Hi morningglory, and welcome to the forum!

It takes a lot of courage to reach out, and I'm glad you did. I'm sorry that you are feeling scared and worried about your T. She has put you in the very difficult place of trying to meet her needs. I know a little bit of how you feel because my ex-T did something similar, although he was much more subtle about it. One thing (among many) that I've learned on this board is that therapy is supposed to be all about your needs, so that you can see what you need to see and change what you want to change. If the T's needs and issues are competing with yours, then how is it different than any other relationship? The therapeutic relationship is supposed to be unique, in that it's all about you.

Today was my third session with my new T. She keeps telling me that she's there for me, that this is a safe place to feel, that she wants to care for me, for all the hard things I had to go through where no one cared for me, where I was used, abused, or abandoned, but not cared for. Sometimes this happens in life, and unfortunately, sometimes it happens in "therapy" with "therapists" who still need to do some of their own work. But I just can't get over how she keeps wanting to care for me. It feels weird...but in a really nice way. I could get used to this.

Morningglory, you said your relationship with your therapist is like best friends. Since you have become friends with her, would it be possible to keep the friendship, but to find someone else to be your T? Just a suggestion, something to think about. I know you will get lots of other replies too. Hang in there, okay?

I'm glad to meet you, and I hope you keep posting and let us know how you are doing.

Peace,
SG

p.s. Do you grow morning glories? I love them!

Thank you so much for your kind words Strummergirl and Hummingbird. Your words made me feel better but also made me cry. I have never felt unconditional love from my mother and I long for that feeling to fill the hole in my soul that I have felt my whole life. My T was helping me deal with so much of this pain and through the transference I came to understand so many things about my relationship with my mother. Then my T began using my sessions to talk about her problems. She seemed to be going through a bad time and I provided a ear but I felt uncomfortable and didn't always know how to respond to her. I have read a lot on this site about boundaries and I think I understand now why they are so important. My heart aches because I love my T so much and I don't think I can leave her even though in my heart I think it might be best.

MG

Hi MG,

I have recently (in the last two weeks) ended with my T because of very badly blurred boundaries. I also loved him so very much and knew that it would be such a huge grief to end with him and that I may not survive the pain.

I knew in my heart that to end would be best for me. Every session I would come away even more distressed than when I arrived and spend the next week trying to process what was happening in the sessions, which was impossible. The very sloppy and slack boundaries made it so confusing and I couldn't begin to work on my real issues because there was so much going on with my T.

It has not been easy at all. In fact, it has been hard, but I have survived. These are some things that helped:

I went and saw my dr and told her that I was ending with my T. She was extremely supportive because she was so unhappy with the way that therapy was going due to his boundaries. She arranged to see me twice weekly and to help me find a new therapist who is a psychiatrist.

I told all of my support network that I was ending with him and I called them constantly for support. I told them that I just needed to talk and that while I desperately wanted to go back I had made the decision and was sticking to it.

I found a clean break was the easiest way. Even just hearing his voice triggers a huge meltdown for me. I do have to see him from time to time around the place and hopefully as time passes this will become easier.

I tried not to expect too much from myself during this time. I expected to feel grief and sadness and to hide in bed at home. So I just went with what I felt and didn't beat myself up for feeling so rotten. This was a huge step for me.

I wish I didn't have to leave. But I have survived even though I didn't think I could. This forum has so many kind and wise people that will help and support you through ending if that is what you decide to do.

MG: I understand why you are feeling sad. It sounds like your T has helped you in so many important ways, and it’s only recently that the boundaries got blurred. There are so many mixed emotions. Letting go of my ex-T hurt very badly because he WAS helping me, and I didn’t understand why things derailed. I’m still sorting that out, but what has helped is posting about it here and talking about it with my new T. The feedback from everyone has helped tremendously. Halo said she didn’t think she could survive it. I didn’t think I could either. But thanks to the people on this board, we did.

