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Hi All---I’ve been wanting to update you all on how things are going in therapy but most days I feel sort of wordless and even if I can find some words I don’t seem to make a lot of sense.

We had 3 or 4 sessions where I was feeling less anxious and began to share more about my past with T. We had a session where I began to tell him of my varied and long work history hoping it would help both of us make sense of why I have been struggling so horribly with work issues over the past three years. Of course it was all too long to tell him in one session and he stopped me midway because we were out of time which then caused a really bad reaction when I was leaving him. It seems that I am overwhelmed with feelings that it was stupid to share that or that I will never now be able to finish the story or that he really was not interested or that I just didn’t talk fast enough… (We still need to address some of this) To make things worse… once again when I was leaving I saw him with his wife hanging out outside the office when I drove away. This once again had me reeling from I don’t know what. I managed not to call him about this but pretty much blocked him out of my mind for the next 3 days until I saw him again. I asked him if he could please give me a few minutes to leave the parking lot before going out with her because it’s difficult for me.

We then had a conversation where he worked to have me accept that we have a good and solid relationship and that he respects me and my hard work and he gave me examples of how well we work together, etc. But once again I was not sure we were working on the same issue and I end up frustrated and surly in session and then I leave and email T. This time I emailed him and told him I was not feeling any better after our conversation. In fact, I told him that the emotional component is missing from our work and that he does not prompt me with enough questions about how I “feel” as opposed to him telling me how good we are together because I don’t believe that is helping me. I told him this would be a right brain type of processing that we need to do but it was missing from our work and maybe because I am too scared to go there. He told me that I need to walk towards him to get through this and he would make sure I was safe. I don’t seem to be willing or able to do this.

Anyway, we exchanged 3 emails discussing this where he asked me on the last one to clarify exactly what was going on for me. So I flat out told him that having his wife on the other side of the wall and seeing them together all the time was interfering with my trying to build our own relationship because that then felt wrong and his real life in my face was causing me to shut him out completely and reject any attachment and then when I do see him again I am so anxious that he will be angry with me because I have this issue in the first place and I can’t seem to get past it and it’s causing our bond to deteriorate. And I was then afraid I would lose him and that felt like death.

He responded that he would think about what to do to get us through this issue and he thanked me for my clarity about it and that we can get through this and I am worth all the work we will have to do.

So when I saw him yesterday we tried to talk a bit about this. I do think my issues with having his wife around are so complex and multi-layered that it’s almost impossible for me to even articulate to him. I’ve tried numerous times. There are the bad experiences with oldT and his wife. There is a bad experience with “C” and his nasty ex-girlfriend. There is my Dad not protecting me from mom. There is my feelings of total worthlessness that I am always struggling with and how that becomes more magnified when I see the wife’s big “M.S.” nameplate on the door which she got just when I was also graduating with my B.S. and how stupid it was for me to celebrate that with T when he had a “real” family celebration going on and how mine seems so cheap and irrelevant. I cannot even talk to him about school because of this and how that impacts me and my grief surrounding this topic. I just feel like he cannot understand. There are a lot of topics I stop from telling him because I can’t get past her being on the other side of a thin wall and I never know if I’m going to see her when I walk out of his office. Plus, there is this feeling that I don’t really matter and what we have is fake and contrived because I get to see a glimpse of what his REAL life is REALLY all about and that does not include me and makes me realize that our is not real. I know he would argue with me about this.

So yesterday … again…. We go back to our relationship. I’m tired of talking about it. I just cannot “FEEL” anything. He reminds me of nice things he knows about me and I just nod. He tells me he cares about me and then we discussed attachment. He wants me to use our attachment to become stronger and more resilient. But I cannot even admit the attachment. Then he went on to ask me what attachment feels like and finally when I would not give him the answer he was looking for… he tells me that attachment is love. Love is a four letter word in therapy for me. I tell him that what if I do accept that and believe it… then I will just lose it like I lost all my other attachment figures. That I cannot risk accepting it because then I will lose it. He asked me “what if you don’t lose it and it helps you?”

He tells me he is attached to me. He tells me that he cannot change his attachment because it has a life of its own and that it belongs to me and he cannot take it back. So if he’s feeling attachment does that mean he’s feeling LOVE? This is really scary to me. How can this be? How can I take this in because I am really struggling to understand what he means and I cannot FEEL it. It’s like I’m blocked. I do understand that he is trying to solidify the relationship before doing any serious trauma work so that I have our relationship to contain me. But this is just SO hard to take in. It’s like I have a really thick defensive wall or even that I’m shot full of Novocain and am numb.

