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I know I have not been around much and it's been mostly hit or miss with my replies. I'm sorry for that as I've been going through some bad stuff lately... yeah still with regard to oldT.

Without going into detail I'm still trying to get my clinical records from him. He's making things difficult and letters are going back and forth for the past few months and still no resolution. I am also asking for a face to face meeting. I feel I need to do this and my current T supports me (albeit a bit reluctantly... because he does not want oldT to hurt me again).

Over the past few days I had to go back to certain places that brought back a lot of what happened last summer. I had to face down the fear of going back to a traumatic place and had to battle the grief again. I've also been feeling really tired. I still wake up each morning with the shakes trying to pull myself together to face the day of work and family and school etc.

I saw my T today and just something about finally being there and being with him just released all the sadness and grief that I was squashing down all weekend and I spent most of my time there crying about stuff that relates to oldT. He was wonderful as usual and very caring and understanding. Very "there" with me.

When I got there he noticed and commented on my pendant. He asked if he could look at it which means we sort of had to get closer LOL... and that gave me some anxiety. Not sure why. So I told him that I'm still not used to the idea that he "sees" me. He kinda chuckled and asked why wouldn't he see me? I said that I didn't think oldT ever saw me. In 3 years he made a comment to me 3 times about something I was wearing. My T then told me he likes my jewelry and sometimes it's something playful, just like he sees that as part of me, my personality, and he likes that. He said that I always look well put together and my hair is always perfect LOL. He said, it always looks good even if it's raining out or windy. I laughed and said "well you have never seen me in the morning" and then I thought "ooh did I say that?" and he chuckled and said... well, yeah, that is true..."

I told him I was tired and wanted to just take a nap on his couch. He said it's a very comfy couch and he has taken naps there on occassion on snow days when people have cancelled. Then I told him how I had to go back to a place that was scary and had really hard memories for me on Sunday and we talked about this. It was a place where I had a very happy, lovely encounter with old T and then months later turned into a place where my son last saw him, where he promised my son he would see him again very soon and then terminated him and never saw him again.

My T talked about how my oldT's inconsistencies really hurt me. He was also good at sending me mixed messages and confusing me. He was afraid of his own feelings towards me and of mine towards him. He didn't understand though why oldT would be afraid of my feelings since I seem to be able to contain them very well. I'm never out of control in any way and am very reasonable.

I talked to him about something really scary and difficult for me. I told him how I have been punished at work for going through that period last summer when I could not function. My boss was really pissed at me for not performing up to my usually super-efficient level and had talked to the manager about cutting my salary. I really didn't think he would go through with it, and I have also been able to improve my efficieny and my mood since finding my current T. Well, on Friday, we got paid and it was plainly evident that he followed through and I got a ten percent salary cut which really really hurts me. I tried SO hard to do my job last summer through all the trauma and pain and grief I was struggling with. I didn't take much time off except for my surgery and the other hospitalization for the complications. The problem was that they found me sometimes crying at my desk and I sometimes took longer at lunchtime because when I was trying to find a new T I would be so prostrate with grief I would sit in my car and cry for an hour before I could come back to work. And then of course I as only able to do the more routine stuff. Anything really complicated (I work in financial services) was totally beyond what my brain was capable of. And now I have hurt my family. They are going to suffer because of what I allowed to happen to me. That I allowed oldT to matter enough to hurt me and us like this and I have not told my dh that my pay has been cut and I just don't know what to tell him or how. Things have already been so hard for us that I have cut back on everything I could. But more than that it's the horrible shame I feel. I'm such a failure. It's my fault. Of course my T argued with me telling me it was not me but my T who failed in this. That my feelings were healthy. That if a patient never develops any feelings for a T over the long term while doing psychodynamic therapy he would worry that something was wrong with them (meaning inherently unhealthy to begin with) or that there was an issue with the therapy itself.

