Oh yes the big question alright! One I’ve had levelled at me many times during my life (‘no you only want that you don’t need it - you’re not going to die if you don’t get it’ that sort of invalidating garbage which can’t be argued with.)

The way I look at it is that getting what I want IS a need - I need to know/experience that I have the ability to get what I want - this especially in relation to people where there is an imbalance of power (me wanting = subordinate/dependent on someone else’s choosing to give).

Big part of that is being able to experience that in not getting something I want, it isn’t an indictment of me (as it currently is). I therefore get myself tied up in knots trying to make a distinction between wanting and needing something - especially when trying to explain to others, there’s this sense that unless it’s an externally acknowledged ‘need’ then I have no right to react emotionally to not getting what I ‘want’. The only difference between saying ‘I really need you to tell me I’m ok’ and ‘I really want you to tell me I’m ok’ exists in the meaning that people put on the words. I get the impression that stuff comes up for me that I label as a need when I feel driven by it - when it feels like an emotional imperative - when I find I’m being really ‘needy (lol that’s most of the time!) despite myself and my best efforts at squashing or getting rid of what I experience as ‘dysfunctional’ needs/wants.

See the thing is that whether it’s a need or a want, either way there’s no guarantee I’m going to get it, so the distinction becomes irrelevant to me. I think I fall into the trap of using the word need as if that somehow means I’m supposed to get it (or have gotten it, as it usually relates to the past) and I get stuck in arguments and counterarguments about it. I’m looking forward to the day when I can say ‘I want’ for all of it and know that’s ok both to openly want it, and that if I don’t get it then I have the emotional ability to deal with the not getting without it turning into a big ‘me as bad for wanting’ trip.

I suppose it becomes a matter of internal power in the end - to take responsibility for its being something I want means I then have the locus of control in me to deal with the getting/not getting (this of course only if my sense of self as ok is strong enough not to be blown out the water by not-getting as an indictment of my self worth.)

:sigh: even the word itself ‘want’ is loaded with negative meaning it keys right into giving people the opportunity to criticize and judge on the basis of its being ‘selfish’, that ‘wanting’ is somehow morally not quite acceptable and so you get to feel guilty at the least for selfishly wanting something.

Mad Hatter thanks for this thread - you’ve asked a question that’s had my brain going into overdrive for years - I could go on and on about all the different things I’ve thought and the internal battles I’ve had (and still have) about it all. I’d be really interested to hear other people’s take on it.

Hm I just reread your post and realized you were talking specifically about therapy. Actually not sure I’d change my answers I think my ramblings above apply just the same in my therapy. As for the what we want maybe not being good for us - maybe the getting of it may not be good for us (like taking transference beyond the boundaries for instance) but the wanting just is - I’ve spent a LONG time denying and controlling wants/needs that I’ve perceived as not being good for me when I would have been better off owning those wants and working through the consequences. Otherwise you end up where I still am now - blaming my own wants and needs for all the bad that’s happened to me.

quote:

Maybe what we want isn't what we deserve

Now that sounds like a message from the past! It's something that's all mixed up in my thinking about this wants v needs thing too - the whole question of not deserving to get what I want/need is right at the core of everything. The Big Issue. I'm very good at rationally coming up with all the 'correct' answers to stuff like this, but it's all just words - one day something will sink in and I'll actually be able to practise what I preach. I live in hope.


Lamplighter

I can tell both of you have given this dilemma much more thought than I have. And now I do have more to think about!

quote:

I 'WANT' residual emotional needs met.

Monte, you stated you WANT your needs met. To me, that sounds very appropriate because I see all true needs as being justified wants to pursue. But if a want is not a need, then I tend to see it as bad -- or view myself as bad for having that want. I tend to look at things as too black & white, perhaps. For example, my tendency to divide my needs and wants into piles of good and bad. After reading LL's post I realize I too am struggling with wanting validation of my wants.

quote:

I therefore get myself tied up in knots trying to make a distinction between wanting and needing something - especially when trying to explain to others, there’s this sense that unless it’s an externally acknowledged ‘need’ then I have no right to react emotionally to not getting what I ‘want’....

I’m looking forward to the day when I can say ‘I want’ for all of it and know that’s ok both to openly want it, and that if I don’t get it then I have the emotional ability to deal with the not getting without it turning into a big ‘me as bad for wanting’ trip.

I never saw this in myself clearly before until you explained it this way, LL. But now I can see how I did this as recently as my last session. I was hurt that my T had been ignoring my texts when I was wanting/needing (not sure which!) her reassurance, and her response was that it seemed to her that what she could give me was not enough. Not the answer I wanted. So what did I do? I turned it around by saying, "Well, I guess my needs are bad, and I just have to get rid of them or learn to take care of them myself." My T said that no, my needs were not bad, but neither did she promise she could meet them. So isn't that like saying I am supposed to just be content to have UNMET needs?
Frustrating!

quote:

I’ve spent a LONG time denying and controlling wants/needs that I’ve perceived as not being good for me when I would have been better off owning those wants and working through the consequences.

I am not very good at this "owning" business. That sounds like the opposite of being in denial. It is hard to own what makes you feel like total crap. Is that really the answer? Too feel like crap? Is there something better on the other side?

Wish I could answer you question MH, but I'm more muddled on this one that Monte! I am really struggling because I'm wondering the same things. I have wants that I think are needs, but then I think they're just wants again, and I go back and forth wondering what they really are. I want my T to understand me, and I also think that's a need for me to progress in therapy. But does SHE think it's a need, or only something I want. Does she think it's my husband that needs to understand me, not her? I could spin out on this sort of stuff. Wish I could help you, but this is one of those things I feel I'll never have an answer to, at least not until I'm in a better place. You all have given me some good things to consider though. Thanks!!

MTF