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Wasn’t going to post anything about this finding a new T stuff until later this week but I’m spinning around so much with it felt I needed to say something now.

It’s been seven weeks since I finished with ex-T and since then I’ve seen eight new Ts - most of them twice, three of them three times, and been back to see ex-T one more time as well. (Not to forget the two I contacted but who were just not ‘suitable’.) That’s got to be some sort of record even for me!

Can’t even begin to describe how crap I’ve been feeling over most of this time - all sorts of stuff going on in my head, from impotent rage at being unable to get what I need to a profound sense of hopelessness and defeat (with the inevitable drop back into it’s all my fault I expect too much I’m unfixable I can’t even be liked by someone who is paid to be on my side blah blah blah) and all the time I’m driven to keep looking, surely someone somewhere out there will be there for me (hm does that sound like an old pattern?)

So ok this is where the state of play is at the moment - I met one T that after the first session with her I came away totally bowled over - rabbited on endlessly to husband about how wonderful she was how I felt so heard and listened to and god damn it understood - yes folks that magical never experienced before experience of being understood, at least about one major thing in my life which I’ve never and I mean NEVER had understood - was not only heard and understood but this T actually got just how horrific and devastating the effect of that one thing is on me.

Have seen her twice more since and though she’s not exactly a mind reader - in fact she says things just like every other T that shows maybe she’s not as much inside my head as I long for - but for some really strange reason it doesn’t bother me like it does with other Ts. You know I think I like her, really like her. WTF since when was I capable of actually openly and unreservedly feeling something positive for a therapist? (or anyone for that matter!)

She’s warm and friendly and kind and caring and so very obviously totally ON MY SIDE. Wow double wow that’s a first. It’s a very strange feeling having these kinds of positive feelings towards and about her (makes me suspicious of my motives lol). But that I like her so much actually makes a HUGE difference to me - I look forward to seeing her I’m actually GETTING from her she’s not a T who sits in silence not responding to what I’m saying nor does she run off at the mouth on tangents that have nothing to do with I’m saying. She talks a lot, but everything she says is related directly to what I’m saying, and what’s so great is that she is so overwhelmingly positive towards and about me - she’s giving me some of what I’m so desperately craving. How could I not feel wonderful towards her Big Grin

Ok so that’s the upside. But and there’s always a bloody but, a damned downside. She only practises one day a week (sorry to those of you who see your Ts even less often, but for me twice a week - even more - is paramount.) Even that I could live with (I’d have to wouldn’t I?) it’s that in another two weeks she is off for at least six weeks. So I get to see her twice more and then nothing until at least September. And even then there’s a possibility that she might not be able to return to work (she’s going for surgery). Oh no no no no!!!! Why why why why???? Just when I find someone who is so very right for me they are going to disappear. I’m getting my knickers in a real twist about it I cannot believe how crap that makes me feel - to get a taste of what I’m really wanting and to have it snatched away from me and nothing I can do about it. Shades of old old old patterns repeating themselves there.

If I were still at beginning to look for a T, I’d not have had a problem with this I’d have calmly gone oh ok well I’ll just wait until we can start properly. But of course the state I’m in now the very thought of having to wait even ONE week screws me up, SIX weeks is like being sent through all the levels of Dante’s Inferno. I AM NOT A HAPPY BUNNY!

Apart from everything else the knowledge that she is going away makes me really defensive about doing too much in therapy because I’m far too scared to start going into anything heavy knowing that I won’t have that sense of ongoing support from her. At the same time I’m just about bursting with things that need to come out so I’m having to sit on everything, control, regulate, stuff away and it’s killing me this incredible tension between needing to let go but having to hold on to stay safe. BOLLOCKS to being denied what I want (stomp foot, throw tantrum, curse the universe, wave fists at God!!!)

I see that in writing all this it’s become really obvious to me that no matter what, she’s the one I want to work with. Oh hell. There’s a complication, in that because I knew she would be away for all that time I’ve continued trying to find another T, and think I might have found one who though nothing like the one I like, who doesn’t make me feel good about seeing her (she’s not a warm friendly caring type and she has already said so many things that tell me she hasn’t really clicked at all to what I’m needing) - but she did strike me as maybe being able to help me all the same. This is only first impressions, I have a second meeting with her end of the week and am willing to go along without being my usual defensive picky self because I so need to start therapy NOW and need to find a way to get over that six week gap the other T has created.