When I told him how hard the mornings are and that I still wake up shaking he asked me where HE was? What was I doing with HIM? I said what do you mean? He wanted to know what I get from him? I said... well if I'm seeing you that day I tell myself I just need to get to him and then I'll feel safe again. He said and on other days? I didn't know. He emphasized that he wants me to take everything I can from him. I told him I get empathy and safety. He said he would hope he offers me reassurance and support and connection and the relationship itself. He wants me to take that in. He said I take very little of what he offers to me into myself and he feels that part of the problem is that I have SO deeply internalized my oldT that it's really difficult for me to allow anyone else in. He told me that what he gives me is mine and is freely given to me. He wants me to have it. That I will always have it even if he drops dead tomorrow. No one can take it away from me, not even me and surely not him. He said this will protect me and make me less vulnerable. He said it's not an option... I must take it in... it will help me if I do. He was sort of smiling at me when he said it's not an option. I said oh that's an order? teasing him.

I think I need time to process all of this today. I hated leaving him today. He shook my hand and patted my arm. It felt good. I really wanted to hug him. He asked me if I was okay to go. We made a few minutes of small talk at the door and it helped me to calm down. He told me I worked really hard today and I always do. He said he'd let me know if my files arrive before our next session on Thursday.

There are times when I'm hit with the grief of what my oldT did to me. It infiltrates so many parts of my life. Then I struggle to live my life because I'm trying to avoid stuff that reminds me of him. Yet, I have to do certain things and then what happens is I get really dissociative or I numb out so I can't feel the pain. Life has become so constricted. The fear is so much a part of everything. Yes, I'm better than I was but so what? I'm still suffering the repercusions of last summer at work and with my son. My therapy has been off track since last June... that is almost ONE YEAR. If I didn't have a journal I would not even remember what I was talking about with oldT just before he went crazy.

sorry for rambling about all of this. I felt I had to write it out to process some of it. I may delete... not sure. I'm just feeling a lot of self-hate right now for all that I've allowed to happen to me and how I reacted to it all.

TN
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TN - No need to be sorry. You are always there for everyone else. I am glad that you are reaching out here. So much seems to be going on. When I hear how much you are allowing this connection with your current T, I can't imagine that such a devastating thing happened to you less than a year ago. You really are an amazing woman! I really do hope you can receive and take in everything your new T has to offer. It warms my heart to hear of your interactions. I can feel his tenderness to you through your words. You deserve it.

I can't believe they cut your pay at work! Is there anything you can do, like talk to HR? If it had been something blatantly medical, there is no way they would have dared doing it. It frustrates me that people still don't see mental health as essential to the health of a whole person. I can understand a bit how you feel. At my last position, my boss retired and I was promoted and asked to report to a new boss. I was told verbally that my new position would be the highest classification for my job, which implied a certain pay range. After three months of asking my boss for my official offer letter, and having my job description changed about ten times, I found out I was a lower classification and had only received a 7% raise when the promotion I had been promised would have been at least twice that. I had already done the work and couldn't fix it. I went to HR, but they did nothing. I know it's not exactly the same situation, but I know what it's like when a boss uses money to control/sanction you. So, I'm really angry for you. I don't know much about your relationship with H, but I have to imagine he will understand. He must have seen how hard things were for you last Summer. And I'd have to imagine that he'd be angry with your boss, rather than you.

Oh, TN. Everything sounds so heavy right now. Frowner I just want to reiterate that you are an amazing woman. You seem to face everything with such courage and grace and still have so much care to offer the others in your sphere. (((((TN))))) It will be OK.
Dear TN,

There is no time frame to grief...and especially the kind of grief you are going through, I hope that you will not be hard on yourself for feeling the way that you feel. Of course you still are badly hurting when stuff keeps coming up to remind you of how badly you were treated by someone who had a responsibility to take care of you and accept you. (((((TN))))

It is so mean of your work to give you a pay cut- you do not deserve that. Of course that is so triggering and hurtful. You do not deserve that, and it's not your fault. How is a person supposed to continue functioning at maximum capacity when they are in deep grief and traumatized? You are not a machine, and I think employers who don't realize that are very uncompassionate.

I'm so glad your T is there 100 percent for you in this, and that he wants you to take in his care for you. ((((((TN)))))))

Love,

BB
TN,

Wow, so much going on. I'm sorry to hear about the pay cut. It seems employers are always looking for an excuse to make cuts and rarely give out extra when someone performs really well (as you have in the past). I know that just adds stress to an already difficult time.

