We need a "like" button on here.
That was lovely CD...and brought a smile to my face, which I desperately needed We need a "like" button on here.
We need a "like" button on here.
The truth is you do trigger me, and I actually had written that into my apology post but took it out because I didn’t want to take the chance that I would add to the pain you’re already going through. So, the pattern that you are triggering to me, I am owning that and I actually am looking at and trying to figure it out. In the meantime, I will try to refrain from reading your stuff, for both of our sakes. And even if you are triggering to me, both my apology and my wish for you are sincere.
As far as the pattern that was suggested for you, maybe it wouldn’t be so bad to take a look at it and at least consider it. Again, my best to you.
As far as the pattern that was suggested for you, maybe it wouldn’t be so bad to take a look at it and at least consider it. Again, my best to you.
Hi RT,
I'm not even going to go into what's happened on this thread thus far - and truthfully, I've been in too much of a med induced fog to read through the whole thread - but I did just want to offer some support. I'm sorry you're in such pain, and I am sorry that you're feeling misunderstood.
I mean this in the gentlest way possible, RT, but I think it gets hard for me to see you in continuous pain when you keep going back to a therapist who is clearly not meeting the needs that you have so clearly defined. One thing that therapists have to hold on to is their own boundaries, and I think that you should not keep asking your T to change hers, and keep hurting yourself in the process.
I also think, out of respect for your T and her boundaries, you should either stay within them and find a way to manage (much, much easier said than done, I know) or find a new therapist. She should definitely not have offered the additional contact without knowing that she would keep it, but she is human and may not have fully realized what she was signing up for. I don't mean that against you, I'm just saying that generally.
However, I hope you can also see that she does care so much about you that she actually WAS willing to change her boundaries for you, even if it was, unfortunately, temporary.
In regards to being disappointed about the posts on this thread.. I have to admit I find that accusation hard to swallow. I know you're feeling vulnerable and wanting help, but essentially demanding responses is going to make people feel more afraid to do so, including myself. I want to be supportive, RT, but it's hard to do that when I'm afraid that something I say to you, even with the very best of intentions, is going to make you angry or just hurt you more. I assure you, that's the last thing I want.
I've had several of my own threads that have had very little, or even no, responses and no PMs. It comes with the territory with a large, active forum like this. It does not directly relate to how much people care, even though I know very well that it can feel that way. Bit even if you just get a few responses, please don't condemn the rest of the board for responses that you do not get. Please don't push us away like that.
I'm sorry for any typos.. Like I said, I'm a bit out of it, but I don't want to see any of this spiral out of control.
If you feel offended by anything I wrote, I apologize, because I assure you, that's not what I wanted at all. I just want to have an honest, caring, and open conversation with you just so that I, as well as others, can be in a better position to offer you some of the support that you need.
I'm not even going to go into what's happened on this thread thus far - and truthfully, I've been in too much of a med induced fog to read through the whole thread - but I did just want to offer some support. I'm sorry you're in such pain, and I am sorry that you're feeling misunderstood.
I mean this in the gentlest way possible, RT, but I think it gets hard for me to see you in continuous pain when you keep going back to a therapist who is clearly not meeting the needs that you have so clearly defined. One thing that therapists have to hold on to is their own boundaries, and I think that you should not keep asking your T to change hers, and keep hurting yourself in the process.
I also think, out of respect for your T and her boundaries, you should either stay within them and find a way to manage (much, much easier said than done, I know) or find a new therapist. She should definitely not have offered the additional contact without knowing that she would keep it, but she is human and may not have fully realized what she was signing up for. I don't mean that against you, I'm just saying that generally.
However, I hope you can also see that she does care so much about you that she actually WAS willing to change her boundaries for you, even if it was, unfortunately, temporary.
In regards to being disappointed about the posts on this thread.. I have to admit I find that accusation hard to swallow. I know you're feeling vulnerable and wanting help, but essentially demanding responses is going to make people feel more afraid to do so, including myself. I want to be supportive, RT, but it's hard to do that when I'm afraid that something I say to you, even with the very best of intentions, is going to make you angry or just hurt you more. I assure you, that's the last thing I want.
I've had several of my own threads that have had very little, or even no, responses and no PMs. It comes with the territory with a large, active forum like this. It does not directly relate to how much people care, even though I know very well that it can feel that way. Bit even if you just get a few responses, please don't condemn the rest of the board for responses that you do not get. Please don't push us away like that.
I'm sorry for any typos.. Like I said, I'm a bit out of it, but I don't want to see any of this spiral out of control.
