Hi Wolfie

I don't know if we've met, but if not, then welcome to the forum

I am sorry that I couldn't reply sooner and am so sorry for your sadness and emptyness. They are really difficult feelings to handle on your own. I guess some would say that those are natural grief reactions, but you list so many losses that I wonder if it the realisation of that accumulation that compounds to make it especially painful.

I can relate to much of what you wrote, but especially:

quote:

My innocence lost before my life had really begun. I realise that I have memories, they are just not visual, they are emotional and physical. Sensations and feelings

wow those words ring out as being so dreadfully real. It's the finality of that for me, that nobody can ever give you that innocence back can they? But maybe you realising that as a significant loss is a start in the grief process. Do you look back and wonder how things might have been different 'if only....'? I can't bring myself to do that, as it seems to highlight my loss more. So I'm not really sure of how to ever accept that one.

quote:

My life lived in despair that something was not quite right with me, the black smear on my soul that has always clouded my feelings and perceptions of myself and others.

Oh yes, that too - I guess that leads on for me from the first one, always trying to tell myself I was ok and striving to be very ok, when I knew in reality I wasn't.

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My exquisitely painful love for my children; full of fear and expectation for them and their futures.

Yes - bautifully explained wolfie. That love is so very painful, but you have so much insight into your childhood pains and fears that your painful love will in turn be a positive experience too. It's painful because you care so much for them and maybe want desperately to give the care and love that was so lacking for you.

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My empty soul, that inner void that is gradually refilling with tears and life as I grieve and come to a better understanding and forgiveness of myself, my weaknesses and my human frailty.

Yes, indeed. I think that is a hope that many of us share. Thank you for phrasing it so sensitively.

I really hope that the work you are doing with your T helps to move you carefully and gently through your grief, and that you can tell her of your hurts as they surface and she can support you. Do let us know how you are feeling wolfie,

starfish

Thanks for your kind words Starfish - I feel like I already know a little about you from reading all your posts in here and I appreciate the time that you have taken replying to me

quote:

Do you look back and wonder how things might have been different 'if only....'?

quote:

I used to spend time thinking about what sort of a person I might have been, but that can be very destructive. T has helped me move past that and to think 'it would have been better if...' rather than getting stuck in the destructive pattern of wanting a past that can never be.

Going for my fortnightly appointment with my T this Wednesday. I always feel stressed and sick to the stomach before I go...he really makes me work hard and I always come away feeling like I have gone through an emotional wringer

The positive that has come out of all the reading and work that I am doing on grief is that I am understanding the impacts od suicide on those who are left behind - I hope that the things that I now understand come to my mind when I am in that dark place because I would hate to cause my precious children that amount of pain and confusion.

Wolfie

quote:

I am understanding the impacts od suicide on those who are left behind - I hope that the things that I now understand come to my mind when I am in that dark place because I would hate to cause my precious children that amount of pain and confusion.

I am wondering if you are referring to that dreadful impact on the one left behind, from the perspective of on who has experienced that in life OR trying to imagine how that might feel for another because it is something you have considered doing yourself? I realise these are really painful/personal questions and will really understand if you would prefer not to answer of course. I have experienced both and strangely it has given me a more understanding and compassionate perspective, that maybe I wouldn't have had before.

It's good to hear that your T is alongside you in all this ....that sick to the stomach feeling seems to come especially to the fore when we are doing really tough work in T. I tell myself that I feel like that because it is important and I care. It sounds like T is working really hard with you ON this work. I do hope Wednesday goes well and you are able to share your feelings a little with him about your sadness and emptyness,

Take care,

starfish

Hey Starfish, thanks for your reply

I am talking about it from the perspective of thinking about it as an option myself. Working through some pretty heavy stuff with my T sometimes really pushes me into a place where it feels like I will never be whole or normal or able to live life without this overwhelming pain and sadness.

We recently made a conscious decision to change track in my therapy because we were seriously hitting my triggers and it was getting to a point where I couldn't even remember what he was talking about in the previous session and my personality was fracturing (his term for when some of my alters surfaced, they seem to have taken a back seat since we moved on from that topic.) It is frustrating tgat when I try to address these things my entire system shuts down and I want to kill myself - so, how am I meant to work through it and get to the other side and become a whole and healed person? Therapy is so confusing sometimes

Well, it is 6.30am in Australia, so time for me to get ready for work!