Your T asking where is HE in all of this is great! Definitely a good thing and I agree with BG, it is huge and very good when it happens. I go back and forth with this myself.

I know that you feel as if you've done this or allowed this to happen, but I can't say enough how much that belief just isn't true. You didn't allow any of this to happen. Sometimes bad things just happen no matter how much we try and you are having a normal reaction to abnormal circumstances. Please be gentle with yourself.

(((hugs)))
((((TN)))))

I think it is natural for you to be feeling this grief right now. There are four stages to grief and I think as you move through each phase, it will be like experiencing a new emotion surrounding what happened with oldT.

I'm so sorry to hear that he is not being cooperative with releasing your medical records. (Clearly he feels he has something to hide).

I'm glad that your new T "sees" you. I know what you mean by not being seen. My T2 doesn't comment on my outfits or appearance and I often wonder if its because she doesn't see me or if its because she doesn't want to focus on my appearance since body image is a big issue for me. I dunno. But I do know that it feels good to be seen so I am glad you are getting that need met now.

It sounds like you are dealing with so much right now. Stress level must be high! How are you sleeping?
Thanks all for your kind words and support in this. I'm feeling lost right now. I think when my T asked me where was HE in all of this when I was shaking and unable to face the day he was trying to help me internalize him so that he will be there... in my head...when I need that safe place. The problem is that I have no space for him in my head. It is still so filled with grief from oldT and fear I don't know how to make room for my T. I don't know how to take him in and take in the good things from him because I'm just not good at taking things in. I never was.

I just don't know how to get oldT out of my head. He is everywhere around me. He was so much a part of all the important parts of my life. And as much as I care for my T now and as much as he has been wonderful with me... I just don't feel for him with the same intensity as I did for oldT. The feelings are not as strong and certainly not strong enough to replace oldT internally.

It's probably this time of year too. Last year at this time I was making big strides (or so I thought) in therapy with oldT. We had lots of real connecting and intense sessions and interactions. Now I'm fighting with him for my files. It seems to be triggering the grief and the trauma all over again and I'm finding myself pushing my current T away from me. Part of it may be that I am feeling anxious about allowing ANYONE to get close to me. But I'm also afraid it's just not POSSIBLE to have those feelings for any other T except oldT and it just makes me sad because my T so obviously welcomes those feelings, understands and accepts them and I find myself really trying hard to believe that I do feel them.

And maybe I do feel them on some level but am unable to acknowledge it out of fear. I'm just feeling a lot of different things and some of them are anger but I'm not sure where to place it so I'm very angry with myself. I was the one who was stupid enough to allow someone to matter to me in the way that I allowed oldT to matter. I knew it was dangerous and I ignored the warning bells and let it happen and now I'm paying the price... literally.... in losing my pay and almost losing my job.

As far as management at work goes... no one understands the grief or trauma I've been through. No one died. There is no body. I look normal. But my brain, my executive function that I need to do my work just ceased during the worst of those months from July through at least November. And my boss because I work directly for him on the commission side, can cut whatever he wants to. And he stopped all my commission income.

I'm just so sad right now.

Thanks for listening
TN
(((TN)))

I'm sorry things are so hard now. I wish there was something I could say to help. I'm angry at your boss and furious at your old T. I think it is amazing that you are still reaching out and connecting with your new T even in the midst of all your grief and pain. I can't do that I don't have any negative T experiences to blame. You are inspirational and deserve so much better than life has been giving you lately.

di
incognito thank you for saying that. I'm just like everyone here ... trying to make sense out of the hard parts of life. I really want to attach to my T. I want to have that same kind of satisfying, soul connecting, intense relationship I had with oldT with my current T but it just does not FEEL the same and I cannot really explain it. Something is missing and maybe it's just the instablility and inconsistency that is missing (which is a good thing) but maybe I'm just not capable any longer of going to such a deeply intimate kind of relationship after what happened to me. I'm starting to believe that the damage inflicted by my oldT is permanent and people (especially Ts) and the world will never seem quite the same to me going forward.

