Where do I start?

Forgive me, this post is one long wailing dump of despair. If you're not a in a good place, please skip reading it, I don't want to make it more difficult for anyone to deal with their stuff. And I know I usually don't feel this way, but I do right now and it feels like my head will explode if I don't just say all of it.

I'm seeing my T tommorrow for the first time in two weeks and there's so much going on I don't know where to start.

1. The past two weeks have felt like 6 months. The last session was really intense and I ended up in a not good place. I've been feeling desparately needy, and in a great deal of pain coupled with the feeling that I absolutely shouldn't be talking about it. The level of pain is occasionally breathtaking and I'm starting to understand Just Me,it's vast, its overwhelming but inchoate, a painful chaos that I can't begin to put into words. Its an undertow I've been fighting for two weeks just trying to get to tomorrow's appt. But what if seeing my T doesn't help? There is a sense of barely hanging on and if seeing him doesn't help I'll go under.

I think I'm experiencing what it felt like.I keep get hitting with waves of pain which I brace against so hard I stop breathing. Then I hear my T tell me to breath and I'm back for a few seconds, then the next one hits. Amd I'm getting more and more exhausted.

Our last session left me in that place which screams at me that relationships are only about pain and about NEVER getting what you long for and ALWAYS feeling bereft and scared and alone. I'm trapped in a place with no escape.

I know in my head that all that isn't true but that knowledge is a weak and feeble thing in the face of this pain and the conviction so deep seated that it feels like its embedded alongside my DNA in my cells, that this is it, this is all there is, just pain and disappointment. I KNOW I don't feel this way all the time, I even get that I've felt quite differently quite recently but it feels unreachable right now.

2. There's the whole issue of appts. I really need to talk to my T about needing to schedule them more regularly, about being angry about not being able to, being angry he couldn't give me an extra appt when I asked, etc. Considering everything I've already talked to him about, it just seems like scheduling should be a cakewalk but its not. I feel like this insatiable maw of need that is demanding way too much. But it keeps cropping up and I know I need to talk to him about it.

3. I need to talk to him about experiencing the anger in a very different, much freer way. That felt really significant and like it would be important to discuss but not real high on the priorities right now.

4. A large, irrational part of me just wants to walk into his office and scream at him to make this pain stop, to make me feel better. Knowing he can't do that sends me straight to the realization that no one can, I have to endure this, let myself feel it, so it can be processed. But I'm getting sick to death of doing this. When is the friggin' pain going to run out? When do I get to the bottom? When will this not be the dominant factor in my life? I want to be done. I am worn out from longing for things I can't have and half the time not even knowing what I'm longing for.

4. When I'm feeling this needy and this much like I should just hide myself away, the relationship with my T starts to feel very unreal. That I'm just one more client on the list and one that he's heartily wishing would just move it along. That I need him so much but I can't really trust thet there's anything there to depend on.

6. I've been reading my journals to try and access other feelings and other times where I have felt secure and cared for, but my entries from last year at this time could just have easily been written today. Like I am still in the same spot, struggling with the same feelings and same problems, not understanding the same things. I've lost all sense of progress, which probably means I should check in with my T and ask if he's seen any and if so, could he tall me about it. But that's just being needy and asking for more reassurance. Which feels pathetic; that he's tired of me being in the same place and talking about the same issues over and over and over and over and over.

5.I feel awful for feeling all this. I have an amazing T, I have been healing and growing so it just feels selfish and self-indulgent and whiny. That I should be more grateful for what I have. That I am giving into despair when so many people don't who have so much more justification for doing so.

6.Its scary to talk about this. That one look at this post and everyone will flee. I can barely stand being around myself so why would anyone else want to be? But I'm tired of being alone with these feelings.And when I'm holding them back I can't let anything else in.

So I have to cover that in 50 minutes. I can do that, right?

