go downstairs in our garage and sit in the truck and hope none of the other residents of our condo comes and decides to try to have a discussion with me while I am locked in my car on the phone...I can't think of anything else to do. H says go on a walk, but I will feel too exposed if I have to say sensitive/vulnerable stuff.

I can't believe how vulnerable I am being with T. I am basically laying out this connection I find to be so disgusting. I am being honest about how it's interfering with my life and how, at the same time, I don't want to give it up! I have even told him how his kindness, connecting with him and then having to leave makes me ache. Yes, I told him I ache regarding the emptiness he makes me feel. Why did I do that? I feel (emotionally) naked in front of him. And what am I expecting him to respond that will make it feel more OK, more acceptable, better? Obviously, he cannot say, "I am here to give you that parental love you deserved and didn't get." He can't say anything other than he understands and cares and wants to help me connect these feelings to the past...what if I can't find a way to make that enough for me? Frowner
aw sweetie, I feel for you. I'll be honest with you- it isn't enough. The intensity of the grief and emptiness you are feeling, is directly proportional to the amount of pain you were suffering as a child- the pain that you can no longer "remember" fully, but is nevertheless, blocking your ability to function as well as you would like to, and needs a way out. Your T is a sort of "conduit" for the pain to escape you- as I see it. I could be wrong on my understanding of this, however. And- if he is a good T, and he seems to be- then he will understand what is happening, and be there to comfort you in the loss you are now experiencing so deeply, and also teach you new ways of being in the present, that will be more effective for you. Like everybody else on this board, you are a really good person. You deserve to be happy. Finding happiness and peace, however, sometime means we must go through a lot of pain first, though.Gradually the pain will lessen, and/or you will grow stronger and much better able to manage the pain you may continue with.. Really.

BB
quote:
Are we all REALLY sure I wasn't better off just shutting all this out and just trying to be perfect all the time? Wink


I actually think this is a really good question. Ag addresses it in some of her posts. I think the basic answer from her T was, that we can't judge anybody, including ourselves, who would never go to therapy, because it is *so* difficult and painful. For me, in ways I think I was better off before, but I can't really say that for sure, because my memory can play an awful lot of tricks on me. In many ways I'm a lot better off now- and that is with a much less than ideal therapy situation. The reality, is that a lot people don't consider going to therapy and digging all this stuff up, unless they have got into a state where things can't really get that much worse. That's how it worked for me. I just can't remember the specifics anymore of *what* was so bad. I just knew that life was headed nowhere, and I felt powerless to change it on my own. Maybe it would help to write out some of your original reasons for seeking a therapist, and try to remember how you were feeling at that time?

BB
Well, it was the trauma with H that got him into therapy. And it was really T who kept insisting that there is no way I could really be "dealing" with that situation as well as I seemed to be. He wanted to see me both to help H and to make sure I was taking care of myself, I guess. After the first week, when I told him I just don't allow myself to feel things that aren't helpful, he said he wanted to see me every two weeks. Soon after, once I listened and really began identifying feelings slightly below the surface, he wanted to see me long-term, then when things got a little unsafe, every week. But it keeps getting worse! From a spiritual perspective, I was enslaved by my complete refusal to connect with anything that hurt me enough to interfere with me being the person everyone needs me to be. I was not being truthful with myself, God, friends, family. I was an island, but I was safe. Now, I am starting to connect authentically (at least with T and our current pastor/his wife). I am approaching God more authentically. But I am suffering all the time. And I am tired. Frowner
"Oh no...does that make my T a...laxative? Sorry. Red Face "

ROFLMAO!!!! Monte, I am so happy to see that you still have it...the ability to completely crack me, and everyone on this board up. FUNNY!

Yaku, I too will be sending a prayer your way this morning..I hope it goes well and brings some peace and some clarity about your situation.

hugs,

BB
OK, now that I'm on my computer and not my phone, I can give a better description of my phone session. I did end up having the session in the truck in the garage, because my sister and nephew were sleeping in my room and H (who I had been arguing with all morning) and our daughter were in our living room. Poor T is still sick, and had a hoarse voice and coughed here and there throughout the session. Frowner

T started out by telling me why he thought it was important for us to have a phone session this week. He said he really understands how overwhelmed I feel and it was important to him that we didn't leave that unattended right now. He also said he's been been hearing my cry for a sense of structure and help managing the difficult feelings that are arising as I uncover what I've buried and avoided for so long.

T suggested that we focus on two things more:
-My ways of thinking (e.g. about myself, about God, etc.).
-Structured tasks (Bible study, applied concepts).
...and one thing less:
-Slow down my journaling again (which he keeps insisting he loves and I should not stop and he really thinks I am processing so excellently all on my own, but realizes it's just too much for me without more support in place).