But I’m really divided. I so want to go with the first T, except that six weeks for me in my state at the moment is just TOO long to wait - so I’m spinning around knowing I have to commit one way or the other otherwise I’ll get nowhere anyway. I’ve thought that maybe I could see this other T during the waiting time and pick up again with the T I really like when she comes back, but that means either I commit to the good T and therefore wouldn’t give therapy with the second T a chance, or I’d end up having to commit to second T and would have to forfeit the commitment to the good T. And the second T would no way go along with seeing me just as an interim measure until my chosen T got back - therapy just doesn’t work that way and I know I wouldn’t be bringing the stuff I’d need to make it work anyway (the whole commitment thing.)

Wow am I stuck here, torn between what I really want but unable to get it, and having the option of working with someone I don’t feel as good about but who is so much more available (right now, twice weekly, and continuous presence).

Actually don’t know what the point of this post is, except to just lay out where I’m at at the moment. In the meantime for the next two weeks I suppose I could see both of them (but both have been clear that they won’t see a client if that client is also seeing another T at the same time, so I’d effectively be lying, pretending that the other doesn’t exist and that would make me feel really uncomfortable seeing as whatever comes up in specific sessions I’d have to keep out of the other T’s sessions oh on and on and on this is a crap situation.

Well on the positive side, it does mean I will have, one way or another, a new T. Sometime.

Any thoughts anyone? Even advice would be really appreciated at this point Big Grin

And thanks for reading this, I know it’s a messy post and not saying very much and as usual very LONG (what a surprise lol).

LL
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Lamplighter, It's a tricky situation and really bad that you can't have the T you want right now.

I will tell you something about myself. I'm not very friendly towards newly met people, I don't really know how I happened to meet a T I like at once.
It happened to me quite often that I met some people that I didn't really like, I fucking hated them and was annoyed by them without any reason. Just refused to like them.
But after a while when I got to know the person a bit better, I really started to like them a lot, really became close and warmed up towards them hugely.
So since the first, lovely T is not quite available, I'll tell you, go with the second one. You never know, it may still develop into a wonderful relationship.
To be honest the persons I disliked so much, became really dear to me, so I really wish something similar happen to you.
Take care! Smiler
Hmm, Lamplighter dear... it's really good to read where you're up to with this, and I have to say I am really having tiny little yippee-skippee jumps inside that you are seeing something potentially positive/helpful with both of these women - even if neither is perfect. It SUCKS that the good one is going to be away for so long, but I might have said that before.

I too am experiencing all that hopeful rosy-tinted hoping with my new T (appt next week) and I am acutely aware of how VULNERABLE it makes one! I'm finding my head is just building up all these plans of how I want it to be, what I want to achieve... and I'm wondering how much I can make it happen like that, or if for whatever reason it won't, and oh god, the potential disappointment... heartbreak, really, when you have this snowballing inner sense of what MIGHT be possible through this relationship. So I get how tenuous and LOADED all this is.

OK, enough about the blimmin feelings! As I read your message, my head filled up with advice ideas. So, neither of these women will see someone who is seeing someone else concurrently... that makes sense - but it's a little bit different to having a commitment to one therapist and openly asking the other if she'd be willing to do short term stand in work with you while you wait.

It's sort of risky to ask - you'd have to explain that you made a commitment to the other woman (perhaps say you felt T1 had particular things to offer you in relation to particular problems, but that you also knew T2 had things to offer you too and you are in need of back-up in this time). And of course she might say no - and it's always horrible to ask for something and be turned down.

BUT she might say yes. Lots of Ts do short term work, and a plan for therapy can operate pretty much over any period - I think knowing the predicted time period allows the T and the client to set their sights on what is manageable within that time. That might be just - having a space to express yourself, and nothing more, for that period.

If it were declared like this, you don't need to worry about changing your arrangement (though you could if you found it wonderful after 6 wks!) and you don't need to worry about the depth of your commitment, either - the therapy is JUST a necessary (but potentially useful) stop-gap for a given period.

Oh dammit! I have just looked back over your message and seen you say this -
quote:
And the second T would no way go along with seeing me just as an interim measure until my chosen T got back
- so if you have already checked that out then all the above is irrelevant. But I'm gonna leave it up anyway, just in case there's a tiny bit of doubt over whether she might contemplate it, or in case it's an arrangement that might work with another back-up T (could you ask T1 if she can recommend someone for this? a referral might make the job easier). Don't forget it seems a pretty common arrangement for people to have back-up Ts, so to try to get this arrangement worked out is not crazy or weird. It's just that you know you need the support, simple as that.

Another alternative that occurs is that you might ask the really good T if she can give you stuff to work on/write on while she's away - that might help you feel like you are still in the therapeutic process, and that you have something to move forward to.