AG

11/30/083:52 AM

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wynneMember

AG,

Breathe. You said you felt this way this time last year - is it a winter thing? a holiday thing? an anniversary thing? There may be other factors involved here.

quote:
The last session was really intense and I ended up in a not good place.

Pretty much the first time this happened to me was the last. I asplained to Tfella that we pretty much _had_ to spend the last 15 minutes or so winding down from what I'd talked about, if I was telling him stuff that kinds sucked to talk about. He sees my panicked looks at the clock when he asks a Giant Question towards the end and remembers - I pretty much lost an entire productive week to that. Progress or not, my own equilibrium between sessions was too important to Go There so late in the 50.

And really, it's all about scheduling and time management in-session, right? And how it makes you feel? That's like just one little compact issue. /sardonic smile

Anyways, just a few thoughts and randoms. Good luck in your appointment!

11/30/085:31 AM

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katsMember

AG

Sorry for the pain you are feeling. My T use to leave me hanging in a bad way often at the end of sessions, until I told her how it made me feel. Well not exactly how it made me feel, but what I did to cope with the feelings "drink" Not a good coping skill. After talking with her how it made me feel she is more aware of time, and makes sure I am in a safe frame when I leave. I think it is important to talk to your T about the appt issue, and let him know how it makes you feel. I really don't have alot of knowledge in this department but I have noticed when I have a problem and can't be up and up with T it blocks my growth. Just a thought.

You hang in there okay.

Kats

11/30/085:54 AM

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Attachment GirlAdmin

Hi Guys,
Thank you for the responses, glad I didn't clear the place out.

I do think I miscommunicated on one thing. When I said the session left me in a bad place, it didn't have anything to do with ending the session in a bad place or my T bringing up something late in the game. Actually, we're both pretty careful about that (lessons learned the hard way for me, and probably for him.) He responded to me wonderfully and we definitly talked through the issue but because we were talking of my attraction to him, my reaction afterwards is once again be face to face with the very necessary boundaries. And that's what I react so badly to. Knowing I can't have everything I want from my T (even knowing that's a good thing) sends me to that place of being needy and not be able to get my needs fulfilled in my attachment relationship. My T is doing NOTHING wrong, as a matter of fact he's holding clear boundaries in a difficult situation to keep me safe while still remaining emotionally accessible.I'm not reacting to him, I'm reacting to my past. These are the feelings that need to be felt and processed. Which is pretty much the cycle, I go towards my T for what I want which he can't give me, I hit that frustration and that directs me to the source of the pain. So I just wanted to clarify that. Although now that I've said all that about my T, my appt tomorrow doesn't look so scary.

Wynne, I appreciate your point about considering the time of year. I always get sick in the November time frame, usually with a sinus infection and/or asthma attack. I'm on my second sinus infection this fall. I can't consciously remember anything this time of year, but I think I will talk to my older sister and see if I'm missing something since this always does seem to be a hard time of year. I hate the loss of light when the time changes and trust me, Syracuse isn't such a sunny place you want less of it.

11/30/086:32 AM

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janeMember

hi All
i haven't posted in awhile, but i have been keeping up with everyone's posts. just haven't really known what to write. nothing much to add, as i don't really even know what's going on in counseling. i can totally relate to most issues you post about, but to explain them like you all do is a foreign concept to me. as you all know, i can never get regular appointments with my T, and now, i find out he's off this whole next month for personal reasons. i have an appt scheduled this week, but i don't know if it will be cancelled yet. trying not to get too excited or whatever about it because i'm afraid in the next 2 days the receptionist will call me to let me know it has to be resceduled in another month or so. and the last time i saw him was 2 weeks ago. that was the day i acted like such a spoiled whiny brat(the way i know about the off for a month thing is a long story, but i haven't done any prying into his personal affairs,so just trust me on that, ok).the holidays are very difficult for me and if itell you why, it would be posting some very personal stuff about my family and i really don't want my id revealed. so, ....

