Hi number9!

I do in-person therapy, but when we can't manage a second session in person, T offers me a Skype as my second session. It can be real and connecting like in person therapy, but "parts work" is a big part of my therapy right now and it is virtually impossible over the phone, because there is not as full of a sense of T's presence, which both triggers a lot of what we need to work on and can be comforting, with or without touch. However, there are still lots of great and valid discussions we can have via Skype (no video) and I have found I still can have access to a decent range of feelings to discuss. However, we do tend toward more theoretical or administrative discussions, or else we will go over journal entries I have written, when we Skype. Thankfully (well, depending on how you look on it), I have a tendency of hiding my face during sessions, so T has become quite adept at picking up on signals from me just through my voice and being attuned even over the phone. Anyway, I think there is a certain amount or type of work I just could never do without being in person, but that doesn't mean that someone else could not. It really just depends on the person and their own needs. The one thing I have found on the pro side is it is certainly easier to TALK via Skype as I do not feel as exposed if I'm not being seen.

Interesting point! I don't like been "seen" on Skype... maybe I'm vain and it has this tendency to catch you and "freeze" you with your eyes closed and mouth open. Picture that when you are crying... oh, no, no, no! I would cover my face as well.

My T is pretty good at attunement via phone, and I actually prefer it. I can walk or curl up under my blankies and talk. Guess I'm in "hideout" mode.

Sometimes it would be nice to have a real human being present. I don't like hugs from strangers, but I think I would accept one from someone I trusted at it would be nice.

So, by online you mean over the phone? Or do you mean email or chat?

I'm struggling with this, because I want to 'see' my therapist twice a week. However, I sometimes have such severe anxiety I feel sick in her presence. We don't seem to be able to figure this out and I told her today I was "considering not going anymore, although I don't want that, but I can't figure out another solution to my problem." I'm thinking maybe phone sessions on Monday and in person on Wednesday. I've noticed I talk much free-er with her over the phone, but I think it has more to do with me being in my dark room at home, and I feel extremely safe in that room. I guess I sort of feel like this will be running away. As, I'd really like to find a solution to my anxiety problem! I just don't get it, I feel safe with her. Maybe it is a particular emotion (fear?) in general that kicks up my anxiety and if I don't talk about it I shake and hand-wring and feel sick....maybe that's it....anyway, rambling now.

actually phone, email, chat, and sometimes skype. I'm used to this kind of contact.

No worries, Ninn, I wanted to see what this brought up for anyone that wants to answer this question. I'm finding myself curious about this.

I'm kind of the "avoidant" type, but do feel urges at times to contact. I am like you, I like hiding out in my "cave" while I talk. I have never contacted in person, so I have no frame of reference. It is also interesting to observe how technology affects our social behavior. Am I weird that the only person I confide in is a person I have never met face-to-face? That I find walking into a room full of people to trigger feelings of lonliness, and that I have better luck connecting online? Does that make me one of those "socially retarded" types? These are good questions to ask, as I think that just being in physical proximity to a person does not make for a feeling of closeness. I for one feel connected to people via words, ideas, intellectual stimulation, bonding via deep conversation and theoretical ideas, etc. But I can totally understand where touch and contact is an essential human need, and I wonder if I'm missing out on that.

So Ninn, Does it sound like a good compromise to experiment with both types of contact? See where each takes you? Tell me what you think!

wow. I did online therapy with my therapist of two years, one I became extremely dependent on, and had HUGE transference issues with. It was so difficult. I think it is what destroyed my chances at succeeding in therapy with him...he even admitted to that. I started off therapy this way, over the phone. As I made some progress, we moved into video therapy. In retropect, the phone was much better for me, although, I couldn't go back to after starting the video therapy. I need to see his face after that. I wish I had stuck with exclusively phone therapy. It kept the relationship real. It kept things intimate, close, yet boundaried. It was safer. I should have stayed with that. Oh well.

Now I have in person therapist. Very different. Both have good points and bad. But I would not go back to online theray. Not ever. Therapy is unreal-feeling enough, without adding that diemsion into it. I needed to know my T was real. I never had that sense. It used to *kill* me to read about touch on here because I knew that would never be a possibility *even* if my T offered it. That was a bad feelings, I'll say that.

Just my own perpectives- take or leave. I really have no opinions about what is best for others. I just know for myself, it was an incredibly painful, incredibly tirggering experience, since I already had ostensibly available, but physically unavailable parents...it created instant reenactment.

Good luck with it- I hope you and your T can work it through.

BB

Blackbird:

These are very, very interesting thoughts. The phone feels real to me. Maybe my T and I have both learned to attune to each other's voices well, and it would be a shock to see added facial expressions, body language, etc. And.. um, he is an attractive man, and as a divorced woman, to be seen as attractive to him may be more important than I would like to admit. It would perhaps distract me. And would take more work

The "voice in the dark" is what I feel like I need to relate to, but it's real. Chat and texting are also interesting.

But like you said, if I were to start seeing a T in person, if I connected to them, it could be hard. And it's funny, I never had any sexual fantasies, but think at times that I would like to meet him in person, just for a damn HUG.

Guess maybe that is not so weird after all.

And thank you for the kind words, still working on that issue. (I am in a "distancing" phase-as I work out negotiations with him again, but every 12 hrs or so, cry as I mourn the connection we used to have!) Eh, but I guess that's common too.