And another alternative that occurs is that you just run with T2 for the next 8 weeks - giving it everything you've got, but with the added security of knowing you have a really good second option to evaluate at the 8 wk mark. That might be a welcome change from this situation you've been in for ages, of feeling like there was little other alternative and you were pretty much at your last option. Only trick is you would have to still be open to the current T, and really willing to try it.....

OK, I think my spasm of compulsive advice ideas is over.... Mostly I'm just trying to say all my fingers are crossed that something really good for you can be assembled from this situation - it seems like there ARE some possibilities here, and I'm so hopeful that it will start to come together for you.

((((((LL)))))))
don't know if this helps, probably doesn't, but a good friend of mine, who is also a therapist, encouraged me to not get so intertwangled with the THERAPIST, but with the process of THERAPY.

i have to think she has something there, and that these 'all our eggs in one basket' type fantasy of finding the PERFECT THERAPIST, who connects PERFECTLY, etc. etc. etc. is just more of this fantasy life I live, at least, that there is a magic answer.

so maybe, keep up with her, find another of the ones you had liked in your interviewing process to keep up with too, and to have in the time when she is n/a, and at the end of that time you may have a better idea of who is the best fit to stay with.

another psychiatrist i spoke with once, who encouraged me to leave my CBT and explore psychoanalysis, and i told him i knew the CBT guy was getting less useful and repetitive, but i hated to leave him as he had so much history on me, anyway, the P said that 'we' tend to think that history is more important than it really is to the process. they are supposed to pick us up where we ARE and not so much in need of the inticate details of how we got there. i know that doesn't do much to feed our egos at to how 'special' and unique we all want to be to our T, but, it is a bit true.

so, i guess what i am saying, find a handrail to carry you through the period she is away, go to her before and after, and fill your desire for 2x a week stuff with two until you CAN merge into one.

i hope that helps, i know how hard it is to not have a handrail, as this transition phase for me has been incredibly hard. but know there is a silver lining up ahead, my friend!!

jill
Man, what a dillemma. LL, I like what Jones said, she really gets it here, I think:

quote:
in case it's an arrangement that might work with another back-up T (could you ask T1 if she can recommend someone for this? a referral might make the job easier). Don't forget it seems a pretty common arrangement for people to have back-up Ts, so to try to get this arrangement worked out is not crazy or weird. It's just that you know you need the support, simple as that.


You could say something like "I'm worried that at the very beginning of therapy with a new T, you will think it is strange of me to ask for backup right away, but I simply need someone to lean on in the time you will not be available to me." I think T 1 would really respect this, and it would show your honesty and trust in her to help you, which it sounds like you really are already developing. The sense I get from this, is that you think you do not deserve an interem support or alternative, almost as if you believe your issues aren't traumatic enough to warrant such a thing. Maybe that's off bas, if so, tell me- but if it is true, than just know, therapy is about getting your needs met, and obviously you need that support. Recognizing that and being able to ask for it could be a huge step in the therapuetic porcess itself! I for one, strongly encourage you to ask your prefered T to help you in this way, and to word it in the way that you are asking for the extra help. Scary, I know, Vulnerable is NOT a fun place to go, even though we may badly want to go there and need to go there.



I alos like what Jill said here:

quote:
they are supposed to pick us up where we ARE and not so much in need of the inticate details of how we got there. i know that doesn't do much to feed our egos at to how 'special' and unique we all want to be to our T, but, it is a bit true.


It's a little hard for me to hear this, I have to say, but it is pretty insightful, so I quoted it because it helped me to realize something really important about my own therapy.

I agree with Jones...
(I always agree with Jones! Big Grin) I think that there are many potential positives in your situation, and though it may seem like, oh crap, here I am in the middle of another dillemma about T's- it could be just depression or whatever talking there, and making you feel your situation is hopeless....I personally am doing my undignified chicken dance that you have found two potentila T's, and I think that by moving towards and not away from one of them, you will begin to move towards the healing you so sererve, dear LL.

That being said, I want to say that I ion no way mean to minimize or downplay the pain and indecison and confusion you are experinecing... Frowner It really DOES suck that this has been so awful and hard for you, and it really IS no fair.

((((((((((((LL))))))))))))

BB
Sorry yet another mega post Frowner

Amazon thanks so much for your reply - yeah I get what you’re saying about initial impressions and that maybe giving someone time I can get to really like them - that’s always at the back of my mind to be honest because I know I’m expecting a lot very quickly. I am struck though that you said you liked your T straight away - that’s the position I’m in that I really liked this T immediately and still do even after three sessions and my gut instinct is to stay with someone about whom I (really unusually) feel so good without the usual rationalizations etc. She’s got to be someone special if I’m not being my usual suspicious and defensive self with her lol. Thank you for saying straight out what you think I should do - it’s very much what my rational self is telling me too!

