(((((TAS)))))

No big words of advice. Just sending hugs. It sounds like you are in an awful bind.

Tas here's my take on what might be happening.
For some people out of session contact just doesn't work. My T said to me today that feeling cared for isnt something that can be traversed in text or email. Personally I have been REALLY pissed with my T at times because the brief text, email or phone call is so inadequate for the infant/toddler part of me who will only be satisfied with him physically being there with me. And this frustration turns into an inner apocalypse of rage and shame because i end up feeling I'm alone and terrified and nobody cares. Any good, safe image of him is completely destroyed. But for me to get better i need to carry a positive image of him with me.

Our T's can't always be there. Although we may carry terribly needy and abused child selves inside, the reality is that we are also an adult and shiuld be treated as such. Healthy adults can be independent but can move closer to an attachment figures at times of distress. If your T granted you 24/7 access, you would not heal, it would only encourage a dependency that's inappropriate and unhelpful. Our T's are there to give us what we need and not necessarily what we want.

Having said this, it is a painful domain to pass through but it is worth it.

I would encourage you t think really carefully about quitting. Have you discussed with him whether you could see him 2 or 3 times per week given out of session contact isn't working and once a week therapy isn't cutting it (and it wouldn't for me).

Hugs Tas xxx

Thank you Liese. I really appreciate it

Green Eyes:

Thank you for your reply. I was seeing him 2 times a week about a year ago but he thought it best to cut back to one time a week because he felt that it was only causing me to be more anxious...

I have tried to maintain a positive image of him...except I feel that I don't know how. I know he has to have firm boundaries but I feel that he doesn't understand. He wants me to come in and talk about this but I don't even know what to say because I don't even understand it...Not to mention how embarrassed I am that I feel so childlike and then I fall back on...but I am an adult...I own my own business...I am a full time college student...etc, etc. etc. Trying to convince myself that I shouldn't be feeling or acting this way because I am an adult, at least chronologically.

Anyway, I may just go see another Therapist to try and work out this negative transference. I know that I have to do something or I feel that all the hard work I or we have done to get to this point will be lost. That is not something I want.

Thank you for your reply
T.

Tas maybe he has problems handling dependency. Lots f T's do. Not your fault in the slightest if that's the case. I do understand you feel embarrassed to feel so needy and little, it's humiliating really, but incredibly normal for a child and especially one who didn't get what they needed from their parents. But it needs to be expressed and accepted to be worked through, and then healed over time xx

quote:

If your T granted you 24/7 access, you would not heal, it would only encourage a dependency that's inappropriate and unhelpful. Our T's are there to give us what we need and not necessarily what we want.

TAS - It's a tough, tight rope to balance on. But coming from someone who has experienced the side of the relationship that you are longing for...it is just as painful, but in a different way. My T was availabe 24/7. By email, text, phone...she would always respond. Day or night..we would have hour long text messaging sessions at times. Sadly, I got worse instead of getting better. As Green Eyes explained, my T created a dependancy that was not only innapropriate and unhelpful, but one that crippled me. I was unable to handle any emotion or problem or feeling on my own. I needed her for every single thing I thought, did, processed. In th end,I got extremely hurt by the whole process and I got worse in most areas, instead of better.
New T has good, strong, consistent boundaires. She does allow phone calls outside of session, however I have not used that yet so I don't know if she would put a time limit on our conversation or what.
TAS - I am a firm believer of trusting your adult instincts. While I believe that your T's boundaries are a good thing, they may not be just the right thing for you. Perhaps you need someone who will allow slightly more outside contact, but who still has safe boundaries.
I am sending you some big hugs and praying that you can work this all out and start feeling better.

Hi TAS,

Just checking in to see how you are doing. It sounds like such a tough place to be in. Can you remember how bad it felt when you saw him twice a week vs. now? Did you feel worse or better.

For me, once a week wasn't enough. I'm functioning much better going twice a week. But if twice weekly sessions, were making you feel worse, then maybe your T has a point.

I do have 24/7 phone access to my T. I cannot text or email. If I could, I would text and/or email much more often than I call him. Probably every random thought I had would get sent off to T and then when he didn't respond right away, it would throw me into despair.