Now that I’m past the worst of the crisis, it is easier to see why it needed to happen, and that it wasn’t so much of a “derailment” as a “switching station.” In just three sessions with the new T, there have been many times when I’ve said, “My ex-T said that, too.” It feels so good when this happens because it confirms that, overall, we were on the right track. For example, he said my ex-BF was a symbol for how I feel about myself. That was partly right, but it turns out that he’s a symbol for even more than that. And I can see that, for whatever reason, he was not able to help me go as far as I needed to go in those areas. But I will always be grateful to him for the distance he went with me.

Transference issues aside, I became very fond of my ex-T, and I miss talking to him (and listening to him talk). That makes it especially hard to think about the last two sessions with him. He looked and behaved exasperated, cold, and dismissive. He obviously was negatively triggered by my issues and I very much wish that it had not ended that way. I worry now about what he thinks of me, if he thinks of me at all. I’ve spent lots of time trying to figure him out, trying to guess what happened on his end of things, trying to figure out how to make it right. But what I have to try and accept is that there’s nothing I can do about it. No matter who I ask I keep getting the same answer, that it sounds like his problem, his issues, work that he needs to do. And I’m powerless over that. But the good news is I’m not powerless at all over my own growth. No matter what his issues are, I can keep going. And it’s best that I do.

Whatever you end up deciding, I hope you keep reading and posting here to let us know how you are doing.

Halo: I am so happy for you. Reading your post you sound like you are in a much better place already. It is wonderful to see you taking care of yourself. And you are already helping others with your experience. It is beautiful to see and I look forward to hearing more about you and your journey.

Hugs to all,
SG

It's so sad to read your stories. Just the thought of loosing somebody who is that important...
I'm thinking sometimes, the therapists, that they really get to know their clients, no one else will ever know them to that extent. They must have feelings of their own towards the people they know so much, people who are so close to them and so open (I imagine). And then they can never let their clients to get to know them. I imagine that it must be so difficult, to enter somebody's world where no one elso was ever allowed, and not being able to let that person into their world. Never, ever share it.
I might be wrong, but I'm trying to imagine how it feels.

Thank you all for your kindness and insightful comments. You all seem to totally understand what I am experiencing. This has been such a long week. I have been unavailable to my husband and children, I can't sleep, I am eating junk food and today I let something small really get to me at work and ended

Thank you all for your kindness and insightful comments. You all seem to totally understand what I am experiencing. This has been such a long week. I have been unavailable to my husband and children, I can't sleep, I am eating junk food and today I let something small really get to me at work and ended up in tears infront of my colleagues. On Tuesday I finally got up the nerve to call my T to tell her I was distressed and really needed an appointment on Friday. (We usually meet every Friday but sometimes my time changes)I called her just to make contact and used the excuse that I needed to know my appointment time because I am distressed and really need to talk with her. She never called me back so I started to assume she was still mad. Finally, I decided to call back again today but I just listened to her voice and hung up. She called back a few minutes later and asked if I called asking me why I didn't leave a message. I told her I didn't want to come across as a pest about my appointment. She seemed distant and said she forgot to call me back the other day. She explained that she penciled me in and looked forward to seeing me on Friday. I said nothing...I am now feeling a mixture of sadness and anger. I thought my T cared about me...I thought she loved me...I have tried to be good...How could she not call me back and just forget? How could she not know how painful this has all been for me? This has all brought me back to how my mother made me feel ( and still does) my entire life. Why does this happen to me? Why am I so unloveable?
MorningGlory

Hi MG,

I have began seeing a new T and reading your story has already started alarm bells ringing in my head! My new T is a little how you describe yours. While it has only been two sessions and so we've only hit the tip of the iceberg I do get the impression that my counsellor sees it more as a "girlfriend" relationship than a formal, professional one. I know for a fact this is because she is kind and wants to put me at ease but after the strict boundaries and transference feeling of my last therapy relationship I am praying and hoping that it doesn't turn into what you are experiencing. Even her disclosure about having a boyfriend in my last session unsettled me. I didn't know if my ex-T had a girlfriend and didn't want to know. I would be too jealous and it would leave me wondering all about that. It was so much better with such strict boundaries. I preferred the formality of it in a strange way. I'm a very open person but this is one relationship where I want things to go a certain way.