TN
TN,

You are not to blame for getting hurt by oldT. You were not stupid to allow yourself to care for him. He was abusive of his power and the fault is his, not yours.

I am wondering if maybe it is possible to let go of the need to get the files from him, perhaps for now? It seems to be adding to your stress. Is there a reason you need them now or can it wait until some point when you are more healed?
(((((((TN))))))) I'm so sorry that your work have cut your pay...I know they mentioned it last year but am shocked they didn't discuss this with you again prior to following through. I'm also sorry you are still hurting so much at the hands of Old T and I am so happy that you have new T to guide you through this pain.

Take care
Butterfly
TN I’m also really sorry you’ve had this pay cut, it seems so unfair and almost like a punishment. Something similar happened to me when I had to take time off work to be in psych hospital, my boss decided when I came back to try and get rid of me (I fought it and retained my job) but it was very much the attitude, we are a business here and can’t afford to carry freeloaders! So much for the old fashioned paternalistic way of running a business. It sounds like you can’t do anything about getting your pay reinstated but is it possible to work your way back to it (ie show increasing productivity and earnings for the company?) Would he then have to up your pay commensurate with your output?

I have lots of thoughts about your feelings vis a vis oldT and newT. Firstly the way you felt and still feel about oldT struck me as very intense, all through the time you were seeing him and posting about your therapy it was really clear that you had profoundly strong positive feelings for him – in a word you loved him. I would be very surprised if you could feel the same level of intensity for newT, especially so quickly and given how you are still affected by oldT’s abandonment, and also I wonder whether it’s actually necessary for you to have to feel so deeply about him for healing to take place? It sounds to me like you are expecting to feel similar sorts of positive feelings for newT as for oldT and that that is some sort of measure of how well your therapy is going, as if you are required to feel like that as part of the therapy.

I think it’s great that newT wants you to take him in and have him in your head to sustain you between sessions, but maybe sometimes that might feel to you like he is expecting that to have happened and is contributing to your feeling like a failure, or that there’s something wrong with you for not feeling the same way towards him? It also reminds me of the classic (for me anyway) situation where my feelings get all tied up with the handsome rogue and the nice kind gentle man who is actually offering all the good stuff just doesn’t inspire the same feelings – a bit like, if it’s being offered on a plate it can’t be worth very much, whereas if it’s withheld from me that’s what I really want… I’m not saying that’s what’s happening for you at all, but it does sound as if you are almost beating yourself up for not having the same profound loving feelings for newT who is by far and away a ‘better’ T.

Can I say that I think you’ve been doing an amazing job of pushing yourself to keep healing, and remaining so open and vulnerable to the awful stuff that keeps ambushing you with oldT. If you can bear to think it, maybe this is all necessary for you to grow and heal – after all you could have just shut down on it all and gotten on with life without the awful pain of trying to resolve what happened. All kudos to you for staying with it and keeping on working through intolerable feelings. ((((((( TN ))))))))

LL
quote:
When I told him how hard the mornings are and that I still wake up shaking he asked me where HE was? What was I doing with HIM? I said what do you mean? He wanted to know what I get from him? I said... well if I'm seeing you that day I tell myself I just need to get to him and then I'll feel safe again. He said and on other days? I didn't know. He emphasized that he wants me to take everything I can from him. I told him I get empathy and safety. He said he would hope he offers me reassurance and support and connection and the relationship itself. He wants me to take that in. He said I take very little of what he offers to me into myself and he feels that part of the problem is that I have SO deeply internalized my oldT that it's really difficult for me to allow anyone else in. He told me that what he gives me is mine and is freely given to me. He wants me to have it. That I will always have it even if he drops dead tomorrow. No one can take it away from me, not even me and surely not him. He said this will protect me and make me less vulnerable. He said it's not an option... I must take it in... it will help me if I do. He was sort of smiling at me when he said it's not an option. I said oh that's an order? teasing him.


My goodness, TN - this is DIAMOND stuff! This T is saying all this to you? Wow!

I want to hug him - "keep saying this to TN - keep saying this - she really needs this right now, - please just keep telling her, you are just so good with her, keep telling her!"

