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Hi everyone, I haven’t been around lately, my computer was being repaired and it took longer than expected! While it was gone I found myself doing a lot of journaling, and some of the things I got out of writing were very helpful. I have conflicting thoughts about my relationship with my T and I wanted to share them and see what everyone else thought…

Firstly, I think I’ve realised the main reason I have gotten so much better in the past year isn’t so much what we’ve been doing in therapy, but the therapy relationship itself (is that Rogers’ theory???). It’s healed a lot of deep core wounds, and being able to trust my T, be vulnerable with her, believe her and ask her for help has been life-changing, right down to my very existence. Which is where a lot of my transference comes from I think.

Here’s something I wrote in my journal:

I just realised something. As much as I want T to be some kind of mother figure to me, it would have issues. I was thinking about talking about the sexual abuse. Some days I think I might be able to manage talking about it a little, but the problem is I don’t necessarily see T on those days. And even if I did, there’s no way of knowing how I’ll feel and cope afterwards, or the next day, or the next week. I found myself wishing I could see her whenever I wanted. That I could talk to her whenever I needed her. Like a mother. I could say “Mum, I want to talk to you now” and we could. And she could cuddle me while I poured my heart out to her.

But if she cared about me like that, she wouldn’t be able to listen to what I had to say. Not without it upsetting her too much which would then get in the way of the whole process. She couldn’t be my therapist and my mother figure. Not properly. Which do I want more?

I wish I could tell her all of this stuff, and about how I feel about her and know she’d be ok with it without pulling back or changing how she feels/acts with me. But I don’t know if I can trust that won’t happen. So to try to protect that relationship I am not being as open as I could be. Which might be hurting my chances of getting better.

Does anyone have thoughts they can share with me? I feel like I am at a crossroads. I think I probably should try to open up more but I am so so scared of losing the relationship I have with her. If having it has helped me so much I am scared what losing it might do…

LTF
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LTF,

I have gone through similar feelings with my T. At first, I was afraid to talk with her about it (how I wish she could be my mom and stuff). Then, it started burning me up inside, and I had to tell her. So, I started asking little questions to sort of gage her reaction to my attachment. Then, I hinted that I was really attached to her. Finally, I wrote her a letter and spilled my guts. She took it really well. In fact, she already knew what was going on with me before I told her, and your T probably does, too. She sees it as a natural process for me, because attaching to a maternal figure is helping me to heal.

I think that it's very healing to talk about this stuff with one's T. The growth and connection that you're feeling now, grows exponentially once you start talking about this stuff. I'm not sure why, and I'm sure someone else will come along and be able to explain it better, but it is very healing.

I, too, have sexual abuse issues that I need to work through. My T has told me that she's wanting to work through that, but she's waiting until I'm stronger and more stable. If you feel like you wouldn't be able to handle it yet, then maybe it's not time yet. Does your T know about your history? If so, you could ask her when she's thinking you could start working through it.

Anyway, it's good to see you back here! I've missed you.

Catgirl
quote:
Firstly, I think I’ve realised the main reason I have gotten so much better in the past year isn’t so much what we’ve been doing in therapy, but the therapy relationship itself


Yes!!!! This is so true for me. I think that that seems to be the general consensus. I have benefitted from techniques and skills that we've worked on in therapy, but it's the relationship that is helping me to heal and feel better inside.
Hi LTF Smiler

Good to see you back, I hope you puter is running in tip top form again!

quote:
I wish I could tell her all of this stuff, and about how I feel about her and know she’d be ok with it without pulling back or changing how she feels/acts with me.
This is such a scary thing to have to go through, sometimes it works out well and other times it's not so good. You need to make sure that you are ready to deal with either response before you spill your feelings about this onto the table. But that said, when a T or P responds favorably it can be an incredible feeling to have shared, and a whole new path of discovery within yourself.
quote:
I think I probably should try to open up more but I am so so scared of losing the relationship I have with her. If having it has helped me so much I am scared what losing it might do…
Only you will know when you are ready to broach this with your T. I recommend starting by telling her that there is something you want to share, and explaining your fears about it before telling her how you feel. I know I tested my P for a few sessions before I spilled my guts about the erotic transference I had for her. My situation was not bad or good .. it was just okay, but I was prepared for the worst so it wasn't that bad in the end.

I know that wasn't a whole lot of help but I just wanted to share a little with ya. Good luck Smiler

Holz (aka HollyBaby0)
Hi LTF,
Good to hear from you again! Everything you're talking about feeling sounds really understandable to me because I have felt much of the same things.

And you've made the incredible step forward of realizing that what you think you want from your T (to have her be your mother) probably wouldn't be what your really need. When we have attachment issues, it often means that we are looking to obtain that which we didn't get from our parents when we should have.

Therapy, and actually, I would agree, the relationship, heals us in two ways. the first is that having a more experienced attachment figure that we can depend on allows us to learn to regulate our emotions, identify our needs, and learn how to get them met. But there is also the very painful loss of having to recognize that some of what we needed, to feel loved, to feel special, to be understood without having to explain ourselves (our attachment figure is supposed to be attuned so they can teach us to understand what it is we're feeling) can no longer be obtained because we're no longer children. Those losses need to be acknowledged and grieved. Doing that (and I think I'm still working on the grieving part) is the most difficult and painful thing I've ever had to do. But my therapist has provided me a safe understanding place in which to face my grief and helps to "contain" those feelings so I can tolerate them.