It sounds like you're having a really rough time of it and I know it must be really hard for you to contemplate leaving your T who you care about so much but at the end of the day you're the important one here. While she may see you as a friend you are a client and it is her responsibility to keep you out of her personal life so that your therapy doesn't become compromised. IMHO it seems tough for you to be worrying about her feelings on top of the work that you're supposed to be doing in therapy. And I really don't think you're unlovable. I just think that your T really cares for you but has compromised her position and is now struggling with it and you're getting tangled up in the big mess that it is becoming.

It is not right that your T should be triggering you in this way. Such triggering should be dealt with by her in a supportive way and she clearly can't do that if she is the one causing the triggering. I hope you manage to reach some understanding in your next session. My advice is just to be honest, explain your concerns. At the end of the day it's your therapy, you call the shots.

Halo: you are so so brave. It must've been so hard. My T was wonderful and it was almost impossible leaving him, I wouldn't have except I had to. I really hope you get all the support and love you need and deserve now. And taking it easy is a great idea, I'm trying to do that myself at the moment. Such a weird experience! But hopefully I'll begin to accept looking after myself. I can't see it happening anytime soon but baby steps.

Mrs. P

quote:

I just think that your T really cares for you but has compromised her position and is now struggling with it and you're getting tangled up in the big mess that it is becoming.

That was what I found the hardest to cope with. Each time that a boundary was broken he would back pedal and then put the blame on me. That I wasn't able to process things or that I wasn't doing the work. By being honest and upfront I was always doing the work.

In hindsight and from what I have learnt from this forum, he was out of his depth with me and scared of me and my feelings. Because he could not cope with me he became too involved and told me that he was thinking about it all the time. He had to force himself not to think about me and my pain.

I am trying very hard not to work through much of this mess yet, I am seeing my new psychiatrist in 7 weeks and will start afresh then. Until then I am just staying numb to protect myself from any further damage.

Hello Mrs. P and Halo,
It is so nice to meet you. I can't thank you enough for sharing your experiences with me. I was feeling very low during my last post. I am going to take your advice and just be completely honest with my T. I am scared that she will get defensive or try to show me my fault in the situation. This happened once before and because I was so fearful of losing her I just went with it...this is what happens with my mother all the time. I hate myself after I go along but at least I don't loose them. This is what I've been working on with my T so I Can improve my relationship with my mother That's why it's confusing to me that it's happening the same way with my T. I am really nervous about meeting with my T tomorrow...I'm not sure if I'm ready to end things and I don't want to say anything to upset her even more.
MorningGlory

quote:

I am scared that she will get defensive or try to show me my fault in the situation. This happened once before and because I was so fearful of losing her I just went with it...this is what happens with my mother all the time. I hate myself after I go along but at least I don't loose them. This is what I've been working on with my T so I Can improve my relationship with my mother That's why it's confusing to me that it's happening the same way with my T.

MG: I'm so sorry for what you are going through right now. I understand because I went to my T for unresolved pain over an old BF, and it derailed in exactly the same patterns I went there for in the first place. So I really do understand how awful it feels.

I just recently posted about feeling guilty for going along with my ex-T even though I could see some red flags. I didn't want to lose him, just like you don't want to lose your T. I received some responses that helped me to understand that that is what people with attachment injuries do. It is what we learned to do to survive. We need T's who understand this and can help us learn different relationship patterns. But they can't do that if they allow themselves to become emotionally involved. That is exactly why it is so important for our T's to keep those boundaries where they belong.

From what you have said about your relationship with your mother, it sounds like you have attachment injuries from your childhood. I do too and so do many others on this board. There are some really outstanding posts that might help you understand what is happening with your T.

Most importantly, this is not happening because you are unloveable. You are not doing anything wrong. You went to therapy to get healing from and help with your relationships. That is a good and healthy thing to do. It takes courage to reach out like that and it means you want to grow and get better. What is happening with your T is happening because your T is getting emotionally involved. They are not supposed to do that because if they do, what happens is called a reenactment. That is why it's happening the same way with your T.

