Hi number9,

What a list! I admit, I've done some myself... mostly with previous Ts. With my current T, she readily admits if she's made a mistake, acknowledges it, and apologizes. It's only happened like twice in the past year together and both times she apologized immediately, sometimes in the same session, sometimes at the start of the next one. I've also used #2 and #5 a few times with her, both resulting in deepening of trust and comfort in the therapeutic relationship.

As for what I've done with previous Ts... #4, 6, 7, 8, 9, and 12. I've not had a T that allows email/texts, otherwise 3 would have a lot more action!

My T is great, and she has been really helpful for me to see that when there is a disagreement, or I'm confused by her (or she by me) I can use my voice and speak up to clarify and fix the situation. Now, if only I can apply that to the rest of my life!

quote:

any one or combination of the following: name-calling, belittling, condescending words, using abusive language or an unneccesarily loud voice,talking over you, cross-examining you at length, etc) and then refuse to own up to it?

My T has never done any of these things. The only real "mistake" she's made has been to mess up on scheduling, and she apologized profusely for it. She also called me by the wrong nickname once and she apologized for that, as well.

Room2Grow:

Thanks so much for the input. I'm not exaggerating about my T. When I finally used #2, he did agree to stop, and was kind about it, but never quite apologized. He said that he knows now that he needs to treat me differently than a "normal" person, that I am sensitive, but the fact is that I put up with a LOT more than many do.

He puts me between that rock and a hard place a lot. Next time he says that I'm going to tell him that "Sensitive or not, I want you to stop because I don't deserve to be talked to the way you talked to me that one day, and if you are really feeling that hostile towards me I need to know right now".

He does this with all his clients, it's his style, I have not been a "handful"- just intellectualize a lot, don't trust him, and hard for me to be vulnerable with him, and that frustrates him, I suppose. To be fair, there have been a few times (2) where I have gotten offended by something he said and it wasn't necessary, and I admitted it and apologized.

I don't like mixed messages- telling me I am "worth it" but then finding the need to be aggressive/abusive to get the "point across". Or using the excuse that he has a "good track record with me" ... that I shouldn't focus on this "one incident"- so that he can say that I go into black and white thinking again.

If someone is being a jerk, and I maturely call them on it, but then get the "overly sensitive" and "black and white thinking" labels put on me, I just have to think that it's about the other, and their "s#*t." Furthermore, it really does some damage in the sense that I'm trying to learn to tell the difference between REAL projection and legitimate bad behavior on the part of another person.

Sorry so mad about this today, I'll take responsibility for my own words, but I won't let someone be rude with me. Period. I now I know also, how NOT to act with someone, I WILL NOT go to down to their level. I refuse to walk into the trap of letting his view of me become a self-fulfilling prophecy, and its hard, if one is treated badly, it is hard to take the high road sometimes. It took me a bit of trial-and-error. I even had a #13- getting an outside consult with another T- who said that mine sounded a bit narcissistic.

What is weird is that both of our egos seem to be softening, and I feel like it may be good to see if I can do this- maintain a relationship with someone who is a bit like me... intelligent, sensitive, and a bit defensive about the work that they do. I often have a need to be "right" (see #12) and so does he, and how do we transcend to #5? Or am I really being stupid for staying? Abusive people like to use that line as well- "I treat you so well, why are you dwelling on that one incident"? (that one incident, perhaps, being a major betrayal by any standards) meh. I'm cynical.

I guess I wonder if I'm the only one I read a lot of posts that say "it's always about YOU, never the T"... and this had me feeling like I was going crazy, questioning my own instincts, that I deserve to be treated this way... I don't think I do, but there is a good way to go about this, and a bad way. So yeah, well, part of it is about me, but it takes two to tango!

So yes, Room2grow and Alpaca, the fact that your T's own up to their words would encourage me to to the same. Leading by example is always preferable.

Thanks so much for hearing all this!

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Do your T's admit when they make a mistake or say or do something that your average person would find offensive, i.e.any one or combination of the following: name-calling, belittling, condescending words, using abusive language or an unneccesarily loud voice,talking over you, cross-examining you at length, etc) and then refuse to own up to it?

I saw a T once who did all these things, and in the very first session1 I responded with 1. and 4. and never went back.

I've gathered that there are T's who have a blunt, aggressive and in your face kind of style like that, and presumably some clients are able to roll with that, but my take on it is I'm not going to pay for emotional abuse when there are plenty of people who will dole it out for free.

My current T has never done any of those things. She is very gentle, although it occurs to me that when she asked about what I was looking for in a therapist at our first session I stressed that I needed someone "very, very gentle," so I don't know how much of the sensitivity and carefulness she demonstrates is in response to that stated need and how much it is just part of the normal style she uses with every client. I would think it's some of both.

Anyway, she's quick to apologize for things like scheduling mishaps, being late for sessions, interrupting, and one time for making a joke that she saw hurt my feelings.

Heldincompassion:

Quite helpful!

I'm glad you did #4! (#1 really does suck, doesn't it?)

quote:

I've gathered that there are T's who have a blunt, aggressive and in your face kind of style like that, and presumably some clients are able to roll with that, but my take on it is I'm not going to pay for emotional abuse when there are plenty of people who will dole it out for free.

Thanks!!! Ah, why do I feel such relief? I'm NOT crazy!! I guess I can handle more than he probably thinks I can, but the question is, why the heck would I want to? Already got my fill of that to last several lifetimes, thanks..

Do you feel a good connection with your therapist?

I have done most of your list at some point in the last thirty years.

My t apologizes whenever he thinks he might have done something unhelpful and he EVEN apologizes if I tell him he has done something wrong and he disagrees but he says maybe he has got it wrong and he is really sorry if he did something inadvertantly that upset me. I am beginning to call him my apology guru as he really teaching me the dignity of apologizing and being mature around apologizing and how to handle it well.

But he has never called me names or any of that list, he just messes up times and appointments sometimes or mis hears me or goes off into a long monologue about his views and ideas, for just way too long. And I usually call him on it AFTERwards. I have a very delayed reaction time.

thanks for this post, it was helpful to ponder this.

Hi number9,

Glad I was helpful! I definitely don't think you're crazy.

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Do you feel a good connection with your therapist?

The vast majority of the time, yes. T is very intelligent and intuitive. I feel she has a good understanding of me and we've had a strong rapport from the beginning. We've done some productive work together in the seven months I've been with her. Now, occasionally we'll have a session where one or both of us is not quite with it and I don't feel the connection as much. Those always feel a bit lame and disappointing. And, there are a few areas I know we don't quite see eye to eye on (religion, politics), and when something related to one of those comes up in therapy I sense a slight barrier to understanding. I haven't felt that to be much of a problem, though.

So. . . are you going to be shopping for a new T, or still undecided?