Jones - I actually did ask for advice!!! But ‘ideas’ are also very much appreciated Big Grin .

Firstly want to say I’m so glad you’re seeing your new T next week and don’t have to wait eons to continue with therapy and secondly yeah I so get that sense of hopes and dreams and anticipation and all the fears that surface with wondering how it’s really going to go and potentially being disappointed and starting to brim (good word that you used) with all sorts of things you want to bring to new therapy. Fingers crossed for you that she is everything you need and more!

Ok ideas - to be honest I’ve just assumed that the second T won’t be happy about being used as an interim measure - basically her approach is solely person-centred and I’ve taken that to mean she doesn’t do short term therapy but reading your words has made me rethink this - you’ve made me realize I am scared to ask - that in doing so she’ll not only refuse but treat me as if i've done something really wrong and I’ll be back up the creek without a paddle and actually it goes even deeper than that it’s that I’ve lost the drive I had earlier to stand up for my needs - now I seem to be in the position of trying to ‘negotiate’ for what I want ie tippy toeing around trying to get what I need without being upfront about it. Because now I’ve learned all over again that if I’m open about what I want/need that ipso facto means I’ll be denied it. So I’ve dropped back into being all nicey nice and trying to convince Ts that I’m really a good well behaved client and won’t rock the boat by being demanding and acting like I deserve to get what I want. Hm.

Actually the way you’ve worded it makes it seem so much simpler and less fraught than I’m working myself up about. Putting it the way you’ve suggested makes it downright reasonable! Just realized that what’s bothering me is that I’ve effectively been duplicitous by not telling any of the Ts I’ve seen that I’m also seeing other Ts at the same time so feel like a bad child who’s about to be caught out in lying and manipulating. Hell I hate all this stuff coming up!

Jones ALL your ideas are great - they’ve really pulled me up short, momentarily stopped me spinning in this silly circle and made me stand back and really look at the possibilities. THANKYOU.

I’m glad you openly said that about asking the T I like for a referral or suggestion - it passed through my mind as a fleeting thought already but I think I dismissed it because I’d already got this other T lined up and it seemed to me to be just really tempting fate to ask for yet another T to see. But of course it makes sense! The T I like has actually said twice now that she doesn’t mind if I see someone else while she’s away (doesn’t MIND? I should jolly well think not!) and I replied yeah well I’ve been having problems finding even ONE T to see, it’s not like I can just go phone someone up and make an immediate appointment! But of course she would be the best person to ask for a recommendation anyway. I will do that next Tuesday when I see her again.

And BB thanks for reinforcing that suggestion - for some reason I seem to be spinning myself out about what ought to be really straightforward stuff.

quote:
just know, therapy is about getting your needs met, and obviously you need that support


Thank you for reminding me of that. You’re right too in what you say, maybe even the not deserving bit, because suddenly I’m finding myself in a place where I’m terrified of being judged and ‘punished’ for trying to get what I want and don’t seem able to just ask outright. What the hell has happened to me over these few weeks????

You know what’s really spinning me out about all of this? It’s that I’m having to bloody well fight and struggle and make decisions and be all damned grown up and self caring about it when what I really want is for someone to come along and take care of it all for me. To have a T say yes ok this is it, we start now and everything will be ok you don’t have to worry about finding someone anymore you can stop holding it all together and just get on with what you really need to do. And they all lived happily ever after lol.

I am so tired of this interminable struggle, this daily fight to keep myself together to keep going to keep on participating in an adult world where I don’t belong don’t fit don’t feel safe don’t know the rules...

Oops bit of truth and honesty slipped out there, well I suppose it is true though. This whole sodding business of trying to find a T who will be able to help me is really taking it’s toll, really flagging up the never very far away sense of being at the end of the line all the time - desperation doesn’t even begin to describe it.

Sorry bit of an emotional digression there.

Jones your other idea about the T I like giving me something to do while she’s away to keep up the therapeutic connection - damn good idea it is too, I will (if I can be brave enough) ask her about that too.

Your last idea about running with T2, is actually what my rational self (rational? is that so, hmm lol) is saying, in line with what Amazon suggested too - I’m posting a bit prematurely here because I have a second session with T2 later today and will have a much better idea of whether she really is going to be helpful or not and so be in a better place to make whatever decisions I have to. Oh hell decisions just wish things would fall into place for once without all this agonizing!

Jill thanks so much for your reply - I too would pick out the quote BB pasted - that’s exactly what I’ve been banging on about to all the Ts I’ve been seeing - word for word ‘I need you to help me get in touch with what I’m feeling/thinking in the present moment in the here and now never mind the past and my background and the reasons why I am as I am’. (I’m very good at talking endlessly ABOUT why and how and what happened, the help I need is in keeping me focused on what’s actually happening in me in real time.) It’s something hardly any of them seemed to have understood.