You have received some very caring and insightful responses already. I would also like to add some information about attachment injuries, but there are others on this board who have described it much better than I can. If you haven't already done so, please read through some of the responses I got in the following threads - I hope they bring you as much comfort and hope as they did (and still do) to me:

Long rant - very confused

Waiting

Keep "punching"

I will be thinking about you tomorrow...please let us know how it goes. We are here for you.

(((((((MG)))))))

SG

MG I know exactly what you mean. I tried to end 8 times with my therapist (he is a senior psychologist) in the last six months. He also ended with me but he let me come back after I begged him. I don't think I was ready before now, I still don't feel ready and I would give anything to be able to go back to him....

Each session was becoming harder and harder because I didn't want to upset him either, in case he ended again. Ending felt like death to me. But there were so many confusing things being said and done that it was like a thunderstorm in my head and I had to bring them up.

The confusion is so hard to cope with. I guess that for me the confusion was never being resolved and was in fact, getting worse.

Our relationship definitely mirrored the relationship I have with my mother. It took a long time to see it. And it just kept cycling and replaying the same pattern over and over. Where he would become too involved, break a boundary, I would take it as encouragement and then want more from him and tell him how I was feeling, he would feel scared and back pedal and become cold and icy.

If you don't feel ready, that is fine. Just remember that whatever you decide we are here for you, to support and encourage you. I truly think this forum saved my life.

Hi Morningglory...just wondering, how did your appointment go yesterday? If you are up to telling us about it.

SG

Hi Strummergirl,
Thank you so much for checking in on me. I don't know how I would have made it through this week without reading all the threads and posts on this site.
As far as my appointment, I think it went well. I arrived prepared with my thoughts and feelings written down. I started to fill-up with tears while I was still in the waiting room. I usually love the sense of peace and excitement I feel while waiting for my appointment but instead I was scared and nervous much like my first appointment with my T. When it was my time to go in, my heart was beating so fast and I started to feel like I wanted to run and keep running. My T hugged me immediately but I didn't hug back and she noticed my distance. We sat down and she asked how I was doing but I immediately avoided her question and changed the subject to something else. Of course, she told me this is what I was doing and said she thought we should discuss what happened after my last session. I began to cry and couldn't get my words out but then she told me that I was in a safe place and she wished I could express my feelings. I told her that I thought it was safe to tell her anything but that I am doubting that now. Then I let it all out and I told her what I I thought happened and how it made me feel. My T then looked me right in the eyes and apologized. She told me it was all her fault and she was upset, embarrassed and very mad at herself for letting this happen. She said she got sloppy with her boundaries and asked me if I would give her another chance. She then asked me in more detail to tell her how all this made me feel and how it effected my family, work etc. Each thing I told her she was able to help me see how her lack of boundaries caused all this. She apologize for taking away a safe place for me to go during such a difficult time and she also apologized for triggering all that happened. I didn't know how to feel during all this because my mother has never apologized for anything she has done to me and so just getting an apology shocked me. My T also told me over and over again how courageous I was to tell her how I felt and stand up for myself in a way I have never been able to do with my mother. She thought that maybe together we could learn from this if I was willing to stay with her. I started to cry and she got up and hugged me again and I sobbed on her shoulder as she apologized again and cried herself for hurting me so much.
So...I am thinking I would like to give my T another chance. Do you all think this is a good idea. I did feel like she was being honest and sincere.
MorningGlory

Morningglory,

This is wonderful news! You just made my day. I'm so happy to hear this I want to get up and dance around the room. (I think I will. Okay...I just did. Good thing no one can see me! ) As far as I know, this is exactly how a T should respond to what you said. You really were very courageous to bring this up, and she said and did exactly what she should have. And how wonderful you got from her what you did not get from your mother. This is how things should go in therapy. They won't go perfectly, because T's are human too, but its how the repairs go that can make all the difference, and you both handled this beautifully.