Meanwhile I am still frustrated because I don’t have a solution to my reactions to his wife being around and we have not processed those feelings so each time I have to go see him I’m really anxious before I even get to his office. Mostly, I’m feeling confused and hopeless. I can’t even envision a solution.

Do any of you struggle with taking in the good stuff? With seeing yourself as good and worthy with lots of attributes and talents? How does one get past those worthless feelings? And any advice on processing the wife being around would be gratefully accepted. I just don’t know what to do and I’m feeling like a total failure at therapy right now.

Thanks.
TN
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Hi TN,

I have trouble taking in good stuff too. I'm really sorry the wife is still a challenge for you, I don't really have ideas on that. As far as that good stuff and self worth go... I constantly compare myself to my Ts and the people in their lives... One of my T's son is a lawyer and she just got her doctorate - I feel undeserving somehow to see her or like she has "changed". So when they say good things, I often wonder if it's pity.

That crazy love word has come up in my work too. Albeit pretty directly, but I do feel "lovable" just not likable (my Mom would say that so much, we love you but don't like you). So I feel loved "despite" again... Sometimes like pity or just because I won't go away. I think love and like for me are somehow opposite of how they should be. I'm a free love sort of girl and say it rather freely in my life with friends and such.

Anyway... The difficulty to take in sucks. I end up feeling manipulative, like by not believing it I'm asking for more "proof" or her to "try harder". It feels good and terrifying sometimes so I feel like I'm trying to squeeze more good feeling by avoiding letting it feel all the way good. I'm really good at making myself feel bad! So if it's not one thing it is another.

What to do about it? I don't know. I feel like I'm often at a point I'm not struggling with connection anymore. That the building attachment and have her chasing my scared self around or me creeping out then running away and it just wears the heart out Frowner I know you know that, too! I don't know how it was worked on, time? Also I've had a ton of "therapy units" there were points for two years I saw her 3-5 days a week (an hour each) and my other T once a week. On top of that... She called me every day in the morning to check in and at night. This was mostly during a period of time I had problems needing to go to the hospital. I've been through significant chronic suicidal feelings. That's a lot of contact... Years of contact in a short time. I see her regularly now (and before the intensive time - she considered our therapy IOP by the way) 2x a week which feels like nothing now. So - it's taken a damn long time and a lot of insane effort on both sides.

I think the answer is time. To get to the point you can take on that good stuff. It must be hard too because you haven't talked about your history much (each time I've had a hospitalization event it has been after significant disclosures in my therapy because the PTSD comes up full fire and I get dissociated and am not there for it but sfter each time we would be closer). So I think not getting to have him know all/more of you will help that feeling of his love being true... I think when we hold our past deeply inside it still defines us and it's so awful that of course even a drop of good is a conflicting and terrifying message.

Hug two
((((TN))))

It sounds to me that, even though you are frustrated by the complexity of your feelings, you are starting to really verbalize to your T what it is that is bothering you. IDK, something sounded different to me about your conversations with him and emails that I hadn't heard before. Like there was more back and forth. Maybe he had more of a curiosity about him than I've seen before. Like you said, just giving the reassurance isn't enough. He needs to ask you questions and it sounds like he's starting to do that - at least in the email.

My OldT was like that, in that I think he often assumed he knew what I was referring to but any assumptions on his part where based on his own transference and countertransference. Any intervention from that point of view isn't really going to be helpful.

But something has shifted. I really like that he said he would think about how to help the two of you past it. It all sounds SOOO positive.

As for love, what if you accepted his love? What then? Can you visualize what your life would be like if you accepted his love?

As far as your relationship with OldT was concerned, I can't remember now if you have ever talked about wanting to please him and wanting his approval. In the past when you have written about it, it sounded like your motivation for going to school, etc., was wrapped up in your feelings for him and feeling loved by him. So, I guess what I am trying to get at is that was your movitation for you doing good things for yourself wrapped up in receiving OldT's approval? Do you have any approval needs re: New T?

