Hi Helle,

How frustrating! Your T certainly seems to be giving you a mixed message by inviting you to text him, and then turning you down every time. You even tried to clear it up by saying you had stopped because there was no response on his end - kind of giving him a way out in case he didn't really mean it - and instead he reinforced it, but then continues to be unavailable.

I would be hurt and angry about this too. He is holding out the promise of giving you something more than therapy, but then not following through. At best, he seems to be unaware of the significance we put on what our T's say and do, and what they offer.

I know you probably don't feel like talking to him right now, but I think the only way to work this out is to talk honestly to him about how it is impacting you. If it were me, I wouldn't want to do that directly because then maybe he would withdraw the offer altogether...and part of me would want to hang on to the hope that someday he might say yes. But then, eventually the pain of that hope being consistently let down might make me willing to let go of the hope so I could stop being hurt and frustrated.

And then I'd be worried about how the whole situation would affect the therapeutic relationship. I'm so sorry you are in this position, Helle...there seems to be no easy answer.

(((((Helle)))))

SG

(((Helle))) I'm really sorry you are so upset and I would feel the same way. But I think you really need to talk to him about this honestly and tell him how he is making you feel. We have struggled in childhood with not getting our needs met and finally we go to therapy which is a place where we can ask for what we need and within reason have our needs me or at least knowing that what we discuss is all about us and not our Ts and what they want and need. What he is doing is frustrating you just like when you couldn't get what you needed as a child. It is sort of reinforcing the old patterns we are trying to break. Therapy is the place were we see that things can be different than they were when we were kids and having our needs negated or refused. I think he does not realize the significant role he plays in your life and needs to be more aware of what he represents to you. This is where I can see that boundaries are really important. They protect you from being hurt. And while the promise of skiing or doing anything outside of therapy with our Ts (to whom we are very attached) seems enticing and wonderful, in the end I think it creates more problems than it solves. And I'm sorry you are the one paying the price for his lack of boundaries where this is concerned.

I hope you can tell him how this is making you feel... if you can't say it then write it down and read it or email it to him. He needs to know about this for your sake. And your anger at him right now is not misplaced at all. He is not behaving in your best interest.

Keep talking to us here and let us know how you are doing with this.

TN

Thank you- to all of you, for your wonderful support. And yes, after getting his response, I wanted to respond to him, but with all of the 4 letter words- I doubt that he would have appreciated it.
With what follows, I might be giving my T too much credit (I will see him on Monday to check this out) but is it possible that he was pushing me to do some work that I had no idea of? He triggered such a strong response. Do Ts do this stuff on purpose to draw something out? Are Ts that smart? Do they see things in us that we need to work on and set the stage for it to happen.I truly do not know.
The following is a letter I began writing to him at about 3:30 this morning. It is my response- insight as to why I was so triggered by his lack of response.
Here it is- i am curious as to what all of you think about this.

March 3, 2010 (3:50 AM)
Dear PSYD,
This is what I am learning from the “I hate you” experience this week:
Firstly (if that truly is a word) – of course it is not really about you, Mark. You are just the trigger. Here is the story, the hurt the disappointment – all of it, but before I begin, I need to add that this takes guts to admit. I never felt that I had the right to say something like this before. I don’t know where that comes from, though. I guess I still want to protect them- you know, so they don’t look like awful parents. And they weren’t.
I guess a lot of shit happened when I was very young because this too was a very early memory- perhaps 4 or 5.
My father and mother-before kids- had a life, and one of the things they liked to do was to go deep-sea fishing out on a head boat, specifically –the Norma Kay out of Point, or another special boat out of Belmar. Someone told me stories of what it was like. I don’t remember whom, though. (I think at this point in my life, I hadn’t ever seen the ocean) Gretchen, Peter and I used to bite our nails and my dad used to make a big deal- an incentive, I guess, about growing fishing nails. That meant if we did not bite our nails- he would take us fishing early on a Saturday morning. Fishing was a big deal, so often the three of us would compare our nails to see who had the best chance of going. There were other behavior contingencies as well, but I don’t remember what they were. (Oh- cleaning our room was one) Gretchen almost always won. I don’t know why he always picked her to go, but we would wake up in the morning and Gretchen and my father would be gone. I thought one of the tricks was to stay awake until 3:30- 4AM until it was time to leave so I tried hard to do that, but I never could. I thought that staying awake was a key ingredient to making that dream happen. I remember waking up in the morning only to find my father and my sister gone. There was never any explanation, any reasons given, or any discussion about it. This was just the way it was.
I remember once, my mom telling me before I went to bed that she thought I was going fishing this time, so I slept in my clothes. My mom came to wake me in the early morning hour, but my leg was hurting so badly that I couldn’t walk, (funny- I never remembered this part until now- So I do have to add that maybe this is not real) so of course I couldn’t go. I never saw my father that night, but I did hear him leaving with my sister. I never seemed to get it right, I never figured out the formula to get my dad to care about me- to pick me.
You know- maybe this stuff or something similar has been lurking in my subconscious because I am reminded of the dream- the frustrating dream where by I was supposed to remember a code and punch it into a large machine with numbers, but every time I tried- the numbers would change, so I could never figure this stuff out. I can never figure out the formula to make things work. The thought just came to me- am I trying to be a controlling person, or am I a person just trying to gain some control over stuff- gain some perspective on my life? Food for thought
I did get to go with him once- (I am guessing about the age of 8) He took all three of us.
I hate it that the lines get blurred or the wires get crossed- or whatever it is that makes me not able to see you as you are, Mark the therapist- and only that. (I don’t mean that in a bad way- but more like in a way it should be) I guess the transference has been about you being my Dad, so let’s not talk about skiing/snow boarding any more.
Hele
PS This surely is very hard work sometimes.

