MTF,
I have definitely experienced that, although I'm not sure that my reasons will be true for you. I've only really understood this through working through it. Looking back in my life, the people with whom I've formed attachments have been the ones who have held out some hope of finally getting those childhood needs met. But the first time I tried to get those needs met and moved closer to the person who was supposed to need them, I never knew what I was going to get and sometimes my boundaries were completely overrun and I was violated. I had to dissassociate so I could hang onto the "good" part and forget the "bad" part so that I could manage to go back again. So on a very deep level I learned that moving closer to someone who was important to me, ESPECIALLY if they had authority (i.e, power) over me, feels very dangerous. So moving closer is scary, being around them is scary. There's also the fear I would feel when i started to hope, because to hope meant I had something to lose and on some level I really believed I would lose it. So even the thought of getting my needs met, which is the promise held out by an attachment figure, was scary.

And during the course of therapy, I actually came to realize that I was scared ALL the time, pretty much about everything. I was really only noticing when it got acute as it had become a background. It was actually a little scary to not be scared anymore.

AG

Hi AG. Good to see you!

Your reasons for feeling that way make complete sense. I guess I haven't looked deep enough into my past yet to really understand what happened to me, as I have a hard time seeing what my parents did or didn't do as 'abuse'. It was more neglect and emotional unavailability from both of them, and I was called names, shamed, expected to be perfect, etc. I too have formed these attachments with people that I thought could meet childhood needs, although I didn't see it that way until I started therapy.

I'm glad to hear that you aren't scared anymore. It gives me hope that I can get there, too! Thanks for the response!

MTF

I think for me the fear lies in that once I become attached to someone, it puts me at great risk for being abandoned, hurt, having my heart ripped out, etc. If I don't attach, it doesn't hurt as bad when someone turns their back on me. But if its someone I've allowed myself to connect with, I have to relive the pains of abandonment that I have felt repeatedly throughout my life. By taking that risk to open up to someone, I am giving them the power to break me in two.

Yes- I can relate to LadyGrey.
also my fear comes from angry people. In fact this is what I am working on now with T. (How do I protecte myself from angry people?) even though I can figure out some of the sources- this just does not seem to be enough.
Also I fear when people are too nice to me. I fear others motives, IDK why, yet.
Good topic- thanks.

I am absolutely in total terror in therapy. I am insanely afraid of a person who I know rationally is not a threat to me. I actually tremble and my teeth chatter

I don't think I could say it any better than AG said, as that is almost my exact experience.

In my case, I'm still heavily dissociated from any sense that my attachment feelings have anything to do with either of my parents. I feel no sense (and have no memory) of having ever wanted to be close to my mother, period. I was very fond of my father, but once he told me I was not welcome to live with him (10-years-old, because my new step-mother was "done raising kids"), I pretty much became the same way with him. I wanted to please them in a, "Please don't take notice of me and abuse me," sort of way, but that was it. Any time I get positive transference feelings (mostly teachers, a boss and now T), it is usually about the abandonment stuff with my dad. So even though I get extremely attached, I am constantly panicking that my neediness will lead to rejection. In mom-transference, I fear that getting noticed will lead to outright abuse or invasion. So, I just kind of freeze, stuck there in my desperate feelings. I am often paralyzed with desperation and fear in T's presence. And the safer he makes me feel, the more kindness he extends, the more terrified I seem to become...yet comforted at the same time. It is very confusing.

Hi MTF,

I frequently feel fear in session, although I'm not sure if that's an attachment-related fear for my T or coming up from something else. I don't feel fear in other relationships, but I really think that's because I've never let myself be so open with someone. So the fear that stems from vulnerability is fairly new to me.

Last week, I did have something unexpected happen. I was feeling scared (again, I think that is some dissociated feeling or something) and then I had this image of my T with an angry face, standing up and towering over me, like she was getting ready to punish me. That definitely cued more fear, and I ended up being scared of HER for the rest of the session even though I cognitively and rationally knew that she was anything but dangerous.