I know that's all vague. I'm trying to verbalize a thought but am struggling. About the closest I can come to verbalizing it is that sometimes I wonder about myself and where the motivation to move forward with my life comes from when it's not all intertwined with approval seeking from others. It's new and different for me. When all the old, dysfunctional introjects have been cleared from my head and I do things only for me, for my approval. Is that something you struggle with as well?
TN, I understand your feelings of struggling to believe you matter to your T beyond the therapy hour. I know those feelings oh so well. It is such an all consuming struggle.

Something in the last few visits with my T has me maybe, just maybe, getting beyond the struggle and believing I matter to her. This woman has been rock solid when I need her and I mean for years she has been. I leave for ten years and need to come back. Her door was wide open. I am in the fight of my lifetime currently in terms of everything wrong that ever could go wrong has been happening to me. She's there for me. I finally get that I must matter because I am not easy and she's still there. She doesn't have to be there but the fact is she is. I finally realize how lucky I am and maybe now at long last we can do the real work.

I guess maybe what I am saying to you is, your T has to care about you in a real way. Look how he is always there for you regardless. Simple fact is he doesn't have to but he cares enough to want to. Sounds like he knows your not easy either. He's still there. Believe him.
Thanks, Cat. I am seeing T 2x a week for almost 4 years now. But I suppose if you take into consideration how traumatized I was for the entire first year and a bit afte that too then it's not that long. I feel the same way you do that I'm somehow asking for more because I can't take in the messages of caring and love from T. But I just truly am trying to FEEL it and understand it. T says to stop trying to understand it and analyze it and just accept it and then see how it feels. It all happened so easily and naturally (the attachment) with oldT that I didn't have to make any effort. But the ending of it so traumatically I think has damaged my ability to attach again.

Hi Monte! Thanks for popping in to comment and for sharing that example of what happened with your T. It makes me feel less alone and less crazy for feeling like I do. Your T makes some very good points, especially about him spending more time with you than other people in his life who are also important. You have a good, real, relationship and it was important that you were able to remember all that your T says to get you through that moment of doubt. Are you back in therapy again after your break?

I am not sure if he's trying to desensitize me regarding his wife. I don't think he'd do that consciously. When he did say he thought I should meet her one day I totally freaked out and begged him to never ask me to do that. He thought maybe it would lower my fears or by facing them I could conquer them? I have also tried (in vain) to desensitize myself from her by staring at her pictures on FB or the net and it has made no difference. My dear friend tells me that is because it's not really about her it's about the past. She is likely right but this gets all tangled up and it's hard to tease out what is the past and what is real life. All I know is I get a terrible reaction and then push T away.

Liese I do think we are talking more about this in fits and starts. And he is trying to ask more questions. I don't know what would happen if I just accepted his feelings of care and love. I am just fearful, I guess, of losing them and how that would feel. Which brings me back to the terrible ordeal of losing OldT.

I don't know if I have approval needs wrapped up with this T. I certainly did want oldT's approval and wanted to make him happy. I think he inspired me to go back to school and helped me to believe I could do it. Sometimes I think I act the opposite way with current T because I'm trying to test him and I am at times very unlikeable with him.

Hi Becca... good to see you. I totally understand what you are saying. When I look at how much T has been there for me. Through some really terrible stuff with oldT, with medical issues, with helping me with work issues and how available he is to me even on vacation and weekends, I tell myself how fortunate I am to have found him. And I realize he does a lot for me because he wants to and because he genuinely cares about me. But all of this is on an intellectual level. I think we still have to dig deeper into the emotional right brain level for me to feel it.

I am seeing T in an hour and have no idea what to say to him. I am so anxious going in at times my brain just freezes in fear. I will see him today and 2x next week then he goes on vacation and so I am hesitating to get into anything where I will need him to contain me. I just don't want another session where I sit and nod at him while he tries to convince me that this is real and he cares and we have a good relationship.

I'll update later,
Thanks.
TN
Hi TN,

I feel like I could have written your post to some extent. I struggled intensely over not being able to take anything in. A few months ago, my T started affirming me quite often in session and I would go home still thinking, “T hates my guts.” T and I both felt like for weeks we weren’t gaining any traction, so kicking and screaming I sought out a CSA specialist to help. She told me several things that really helped me in my thought process (although it comes up often and will come up again, but now I have some tools):

1. I don’t need T to feel what I feel (At that moment she told me this, I felt that T hated my guts). She said I could be sitting in front of a chair and I would think the chair hated me.
2. What I perceive others to think about me is how I perceive myself. I was projecting how I feel about myself and assuming everyone else felt the same way.
3. The reason I believed T hated me is because in reality I hated me. I had a hard time taking in what my T said because I didn't believe it for myself.
4. Even though feelings are strong and overwhelming, they don’t always communicate the truth. I need to challenge my feelings and test them to see if they are true.