What he is saying to you is music to my ears. I really feel AWE for the man, - he is GOOD. Really really operating from the heart, with true wisdom and kindness, and so experienced.

Drink this in, TN. Drink this in.

I feel for you. I don't know whether it helps - but I am on a 10 of my level of 1 to 10 of how bad it gets. I too find just functioning hard. I am hurting so bad. I have a friend who has terminal cancer. She was in the cancer hospital here until Sunday as the latest bout of chemo knocked her. Everyone is rallying around and being supportive and kind and she is inudated with help and advice and support and free reflexology and money for massage and all that


....

well you know what I am going to say next - and you will probably loathe me for it ...


but I cannot TELL anyone how much I hurt. And no kidding my pain is life threatening too in a quite different way - but no one knows and if they hear a bit, they back off, or they tell me to get my act together

This emotional pain hurts so much - and to go through it just with the support of a T - but no other real support is HELL>


I feel for you. I am sorry I have probably gone on too much, but you are holding a lot of grief that is utterly valid and it is going to feel hard going through this and I wish it was easier. I am so glad you posted and keep posting. I am sorry I am not here much to cheer you on and offer a cyber hand of gentle care.
quote:
I think it’s great that newT wants you to take him in and have him in your head to sustain you between sessions, but maybe sometimes that might feel to you like he is expecting that to have happened and is contributing to your feeling like a failure, or that there’s something wrong with you for not feeling the same way towards him? It also reminds me of the classic (for me anyway) situation where my feelings get all tied up with the handsome rogue and the nice kind gentle man who is actually offering all the good stuff just doesn’t inspire the same feelings – a bit like, if it’s being offered on a plate it can’t be worth very much, whereas if it’s withheld from me that’s what I really want… I’m not saying that’s what’s happening for you at all, but it does sound as if you are almost beating yourself up for not having the same profound loving feelings for newT who is by far and away a ‘better’ T.


LL...you just have a way of wading through all that I write to find the nugget that needs to be looked at and explored.

I feel like I'm backsliding. I don't know what is wrong with me but I feel a total disconnect from my T. Like I don't even want to go back. Something happened yesterday that was like a switch that is either killing my emotions or causing them to switch off into numbness. I am trying to figure it out but it's like the past six months never happened and I'm back into that black morass of hopelessness.

I've been pushing myself to feel for this T what I felt with my oldT and LL like you say maybe that is just not possible. They are different people and I'm a different person now too. But I understand it cannot be the "same" but I hoped it would feel as deep in it's own way. As meaningful in it's own way. It does not. I'm wondering if what happened yesterday was that it felt like my T was telling me I should feel about him the way I felt about my oldT that I should think of HIM in the morning and not the loss of my oldT. That HE should be the one in my head when I can't seem to be able to get him in there. There is no space in there. I'm trying but my emotions and my wants just switch back to my oldT. So I'm a freaking failure with this. The man keeps hurting me, won't see me, won't cooperate with me, hurt my child and caused my life all sorts of damage and I still cannot get him out of my head! I'm so defective I'd rather be hurt than cared for. That is totally sick.

Yesterday my T told me he could see how much I loved my oldT. He didn't think I was IN love with oldT but that he was clearly a very important person to me and I cared a great deal about him. I HATED hearing him say that to me. I don't know why except that it made me feel even more sick that I could love someone who was so cruel to me.

I just want to crawl off some place and hide for the rest of my life and just give up on all of this. I don't feel like I'm capable of a therapy relationship... I've been too damaged.

TN
TN - I was abused, hurt, molested, assaulted, manipulated and used by a guru, then by a T. I loved them both, I wanted to go back to them both. I was an adult both times, one when I was 26 and one when I was 33. Would you call me sick for responding to the little kindness of both,that made my 'little me' so fond so attached to both of them, for the hearing they gave me, the little moments of kindness that I had never gotten in my life before? No - you would understand.

You LOVED old T. Your 'little you' was attached to him big time. He was THE person in your life. Your 'little you' does not know all the reasonings of your big you, or of your new T, all she knows is how she feels and she MISSES him. I understand that.I think you understand that. I know your T understands that.