But I have to disagree with your therapist friend - for what I need, the therapist IS the therapy. Trust is the biggest issue for me without it I don’t have a hope in hell of getting anywhere and unless I feel I can get to trust a T at some point it wouldn’t matter how wonderful their approach or method is I’ll stay shut up in my intellectual defences. Lol I don’t need a perfect T, just a good enough one.

Ok I’ve really rabbited on here. I want to thank you guys so much for replying - it’s only once I started writing this stuff out that I’ve realized just how screwed up about this I’ve become and hearing your supportive and helpful words has really made a difference to how I’m feeling. Thank you Smiler

LL
quote:
So I’ve dropped back into being all nicey nice and trying to convince Ts that I’m really a good well behaved client and won’t rock the boat by being demanding and acting like I deserve to get what I want. Hm.


Thank you LL, for putting this thought so coherently into words for me. I am realizing that my sweet little girl does exactly this: demands her needs. I need to look at why this makes me so angry. You may have saved me from crushing her spirit with this one simple phrase. I am realizing, when she so eloquently demands and knows what she needs, I MUST learn to respond with kindness and understanding even when I cannot meet the need, otherwise she will grow up to think she has to be all nicey-nicey and leant to be clueless about her needs in order to get them met. How sad...that someone knowing exactly what they need and asking for it should cause another person to respond by refusing to give it because they wern't "nice enough" about it. Why? I just want tho thank you because I have seen my own tendency to squash these demands under a cloak of niceness, instead of encouraging my daughter to express her needs and accept the forceful nature of her demands. And I believe she will calm down once she sees that her demands are understood and that I honestly try to meet her or at least understand what she needs and accept the pain of not being able to meet them without turning it on her and squashing her.

I've written this because I wanted you to see how much your posts can in very serious and concrete ways help others. Expressing yourself hoenstly is such a good thing. I pray you find the T who can meet what you need!! This new one sounds very promising...even though she "doesn't mind" if you see other T's, I still think it is good she said it, especially since it is something you seem to feel a bit guilty about.

You are getting there LL!! It really seems like you are getting there....your resolve to get your needs met is amazing and wonderful! I can see that very clearly.

BB
LL,

What has already been suggested by everyone else was where I was going to go with this as well. I think there are several options available from asking T1 for an interim referral (and work), to seeing T2 in the interim and then deciding, to asking T2 just to be a backup. Hopefully you will get a more clear idea after another session with T2. I am really pleased that you have connected so well with T1. It really does suck that she is going to be gone so long!

Jill: I also have to disagree with your therapist friend. My relationship with my T IS the therapy. Not in it's entirety obviously, but to really separate myself from my T and just think about the therapy and not the therapist would cause me to be so guarded and disconnected that I would never be able to make meaningful progress. As much as I hate to admit it, my eggs are all in one basket. This is not to say that if (God forbid!) something happened to my T that nobody else can do T with me, but they would be hard shoes to fill. Not because I've idealized my T or think she is superhuman, but because I've found a unique connection with her that is so much the process that starting over would be devastating.
{{{{{{{{LL}}}}}}}}

Hi LL, I don't have much to add to all the great feedback you've already gotten. I'm sorry that it has to be so complicated...but I hope you will ask for what you need, and I very MUCH hope there is a way to make things work with T1! I really love that she understands you so readily, and even the little things that normally might bother you with other T's don't bother you with her. And you've seen her three times now, so you know she's consistent. Big Grin If a choice absolutely has to be made, I'd hold out for T1 instead of settling for a lesser connection with T2. I really liked the idea of asking T1 to help you get through the time she'll be gone, whether it's assignments or maybe phone calls at least. Then if she really can't return to her practice after her surgery (banish the thought!)...then you could look up T2 again or continue the search. But I really really hope that doesn't happen. Good luck, LL...keep us posted.