ag
i am so sorry you're having such a hard time.like i said before, i really don't have any good advice. i know the rejection well. all too well. it does sound like you have a good T who is very caring and understanding though. you probably should tell him all this stuff tomorrow. he will know what to say to help you.

when you all say you know you just have to "work through it", what exactly does that mean?it seems like my therapy is just bringing up all this old stuff that i don't want to remember, and there it is again just reminding me how pitiful everything has been. i have worked hard to get away from it all, and now, it seems i am paying somebody to dredge it all up again. it is very painful and confusing and doesn't eally seem worth it at times.

jm
i know you have been having a hard time lately, too. i hope all is working out better for you.

you all have been so helpful to me. i am sorry i can't return the help when you need it now. maybe i will learn eventually--although with his crazy scheduling, i really don't think so.

i think this is a hard time of year for most, all of the hype about how happy we are all supposed to be and stuff--and seeing families for some that we only see once or twice a year can be difficult and very stressful. i am sure that at least contributes to the sadness and difficulties we are having, and as AG said, the weather and more darkness certainly don't help any either.

11/30/087:35 AM

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riverMember

AG,

I am so sorry that you are in so much pain. (I am impressed with how well you can describe it.) Your item #1 especially resonated with me and I thought, "Triage. This women needs some immediate relief before anything else can be worked on." (I guess I have watched too much "er"

) So please pardon me (or completely ignore me if you want) for saying this but if I were you I would start my next session with saying this:

quote:
The past two weeks have felt like 6 months. The last session was really intense and I ended up in a not good place. I've been feeling desperately needy, and in a great deal of pain coupled with the feeling that I absolutely shouldn't be talking about it. The level of pain is occasionally breathtaking... Its an undertow I've been fighting for two weeks just trying to get to tomorrow's appt. But what if seeing my T doesn't help? There is a sense of barely hanging on and if seeing him doesn't help I'll go under.

Your T needs to know about your pain and how bad it has been. He also needs to help you leave this next session in less pain. If right at the beginning of your session you explain your fear about this not happening then your T will know how to direct the rest of the time to help get you into a better place so then you can deal with the other stuff and not feel like you are going to go under.

Hang in there AG! We all feel your pain here and are cheering you on!

11/30/087:47 AM

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justme 2Member

AG,
I am sorry you are hurting so deeply.

It is good that you have developed this close relationship with your T and he is so responsive and caring to your needs. The way you describe how much freer you are able to be with expressing your anger certainly speaks of the tremendous progress that you have made under his receptive care.

However, I am also picking up on something else and I hope that as I stick my neck out it will return with my head still intact.

You have a lot of pain and agony you are coping with and sometimes due to the intrinsic nature of our relationship, it naturally reflects off our T in one way or another. We all know what that is and why that happens. But what I notice, and this is where I may be way off base, is that you tend to go right into defensive mode about how wonderful and understanding your T is (**AND HE IS**), but I dare say that only minimizes what your feelings are preceding that statement. It seems to offer him a protection that he does not need, because he will be just as wonderful and amazing if you do release your anger, even if directed at him and tell him what you really need from him...

Regular appointment times for instance. Just because he has failed to provide this for you doesn’t mean that he has failed you and isn’t as wonderful as you know him to be (and I know that you never said that it did, just covering the bases). It may well be that you haven’t communicated your need well enough to him. Or, maybe this is just the way it is going to have to be because he doesn’t have anything more regular to offer. Whatever conclusion you and T arrive at will be between the both of you, but you definitely have strong feelings about this that need to be heard.

So here is my point, this need may seem to be only about “regular appointment times” but it represents much deeper needs that you had to make excuses for not getting met a long, long time ago. You stated

quote:
A large, irrational part of me just wants to walk into his office and scream at him to make this pain stop, to make me feel better. Knowing he can't do that sends me straight to the realization that no one can, I have to endure this, let myself feel it, so it can be processed.