Please cut your 'little you' some slack. She is missing him BIG TIME. This is so hard for her.

Please - and I send hugs
TN, I am so glad you are reaching out. You have talked about the pain you are left with but I haven't seen you post much about it lately. (sorry if you have and I have missed it Roll Eyes)

Your new T.....LOVE HIM!! He knows just what to say...doesn't he?!! I am so glad you have his support through the difficulty of re-visiting places of pain with oldT. Opening even partially healed wounds can make the pain feel so fresh and make it seem as if no progress has been made.....BUT IT HAS!!! I hope the process gives you some sense of peace.....even if it is just a bit.

I am so angry at your boss!!!! I get that he is working for the company and his responsibility is to the company....but is there no room for humanness...compassion...the very real impact of difficult life circumstances? I am finding myself wanting to put your boss in your shoes to see how he would cope. Having a HUGE reaction to that...must be pulling on some things for me in some way!! I will just say...in case I have been unclear....that I do NOT like that he did that to you!!! Mad Mad

quote:
My therapy has been off track since last June... that is almost ONE YEAR.


You are grieving the death and cruel betrayal of a very emotionally deep relationship of which you had no control over the ending in any way. He got to decide everything. The wound is significant.....please be gentle. Smiler I actually think your therapy is exactly on track with your new T.

quote:
just before he went crazy


TN.....I LOVE this!! You are absolutely right!! HE went crazy!! He is responsible for this. YOU have done nothing wrong by trusting he would be the therapist he was supposed to be. What happened was NOT your fault!!

Thank you for updating us on what is happening with you. Smiler Frowner Sending healing energy...
seablue
quote:
You LOVED old T. Your 'little you' was attached to him big time. He was THE person in your life. Your 'little you' does not know all the reasonings of your big you, or of your new T, all she knows is how she feels and she MISSES him. I understand that.I think you understand that. I know your T understands that.


Thank you Sadly for your sensitive response. We must have cross posted as I didn't see your other post. I'm sorry about your friend being so sick and about your own suffering that is so hard to make known. The inside agony goes unrecognized and that makes it so hard. That is why we have this place to express ourselves to others who can understand.

I know what my T said is "diamond" and that I should be so thrilled to hear something like that. I would have been if oldT said it. And it WAS nice to hear my T say those lovely things to me but it's like I have this wall of glass that he cannot see but his words cannot penetrate. They sort of hit the wall and then slide off without being able to reach inside of me. There is NO doubt that he is a talented and knowledgeable T. He is just not that warm and fuzzy and sometimes that is what little me needs. Sometimes I just am too tired to be strong and need some soft kindness. Some fuzziness.

Sadly are you back home again? I'm sorry to hear of your EMDR T troubles and all that you are dealing with too. I hope you can work things out. When will you see sweetP again?

Thanks for the kinds words.

TN
TN, I agree with others that your grief and despondency is so understandable, and a normal part of the recovery process. I think it can be especially hard to hear someone's offerings when you are feeling closed - I have the image of your T leaving flowers out the front of a closed shop. You might then feel that the other is somehow diminished by continuing to be open and offer in this circumstances - like he loses value or dignity - but actually, I think there's a really core strength in his openness and humbleness that you will come to see and feel.

I was thinking about this problem of having OldT in you so much there is 'no room' for new T. I wonder if you can have a little play with the way you visualise this. Once a T asked me to visualise myself in an encounter with someone who really threatened me - and then to picture my loved ones, all the people who cared about and supported me in the same scene. I had them spread out behind me, my 'backup', and it made me feel much, much safer.

So I was wondering if you could somehow picture having both T and OldT in the same scene. Or if when you are feeling overwhelmed by feelings about OldT, you could try not to replace him, but just to bring your T gently and quietly into the scene somehow. The touch on your arm that makes you feel safe and connected, something like that.

Just a thought - of course, there may be nothing in this, or you might have an entirely different way of doing it.