Hugs,
SG
quote:
I am so tired of this interminable struggle, this daily fight to keep myself together to keep going to keep on participating in an adult world where I don’t belong don’t fit don’t feel safe don’t know the rules...


i hear you loud and clear on this thought!! would life just STOP for a moment so i can catch my breath!!!

and all, as to my friend 'the therapist'...her concept to devour the PROCESS of therapy, i think she saw me idealizing T3, and she wanted me to settle my hopes on that MAGICAL connection, and really work on the issues i need to work on. i agree, it is tough to imagine separating the person from the process, but i do agree that no one person (T) can fulfill our needs, as, by the very nature of the theraputic relationship, it IS (or should be) one sided. don't get mad at me, i don't like that thought either, and it is only that very small, logical adult corner of my mind telling the rest of my "slobbering, looking for a mommy" head, that, my years for being accurately and realistically MOTHERED are OVER. not that some critical parenting steps can't be achieved in therapy, but, a T is NOT our mother, or our lover, or our best friend!! I wish it weren't so, but i think letting go of that mirage is critical, as one day it will have to be realized.

i wanna go suck my thumb, too. and make all this SHIT go away!!! i wish and pray and pretend all day long, as i act like a blasted adult, but i really want to suck my thumb and cry!! i guess what i am saying, is, i am on y'alls side, but a T can never be, for me, anyway, what i wish he/she could be. therapy isn't real life, real life is, unfortunately. and please, ignore me as i don't intend to hurt anyone's feelings with these thoughts, and i am quite jaded as i have been through the T's lately, but, i am trying to get realistic with myself, rather than set T3 up to be perfect and crash SO HARD when i realize she can't truly turn back the clock and be my mommy.

i sincerely hope i am not being rude, friends. and know, i am extremely f-ed up, so what i say holds little truth i am sure!!
Hi all -

Interesting discussion here on being invested in the therapy or the therapist - I tend to think they are not mutually exclusive - like you can like caramel AND vanilla, as I profoundly do. I don't have much time but I want to say I get how fundamental the relationship with T is to therapy, and a close, attuned, stable T relationship seems to do incredible things for people. But there are so many situations that can interfere with that relationship and its stability.

Jill, I like your friend's formulation because it suggests the game is not 'over' for us even at the times when we don't have access to that ideal relationship, and I see that to be true on this board every day. We're all still invested in healing, understanding ourselves, trying to figure out a way through the difficulties and a way to get to the care we need. So that pushes us forward - we write, talk, think, read, engage with the process and we keep on keeping on trying to find a suitable person to help us with that if we possibly can. And I think that's the same sort of investment in process - in actively healing ourselves - that primes us for making good use of therapy itself, and that supercharges the therapeutic work when we do get into the right relationship (or a good enough one). And I know that everyone on this board has that active energy about their therapy - because they are here on this board!! Smiler

LL, you're very welcome. Remember that you are well within your rights to check out as many Ts as you like, and in fact it is a REALLY responsible thing to do, because you have a good idea of what you need, and you are trying to take care of yourself. I still see you on that boat, and I know you are using all the skill you have to get it to the right place to pick up someone you can really TRUST to help you sail it. You're not a bad child at all. No client reveals all information at the first session, and I'm quite sure you will say all that needs to be said at the right time.

quote:
What the hell has happened to me over these few weeks????

You know what’s really spinning me out about all of this? It’s that I’m having to bloody well fight and struggle and make decisions and be all damned grown up and self caring about it when what I really want is for someone to come along and take care of it all for me. To have a T say yes ok this is it, we start now and everything will be ok you don’t have to worry about finding someone anymore you can stop holding it all together and just get on with what you really need to do. And they all lived happily ever after lol.

I am so tired of this interminable struggle, this daily fight to keep myself together to keep going to keep on participating in an adult world where I don’t belong don’t fit don’t feel safe don’t know the rules...


Yes, this has been going on for far too long for you.... Anyone in this situation would feel absolutely exhausted. You have incredible tenacity, though, incredible strength and passion. These will get you through - they have allowed you to survive so far. I believe you will make it, and that the signs are looking good for you to get some relief soon. Hang in there, friend.

xxJ
And Jill - you're in this battle too, I know! I don't know if this fight to get the care and nurturance and love we need ever goes away, but I know it settles down as we bit by bit get the fundamentals sorted.... I love how DETERMINED your little girl self is to BE a little girl - and I'm so glad that your new T seems to have a clue. Hopefully she'll be enough of a mommy for you that some of that pain and lostness and hurt starts to be heard and be healed.

J
SG you’re not only welcome to peer through the curtains but come right in and have a cup of tea (and some fudge cake I’ve just made).

Thanks so much for thinking of me. Smiler I seem to be getting more screwed up with this new T business each day that passes and have landed myself in an exceptionally bad place - it must be bad because I can’t even bring myself to talk/write about any of it and that’s got to be a first. None of it is going well at all and I’m having a hell of a job keeping myself rational - real head down get through the days state at the moment. So apologies to everyone for not posting, I am still reading just not capable of replying much.

By the way SG I agree with BB please if you could bear to leave that longish (lol) post up I would appreciate it, lots that you said in it I know I want to reply to, just haven’t got the brain cells firing well enough right now to say it properly.