I realized my self-hatred and self-rejection was a defense for feeling shame. Working through the shame issue helped me work through feeling worthy of receiving love. When I felt worthy for those two seconds, I was able to accept T’s love for two seconds. The more we work through this, I can carry those feelings a little longer.

My faith played a big part in working through the shame. Thinking through having intrinsic value and not being defined by the circumstances or experiences in my life was a huge help. I realized my shame was a result of denying my humanity. I expected perfection to be acceptable. Once I accepted the limitations of being human, I could start thinking about having more realistic expectations of myself, which in turn relieved some of the shame. Ultimately, allowing my faith to define me instead of my defining myself or asking T to define me helped me get to a place where I could actually absorb the love and care of my T. Shame rears it’s ugly head and overwhelms me on a regular basis. I feel like I’m a full-time shame war, but now I have a few tools in my belt to help me work through it.

Feelings of jealousy often overwhelm me. I don’t know why, but T talks about his wife with almost every illustration he gives. I hate it. Some sessions, he can bring her up 4-5 times. I haven’t been able to tell T how I feel about it, but it fills me with so much jealousy, fear, anger, feelings of inadequacy, and feeling like I’m not enough. I came to a conclusion, but I have yet to talk it through with anyone, so sorry if it doesn’t make any sense.

I feel like my jealousy is because I’m so afraid to lose what I want. I want my T’s unconditional love and acceptance. I want to feel special, loved, adored, needed, unique. I want all these things, and even though I don’t have them, I’m afraid of losing them. I decided to change what I want. Instead of obsessing about wanting those things from T, I decided to focus on wanting to heal and getting stronger for myself. The jealousy hasn’t gone away, but it’s slowly decreasing in intensity.

In one session, I think T could sense my jealousy starting to grow. He challenged me by asking me if I love one kid less when I think of another kid. Or if I loved my kids less when I was with my spouse. Or if I loved my family less when I’m with my friends. He said we are capable of loving more than one person at the same time, even if they are not in front of us. And he is capable of thinking about me and caring about me when he’s with other people.

I want to say you are absolutely not a failure in therapy. Your response to your T’s wife is so normal considering your past experiences. I’m sorry it’s such a frequent occurrence. Frowner Your experiences created feelings about yourself, but your feelings, which are really strong, aren’t telling you the truth about you right now. Your dad should have protected you. It was his job. Just because he failed in his job doesn’t change your worth and value. Your accomplishments, talents, and attributes are to be celebrated, even if those around you fail to see that. Other people’s accomplishments don’t invalidate your accomplishments in any way.

Sorry for the super long post. I hope it’s somewhat coherent. I’m still raw from recently processing this all myself.

PF
Hi Monte... glad to hear it's going well with your T. Feeling safe is so important. I think that this is where I get stuck. I really do not feel safe when I got to see T and I can sit there and tell myself he is safe and try to get past that wall of fear yet, whenever he comes closer in proximity to me I curl up in fear (internally). I need to talk to him about working through this.

PF... that was an immensely helpful explanation for me. I am definitely 1-4. I can't take in what T says about me because I don't feel that way about me and it seems like he's making this all up to make me feel better and it's a bunch of hooey. He says he wants me to see me as he does. Well, I don't want to see me at all and if I catch a glimpse of me, I recoil in horror that this is what others see. My mirror is usually empty but if something IS there... it's always horrible. My T says he wants me to see myself the way he does... undistorted by the past. I despair of ever accomplishing this. Thank you PF and I wish you well with working through these things. It's not for the faint hearted.

Thanks so much RT for the encouragement and support with therapy work. It is really hard at times, as you know.

Well, last Thursday I finally somehow in the middle of our session blurted out that the day almost 2 years ago that I came to see him to talk about my grief around school and not having the opportunity to go on to grad school due to financial issues and also that I could not meet the internship requirements in order to graduate without quitting my regular job... that was the day I was blindsided by seeing this HUGE gold nameplate on the door next to his with a HUGE M.S. on it and I told him I was so shaken that I never told him what I had to on that day. I just buried it away. And as a part of this shock of finding out his wife just also graduated, with a higher degree, it felt that our celebration of my own graduation felt like sham, felt irrelevant and fake and contrived because he had this other real life celebration in his life and mine was stupid and we couldn't even really celebrate like people do in "real" life. And I lost all positive emotions connected to that day. That memory was now forever tarnished and is something else to grieve. Something else that I lost.