He stopped after this and asked for my thoughts/feedback and I expressed that my on/off switch would mean I would go completely to intellectualizing and start disconnecting from my feelings again (which he had actually already labeled as a concern I might have). He made sure to note we were not going to disconnect and he will work with me to moderate the thinking/feeling balance.

He then brought up codependency and asked if I had read about it before, which I have, but not in years. He asked (gently) if I realized I had some codependent tendencies (which I do and told him). He also discussed moving away from the manufactured self and learning about the real self. He explained how he thought I had adapted those mechanisms for survival in such a chaotic environment.

T said I have been stuck at the point where I had to become a caretaker to have a "safe" identity and survive and the process we're in now is growing me up emotionally...and that framing it in those terms might help me to understand my confusing feelings. He said we need to integrate those feelings that are stuck in the past, especially my rigid, child-like evaluations (feelings of judgment toward myself). T said for now, I need to be comforted and reassured through those feelings, until I can learn to mediate them for myself. I wish I could have asked, "And do I get to have you be the one doing that?" Wink It made me feel temporarily, slightly more OK with needing him and wanting his support so much.

Here he asked for my feedback again to see how I was tracking what he said. I let him know that I intellectually agreed, but I also was concerned at how my being more real was affecting my family. We discussed some of the problems I'm having with H and withdrawing from him, not living up to expectations I set, the judgment I feel about it and how hard I'm finding it to embrace the "real" me and find balance without disconnecting from my marriage and hating myself for failing.

We discussed the role reversal and how much of it was me going too far the other direction vs. being in imbalance for so long making it FEEL as if I wasn't doing my part. T says he sees me as a very understanding person with people in general and H especially and made me feel OK about wanting/expecting understanding from H as I struggle. This really helped me take a step back from internalizing my H's judgments and rather than feeling vindicated, like I wanted to withhold from H more, it actually made me feel more giving toward H, which was nice. H later expressed disappointment in himself for not treating me like he wants to, but he is having trouble dealing with his wife not seeming like his wife anymore...which I understand. I think he's becoming jealous of how therapy is taking residence within my life.

T said it sounds like my marriage is "typical," but as we learn give-and-take it might be a rocky transition from the manufactured "fairy tale" to normal and eventually better than average marriage. He then realized he had used "manufactured" a few times and asked if I was OK with him using that term or if it was hurtful. I told him I was OK with it, saying, "Well, it's not pretty, but it's reality." T liked that response, because it was honest that it did not feel great, but that I was willing to acknowledge it as true (especially since I have brought that concept up several times under different phrasing).

T here complimented me about how well I was following this whole discussion and the feedback I was giving him to help him know I was understanding. He said, maybe one in twenty clients has been able to track with him and converse in a way that makes him confident that they understand and are applying/relating the concepts to their own experience.

He also asked me if I studied psychology in school. I said I hadn't (because, I haven't). He was almost incredulous and said that sometimes the way I identify concepts and my experiences sounds like someone who has a degree. I let him know that I had done a little reading on my own, but mainly I assumed it was either coincidental that the way I express myself linked up with psychological concepts or I unconsciously incorporated things I was learning in therapy with him. Again, he suggested I might someday become a great therapist myself.

This guy is always insisting I'm going to publish my writing or become a T or something. I felt really complimented by that, but unworthy of such praise, so I just said that for now, "I'm just focused on becoming a human being." I could almost feel T smiling through the phone and he said something about that being great and that God was just interested in me being myself and loved me without me having to "do" or "be" anything more. I actually do want to have aspirations to write or teach or do something that could help people like being a therapist, but while I am so broken, I don't feel safe to have those kind of goals. Baby steps, I guess.

It was already 10:55 at this point (50 minutes was up). He had to ask me the time, because he was using his phone, which had the time on it. He said, "Wow, that went really fast!" in what sounded to me like a disappointed voice. I was scared he was going to just say, "Well, we'll have the save the rest for our next session." He just said, "Does it feel OK if we begin wrapping up?" I loved the way he asked this, because it shows he knows how hard ending sessions is on me and also that if I was not OK, he would prioritize me...no one has ever done that for me. I said I was OK with it, but rather than just wrapping up as I expected, he asked first if I had any questions. I asked for some clarification on the structure he was proposing and he said, "Yep, I was just about to get to that." So, he wasn't rushing me off the phone anyway. Big Grin

He reiterated that my journaling was "so good," and how helpful he thinks it is and how much he enjoys reading it. He kept saying that he does not want me to eliminate it, but he wanted to give me other tasks to mix it up, bring myself a little more into balance, so I am not processing myself into such an overwhelmed place. He suggested that if I am not already, I begin all journaling, Bible reading and assignments in prayer, admitting I am unable to handle everything on my own and asking for Him to hold me and reveal what I needed. His first assignment is to do a study on the phrase, "The Word of..." (also, "the gospel," "the message," etc.). He left it up to me how to focus. In addition, he recommended reading a book on codependency (which I think I have actually read before). He also reiterated that this was not meant to replace journaling or to be prioritized above my other roles (mother, wife, etc.) in a way that would cause me to heap judgment on myself. I admitted that I like learning and performing, so it would be a struggle not to go full throttle into it. He liked my honesty there and his reply gave me a kind of "You can do it!" feeling.