Let us know how the assignment goes, MTF. It's definitely tough, but I think it will be really valuable. (((MTF)))

I had that too, once Kashley, and the next session I asked him why he growled at me the week before. He was speechless. Sometimes misperceptions seem so real when we are triggered.

MTF –

quote:

I felt fearful or frozen when I was in their presence, at least for the first little while, then settled down a bit the longer I was in their presence.

I can really relate to this. I always feel baffled why I get nervous in the beginning, and then it fades… perhaps for me it is because they show that they are going to be at least a little safe…

What a tough but good assignment your T has asked you to do. It is really interesting. I’m not sure how I’d answer it for myself.

Great thread MTF... very thought provoking.

quote:

I think for me the fear lies in that once I become attached to someone, it puts me at great risk for being abandoned, hurt, having my heart ripped out, etc. If I don't attach, it doesn't hurt as bad when someone turns their back on me. But if its someone I've allowed myself to connect with, I have to relive the pains of abandonment that I have felt repeatedly throughout my life. By taking that risk to open up to someone, I am giving them the power to break me in two.

LG, I feel exactly like you do. I have had my heart ripped to shreds before from so-called attachment figures that I was supposed to rely on. Now it takes a lot for me to allow myself to attach. Four months in, I still am testing my T on a regular basis.

Ugh. I have a session tomorrow and my T has asked me to come prepared to tell her where she fits in my attachment issues 'picture'. I have NO IDEA what to say to her and have been avoiding thoughts of my session and how I feel about my T. Medication has helped my obsession with my T, but it's almost turned my mind off to thoughts about her completely.

I sat on my bed the other day and tried to think about all my attachments in the past and the current one with my T and I just started bawling uncontrollably. I know that what I want from her is the same thing I've wanted from previous AFs. Unconditional love, being accepted for who I AM, not what I can be, do, or give. I know the real issue is that I need to love myself as well as to accept God's love for me...I just don't know how.

So I don't know what to tell my T. I'm embarrassed that I'm even in this place to begin with. I have lists of attributes or characteristics and such that drew me into these attachments for each of the 4 people I picked to focus on (my T being one of them), but we never got to my list about her last time. I didn't/don't want to list her positive attributes off to her because in the past she's reacted negatively, at least that's how I have viewed her reactions. I think I'm scared that I'm just going to get the same sort of thing from her and walk away hurt and angry again. I keep waiting for the bomb to go off that tells me loud and clear that I need a new T. And maybe I'm just being a huge pessimist.

T told me last session that she wants me to be able to get to the point where I can enter into a relationship with someone that triggers my attachment issues and be able to set up boundaries for myself and maybe even for them so that I don't get into the same sort of painful relationships I have. She says I think the other person has a puzzle piece that is what I need in order to be whole but that I am whole already and someone else's 'piece' doesn't fit in my puzzle because it's their piece, not mine. I want to know everything I can about them because I think if I can just find that missing piece (be like them, have what they have, etc.) I'll be okay. I sometimes feel like she's right on the money, but other times I feel like something's missing. I'm getting tired of trying to figure this stuff out.

MTF

Hi Monte,

Thanks for the response. I didn't see it until today after my session. You pretty much summed up what we talked about in session. I too think my T might be more of the type that is good at helping people 'move on' rather than face the past. I don't know.

Today she wanted me to tell her what was different and also what was the same about her and my Physical Therapist, as he was the previous recipient of my attachment issues. I froze up, as I knew I would. I had typed up something to read, but couldn't do that, either. I just told her that I don't want to go there, I fight it. It's like there's a wall in my mind that I have put up around the feelings I have for my T. I feel so much fear about talking to her about my feelings for her and about the attachment in general. I feel childish, foolish, stupid.