If you feel offended by anything I wrote, I apologize, because I assure you, that's not what I wanted at all. I just want to have an honest, caring, and open conversation with you just so that I, as well as others, can be in a better position to offer you some of the support that you need.
Hi RT - slightly anxious about posting this as I am new to the forum, but I felt compelled to on a number of levels.
Firstly, and with sincerity, I think the level of integrity within each and every responders message has been amazing, and whilst clearly contentious, I am glad to find a forum where we can be challenged supportively, and I think it a great sign of strength and resilience in you and all respondents to try to support you in getting to the nub of this issue.
So the second point is for me...what is the nub of the issue; I think the pain that we experience in relation to our therapists is a message that something needs to be sorted; and I think the nature of the posts that you have received and responded to suggests to me that you are in an 'impasse' - stuck in a relationship that is no longer working for you, and it is very likely the transference and counter transference that is highly potent between you at the moment. However the most striking comment I read of your was that you were fiercely loyal ( 33 year anniversary - congrats), and judging by your post you are very tenacious too; but I wonder whether it might be worth taking a different stand, and yielding to the situation you find yourself in. Perhaps loyalty for the sake of it is insufficient to keep you trying to sort this with your T. Perhaps the lesson in all this is that if its not working you don't have to try so hard to fix it...you can just go and get a new one.
I don't mean any of this flippantly, I know how strongly we crave the attention of our Ts, but I also feel as I read these posts that you have backed yourself into a corner, and you are at a loss to know what to do, so not only are you in pain, but you are not in control of the situation, and are powerless, and for you this feels like you are being 'played with' ( not the best phrase, but I wanted to convey the sense of hopelessness and impotence you seem. To be expressing, which is a horrible place to be.
So I guess I am wondering if , instead of defending against all these posts because you perceive them to be attacking you personally ( and I understand that feeling as vulnerable as you do right now then you're bound to be sensitive to other comments), that you take a step back, and see whether the bigger picture is that this is an opportunity for you to do something different...your loyalty to your T isn't serving you anymore.
With compassion, Crootie.
Firstly, and with sincerity, I think the level of integrity within each and every responders message has been amazing, and whilst clearly contentious, I am glad to find a forum where we can be challenged supportively, and I think it a great sign of strength and resilience in you and all respondents to try to support you in getting to the nub of this issue.
So the second point is for me...what is the nub of the issue; I think the pain that we experience in relation to our therapists is a message that something needs to be sorted; and I think the nature of the posts that you have received and responded to suggests to me that you are in an 'impasse' - stuck in a relationship that is no longer working for you, and it is very likely the transference and counter transference that is highly potent between you at the moment. However the most striking comment I read of your was that you were fiercely loyal ( 33 year anniversary - congrats), and judging by your post you are very tenacious too; but I wonder whether it might be worth taking a different stand, and yielding to the situation you find yourself in. Perhaps loyalty for the sake of it is insufficient to keep you trying to sort this with your T. Perhaps the lesson in all this is that if its not working you don't have to try so hard to fix it...you can just go and get a new one.
I don't mean any of this flippantly, I know how strongly we crave the attention of our Ts, but I also feel as I read these posts that you have backed yourself into a corner, and you are at a loss to know what to do, so not only are you in pain, but you are not in control of the situation, and are powerless, and for you this feels like you are being 'played with' ( not the best phrase, but I wanted to convey the sense of hopelessness and impotence you seem. To be expressing, which is a horrible place to be.
So I guess I am wondering if , instead of defending against all these posts because you perceive them to be attacking you personally ( and I understand that feeling as vulnerable as you do right now then you're bound to be sensitive to other comments), that you take a step back, and see whether the bigger picture is that this is an opportunity for you to do something different...your loyalty to your T isn't serving you anymore.
With compassion, Crootie.
My point was not to say that posts do not deserve responses - it's just that it's very easy to miss a thread, no matter how urgent the need may be. It's not intentional, and I'm sure that if this forum were not as active as it is, threads would not be missed. But it does happen here just because it's an active forum.
I'm going to take another step back from the forum. I'm glad I was able to share some support with you, RT, but it was painfully vulnerable for me to do that right now. I try to be brave and post when I feel compelled, and I do send hugs even when I don't post. I always think about everyone here, more than I'm sure any of you know, and I'm probably not the only one who sends along warm thoughts without actually posting.
I'm going to take another step back from the forum. I'm glad I was able to share some support with you, RT, but it was painfully vulnerable for me to do that right now. I try to be brave and post when I feel compelled, and I do send hugs even when I don't post. I always think about everyone here, more than I'm sure any of you know, and I'm probably not the only one who sends along warm thoughts without actually posting.
quote:if you are a reader and inclined not to respond with words, please send hugs - for all of us.