Symbolically there is nothing irrational about that at all. What you couldn’t tell that significant person in your past, you can tell your T. “I need this.” “I don’t like it when you…” “It makes me angry when you…” And I know that you _have_ had such frank conversations with your T and based on what you know about him you know that he will still be there. He’s not going to fall from grace and even if he does just a little bit, he’ll still measure up to your needs and he will still be your T.

You may not even get the appt times you want, but at least you will have been heard and have demonstrated your empowerment to make the pain stop and make yourself feel better.

So I know that you will find a way to be able to have this conversation with your T as you always do. But AG, you know that I also understand all the fears that come with the territory. I truly do and I’m not sending you to the wolves by telling you do to anything you don’t feel is right, but when you get up the nerve to really express this to him, I just want you to consider what else it really represents for you. I hope that makes sense and does not sound like anything negative about your relationship with your T, because it is not. You have an absolutely wonderful working relationship with him. This is just an observation that again I may be way off base on. But I know that you like to analyze as much as I do and well, you haven’t bitten my head of yet.

Signed Anonymous?? (for protective reasons of course)

12/1/082:55 AM

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Attachment GirlAdmin

Just Me,
I promise I'll leave your head intact.

I think you really hit it. I actually have a pattern of vigourously asserting how "wonderful" a significant figure in my life is when I'm angry with them. And you're right it's protective. But the truth is, I can say all this to my T. And its important that I do. I think a big part of the pain that I've been in is feeling like my needs are not important, are too demanding and will not be met. It is important and significant that I be able to make them known even if there's not a solution I'm too happy with. Its the speaking up and realizing I have a right to speak up and that my relationship will still be intact with my T. Which, as you also pointed out, I have experienced with my T in the past. And I do have a tendency to idealize him. I think its a little scary to see his flaws because that translates into the scary possibility that he will fail me. But as he keeps explaining, he is going to fail me at times. But what's important is learning to tolerate that and repair the relationship since its impossible to avoid. I think I can still be pretty "black and white" in this area.

River,
Thank you for your "triage" assessment. I think my tendency would be to walk in and just say "gosh, I've had a tough time" which I think is an inadequate description of the last two weeks, to put it mildly.

I need to let my T know how really difficult its been and not minimize it. It goes back to my trying not to be too needy again. But its really safe to talk about now.

So, I'm talking about two things today, pain and appointments. Which shouldn't be too difficult 'cause I think they're a wee bit connected right now.

Thank you all so much for your support, this is such an incredible place to come, knowing its ok to be in pain and needy and be met with such loving support. I don't know how I'd be getting through this stuff without all of you!

AG

12/1/085:22 AM

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Attachment GirlAdmin

quote:
when you all say you know you just have to "work through it", what exactly does that mean?

AJB,
It means your a sopping chaotic mess for awhile.

For me, what I mean, when I say I need to work through it, is that when I was a child I was faced with a lot of situations in which it was impossible to deal with my feelings because I didn't have the resources. And in some cases, I couldn't even let myself acknowledge a loss, let alone the grief, because it was too dangerous to know about. I'm going to give you a specific example, because I know this a really confusing concept and I still struggle with it.

I remember my T and I once discussing how difficult it was for me to ask for reassurance and make my needs known (noticing a theme?

) and I told him that it felt like I was sucking the life out of the people around me. He said that my feeling that way was an attempt to make sense out of what happened to me. That the truth was, it was my father sucking the life out of me, that instead of taking care of my needs, our relationship was all about his need. When my T said that, one of the emotions that I had stored away because I couldn't deal with it at the time, came back. I remembered what it had felt like to have my father ignore my needs to fulfill his. It was incredibly grievious and painful. I was able to express that in front of my T and have him hear and understand my pain, my grief and my anger. And to affirm that those were all reasonable reactions. So not only did I matter enough to listen to, I wasn't crazy or overly demanding, etc. to have those reactions. All of the things I should have had when I was child and learning to deal with my emotions, my T was now providing. Going through that process, "clears out" those stored emotions and heals them.