T allowed me to talk and actually seemed shocked at what I was telling him. He really had no idea that this was bottled up for so long and how I have been affected by his office arrangements. He told me he wanted to make a deal with me .. but I refused and kept saying no. He said he wanted me to never not tell him something I need to say to him. That I should never hold back or allow anyone to stop me from telling him things. But I cannot promise that. Not the way I'm feeling now.

He also told me, in a very quiet and serious tone, that he does not compare me to anyone else. That our celebration was very special to him because he really knew how hard-won it was and how much I had gone through in order to graduate with my B.S. I had to take a six month leave from school because of the trauma of oldT. He was the one who helped me to recover enough to re-enroll and finish my degree. He said sitting on the floor and drinking cider and cookies was memorable to him and he would never compare it to anything else. He also said that even if he WERE to compare me to anyone else, that I would, in many instances, be far better. Way better than I could imagine.

I told him that it is too hard for me to believe what he says. He asks me if I think he's lying. I say no, but maybe his standards are too low and he bursts into loud laughter. And thanks me for letting him know he standards are low. I also tell him he may be delusional. He laughs at me again and tells me that I insult him more than anyone else who has ever sat in his office. Then he smiles and says how much he enjoys me. I swear that man is crazy!

I know we talked of other things too but I was so activated I can't remember the other stuff. All I know is that I was extremely exhausted after session and had to go to work. It was a long day. And I felt okay for awhile but then I started to panic at what I told him and how open I was. The anxiety got really bad so I called him on Friday but we kept missing each other. I emailed on Friday night and got a reassuring response on Saturday morning.

I think I am beginning to feel his care but it's still quite frightening to acknowledge it. His constant, consistent steadiness and always being there for me is beginning to count for something. I just am not there yet where I can feel it.

Tomorrow is another session.

Thanks all
TN
TN, I am glad you are beginning to feel your T's care. That's good and with time more will follow. Scary...yes but good feelings too. I find with my T that the constant steady assurance of her being there when I need her, is without question, the most healing thing for me. You have got such a gem of a T there. I know you know that. Keep letting his care soak in bit by bit.
TN

I'm so happy for you being able to express what had been incredibly painful and bottled up for so long!! That took mega-courage!

it's awesome your understood.

My T is like yours in really REALLY wanting me to express ANYTHING to her - and ESPECIALLY if it's something she has said or done that has left me wounded (her word - wounded describes it perfectly!).

She reminds me so often, it's reassuring - I like to think the more our Ts say it, the more it sinks in. I know it has for me - I DO feel more able to share with her when things aren't right. It's bloody scary and really hard - but it always HELPS.

It's how we develop a better understanding. Your T will have a deeper understanding as to what hurts you now, since you've told him all of it. It can only result in better care and support for you - but as my T also reminds me - she's not perfect, she's human and yes, she WILL get things wrong sometimes - but she would NEVER EVER hurt me on purpose or try to 'test' me.

Another thing I think is important - my T says I need to tell her because it's imperative we don't inadvertently repeat old relationship dynamics. If I never told her how she hurt me (even though I know it's never on purpose), then it's much easier to fall into old relationship dynamics.

Even with the. Best care and intention. Not sure if you read my post ages ago how at the end of a session my T bought up something that I'd emailed her and said in my email I want able to talk about yet due to it being too triggering..... When she bought it up at the end of our session I froze in fear and panic. She kept taking and prodding and the result was devastating - it felt like molestation - I froze and she kept going, while inside I was screaming 'no no no'.

Anyway - I was able to tell her - via email - 2 weeks later. I'd not wanted to tell her because I knew she would be pretty horrified that I'd felt that way from something she said / did. I wanted to protect her feelings (old pattern of mine). In the end, telling her was the right thing to do. had I not, it would have greatly affected our relationship dynamic and I would have responded in old ways (traumatic relationship pattern like with my mother).

Anyways, hope you're feeling less afraid today, and hopefully the positives of speaking up are glowing through - I hope a wee part inside of y knows and believes your T

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