Even topics tht get no replies can be as valuable as replies.
I, and I hope others, will continue to post how they want to.
As an FYI, both my posts (and I think anon's post too) went completely unacknowledged..... Just sayin.
I think it would be ridiculous to expect from you a hug on every single posted topic. Maybe you can lead this change so others can follow suit.
It's also interesting to think about what we read into silence, the judgements and self-judgements we make in that space, like painting on a blank canvas.
I read a lot and rarely post. That's mostly about me taking care of my needs in my life. A lot of the time I also feel like people are going through the process they need to go through, and my hugs are beside the point. Who knows, they might even be counter-productive, a salve to something that might need to be felt in its entirety.
Recently I've enjoyed reading Muff's posts and the reflective silences they open. To me that feels rich and open. I understand that distress calls in different ways to people. But still I wonder if the silence can open up a space that needs to be heard. If so, sooner or later that silence will come back, hugs or no hugs.
I read a lot and rarely post. That's mostly about me taking care of my needs in my life. A lot of the time I also feel like people are going through the process they need to go through, and my hugs are beside the point. Who knows, they might even be counter-productive, a salve to something that might need to be felt in its entirety.
Recently I've enjoyed reading Muff's posts and the reflective silences they open. To me that feels rich and open. I understand that distress calls in different ways to people. But still I wonder if the silence can open up a space that needs to be heard. If so, sooner or later that silence will come back, hugs or no hugs.
"another country heard from."
I'm not sure if that's sarcastically meant or not. It usually is where I come from. But yes, different lands of experience that lead people to act as they do, & to have differing needs. Sometimes even when the needs don;t match up with what's on offer, understanding the background helps make sense of it and bridges the gap a little. sometimes not.
I'm not sure if that's sarcastically meant or not. It usually is where I come from. But yes, different lands of experience that lead people to act as they do, & to have differing needs. Sometimes even when the needs don;t match up with what's on offer, understanding the background helps make sense of it and bridges the gap a little. sometimes not.
cool.
Hi RD
I'm sending hugs!
Just a point about responses. I read several times during the day, but don't reply very much. Mainly this is because I think I do not have enough therapy experience to advise others, my second reason is that although I ead during the day when other family members are around, I don't feel comfortable to sign in and write until everyone else is in bed or out!
I do however gain a lot from reading here and hope eventually to feel able to contribute more.
I'm sending hugs!
Just a point about responses. I read several times during the day, but don't reply very much. Mainly this is because I think I do not have enough therapy experience to advise others, my second reason is that although I ead during the day when other family members are around, I don't feel comfortable to sign in and write until everyone else is in bed or out!
I do however gain a lot from reading here and hope eventually to feel able to contribute more.
I'll probably regret weighing in here, but I think what Cat was trying to say (I could be misreading) was not that either herself or I needed a response to feel good.
I did, however, notice that there was a lot more energy being put into arguing and defending than energy put into "receiving" the support that WAS being offered or was more along the lines of what you need at the moment (not that it makes the other posters' contributions less valuable, but just something you might get more out of it if read at a different moment and in a different place from where you're at). This doesn't make anyone bad, and I'm sure I do it myself all the time. And I hope this isn't coming across as feeling unappreciated or something, because I didn't take it personally, but I felt...not inclined to participate more, because obviously what I offered was off the mark from what was needed if it didn't register at all?
So, need a response? No. But, is feedback helpful for others who are so inclined and able to provide the kind of support that is most needed at the time? Yes. Kind of along the lines of what AG was saying earlier.
There are times when I put myself out there and don't get replies and freak out and delete. Somewhat recently, I've actually come to the place where I'm miraculously not projecting my self-loathing all over other people, but aware it is my OWN feelings for myself, and how deep the shame goes. I sometimes still feel the need to delete out of my own feelings of not wanting to be seen anymore, but it's about me and not what I think other people feel as much.
In the end, whether it is our partners or our Ts or forum members, people can't always provide what we need. They don't have it to give, or they misread what we need, or whatever other reason. It is painful. It replays awful stuff for many people, especially with attachment wounds. One way or another, we have to find a way to accept the limits of what is available to us. If we have a need that can't be met by a person, we can try to see if something can be negotiated, but if it can't, then we have to look elsewhere to get it.