Love,
Jones
Hi Seablue... if my boss had been in my shoes he would have ended up insane as he is not very good at handling pressure of any kind and just freaks out. The thing is that around 12 years ago when his wife asked him for a divorce he went crazy... screwed up big time in a lot of ways ... but I was there to clean up his messes and take on a lot of his work that he was incapable of doing at the time. It would have been nice to have the same compassion and consideration that he got from me!

Jones, thank you for replying as I know you are struggling with your own T and with the session you had yesterday. I will experiment with doing as you suggested. This morning I tried to bump out oldT but he would not budge.

I have really tried to sit with this unknown but upsetting feeling that I have which is making me feel agitated in some way. Something happened in my session yesterday that has left me extremely disconnected from my T. Whatever it is feels quite elusive. I am wondering if it's his detachment that is bothering me. I was in a lot of pain and didn't get so much as a word of empathy. Sometimes it would be nice to hear some acknowledgement of the pain I'm in. And then it also feels like he expects too much from me. Just because I'm a knowledgeable patient does not mean I don't need some TLC at times and some gentleness... and a break too on getting past all the grief. Sometimes the pushing he does wears me out.

Sometimes I think he thinks I'm an idiot for caring so much about oldT. He pretty much said he has become a major distraction to my therapy. I try but can't get past this huge bump.

I feel angry and disconnected. There is not even the feeling that I want to send him an email or make any kind of connection with him. Like I could walk away and never turn around and look back. I'm just numb.

I hope I can figure some of this out before my next appointment... or maybe I should just cancel it?

TN
Oh TN, you are suffering so much at the moment, it sucks Frowner

Can I say that what FOT wrote makes a lot of sense, about there not being room in your head for newT until the space has been cleared of oldT. I also don't believe that it's not possible for you to feel profound and loving feelings for newT - eventually. Like everything it's going to take time, probably a lot of time, I have this image of you one day suddenly realizing that not only are you free of the pain of OldT but that you will find true and genuine feelings of very healthy attachment for NewT. He's there waiting, and offering and judging from how he has been with you so far, he's not going to get impatient or expect you to miraculously feel strongly positive emotions for him at this stage, or indeed at any stage. He's giving, but I seriously doubt that he's expecting you to feel any specific way about him - he doesn't sound like the kind of T who needs gratifying by his client's feelings for him.

None of which makes any difference to how you feel now of course. I hope you will be able to talk to him about all you are going through at the moment, especially how you feel out of sorts with him - scary, but the way to go don't you think?

Big hugs to you TN

LL
quote:
The thing is that around 12 years ago when his wife asked him for a divorce he went crazy... screwed up big time in a lot of ways ... but I was there to clean up his messes and take on a lot of his work that he was incapable of doing at the time. It would have been nice to have the same compassion and consideration that he got from me!



ooooooh....trying to contain it. Have you thought about a gentle reminder of the time around his divorce?? Just wondering....I know it's easier said than done. And I know it ultimately doesn't change the pain you are dealing with, but Really? A pay cut? Frowner

I am sorry the pain has been so relentless. Do your best to be kind to yourself. Smiler
sea
Hi TN. Changed my mind. Still posting.

I wanted to tell you, that the reason you have the feelings for oldT, is not because he hurt you or was bad- no. It is clear that you were attached to him because of the kindness that he showed you often. That wasn't consistent so it became dangerous to accept. You never knew when it would be taken away again. Also- the heart or inner child doesn't know the rules, as SB pointed out. So, because of his loose boundaries, and inconsistency you felt even more attached, probably, like he cares for you in his *life* and not as a client. (I know I would feel that way) So- now you have a T with the solid boundaries, correct? **Because of what your oldT did, these new boundaries will be that much more painful for you to endure** and will feel much worse, and more foreign, and terrible- in my opinion, than if you were used to a T who had them in the first place. And that is totally normal, and not at all messed up or sick. You are longing for maybe, the kind of warm fuzzies that make you feel cared about as a T would care for a daughter or friend, not client kind- does it make sense? That's what you were taught to want, maybe, by OldT- and naturally- we all want that. So unlearning will be very very painful. So- it's taking *long* time to heal within this new set of unfamiliar boundaries with less intense "warm fuzzies." As you know it is hard enough and terrible, to have to endure good boundaries from day one. But after having experienced being given some of what one longs for in therapy- ouch. Really, really ouch. But that you T isn't giving in on this matter seems very caring. You will have to hurt a lot through these awful-feeling, foreign new boundaries in order to heal, and he knows that.