LL
{{{{{{{{{{Lamplighter}}}}}}}}}}

You are so kind...I'd LOVE some tea and fudge cake...how decadent Big Grin ...next time I will bring the cake...I just recently made a chocolate bundt cake called "Tunnel of Fudge" I'd like you to try, it is to die for. Then I can sing you a song, rub your feet, massage your temples...something to help get you through this desert-place you are in right now.

And don't worry, I won't delete the "longish" (yeah, I'd say LOL!) post...although it's just about killing me to leave it up there. Roll Eyes Just know that we are here thinking about you and ready to listen and support you when you are feeling up to posting again.

Hugs,
SG
Strummergirl, Draggers, Starfish and Attachment Girl (I started out with just the initials and it looked really silly!) - thank you so much for your sympathy and support - it really means a lot to me and is like a ray of light in this black mess i've gotten myself into. You've made me feel just that little bit less lost and alone and that matters to me bigtime - so thank you again, so much.

Hugs to you all

LL
UV thanks so much for your really helpful reply.

You’re so right about expectations. Ditto for me when I first went into therapy I didn’t have any conscious expectations because I didn’t really know what therapy was all about - but I DID have an assumption that a therapist knew what to do and was there to actively help me (ha ha how wrong could I be!) Many years later lol, I have a lot more open expectations of therapy, and have to say that this forum has informed a lot of them (all to the good!). Therapists for some reason don’t seem to make a point of explaining how therapy works or what a client can reasonably expect and that rather annoys the hell out of me!

Having worked my way through about a zillion therapists, particularly recently, I’ve come to realize I have pretty explicit expectations that stem from emotional needs - and while it screws my head up trying to sort whether these expectations/needs are realistic or not, or in my best interests, the bottom line is that any rational decision I make (if you can call it rational lol) is going to be based on my emotional responses to a T. Getting my needs met is (and has been *sigh*) such an overwhelming lifelong priority for me I’d be hampering myself not to go with a T who seems to be meeting them. Spent too many wasted and sometimes lethal hours with Ts with whom I had no emotional connection at all (except maybe negative) or maybe more to the point who had no emotional connection with ME, that I’m leaning more to allowing my feelings dictate my decisions (which doesn’t mean I don’t spend days and days endlessly thinking about it all as rationally as I can lol).

Actually reading your added post I think I’m saying in my typically wordy way, exactly what you’ve been telling me!

quote:
You stated so many concerns; i.e. needing to be in therapy 2 x a week and the length absences. Those are huge. I think you could be very disappointed if you chooose this T, despite the positive aspects/her qualities. The other rational component-you know you are going to be in this for the 'long term', thus, you know you will have to deal with one obstacle after another about getting your therapeutic needs met.


UV that’s exactly my fears! I just found out that this T will be off for more surgery again in six months time, which will involve another six plus weeks out of action. The frequency of sessions IS a big issue for me I can’t get away from that - the unavailability and potential breaks is what’s throwing the massive spanner in the works.

quote:
As far as seeing more than one T, I don't personally believe that is a good idea. I've never experienced that, so I can't say from experience as some others might. I just imagine that for myself, it would somehow take away from my therapy. I see potential confusion and triangular transference emerging. Although that could be positive-you could work thru triangular issues; then again, if you were intersted in doing so, some Ts might not be comfortable iwth that. You have already recognized some anticipated discomforts you would potentially have.


Totally agree with your UV, seeing two Ts at the same time is a recipe for bad therapy. Even these last couple of weeks seeing the two Ts purely in order to sort out what I’m going to do, I already ran into the issue of finding myself about to bring up stuff with one T that had arisen in session with the other T (kept having to check myself so as not to let it slip). But also, it’s the whole thing of commitment - running two Ts at the same time makes it hard to really commit to the therapy - always the temptation to play ‘mummy off against daddy’ type of thing, hedging bets and staying too defended ‘just in case’... And what’s worse is that Ts round here seem totally against a client being in any other form of therapy that doesn’t involve them (not ‘allowed’ to go to a group unless they are presenting it for instance) so even having a back up support T seems out of the question… I actually asked T-I-like in previous session about her finding me someone but she isn’t from this area and only knows Ts in a different county - too far away - BUT she was also really clear that she wouldn’t be my T if I was seeing someone else in the meantime so whatever other T I saw would have had to be my sole therapy, not just a back up while I’m waiting. Frowner Frowner

quote:
As for being more concrete about T qualities...I definitely recognized the 'being on my side' feeling you mentioned right away with my T. Since I am a fearful person, and I know from what you said you will relate to this, the reason I felt that, I believe, is because he was very honest and direct about his own feelings. I also think the being on your side feeling comes from being accepted, natrually, but mainly from feeling safe and trusting. This comes from T transparency. Maybe it was subtle (maybe not) but this T may have been direct about something that led you to feel safer.

