(((GREENEYES)))

quote:

gets so angry because nobody does and she blames herself for that.

Nobody does? Or nobody did?

quote:

it really would not have made much difference to anyone had I lived or died.

If this is about some defect in you, then you must believe it about other people as well, that some people aren't worth giving a damn about. That they are castabouts or throwaways. You couldn't be the only one in the world with some kind of defect that would render you unworthy. It would be statistically impossible.

None of us asked to be born yet here we all are. We are all facing the same struggle, survival. Aren't we all human beings who are entitled to the same things? The same security, the same basic rights? To be treated with humanity?

There could be another explanation. That the people that raised you didn't have the capacity to see your strengths. That they felt so awful, so rotten about themselves. They hadn't separated or individuated enough or at all so that they couldn't see you WEREN'T an extension of them and just treated you as an extension of them.

GE, I have a small "understanding" I think of what you are going through.

She didn't do anything wrong. She deserved to be loved and cherished and it's tragic that she wasn't. Just think of what you'd tell me or anyone else - you'd have compassion for that little girl just like I do for yours. Be gentle with yourself. xx

Thank you for all your supportive and caring replies

TW: abuse, death and other horrible stuff!

Cat: i went through chronic CSA for 8 or 9 years. my parents weren't alcoholic, but they drank a lot, they were highly narcissistic and they smoked a lot of dope. they were abusive and neglectful. My mother died when I was in my mid teens and my dad when I was in my mid 20s. I have a sadistic older brother who hates me and my aunts/uncles abandoned me when my mum died.

I appreciate your lovely comments about my good qualities. While my caregivers are largely to blame for their appalling conduct, its still a devastating loss that cuts very, very deep. It doesn't matter who is at fault when you've lost so much.

Liese - both nobody does and nobody did. My husband finds my need for nurturing and protection very difficult sometimes. My T can accept and hear these parts but can't be a parent. Which leaves me feeling like if I was worthy enough or mattered enough it would be different. My hubby would protect and care for me when needed and I could live under my T's desk when I needed to.

This sad realisation came to me after spending time with my son. He is nearly 13 months and he is breathtakingly beautiful in every way. I would want to DIE if he died or was seriously ill/injured etc because he is sooo precious to me. We are all entitled to the same security and basic rights. Unfortunately not all of us are treated that way. Your description about my parents is pretty spot on.

Scars - hugs and thanks for understanding

Kashley - i find it soooo easy to have compassion for other people's abuse but struggle to extend that to myself. because I still blame myself at some level

((((GREENEYES))))

That sounds really hard. I'm sorry your H isn't more nurturing. I wish you had those safe places to go to when things get overwhelming. We all need that.

((((GREENEYES)))

It took me a long time to really believe that the problems were with my parents and not with me. I was so conditioned to believing that there was some inherent defect within me. The battle still isn't over.

I'm sorry about all of your losses and the general lack of support in your life, then and now.

(((GREENEYES)))

Sometimes I think we need someone to carry us emotionally for a while. Can you talk to your T about how alone you feel?

Liese i've spoken extensively to T over how alone I feel and sometimes that makes things worse because inevitably sessions must end, there are weekends and holidays, and its a therapeutic relationship. I get into the "if you really understood you wouldn't make me leave and you'd let me stay here" etc etc.

I've had a really awful 24hrs due to H being self-absorbed and a bit nasty and my mother in law driving me to a new level of insanity!

(((GreenEyes))) Just sending hugs. I know what it's like to have hurting little ones inside that can't understand not being helped and cared for like they needed.

((((GREENEYES))))

How often do you see your T? Do you have out of session contact? Maybe you need more contact than you have now?

I used to get a terrible pain in my chest when I left my T. It was the pain of separation. Adding a second session really helped a lot and for a while I had to call about once a week to talk to him on the phone. It turned out I was having contact three times a week but it helped a lot!!