I'm not sure how much sense this makes, but I hope it helps. Ask if there's anything you want me to try and explain more. Its difficult to put into words, because its a very right brain, visceral experience kind of thing, not a cognitive, I understand kind of thing.

AG

12/1/085:32 AM

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Attachment GirlAdmin

I feel much better! (I told you so's echo and rebound off the forum walls

) And have I mentioned that I LOVE that man. I walked in (shaking from head to toe) sat down and said "that was a long, difficult, miserable two weeks and we need to talk about appointments." Figured that way I couldn't dodge.

He asked me to talk about how I felt and I think I went on a 20 minute long solilquy including all the emotions I had been experiencing including being angry about not getting an appointment when I asked for one and not having a regular appt. How I was feeling needy and like I was hanging on for dear life. He listened, asked a few questions and waited for me to run down. I finally said I needed him to start talking because I was worried about what he was thinking. He, of course, I mean the man is your quintessential therapist, asked what I was afraid of, so I gave him a long list.

He was completely calm, yet very understanding. He understood me being angry about not getting an appointment and not having a regular one. Bottom line on the appts when we finished discussing was that we both felt the underlying issue was my trying to have a perfectly dependable relationship in which I was never upset or dissapointed, and it isn't going to happen, it's not possible. That he needs to be honest with me, knowing that sometimes he's going to fail me or disappoint me and that the important thing was my ability to talk to him about it and have my feelings heard. And that so much of the pain I am experiencing is about the loss of safety and security it was my right to have as a child. That getting angry implies that you deserve something, that you have a right to expect it. We then spent a while talking about how I don't believe that about myself. That its always been about an attempt to behave in the correct way to get what I need instead of being able to expect it. I'm not sure if I'm explaining it well at all, but we went to the roots of where all the pain and anguish were coming from and I feel a lot better now.

My T pretty much let me know that I wouldn't be getting a regular appt because he just didn't function that way and he didn't want to promise something he knew he couldn't give. And that's one of the reason that he provides unlimited access between appts. He also strongly reiterated that it's really theraputic for me to call, that stepping outside my comfort zone and asking for what I need is really important. He also made it clear that if he has a problem with the calls in terms of length, frequency, or even the possibility that they don't seem to be working, he'll let me know; but so far I hadn't even come close to causing a problem. So I need to call when I want to.

Two things really helped; I know that my T is willing to tell me no which means when he says yes its because he wants to. And he's always honest with me, so I can trust whatever he tells me.

He thanked me (a couple of times) for coming to him and being so honest about all my emotions. That he realized that this was deeply personal stuff, that it was hard to discuss a lot of it but yet I still did it. That this is exactly where the work gets done and I'm doing exactly what I'm supposed to be doing. He really said it like he meant it, especially the part about being honest. I think I'm more open with my feelings than I realize.

He also conveyed his sense that I am definitely growing and making progress, but the nature of the work with these types of problems is that sometimes it won't feel like that.

We talked about boundaries and how sometimes they make me feel safe and sometimes they make me feel trapped. He talked about him remaining calm and not scared of my emotions but he also didn't want me thinking he didn't care about what I was feeling and that he didn't like seeing me in pain. I told him that he did a good job of keeping the boundaries while remaining emotionally accessible. He said, "exactly, that's what it was supposed to be like when you were little."

I feel like I have solid ground under my feet again and I've waded out of the surf and the undertow. I raged and whined and ranted and cried and he just stays with me and understands. Even my complaining that I'm just tired of doing this and feeling these things. Its such an incredible gift. It's really weird that in some ways nothing has changed, but it all feels very different.

I just want to thank everyone for being there and giving me a place to fall apart while I got through this.

And let me tell you, I'm calling when I want to call! (See I can talk big when I'm feeling fine!)

Oh, and I have another appt in 8 days (a collective sigh of relief goes up around the forums).

AG

12/1/081:09 PM

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Attachment GirlAdmin

(((Draggers))) Thank you, I needed to read this right now.