So, it's OK to have those needs, to ask people to meet them, and when they do their best and it's not enough and they make it clear that's all they have to give, then we need to decide whether we'd like to live with that disappointment where we're at or go seek to have the excess need met in other relationships or environments. With your T, that could be getting extra support in addition to her (adjunct) or it could be getting a new T who could provide what you need. Here, it could mean putting it out there exactly what you need, reaching out to someone you really trust in a PM, or joining an additional forum/chat geared at the specific issue or need you have at the time.
I guess I'm seeing in both cases, a painful thing is being stirred up for you here. In the past, as a child, you had no choice but to either shut down or fight to get your parents to meet those needs, because they were the only ones in the position to meet them. At this point, as an adult, there is a choice, and there are lots of places to meet those needs...but it is still scary as if we are children. I know, because I'm currently terrified from trying to branch out in my support network. All I can say is hang in there and keep thinking, and talking, about what you need, until you work out the way that is best for you (safest, healthiest, long-term) to meet those needs.
(((hugs to all)))
I did, however, notice that there was a lot more energy being put into arguing and defending than energy put into "receiving" the support that WAS being offered or was more along the lines of what you need at the moment (not that it makes the other posters' contributions less valuable, but just something you might get more out of it if read at a different moment and in a different place from where you're at). This doesn't make anyone bad, and I'm sure I do it myself all the time. And I hope this isn't coming across as feeling unappreciated or something, because I didn't take it personally, but I felt...not inclined to participate more, because obviously what I offered was off the mark from what was needed if it didn't register at all?
So, need a response? No. But, is feedback helpful for others who are so inclined and able to provide the kind of support that is most needed at the time? Yes. Kind of along the lines of what AG was saying earlier.
There are times when I put myself out there and don't get replies and freak out and delete. Somewhat recently, I've actually come to the place where I'm miraculously not projecting my self-loathing all over other people, but aware it is my OWN feelings for myself, and how deep the shame goes. I sometimes still feel the need to delete out of my own feelings of not wanting to be seen anymore, but it's about me and not what I think other people feel as much.
In the end, whether it is our partners or our Ts or forum members, people can't always provide what we need. They don't have it to give, or they misread what we need, or whatever other reason. It is painful. It replays awful stuff for many people, especially with attachment wounds. One way or another, we have to find a way to accept the limits of what is available to us. If we have a need that can't be met by a person, we can try to see if something can be negotiated, but if it can't, then we have to look elsewhere to get it.
So, it's OK to have those needs, to ask people to meet them, and when they do their best and it's not enough and they make it clear that's all they have to give, then we need to decide whether we'd like to live with that disappointment where we're at or go seek to have the excess need met in other relationships or environments. With your T, that could be getting extra support in addition to her (adjunct) or it could be getting a new T who could provide what you need. Here, it could mean putting it out there exactly what you need, reaching out to someone you really trust in a PM, or joining an additional forum/chat geared at the specific issue or need you have at the time.
I guess I'm seeing in both cases, a painful thing is being stirred up for you here. In the past, as a child, you had no choice but to either shut down or fight to get your parents to meet those needs, because they were the only ones in the position to meet them. At this point, as an adult, there is a choice, and there are lots of places to meet those needs...but it is still scary as if we are children. I know, because I'm currently terrified from trying to branch out in my support network. All I can say is hang in there and keep thinking, and talking, about what you need, until you work out the way that is best for you (safest, healthiest, long-term) to meet those needs.
(((hugs to all)))
quote:I'll probably regret weighing in here, but I think what Cat was trying to say (I could be misreading) was not that either herself or I needed a response to feel good.
You got me, hun.
quote:It's also interesting to think about what we read into silence, the judgements and self-judgements we make in that space, like painting on a blank canvas.
It's fun to get replies, but I also feel that this board is not at all a bad place to think out loud, with perhaps a host of silent witnesses.
People may bear witness in silence with many different attitudes; I like to think at least some of them are interest, respect, caring. These don't always translate easily into words, especially depending on where the reader is coming from and where they are at the moment. When posts get few replies, there is the option of thinking of it as an opportunity to renegotiate one's relationship with silence. It's a process, yes.
It's also okay to need replies and ask for them. There have been times people specifically post saying they feel bad and would just like hugs, prayers, good vibes, or whatever. To know they are heard. I find people are usually responsive to that.
Maybe the forum is just like life, just like any place. You have to learn to work it to get what you need and figure out your own best style for contributing back.
It's all good stuff. This thread had me biting my nails at some points, but it's also taken some really positive turns, I think. People care about you, RT. Hang on in there.
Jones: "...a salve to something that might need to be felt in its entirety."
This is so difficult to bear...even when you know it is NEEDED...because everything within you is screaming for comfort...what you want and not what you want...
But, it is truth, although it be painful.