I love the phone access because I think four times before I call him. It's not as easy to place a phone call as it is to text or email. I ask myself what it is he can do for me if I do call. Will it make me feel better? If I hang on, will the feeling pass or will I stay like this for days? And, so on. I don't contact him a lot out of session because it's hard for me to pick up the phone but it's nice to know he's there for me. For me, the worst thing was feeling like he was inaccessible to me.

What goes on for you? Do you think if he let you call only but not text or email, you'd feel like he was there for you more than you do now? That he understands?

TAS, I don't know you and I don't know your therapist but the trauma literature talks about the need for the therapist to make repeated offers for contact. Your therapist sounds like he's doing the opposite. He's limiting you to this tiny little window and I would feel as distressed about that as you sound.

It's worth talking through all the issues with him. There are some great articles out there about contact with the therapist that you can bring in as a resource. It also talks about putting into place check in phone calls instead of crisis phone calls. And, so, if you see him on Mondays and agree to a check in phone call Thursdays at 12 for 15 minutes, it might put you more at ease in between sessions.

It just sounds like it's not working for you the way it's going now. He might need to be a little more open and/or flexible here with you.

Hi Liese
I met with him today and he stated that there would be no texting contact allowed and there would be no phone contact allowed unless I had to call to tell him I was cancelling due to sickness. He said that he expects me to be at my appointments, without fail.

I just feel that he doesn't care. Now, I don't know if that is the child part of me or what. That's what I mean when I say maybe I am putting too much on him in the sense that I want him to be what he can never be.

I can never have all access to him and truthfully, that is not what I want. But, then again, I do.

The part of me that needs to grow up...then there's the part of me that desperately needs to know that he is here and present and not going anywhere.

So, how do I take the above limits? Do I see them as him not caring, OR do I see them as an act of caring because he is pressing me in some ways to grow even though it is painful.

The child who screams and cries as their momma takes them through the store, telling them no, they can't have what they want...the child, at some point, realizes that no means no...and no amount of crying or screaming is going to change their mind.

I feel that there is a part of me that desperately needs to hear that he is here...but he has told me that before and it is as if he doesn't exist when I no longer see him...it's very hard for me to maintain a connection with him...as soon as I walk out that door...he is no more.

He has never been mean to me and he has told me that no matter how long it takes...he will stick with me.

Every Therapist has a different way of doing things. I wish he would allow me just to touch base...but he says no.

I hope that by the time next week comes I don't feel so disconnected that I don't see the point in continuing. I do believe he is doing what he thinks is in my best interest...as that is the main object of therapy...What is best for the client.

I guess everytime I feel that I want to reach out to him...I am going to have to figure out something...maybe just write about it...I don't know.

I can feel that feeling of 'He doesn't care...' creeping back in...and then I spend my time on that battlefield.

I hope you are doing good and I am glad that you are able to see your therapist twice a week.

T.

TAS I am sorry that your T has said No to outside contact because I find it very helpful and I see T twice a week.

I am curious if he has explained his reasons WHY you cannot have any contact?? I think this would really be important to know and understand. I don't understand how he would believe you could form an attachment or development object constancy with him if you are not allowed to reach out to him when you need to.

Hugs
TN

I agree with TN that I'd like to kind of understand your T's point of view better. I have a very liberal contact policy and although it did make things very confusing (re: disorganized attachment) at first, I have found it so stabilizing when dealing with really hard work over the long term. Knowing I can check in that he's there and doesn't hate me when needed allows me to come in starting from a place of connectedness, rather than a place of terror and almost uncertainty of who he is (like awful transference and projection would replace him in longer periods of complete silence, or else I would just go numb and cut the internal connection, as it was too stressful to deal with those things on my own without being able to check in).

Thank you TN and Anonymously

TN: He said he believes the positive transference...me touching base and him replying is not harmful in itself but when I do touch base and he doesn't reply it lends to negative transference...I don't think he cares...etc. etc. etc.

I don't know. If I can't maintain a connection...and I have been seeing him for a year and a half...there is no point in staying. The ironic part is I fight connection ... I must have it...ugh, this is where I feel really messed up!

I don't know. I am sure he will bring it up next week. I don't think he is a bad therapist but he is very tight on his boundaries...

I guess I have to trust that he knows more about this than I do.