You guys are great!

Oh yes, I remember. I did go through a HUGE phase where he felt "unreal" to me. I felt like a ghost myself, and still find most people to be unreal, unreliable, and phony, and was always waiting for him do disappear. Hmmmmm...

To clarify, we never use the video function of Skype, voice only. We did phone first, but once my insurance started covering it, they demanded the switch to Skype. And yes, there is something to be said for talking out of the safety of my closed room, at least when someone else is watching Boo in another location, as hearing her and others in the background can be difficult.

So it looks like exposure is a theme here, along with anxiety. Yeah. I can see that. We tried Skype for about 2 minutes, couldn't get it to work right, so we signed off, and never tried it again. It felt awkward. I think I did feel more "exposed".

In case I'm confusing you guys, we originally tried the skype thing, and found that we both preferred phone and sometimes chat or text. FB PM's are also used, used a bit like journal entries that I share with him.

I would never presume to tell anyone what kind of therapy is appropriate for them but for me I could never do online therapy. I need to BE with someone who I can see and FEEL there in the room. I need to read his body language and the non-verbals are what seems best to reach my limbic system and helps me learn to self-regulate my emotions which has always been an issue for me. In fact, my T pretty much insists on eye contact when we are speaking. He wants me to "take in" his expressions when I tell him things. He says I will miss a lot of important info if I don't look at him.

I feel for someone with complex trauma or attachment injury, where the hurt was an interpersonal or interrelational injury, it needs to be healed through a corrective interpersonal relationship. It would be difficult for me to feel that the relationship was real if my T was only a voice on the telephone. I think I would feel really alone with my grief, my tears and my emotions which is something I had enough of as a child.

number 9 you say you feel close through exchange of words, ideas, theories and intellectual conversation but those are all left brain activities. Intellectualizing can be a defense against accessing the deep emotional parts of yourself and if you only stay in intellectual mode you don't have the chance to integrate both parts of your brain. I agree it feels safer this way but is it healing you or making a difference in your life. Are you allowing someone else to know you, the emotional, deeply intimate you?

I don't know you very well and I'm not sure why you are in therapy so perhaps you are getting your needs met in on line therapy and it is working for you. You are the only one who can judge that. I really don't mean to be critical at all, just offering my view on this type of therapy and my own very personal opinion that I feel, for me, with my dx, it would not be very effective.

True North:

wow. this post is really thought-provoking (and emotion provoking, it turns out)

There is something odd I like about the phone. But I get what you are saying. An analogy would perhaps be being blind all your life. How could one describe the full experience to someone who has been blind all their life?

I would like to be able to enjoy both types of contact, for the same reasons I enjoy minimalist/simple things, but also enjoy rich and complex things (music, art, wine) Maybe that's a bad analogy. Why the preference for the "voice in the dark"? Is it because my other senses would distract me? Words are important to me, as is music, and sound. Something primal about that too. Or maybe I just want to hide, and let my words provide all the information about me, and not feel like I'm under a microscope quite as much. One day I'm going to have to be seen, though.

Sometimes I have a right brain response when I'm having a left brain conversation with someone. I think that people can bond over talking about ideas and concepts, sharing a passion, etc.

But.... I think you are correct. Something just feels a little unbalanced right now. And you hit on something pretty big there. I am not trying to be cheesy, but I felt a little teary-eyed at those last few paragraphs. I have almost no outlet for emotions. No wonder.

Those last 2 paragraphs showed skill in confrontation and compassion at the same time. Damn. Seriously. Thank you!

Mine has to be in person as I need the feedback from their body - I need to see it to help imprint their reaction and validation into my brain. Voice alone is not enough. I have object permanence problems so I need to see her to know she is there.

T has offered a phone consult over the holidays but i declined as I think it will be frustrating for me and will cause problems - I will only have her voice and not see her.

I don't ever touch my T - so I have her in the room as me - but we don't touch. But the thing is I *could* if I asked her. But I won't.

I think it is great that T's are so flexible in their delivery of therapy and that we are able to use different modes of therapy as they suit us. I think that is the most important thing.

I do in person therapy, but for about six weeks when my pregnancy nausea was at it's worst and I wasn't wanting to leave the house, we switched to phone sessions. It was okay. *Definitely* better than nothing. T has a very emotionally expressive voice. She's good on the phone, and having those sessions meant a lot to me. They were stabilizing and grounding while I was going through a tough time. I felt they did a lot to support me in the midst of constant feelings of pretty severe sickness.

We're able to connect well on the phone, and we had some important and productive conversations, but. . . I still greatly prefer in person therapy. It can feel more vulnerable, but being in that state of vulnerability seems to put me in a place where I'm feeling all of my emotions more, and where I'm able to receive more, on an emotional level, from T. TN put it well when she described how she feels being physically present is important for limbic connectedness.

quote:

Sometimes I have a right brain response when I'm having a left brain conversation with someone. I think that people can bond over talking about ideas and concepts, sharing a passion, etc.

Just wanted to say I agree with this too. Left brain conversation has been an important part of my therapy. It definitely helps me connect.

Hi Heldincompassion!

Agreed. Everything you mentioned, put together, sounds like a very nice balance.