Liese I'm almost embarrassed to say I have 5 sessions per week (its intense psychoanalytic therapy). text phone and email in between just don't cut it for me. I saw my T this morning and could easily have another session this arvo. Yeah there are time I feel like I'm being torn apart internally when I leave my sessions. The pain of separation can be excruciating

(((GREENEYES)))

There goes that theory.

Yep
liese

Hey GreenEyes,

I'm just playing devil's advocate here...but could the high frequency of your sessions be a factor in your pain? You see your T so often that it seems like having him be a parent figure is just within reach, and it seems so close that it makes it all the more excruciatingly painful that he can't be that figure in your life. Could that be a possibility? I actually wonder if, in the long run, it might be more beneficial to actually cut down on sessions so that that painful truth isn't so salient to you (at least for a while). Granted, I know how painful that would be...and I know that's probably not a possibility, and I really, REALLY hope I haven't said anything out of turn. I don't want to minimize your pain at all. It's a horrible, horrible pain that you should never have to experience, and I'm sorry you are.

Hey kash,
No, you raise some valid points.
As I get better and more stable and happier for longer stretches, I will be able to cut down. When DH is off with the man fairies, I have no support outside of therapy so cutting back at the moment isn't an option
hugs to you xx

So I am in a real pickle ATM.

I'm stuck in the hole of cruel, raw, endless despair. I know I can't stop living because my son and husband need me. But I can't help sensing that I've lived my life for others with little thought for what I want. And what I want is for the little one inside to be safe, loved and special. I actually want to be infantilised and cared for. But nobody loves that part of me the way she needs to be, the way that would be healing and soothing. And because of that I literally want to excise that part of me so I stop feeling so miserable and tortured.

I'm also wondering if I'm going through an existential crisis. Apparently that, along with having a deep, complicated and highly intense emotional and intellectual life is common in those with higher IQs (mine is in the high 130s).

Gosh sticking my head in a blender is so appealing right now!

Hi GE
Wanted to share a book I have found massively helpful called Against Depression by
Peter D Kramer.
In it he debunks the myth that depression is somehow noble and creative and that
great things come from suffering through it. He highlights all the latest neuro
studies that now identify actual changes and damage in the brain caused by depression.
He says depression is a disease that must be treated aggressively like any other
illness. He is in favour of medication if required. I don't know your circumstances
or if you identify as depressed or if you are already on medication, but I'm
wondering if you need some or need dosage adjusted to enable you to tolerate
the therapy work you are doing?
I'm in no way suggesting that you stop therapy and just take medication but
when we are stuck in a suicidal place and in utter despair it surely seems
worth trying medication to ease the symptoms. Depression is a disease, visible
differences in the brain of those who have it or have had it are now able to be
clearly seen in MRI scans. There is nothing to gain through suffering and maybe if
you can get some relief from the pain you are in, maybe you could begin to love
and care and protect little GreenEyes rather than being stuck in the grief, anger
and loss that you are currently in?
I have been dealing with the same stuff in my therapy...I felt sick at the idea
of me loving little me. Just wanted to cut that hateful, hated, weak, needy, disgusting
inner child out of me. I have struggled with this a lot.
I've been depressed yet functioning for so long I didn't realise it wasn't normal
to feel like I did day in day out. I have been on anti-depressants for nearly 2
years and the dose was increased when I once again became suicidal in the autumn.
I perked up a bit and was no longer actively suicidal yet I still wasn't as good
as I could've been. Last week my psychiatrist put me on quetiapine which is an
Anti-psychotic that is also used to turbo charge the effects of an anti-depressant.
I have to say it has been life changing for me. I no longer drag myself out of bed,
Drag through the day, and drag myself back to bed. I am able to be much more
"present" with my two boys and best of all I have stopped feeling so appalled
at the idea of me loving little me and the desire to excise that part of me
has completely gone. I can say for the first time in years that I am not living
with the idea of suicide as my escape from the crap that has been my life so
far. I can actually look to a brighter future and experience happiness in the
present moment. That is so healing for me. I have done alot of grieving in therapy
for what I didn't get when I was a child but the depth and intensity of that
loss is greatly reduced.
I'm possibly just rambling at you now...I just wanted to say that there is hope
that things will change for you. You can get through this. Nothing stays the same
forever and if you need medication to help you deal with the pain of therapy,
there is no shame in taking it! You are doing intense, good work in therapy, be kind
to yourself and go gently.