I had a breakthrough at one point about these issues that might help you, you can find it here: Update on Transference The way I got to that breakthrough was by going back time and again and talking to my T about my feelings about him. Because in our relationship is where all of my beliefs and relational patterns played out. It was how I could see what needed changing. Our T gives us a unique opportunity to do this because its all about our needs.

And you're correct about the relationship being the important part. There's a lot of research that the most important indicator of therapy being successful is not the type of therapy or education of the therapist or any of those types of factors. It's how good the relationship is, how attuned the client feels like the therapist is. That is because so much of what we need to learn is right brain knowlege that is learned implicitly, it's not about our cognitive understanding. And we can only learn it by being in relationship with someone who can already do what we need to learn. I know I keep pushing the book really hard (seriously, the authors should be paying me a commision) but I would really recommend General Theory of Love by Thomas Lewis et al. It does a great job of explaining these concepts and why the relationship IS the therapy.

Below is an excerpt from the book that allowed me to feel a lot more comfortable with how dependent I was feeling. My T ended up reading the book after I talked about it and it has remained very important to our work together. I hope this helps.

************************************************
The first part of emotional healing is being limbically known--having someone with a keen ear catch your melodic essence. A child with emotionally hazy parents finds trying to know himself like wandering around a museum in the dark: almost anything could exist within its walls. He cannot ever be sure of what he senses. For adults, a precise seer's light can still split the night, illuminate treasures long thought lost, and dissolve many fearsome figures in to shadows and dust. Those who succeed in revealing themselves to another find the dimness receding from their own visions of self. Like people awakening from a dream, they slough off the accumulated, ill-fitting trappings of unsuitable lives. Then the mutual fund manager may become a sculptor, or vice versa; some friendships lapse into diliapidated irrelevance as new ones deepen; the city dweller moves to the country, where he feels finally at home. As limbic clarity emerges, a life takes form.

Limbic Regulation
Balance Through Relatedness

Certain bodily rhythms fall into synchrony with the ebb and flow of day and night. These rhythms are termed circadian, from the Latin for "about a day." A more fitting appellation is circumlucent, because they revolve around light as surely as Earth. Human physiology finds a hub not only in light, but also in the harmonizing activity of nearby limbic brains, Our neural architecture places relationships at the crux of our lives, where, blazing and warm, they have the power to stabilize. When people are hurting and out of balance, they turn to regulating affiliations; groups, clubs, pets, marriages, friendships, masseuses, chiropractors, the Internet. All carry at least the potential for emotional connection. Together, those bonds do more good than all the psychotherapists on the planet.

Some therapists recoil from the pivotal power of relatedness. They have been told to deliver insight--a job description evocative of estate planning or financial consulting, the calm dispensation of tidy data packets from the other side of an imposing desk. A therapist who fears dependence will tell his patient, sometimes openly, that the urge to rely is pathologic. In doing so he denigrates a cardinal tool. A parent who rejects a child's desire to depend raises a fragile person. Those children, grown to adulthood, are frequently among those who come for help. Shall we tell them again that no one can find an arm to lean on, that each alone must work to ease a private sorrow? Then we shall repeat an experiment already conducted; many know its result only too well. If patient and therapist are to proceed together down a curative path, they must allow limbic regulation and its companion moon, dependence, to make their revolutionary magic.

Many therapists believe that reliance fosters a detrimental dependency. Instead, they say, patients should be directed to "do it for themselves" -- as if they possess everything but the wit to throw that switch and get on with their lives. But people do not learn emotional modulation as they do geometry or the names of state capitals. They absorb the skill from living in the presence of an adept external modulator, and they learn it implicitly. Knowledge leaps the gap from one mind to the other, but the learner does not experience the transferred information as an explicit strategy. Instead, a spontaneous capacity germinates and becomes a natural part of the self, like knowing how to ride a bike or tie one's shoes. The effortful beginnings fade and disappear from memory.

People who need regulation often leave therapy sessions feeling calmer, stronger, safer, more able to handle the world. Often they don't know why. Nothing obviously helpful happened--telling a stranger about your pain sounds nothing like a certain recipe for relief. And the feeling inevitably dwindles, sometimes within minutes, taking the warmth and security with it. But the longer a patient depends, the more his stability swells, expanding infinitesimally with every session as length is added to a woven cloth with each pass of the shuttle, each contraction of the loom. And after he weaves enough of it, the day comes when the patient will unfurl his independence like a pair of spread wings. Free at last, he catches a wind and rides into other lands.
************************************************

AG
quote:
Originally posted by learning_to_fly:
I just realised something. As much as I want T to be some kind of mother figure to me, it would have issues.


I found myself wishing my T were my father. (Probably literature would say I wanted him to mother me, but that feels weird to think about, since he's, you know, a guy.) When I started opening up to him and he responded well and encouraged me to continue, our relationship changed. But it changed in a good way. Now I feel more like the relationship we have is a unique healing relationship.