I'm sad that your T said that OldT is a distraction for your therapy, because right now, oldT is the subject mostly of your therapy, very naturally so. imo he made a mistake to say that, and of course you will feel awful and very scared, numb, shut down.. However- I'm sure that if you bring this up with him, he will understand, and be able to make it better. Because he is a good T, and wants your therapy to be about you getting your needs met. It is likely a miscommunication.

Lastly- yes, you do need TLC and gentleness and care. It is ok, though, if it's not happening every time- doesn't mean your T isn't there and caring, he is, and doesn't mean that you are defective- far from it. It's just really painful when it's not there- of course! And in time you will learn how to work within the new boundaries and let the care of your T in. Now I just see- it seems your T is testing a tiny bit to see how you do, challenge you a bit? Do not worry. If it is too much, he will back off, I'm sure. Because he cares. But- you know that these ruptures are inevitable and crucial part of therapy. So difficult right now, though. I'm just sorry that you are having one right now when you are not in good place. ((((((TN)))))))

One day you will find, you will use therapy skill to stand up for yourself at work! It must be frustrating, to not be there yet, and to feel that you are not moving fast enough- but- do not worry! In the right time, it will happen, for now, it is not the right time it is the time to give yourself this gift- to let yourself grieve, you just need to, that is all. It is not wrong or bad to grieve the loss of the more personal connection and looser boundaries that your OldT allowed at times, and the care that was there- in spite of his very serious, bad errors. Of course you will grieve all of that, very deeply.

sending comforting hugs,

BB
(((((TN))))))

Haven't been around much because I'm going through some painful stuff with my T but I read your thread and I just want to tell you that I know how deeply hurt you were and are by OldT and that it seems as though the negative ramifications just don't seem to end. Now may be the most important time for you to keep going to newT even if you can't take in right now what he has to offer you. You know how it goes, two steps forward, one step back. One step forward,three steps back. You don't always have to make progress. It's okay to stop and grieve. Probably even necessary. And, I'd like to make a bet that newT will still be there at the end of whatever it is you have to do right now.

(((((HUGS))))

Liese
Hi Beebs (and everyone)...

I appreciate everyone's kind input and support on this. I'm okay but just really confused and puzzled as to my extreme reaction after my last session. It seemed okay but then when I left all kinds of feelings and emotions surfaced and this really weird anger at my T. I'm not sure he deserves it but it's there nonetheless.

I'm starting to think that some of what he said or his attitude about certain things has triggered emotional flashbacks of my mother. I guess I should talk to him about this but it's really still quite fuzzy.

I'm leaving in a half hour for my session. I'll come back and post an update if I can.

BTW... Beebs... I'm glad you changed your mind and are still posting. Your post was very helpful.

Liese... it's good to see you again. So sorry things are rough with your T right now. Maybe you can tell us what is going on so we can support you.

thanks again,
TN
TN,
i am so sorry to hear about your paycut and difficult time and feelings you're going through. i am so angry at your boss for doing something like that! you deserved a payrise or at least some recognition for trying so hard to keep up with your work when you were going through a really traumatic time. he sounds like a coward anyway and he doesn't deserve to have you! i actually feel sorry for him that he didn't understand or didn't want to understand and be human.

i hope your session goes well. i have a lot of faith in your T (like everyone else here) and i think you will be ok. don't be too hard on yourself that you're still grieving old t, whatever the reasons, the feelings are there and they're important. i'm sure you will keep working through them with your new T. i've seen you make amazing progress, slow and steady, but that is the best kind. i have a lot of faith in you too, not just your T, i should have said.

i hope you can do small kind things for yourself to help you get through this painful time and that you can let others to the same for you too.

puppet

p.s. didnt meant to say that your progress was slow, more that it seems healthy and steady, something that will last, rather than a quick fix. cant find my words today.

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