He asked how I was feeling about the session being over and I think I said, "OK, I guess," because I was having mixed feelings. He asked if there was anything else I wanted to talk about, but I said, "No, I don't want to open up anything new, since we're already past the time." I worked out some scheduling stuff really quickly (I either have Monday or Tuesday at 9:00 pm, but I don't know which yet). So, T prayed and I thanked him and he said, "God bless." And, I wasn't sure how to end, so I just said, "Bye!" And he said he'd see me in a few days. The session ended up going until 11:10 (65 minutes instead of 50).

I texted T an hour later to let him know how sincerely I appreciated how he was working with me and how talking about the marriage stuff had helped me to feel more resolved. He texted me back almost immediately, "So glad! God is good!" He's so humble; I find it endearing. Anyway, I will probably be stuck in these lovey-dovey feelings for a little while, before it hits me again, "Crap! T is going to be gone as soon as you can stand on your own feet," and then I will want to run away and hide or hate myself for putting myself in the position to need someone who is going to leave me. Anyway, sticking with therapy for now.
Yaku!!! So impressive at how you handled the phone session, especially considering how much anxiety you had wrapped around scheduling it.

It sounds like you really got some good nuggets of wisdom from the conversation, and that your T has really been listening to you.

I hope that with the new pieces of "homework" you're able to find a little more peace between sessions.

(((((Yaku)))))
Yaku, I'm so glad your phone session went so well but I had a feeling it would. You sound like you have a very good T. I'm also amazed at how clearly you remember the session. I think you were very focused on his voice and you were really connected to him.

It sounds like you did a lot of good work on the call. I think what also contributes to your therapy knowledge, aside from the reading you are doing, is coming here, reading comments and talking about things. It's surprising how much it helps and what you can pick up in hearing about other member's issues and difficulties and their successes too. Aside from that I just think you are psychologically minded and have a lot of insight into yourself. T's love that.

I know you struggle with the part about what we call "the bind"... getting well and then having to leave the person who helped you so much and to whom you have grown very close to. When I discussed this with my current T he asked me "why do you have to leave when you get well?" And I said, because therapy is over. He smiled at me and said "that is when the good stuff begins, your real growth and change, your expanding of your life, stretching your wings. Besides once we are in each other's lives, we are there always." That has really helped me to stop worrying about being sent away when I was "well". And I believe him because he walks the walk...

I hope you are keeping that warm, good feeling wrapped around you until you see him again next week.

TN
Thanks for all the support, you guys!

Well, I think it is a combination of me having an audial memory (when I don't dissociate and blank out on what T is saying) and that I was taking notes to help stay connected, because I was so nervous being on the phone with him.


I definitely have gotten a lot of knowledge in my short time here, but many of the terms that or linkages that he identified were just things that popped in my head months ago or I have thought about for years on my own (e.g. containment, grounding, projection, annihilation, etc.). This site really helped me identify transference, for sure, which I had been describing to him for months without being able to get it across. Every time I go in now, T has my transference "map" on the top of all his paperwork and the journal entries I've sent him. He says how much he loves it any time it comes up. I just now realized we can call it an attunement map, because T now seems to be avoiding negative triggers, addressing projections more quickly, and hitting all the positive ones that make me feel cared for. I asked about getting it back (so I can destroy it, because it embarrasses me to be so revealed). He said I can, of course, have it back, but sounded disappointed. I guess it's like I've given him the key to the city (within me) and then said, "Nevermind, you're not worthy of that honor." Perhaps I will let him keep it...

I am pretty sure H wants me to "get better and stop going." I wonder if he'll ever change his view on that. I want to keep T forever right now!

I'm doing OK, but did have some weird annihilation stuff come up over some of his integration talk. I think those child-like, helpless parts are scared about what will happen to them. And I'm scared coming together means losing a unique way of being that makes me myself...like I will somehow become less through addition, and the best, most innocent, creative, unconditionally loving parts will disappear or be corrupted, damaged, subjugated or defiled. Still not really able to make sense of these feelings without help. Already had so much contact with T today, so I'm too ashamed to contact him about how anxious it's making me. Frowner Maybe tomorrow.

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