I don't see the point in only seeing him an hour a week and then struggle through...I have told him that when I walk out of that office...he may as well not exist...

Anyway, I could go on and on...I thank each of you for your replies....

It makes me think about wants and needs. Needs should be the priority because wants will displace need. That is not healthy either.

T.

Hi TAS. It sounds like you're in a really difficult spot. You keep running up against your T's boundaries with regard to outside contact and he is just not budging. While I understand other's point of view that your T will not and cannot be there 24/7, I find it somewhat disconcerting that he isn't able to be more flexible. I obviously don't know you or him, or what his thoughts behind this is, though.

Is this just his policy that he uses with every client? Or is this boundary specifically for you because of your negative transference and needs and whatnot? Maybe you have no idea. I just think that if this is his policy across the board, I would question his ability to really grasp attachment and how important establishing secure attachment with survivors of trauma is. On the other hand, maybe he has really, truly thought this through, taking in consideration your work together and your needs. If that's the case, I would ask him to explain his thoughts around how this boundary is helpful for you. You have a right to know and it is something that may have to be explained several times before you can integrate it.

I guess I lean more toward thinking it's making it worse to not have outside contact. I can only base it off my own experience, but I know it's always helpful for me to know what other T's do..so I'll just briefly share what my T does. We have never explicitly talked about phone contact/email contact outside of session. On a few occasions, my T has told me that I could call her if I wanted to. I did call her one of those times and we talked for 15 minutes. It was my birthday and the day after my uncle died. She was really nice and I felt comfortable calling her because she had said I could the day before. I've called her one other time, which was really hard to allow myself to do. It was a call out of the blue when I was having some difficulties. She was again really accepting of me and we talked for 20 minutes. It made me feel like she cared and was there for me. I've emailed her a couple times too, and usually the emails are brief, but once when I was really struggling, she emailed a couple paragraphs. So, that has worked for me. She is available, and does not make me feel ashamed of asking for help (although, it's rare I actually do ask for help). But just knowing she is there is comforting.

I wish for you that you could get some relief from the pain you're in. For me personally, I would feel kind of crappy knowing that I only had one hour of contact with my T and no chance to reach out if I really had to. I don't want to tell you what to do, and you obviously know yourself the best...but maybe there is another T out there who could better support your individual needs.

TAS - I think, if he has proven trustworthy, certainly trust him. But that doesn't mean not dialoguing to try to understand his point of view or tell him exactly what it brings up in me.

My T lets me email him journals, but he won't email back. His short texts (which are only more than a few words or a sentence of reassurance when there is a crisis going on) are very encouraging. Sometimes, it's something like, "Still here. " and it calms things down completely with inside kids.

It's possible he has perfectly valid reasons and this might work out better for you in this case. On the other hand, if you feel like it's causing distress, that's exactly the sort of thing to be exploring together. But, you have to show up to do that. I do agree if my T said I "had to" be there, it would panic me. When I've talked about quitting, T will tell me whether he thought it would be a good idea, but he always make sure I know it is my choice to be there and has always been. His saying I was free to run away made it feel safer to stay. But, I can see how being unwilling to show up regularly might interfere with working in the way that your T is trying to, as it sabotages the consistency and predictability he is trying to provide you. One of the last times I wanted to run, T said, you know, it wouldn't be quite so bad as it would have been in the beginning, and he had faith that I would do OK if I had to do that, but he still thought I could do a lot of growing if I stuck it out. Anyway, it was scary to hear he saw me as OK without it when I don't feel ready, but it also felt safe that he leaves the door open for me to decide what I need.

Anyway, I hope you can talk more about this with him, but I agree it should be directly in a session and not outside of one, as horrifyingly difficult as that is.

(((TAS)))

One of the hallmarks of a secure attachment is reaching out for help appropriately when needed. It doesn't sound like you are learning that. I really like what Erica wrote up above. Why not tell him that some of us have felt that out of session contact to our T's helped us to feel more secure and independent? What about setting up something structured so that you don't have to wait for his return call? Three or four days after your session, have a check-in call scheduled? Or even do two check-in calls two and five days after your session? Just some thoughts.

It seems as though you and your T are stuck right there and you aren't going to be able to do any therapy until this issue gets resolved satisfactorily for both of you. Not just him.