(((Hugs)))

Searching
P.s. the first week on the new meds was awful with side affects but I am
rreally noticing the benefits now!

I remember when I first started therapy I struggled to accept that little girl part of. I talked about her as a separate being. I used to tell my T the little girl is sitting in the corner of the room. After one really hard session I told my T I wanted to leave the little girl with her until I came back for my next session. T told me I could leave the little girl with her, I left the session feeling like a big weight had been lifted and I really felt like I'd left her there with T.

It took me years to accept the little girl was part of me but now I'm able to give her a voice in therapy and give her some compassion

Luc

((((LUCINA))))

What a beautiful story.

((((GREENEYES))))

What if your T said, "I'm here for you. Call me (or text me) anytime you need me. I'll be here for you for as long as I can be. You never have to quit therapy"? "You ARE important to me." "I DO care about you." And then what if your T did things within the boundaries of the relationship that proved he cared? Would that make a difference to you in terms of you are feeling? This "you've got to grieve" stuff just isn't working for you. It's making you feel hopeless. You need hope right now and a reason to live.

It just seems like that little girl isn't going to focus on anything else until she feels secure and I wouldn't blame her if she got pissed off and gave up.

Thank you so much for your thoughtful and supportive comments.

Searching - I completely agree that depression is a serious illness that requires proper assessment and treatment. And yes I guess my primary diagnosis is severe depression. I tried Lexapro for a few days but had horrible side effects, worse than the depression itself. I made the decision to heal without drugs, apart from taking samE during therapy breaks to help me cope. I'm so glad for you that medication has helped you to live a happier and more present life. I am sorry you know what I'm going through as well

Cat - I have some compassion for my little one, it just seems the love and support I have given her past and present have never been enough. The shame of having needs and what your little one can propel you into doing is something I can very much empathise with

Luc that's a gorgeous story. maybe I will ask my T if my little one can stay with him.

Liese - my T has pretty much said all of that. I know he'd move heaven and earth within the boundaries to help me. But there are times I need his help and he's not there for me and for the child part of me, that generates so much shame and rage that it takes over my entire mental space and I end up in a state of complete despair that seems endless. I am living for my husband and son, and one day I hope I will be living for myself as well.

There is definitely an aspect of remembered helplessness and hopelessnes that is linked to existential despair that has haunted me my whole life. But the present is also complicated by the fact that my husband can be very self absorbed, contemptuous and nasty when he's stressed (as was the case through the end of last week). So in a way when he's like that its like the past has come to life again. Beyond him I have no support; both of my parents have died, my brother is a sadist who I refuse to relate to and the rest of my family have abandoned me. DH's parents are divorced and pretty self absorbed. I have good friends but they have their own lives and kids. So I feel very, very much alone when DH checks out into male fairyland. And that in itself is triggering because its how I spent my whole childhood and adolescence feeling - completely bereft and abandoned.

(((GREENEYES))))

So great to hear that your T gives you so much security. I'd screw the grieving for now. It sounds like you are not ready for it yet. Of course, that's just my opinion.

quote:

So I feel very, very much alone when DH checks out into male fairyland. And that in itself is triggering because its how I spent my whole childhood and adolescence feeling - completely bereft and abandoned.

I had been thinking that existential crisis are linked to disruption of attachment and found this article:

attachment and existential concerns

Hope this week is better for you.

Thanks Liese look forward to reading it soon

Liese-- you always find the coolest things to read. I'm going to have a look at that article soon, too.

Thanks Liese it was a great article and really reinforced some of the thing my T was saying to me this morning xx