oh jill, I'm so sorry. That's just awful. grr.

validation is so important...

I don't really experience you as feeling sorry for yourself at all. And if you go through abuse and neglect - well, then it's not really just "labels." It's reality. That kind of treatment affects people! And therapy is supposed to be about dealing with all that stuff. Being comfortable there? I don't experience you at all as being comfortable with those "labels"...

oh, I may be speaking from my own stuff here. shiesh.

I'm trying to think of when it would be ok for a T to say that... let's pretend that you were feeling sorry for yourself. dang it, I think sometimes that's really ok! it's grief! it's grief about loss. things you want or wanted. I guess it's possible we all could "pity ourselves" in an "Eore"-sih (from Winne the Poo) kind of way, and that's not so good or *just* feel sorry for ourselves and take not action when that is what is needed too (and sometimes the only action to take is to deal with the loss and unresolved grief) or...? but girl, you take action! you are dealing with your stuff. I'm so impressed by what you read to your T the other day, and you have real losses to feel sad about and grieve.

I'm proud of you that you did ask her about what she meant when she said you were feeling sorry for yourself and it didn't lead to a more helpful conversation in that moment. I'm so sorry it's so painful.

I think asking her about it is a WONDERFUL idea. Good way to take action! Maybe she did misspeak or had a good purpose behind saying it. Maybe! I dunno.

I just can understand why you feel hurt and mad. hang in there.

ugh, Jill. I know T's mean these things to help but that one really bites. As a person who (as you know from reading the "neglect" thread)constatnly doubts and thinks I am just "feeling sorry for myself" I can understand how deeply that would hurt. adn maybe someimes we DO feel sorry, and do want some sympathy and care. I always worry that the one thing my T would NEVER be willing to help me with, is if I really *was* making it all into a much bigger deal "just to get attention." But I also feel like if I really AM doing that, (which I still have yet to figure out) well, that is also a very debilitating thing- and I would need help even in that dark place, right? I the end pain is pain and needs to be dealt with and not stuffed away.

Good on you for your resolve to bring it up with her! That could also lead to a very productive session, I would imagine. Let us know how it goes.

BB

That would hurt, Jill...deeply hurt...I hope when you bring it up with your T that it works out...I'll be reading to see how it goes...mlc

Well that stinks. I really do hate those moments.

I like to think Ts are infallible. But as my T so gently but irritatingly said at the very beginning, she is human. And that irks me still that she held that as a defense.

Because they're better than the regular humans right?, Better than me at least, right? Has special training and all that. Knows what definitely not to say and how to "fix" us. Right?!

Man, and then they go and say something so insensitive as that. I'm sorry Jill!

My T has made a few jarring comments. The most unsettling was "that sounds immature as if you're a teenager still trying to discover who you are." In reference to a comment I made about annoyances I have.

Yeah, um, parts of me are immature (and 6 years old!!!), but DANG, did she have to criticize me like that!?

So I understand dear Jill. [Hugs for you with snuggly blankets by a fireplace] (providing you like snuggly blankets and fireplaces)

But the bright side, (I think) is that after I told her how displeased I was about her comment (in probably an immature way), she has been more careful and she now has learned what rubs me wrong and can continue to learn how to redirect her points to me.

So MAYBE, yours will too. Seriously I think they fall into a zone of thinking what works with one (or 100) clients will work with them all. She may have said that so many times before without getting any feedback.

Different things for different people, I say. That sort of (what, tough love or something) comment may have caused someone else to say "hey, ya know, I do do that way too much. Thanks T!" Yeah ok, so maybe, maybe not. But it seemed like a pretty speculative comment to make that whether it was right, seemed too tough love and if wrong, well it leaves you going "what the H?"

And I'm also a believer that Ts have to be taught. To the extent that they are willing to work with my needs and the "teaching" isn't something over and beyond their scope of ability.

But I have had to "teach" current T what works for me in terms of spatial distance, language, and how to end arguments (I'm right until I'm ready to hear that I'm wrong)

And I didn't really realize I was teaching her how to be differently with me until I really thought about it now.

So, I'll quit droning on and on now, but the point is, that Ts can say really insensitive things, (hopefully unintentionally), and will definitely need to be told about your comforts and discomforts.

And a good T will be able to adapt to what you need (even if it's a little, and even if you don't immediately notice it).

Am I making sense? This response feels scatterbrained....

sis, you are making perfect sense, yes, they DO have to be groomed somewhat. and she certainly knows i am 'not the normal' messed up client. she has already told me i do things backwards from 'most' screwed up people...and i don't think that was grouping me with the well people out there, i just have my own particular brand of f-ed up. i guess i should feel happy she noticed. and i am.

she didn't deny the comment but categorized it as being interpreted in many ways, whatever, she was clear later to refer to me as 'profoundly affected' so i guess that is a back handed compliment that i have something to feel 'sorry for myself' about. whatever, the brain is off for the night, so your scatterbrained response just slid right into my mindstate.

thanks, friends, bb, mlc, jane doe for caring!! and 'tough love'!!?? i am not so sure i am really even liked right now. i know i am a nut, but she kept reminding me of my age, as if what she was seeing was more a nine year old, at best!!

xxoo, jill

Jill: I am sorry to hear that your T had hurt and invalidated you...that sucks....this seems to be an all too common experience in therapy....

I like how Forlorn brought up the human defence...While for the most part, in my 11 year therapy run, the sessions progressed rather smoothly, I can remember feeling so hurt by her actions once that I thought that was it.... no more therapy for me...when she apologized I wondered whether it was sincere....she brought the human defence into the situation...I pointed something out to her....In my profession, if I make an error, I could end someone's life....I wonder how families would take the message...."I am so sorry that I gave the wrong medication dose to your loved one and that they died because of it...I am only human you know"....I remember that she was unable to provide a response....

Therapy can certainly have its ups and downs....and for the most part I was really blessed to have crossed paths with a very remarkable "human" therapist!