I was able to tell her some of what I understand about what this attachment stems from. I know it's partly because my mother was emotionally unavailable to me, not the 'ideal' mother I needed, and that I'm still looking for that female ideal. She was pleased with my insight. She has a few other clients that she's working with right now that also have attachment issues, so she's trying hard to understand what makes me tick, as opposed to her other clients, as the dynamics with each of us is different. I'm feeling a little more open with her and am able to articulate things a little better now. I think it helped me to face the reality that I am not 'special' to my T.

I also think that is a huge part of the pain I am dealing with right now. Even my T noticed that I was down today. She asked if I had been crying a lot lately. I told her I had this past week due to the assignment she gave me, so of course she wanted to know what about it was so hard. I told her that it's hard to face reality...to understand why I feel like I do...to understand where this comes from and what I was deprived of as a child. It hurts, and I guess I am grieving both that pain and the pain of realizing that no one can fill the hole, no one can take away the emptiness. My T can't 'fix' me and make me whole. No one can.

She talked about how I can get my needs met through others. That instead of putting all my hopes for my needs being met into one person, I need to look at what my needs are (which I am very out of touch with) and then look at the people in my life and see who can meet each individual need. She always talks about 32 spokes of a wheel being like life. We need many people to support us so that if one or two or three aren't available, there are others there to support us so we don't collapse or aren't negatively affected like we would be if we only had a few 'spokes' on our wheel. I'm at the too-few-spokes stage and need to build up my support network. That is a toughie for me.

So my next assignment is to figure out what my needs are. She said she wants me to make my lists, as if she is anticipating that I have A LOT of needs. That is actually going to be a difficult assignment for me because I have always focused on others' needs, rather than being aware of my own and getting them met. It should prove interesting.

Anyway, I'm down tonight and needing some sleep. I miss my T a lot already. I know it's the lack of emotional connection in my life that makes me miss her, but knowing it doesn't make it go away. I've had a headache since my session, as I went into it in a completely fearful state and was so activated that I think my energy has been depleted. Tomorrow will not be a very productive Saturday.

Thanks for your insights and for always responding. I'm glad things are going well for you!

Hugs,
MTF

Hi MTF... my heart hurts for the pain you are in and the dilemma you find yourself in with your therapy.

I think that Monte had a wonderful explanation of what is happening with you and I could not add more to it. That missing piece is what we should have had in our childhoods when we were SUPPOSED to be the center of attention and when everything should have been about us and our needs. But we didn't get that and while our Ts can help with some of it in an "approximate" way... it is not the same and it can never be the same because we are not children any more.

This is where and what we grieve. This is the hard sucky part. But I do think it helps to have a T who is okay with some dependency and attachment within the relationship because we won't need that forever. Just until we can pass through those developmental stages that went awry for us as children.

I'm so sorry you did not have a connecting session with your T and you are feeling so down now. May I suggest something... I think you could not tell her those things nor even read them to her because you felt inside that she would not understand and not have the reaction you need her to have and so you didn't tell her. The problem MTF is NOT with you but with your T. If you cannot feel secure in sharing that part of you... that very important part and you are holding back on it... then there is a problem and it's not with you but with her.

It's late and I'm beat too from a hard week but I want to send you hugs and support and hope you can find some calm space to settle into until your next session.

Hugs
TN

quote:

I think your T is absolutely right in suggesting that we cannot find 'wholeness' in other people...we can't, can we?

Monte- this is wise. Some people find the missing piece in God. Some say- the missing piece is the reason for their spiritual seeking, their spiritual journey.

Many HUGS to you - (((((((((((((((MTF))))))))))))))

ps- i just found this-

" May you experience the Love of Christ, though it is too great to understand fully. Then you will be made complete (whole) with all the fullness of life and power that comes from God."

"Your roots will grow down into God's love and keep you strong, and may you have the power to understand how wide, how long, how high, and how depp his love is."

Not preaching- just saying.