I don't know if you would have that same experience, everyone and every situation is different. Loosing your T as a "mother figure" could be a real loss, something you may grieve. But what replaces it may be better.

As for talking about your sexual abuse, take it at your own pace, there's no need to rush. You talk about wanting to tell her things at times you are not in session. I find that the act of being in session or talking with my T changes what I feel and want to speak with my T about.

I think journaling can be a great way to get your thoughts into words so you have something more concrete then just feelings when you go to speak to your T.
quote:
Like a mother. I could say “Mum, I want to talk to you now” and we could. And she could cuddle me while I poured my heart out to her.

But if she cared about me like that, she wouldn’t be able to listen to what I had to say. Not without it upsetting her too much which would then get in the way of the whole process. She couldn’t be my therapist and my mother figure. Not properly. Which do I want more?

I wish I could tell her all of this stuff, and about how I feel about her and know she’d be ok with it without pulling back or changing how she feels/acts with me. But I don’t know if I can trust that won’t happen. So to try to protect that relationship I am not being as open as I could be. Which might be hurting my chances of getting better.



Hi. LTF, Sorry it took me a while to reply!

I wanted you to know that I have taken some big risks with my T recently like you are talking about (i.e. lettng her know I have very maternal feelings about her, telling her I wanted to be able to curl up next to her and have her hold me; that I wished I could just be there with her all of the time) The process of opening up has been incredible--I hit some very difficult boundaries, but on the other hand, my T has been so very kind, gentle, and has made sure I have known that our relationship is stong and that she can withstand whatever I say to her. It was and is very scary to open up like that, and like I said, the boundaries of not being able to act out the impulses and desires are very painful, but the process of being so open is a wonderful one, and has really made a huge difference with my T and me.

whereami
Thanks for the welcomes back and support everyone!

CG- Yep, my T knows my history, and she knows how scared I am to delve into it. Last time I tried it didn't go so well and that makes me even more scared... but the SA has been bothering me again lately which is why she suggested we try again. But i just don't know. Thanks for sharing your experience, it gives me hope that mine might not go so badly after all.

Holz - that's great advice about testing the waters! i think i'll do exactly that. tell her there's something, discuss my fears, and go from there. There is no rush. Apart from my impatience anyway!

AG - That transference update post was amazing. I am so happy for you (belated!) Reading that I can see so many of the same "needs" that weren't met by my parents that I am now trying to get met by my T. It astounds me how deep an impact your childhood has on your adult life.

Heather, how do you navigate your T session since your feelings change once your in there? A few days ago I was in a deep depression, couldn't stop crying and desperately wanted to see my T. Today I'm a lot better but kind of feel numb so don't know if I'd be able to express my emotions if I saw her like this. Talk about frustrating!!!

Finally WAI - thanks for sharing your experience with this kind of situation too. That's kind of how I want this to turn out. I don't need her to BE the mother figure I secretly yearn for. But I do need her to be supportive and understanding of those feelings. And guide me through them. I think setting boundaries (that are consistent and sticking to them) is a sign of a great T and I am glad you have found one so amazing!

Thanks again everyone, this place is just a sea of support and I love it. Glad to be back!
Hi All, First I would like to respond to "learning to fly" I too journal- and for the most part- much of my communication with my T was/still is through writing because I could not voice the topic of early childhood sexual abuse. So I write a letter to him during the week and in session he reads it and we talk about it. This way- when I need to talk and I can not see him, I write out my stuff. Sometimes up to 10 pages. He is always very patient and kind with this. Now I keep my writings to a 5 pg max, but I still do this. He says it makes his job easier, because writing allows me to do most of the work, and it gives me the voice I need to express things I can not say. This has been very healing for me. I tell him- he is just another nervous system to share my stuff with. He liked that (learned it from Shrinklady)
I too admit to transference issues with him, but I don't have a clear picture of where it is coming from.
Here is my therapist question-
I have been in therapy on and off for 9 months. Early on I knew our spiritual differences would eventually cause a problem in therapy, but T said no, and that he welcomes spiritual stuff. He practices Buddhism and I am a strong Christan. Our relationship seems to be great- in the attunement way. But now our differences are causing misunderstandings. And through journaling this one truth seems important "_____ is therapy. (the blank is his name)Spiritual discussions have become such a part of therapy because he feels it is such a strong resource for my recovery, (and he is right) but now our differing views are causing a problem for me, and he misinterprets my stuff. A new therapist? I feel saddened by this thought, but what to do? I am completely honest with him in my journaling. I don't know how to get past this and I feel he is angry at me for something I said. He thinks my problem is that I want him to be like me, but that is not it at all, really. The immature me wants my own way, but that is not the person I want to be. Insights- anyone?
Hi. I have a question for AG (moderator). I have just read your post on Therapy relationship question? You mention a book that you have read LIMBIC REGULATION - BALANCE THROUGH RELATEDNESS. I would like to read this book. I have looked on Amazon and cannot find this exact book. Please could you give me more details re author and etc. Many thanks.

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