I need to clarify- when I was very young, actually for most of my childhood (on and off I had a disease that manifested itself as joint pain in my legs mostly- rheumatic fever) So this interphered with my life and relationships.
This thing with my T triggered the feelings of rejection from my father.

quote:

then maybe he would withdraw the offer altogether...and part of me would want to hang on to the hope that someday he might say yes.
thanks SG I feel this too.
[QUOTE]I feel like you're just toying with me by even suggesting it's a possibility and then not following through."

I did say this to him- his response was- no I am serious-I want to get out on the Mountain.In fact it was just 3wks ago that I said this. thanks
You are so right TN when you say-

quote:

What he is doing is frustrating you just like when you couldn't get what you needed as a child"

That is exactly what I was thinking. That is why I became furious- but didn't know it at the time.

quote:

If it’s going to ‘work’, the communication has to be so clear, because their impact on us can be huge and even the smallest gesture can be so precious to us and it gets scrutinized by us…and even blown out of proportion once it enters the fantasy chamber in our brain.

Yea Monte- I could not agree more, and he does enter that fantasy chamber from time to time.
You guys are so wonderfully helpful and supportive. If I had not been down this road with him once before, I would fire him in a heart beat, but I have to find out wtf is going on, and the insights have been incredible.
I don't know if this makes sense or not.

Oh my God, How could you father do this? That's absolutely awful!
I think the dream matches perfectly with the experience with your dad and now with your therapist. You have to tell all this to your therapist. He has to see what the hell is he doing!
The machine where you punch the numbers... I suppose that's the mobile phone you use to text your T about promised skiing...

You are saying that you confronted him about going to the mountain and he confirmed that this was serious and he really would like to go skiing with you? Is he supposed to make an offer like this? I think it would be better if he drew the boundary firmly. There are things that we didn't get from our parents and that can't be undone. Corrective emotional experience... but doing something together outside the session is more then emotional experience. I imagine that would be wonderful, but... I don't know. I know if my T offered something maybe it probably would be impossible for me to decline it.

Thanks Amazon- I am really quite surprised that you stuck it out and read the entire thing.
Yea- I do have much to talk to my T about. I will see him on Monday.
I find it so weird how all these things seem to fit together- maybe it is just in my crazy mind. I will mention the ski/snowboard thing again, and ask him why he says one thing in session, and another out of session.
Thank you for your support. I will let you know how it goes.

helle, I loved your story. It's difficult and painful, but it's beautiful as well. I think it really gives good sense of your emotions. I think your T should read it.

Thanks-
He did read it. In fact, I read it to him. He was actually a bit sad about the ending. He was serious, but he knows that it crosses boundries for most professionals and in most situations. However he is a Rogerian through and through and studies have shown that for some, having a friendship outside of therapy is not only possible, but ok. Clearly he knows now by my freak out letter that I was not ready and he is so humble that he really does not have a clue about the impact he has on his clients. (that - of course makes him more dear to me) I reminded him of that, and he said- Oh- I do forget that sometimes.
So it looks like no skiing with T - at least this year.

Please don't take this as gloating, but more like a HAPPY ME guess who I skied with today?

Today- LIFE IS GOOD!

You are right- It was the Pope. =)