I did some reading about paranoia and hypervigilance, and since you mentioned fears, maybe this concept will help you identify T traits that work for you. The more something is less obvious/abstract, the more it is feared. If it is concrete/provable, it doesn't cause paranoia (fear/anxiety-whatever you want to call it) to escalate. I so recognized this when I am fearful. An example-if a T has nothing on her desk, no pictures in the room, etc., your mind can fill in the blanks. If T has family photos and lots of stuff around (my T's office is filled with personal stuff), you don't fill in the blanks. If Ts office does not reflect anything about her, you may-probably unconsciously-wonder what she is 'hiding'.


You know UV that makes a lot of sense. The thing that’s struck me so positively about both Ts is that they come across as genuine - they are who they present themselves to be. Can’t quite put my finger on it but I just feel this authenticity coming from both of them. And yes both self disclose to quite a high degree (in one case, actually too much for me - I don’t WANT to know all this stuff about a T, not this early in the piece, because it just makes me concerned for them, thinking about them and putting them into the context of their external lives - stops me relating to them as a therapist and makes me relate to them more as a contemporary/friend and that’s not good for me right now.) Don’t know, I find myself stuck between two poles on the transparency/self-disclosure issue - on the one hand I want an ideal T who is there just for ME - totally involved with and thinking about nothing but ME - on the other hand to have a T be ‘human’ - ie bring their own feelings and thoughts to the therapy apart from me - could be more helpful in terms of experiencing how I respond in a ‘real’ relationship. This is confusing me. What a surprise.

I’m still not clear what the hell is going on with me and these Ts, and need to think about it a whole lot more - will be posting a new thread about it all shortly once I’ve edited down the several million repetitive and confusing words I will no doubt end up with once I start writing it out.

Thanks again UV for your really helpful and supportive reply.



LL
Thanks again UV for your thoughtful and supportive reply. :hug:

Been thinking more about this T self-disclosure thing, I get how in the end it can increase trust. I think though at the beginning of T it’s something that makes me pretty uncomfortable. Sort of reinforces the prohibition in my head about relating to and focusing everything in therapy on me.

Still it’s academic right now lol. Thought I’d post in this thread where I’m at with finding a new T as I can’t seem to bring myself to post that threatened mega post about it all.

As of Friday I am now T-less for the next few weeks, until the T-I-like comes back to work around September-ish. Did continue seeing T2 right up until Friday but just knew (after 6 sessions) that it wasn’t going to work for me. (She is the one who did a lot of self-disclosing.) But it wasn’t so much the self disclosing as that her approach was far too close to CBT to instil in me any levels of trust that she knew what I was on about. In fact despite careful and repetitive explanations on my part, it was pretty clear that she really didn’t get me at all. Which is a shame as there was something so very genuine about her that I intuitively responded to.

Anyway, I’m now committed to T1 - for some very good reasons (which are what I keep wanting to put up a thread about, but can’t seem to make myself sit down and think about it properly). So I’m going into limbo land for a while - don’t know how I’m going to get through the waiting, but ain’t got much of a choice. And you can bet I’ll be putting myself through hoops imagining all sorts of negative scenarios that will end up in my being permanently T-less. Uncertainty, doubt, fear I hate it all!

That reminds me of a comment you made earlier UV, about the spaces, the not knowing, which allows our fears to fill with worst case scenarios - and it’s infinitely worse when there’s no way of being able to disprove those projected fears. Uggghhh!!!!

Anyway, after having seen 14 therapists since first starting looking end of last year, I think I can say I have finally found the right T. I hope Big Grin .

Thanks every one for your support throughout this - couldn’t have done it without this forum.

LL
wow, LL, kuddos to you! that discerning mind of yours to KNOW what you need and when it is there and when it is NOT is SOOOOO GOOD!! i admire that!! i think my search was short in that anyone who is nice to me and doesn't fall asleep during therapy seems like a possible mommy to me! and i am hooked and wondering why i can't just go ahead and have her adopt me. and i don't even know her.

i really admire you knowing SO WELL what will work and what won't, and the resilience in sticking with it til you find it says so much about you.

YIPPEE!!! time will pass, i would say, read, listen to music...pray...i know how hard the waiting must be, but once you really get started, it will MORE THAN MAKE UP FOR dicking around (sorry!) with someone who isn't right, just 'available'.

hugs to you for time to pass well, not quickly, as i hate to wish days away, but pass WELL, my friend!!! ((u))

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