T. or maybe 
because it hurts so gd much.
This is so difficult to bear...even when you know it is NEEDED...because everything within you is screaming for comfort...what you want and not what you want...
But, it is truth, although it be painful.
T. or maybe because it hurts so gd much.quote:Am I truly being blind to my own folly? What am I missing
I thought Jones' post was interesting and applicable and it made me reflective so I shared some thoughts. It was me attempting to contribute to the conversation. It wasn't intended as criticism or indictment.
I've been reading, but up until now, I haven't felt the desire or need to respond. I was slightly annoyed by your second post on this thread after people didn't respond to your first post in a timely manner in which you felt was acceptable. So, I didn't think I should post, because really, my thoughts were not helpful to you at that time. I didn't feel like I needed to send hugs either..I just was okay reading along because that's what I chose to do. (I sent you hugs on a different post that you started I think around the same time that this one was, though). I'm not triggered by you and I'm not experiencing anything similar to your situation...I just chose not to respond and share my thoughts because I didn't think they'd be helpful or met with an appreciative ear.
I see that you post on many threads, and I'm sure your responses are greatly appreciated! You are very supportive here and add a lot to the forum. However, I don't think it's okay (this is obviously just my opinion) to demand/ask/whatever that from others. Not everyone feels comfortable responding. And also, one or two of your previous threads have contained some sort of drama/contention/mild arguments...that could turn people off from responding? I for one felt like one of your threads (the one where you wrote out your T's full name) was kind of inappropriate. I didn't get a good feeling about that, so I have been cautious I guess.
Everyone uses this forum differently. I think it's great that you're so supportive (this is not sarcastic at all). Not everyone is. That's life. Some people take more, some people give more. I take more on this forum. I read a lot but don't really respond much unless something compels me to. That is just where I am right now. Also, some people aren't at home a lot and can't just respond whenever. I think you mentioned that you tend to stay home while your partner works, which probably means you have a lot of free time. (I don't mean to assume, so I apologize if I'm way off base - this is just what I got from some of your posts). Anyway, I'm sorry for your pain. I really hope you and your T can work it out so that you're not struggling so much. And I hope you can get what you need from this forum too.
I see that you post on many threads, and I'm sure your responses are greatly appreciated! You are very supportive here and add a lot to the forum. However, I don't think it's okay (this is obviously just my opinion) to demand/ask/whatever that from others. Not everyone feels comfortable responding. And also, one or two of your previous threads have contained some sort of drama/contention/mild arguments...that could turn people off from responding? I for one felt like one of your threads (the one where you wrote out your T's full name) was kind of inappropriate. I didn't get a good feeling about that, so I have been cautious I guess.
Everyone uses this forum differently. I think it's great that you're so supportive (this is not sarcastic at all). Not everyone is. That's life. Some people take more, some people give more. I take more on this forum. I read a lot but don't really respond much unless something compels me to. That is just where I am right now. Also, some people aren't at home a lot and can't just respond whenever. I think you mentioned that you tend to stay home while your partner works, which probably means you have a lot of free time. (I don't mean to assume, so I apologize if I'm way off base - this is just what I got from some of your posts). Anyway, I'm sorry for your pain. I really hope you and your T can work it out so that you're not struggling so much. And I hope you can get what you need from this forum too.
quote:Originally posted by RedTomato:
Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit.
There is no one who loves pain itself, who seeks after it and wants to have it, simply because it is pain.]. [de Finibus Bonorum et Malorum, written in 45 BC, is a treatise on the theory of ethics very popular in the Renaisance.]
RT,
I am a reader more than a poster but have taken heed and often been struck by, and moved by what I have read. Sometimes I respond to posts, sometimes it may be just a hug because that's all I believe I can do to acknowledge the pain or suffering of another.
I don't have answers for you, but I do feel for you and want for you to find some peace and hope in your journey.
I struggle so much in my own therapy that I feel most of the time, I'm just not equipped to help anyone because I'm such a mess myself! But that doesn't mean I don't care!
Blu
I am a reader more than a poster but have taken heed and often been struck by, and moved by what I have read. Sometimes I respond to posts, sometimes it may be just a hug because that's all I believe I can do to acknowledge the pain or suffering of another.
I don't have answers for you, but I do feel for you and want for you to find some peace and hope in your journey.
I struggle so much in my own therapy that I feel most of the time, I'm just not equipped to help anyone because I'm such a mess myself! But that doesn't mean I don't care!
Blu
Remember?
"Courage starts with showing up and letting ourselves be seen." ~Brené Brown
"Courage starts with showing up and letting ourselves be seen." ~Brené Brown