Thanks for being there and listening Starfish, ((((((Starfish))))))

Wolfie, I'm sorry it feels so hard for you and you are having these difficult thoughts now. I am glad to hear that T has realised why these may be surfacing and has changed tack. It is also reassuring to read that those alters have taken a back seat since, but I guess it will take a while for your system to settle again.

quote:

when I try to address these things my entire system shuts down and I want to kill myself - so, how am I meant to work through it and get to the other side and become a whole and healed person?

oh (((wolfie))) I guess you have to trust your T really hard, despite any misgivings you may understandably have, and remain open as to how
you truly feel. Therapy is confusing, I agree ...have you asked the same question to your T, asked him to explain how he expects you to deal with this and provide you with strategies to work through it and maybe even a bit of reassurance that you WILL come through this pain and sadness eventually? In the meantime please take good care of you,

starfish

Hi Wolfie,
EVERYTHING you wrote about grief resonated so strongly with me. The heart of the healing I did in therapy, especially with my second T was the grieving, although I think the more difficult part of the grieving was actually accepting and facing the losses that needed to be grieved. I know that what you are feeling is painful and difficult, but I can see so much progress in your ability to identify all these griefs. I am sorry though for all your losses. They are very real and very painful to face.

quote:

I used to spend time thinking about what sort of a person I might have been, but that can be very destructive. T has helped me move past that and to think 'it would have been better if...' rather than getting stuck in the destructive pattern of wanting a past that can never be.

This really struck me because I remember when I came face to face with the realization that I had lived my whole life in a constant state of fear. So much so that when I realized I didn't need to be afraid all the time, it was scary to not be scared. I sat with those feelings between sessions and at my next session told my T that I had been thinking through so many major decisions in my life that had been driven by my attempts to keep myself safe, that fear had often been such a major factor in what I did. That I wondered what my life would have looked like if not for the fear? That part of what I was grieving was the knowledge that I could not know WHAT I was grieving. I remember saying that I couldn't know for sure that I would have chosen differently but... and my T replied that maybe it would have turned out the same but he knew I would have spent a lot less time scared.

quote:

It is frustrating that when I try to address these things my entire system shuts down and I want to kill myself - so, how am I meant to work through it and get to the other side and become a whole and healed person? Therapy is so confusing sometimes

And I just want to encourage you. I know it's really difficult to do this work, although I don't think I faced the level of difficulty you do, because although I needed to integrate some split off parts of me, they weren't alters so I was not dealing with a whole system the way you are. For which you have my deep respect, I think it takes even more courage for you to work through your healing. But the struggle you talk about, needing to address your past but getting so triggered that it makes it almost impossible is the struggle to stay within the theraputic window. We have to feel enough to experience what happened but it's so easy to get overwhelmed. John Briere is a leading trauma specialist (h/t to TN who introduced me to him) who talks about about this in his work. You can find articles by him on his website here:

John Briere

I'd also search for him on Youtube, there are some great presentations by him. I think you might find him helpful.

But what I really wanted to say was that I have felt each of the griefs you spoke of, and there is a far side to despair, a way out of the depression and grief. You are doing what you need to in order to heal and you'll get there. I'm glad you reached out to express your grief here, it can be helpful to be heard.

Peace,
AG

Hoping your session is ok today wolfie,

starfish

Thanks for your thoughtful words AG - it is encouraging that you have been able to work through and process some of your grief, I am limping along but hopefully I will get there in the end! I have started reading the John Briere article that you pointed me to, thanks for that, I am finding it helpful.

Starfish - so sweet for checking in on me Thanks for the good advice - I am trusting my T and he hasn't steered me wrong yet. It can just be so frustrating because I it is difficult to heal and work through stuff when I can't even be 'present' when we hit one of my triggers

I had my session with my T today and it was a good one, I wasn't 'absent' at all, I was
'present' and able to fully participate. I told him about my transference and he was so kind and gentle with me. He did a fantastic job of explaining it to me and was very reassuring. He said that if there is no transference then it is really just a conversation, not therapy Made me feel a whole lot better.

Am feeling very vulnerable though - having these feelings for my T makes me feel so very vulnerable but our session today really strengthened my trust in him. When you have had trust abused in the past it makes it hard to trust and feel safe.

I hope that you are all having a good day today

How you doing Wolfie? Just checking in ....

starfish

Hi, Wolfie...I'm so glad to see that you were able to tell your T and get so much reassurance from him about it...that is wonderful. Yes it makes very vulnerable feelings though doesn't it. It sounds like you have a good T who will respect and honor those feelings, though? Anyway, I just wanted tosay I like your posts. I hope it's still going well.

BB