So I say yes, absolutely, give this T another chance. Because she handled the chance you gave her yesterday so well. Good for you, morningglory!!! I'm going to be smiling for a long time about this.



Cheers,
SG

Hi Morning Glory,
Welcome to the forum and sorry I'm late to the party! Life has been a bit on the interesting side lately so posting has been few and far between. I just wanted to say that I'm really impressed at how your T handled this. She was very wrong to discuss her life and her problems with you. The theraputic relationship needs to be all about you just for the reasons you found out. You can't be worried about your therapist or you won't be able to say what you need to. But they're human too and what impressed me was her ability to hear you out without getting defensive and admit that she had done something wrong. Two really valuable qualities in a therapist. She has probably learned as much from this as you have and she'll be more careful in the future to maintain the boundaries and keep the relationship about you.

All relationships, including the ones with our Ts, are going to run into problems. Any human being will eventually fail you, not because they don't care but because they're human and none of us are perfect. What is important therefore isn't finding someone who never makes a mistake, it's finding someone who can repair the mistakes. I'm really glad you came here for support and even happier it's working out with your T.

AG

Hi MG,

I'm so so happy to hear about your positive response-it sounds like you T is learning a lot from her relationship with you. Her reaction shows how much she cares about you and your feelings and it was very important that she admit her mistakes and show you that it was not your fault, that it was unfair to share so much about her personal life.

It did sound like your T was being sincere and like she said, it seems like it is a learning process for both of you, that you are on this journey together. She was correct in that you were very brave and courageous to stick up for yourself and (if you want to take the glass half full approach which I rarely do!!!) then something good has come out of the hurt that was caused to you. It showed you how strong you are, that you realise you are really worth more than what you were getting from your T in the past and from those who have hurt you in the past.

Hopefully you can both move on from this. If there is any doubt about the boundaries again I hope you will feel safe in bringing it up or putting your foot down. Fingers crossed you won't even have to deal with this issue again. However, if you do, we all have faith in you that you will be able to ask for what you need and deserve from your T.

Take care,
Mrs. P

Hello and thank you all for your congratualtions and kind words regarding by last session with my T. Unfortunately, my session this week reverted back to the same behavior.My session was almost entirely about my T and although I didn't let on at the time she shared another very personal story that once again crossed the boudaries that I have learned from this site are so important. However, this time I dont feel so sad...I feel mad and cheated. I know in my heart that I need to start looking for a new T. Do you all agree?
MorningGlory

Oh, no...I'm so sorry to hear this, morningglory. How disappointing and I'm not surprised that you feel mad and cheated. It sounds like she is possibly unaware of what she is doing and that must be so frustrating after the wonderful conversation you just had. I don't know if calling her attention to it right when it is happening would help make her more aware. At any rate this is supposed to be time spent on you. It sounds like you will have to decide how much more you are willing to bring her attention to this. Maybe a trial appointment with another T would help you decide, I don't know. Please keep us posted on how you are doing.

Hugs,
SG

MG I'm sorry you feel mad and cheated. You have every right to feel that way. You are paying to have therapy and that means it all about YOU and your needs not your Ts needs. I have to admit that there were rare times when my T and I veered off course a bit during session. Not that it was about him at all but we just got to talking about things that I felt were extraneous and when I realized it I would say to him... I don't want to talk about that... I want to talk about THIS. Or, we don't need to talk about that but I need to tell you this. He would say of course I'm sorry and we would get back on topic.

So what I'm saying is that if you really want to keep this T you will need to do that. To direct the conversation and make her aware of what she is doing. Is she a young T? What she is doing is certainly violating boundaries and that could be harmful to you.

You may want to start looking around for a new T if this happens again. I wish you the best. I know how hard that would be. Please keep us updated as to how it goes next time.

Be well,
TN

Dear Strummergirl and True North,
Thank you both for your replies. You both made me think about things in a different way. It never occurred to me that I could be the one in control during my sessions and for that matter my life. I guess I have always been the kind of person who thinks that things happen to me instead of thinking I could be the one guiding the direction. What you said I could do during my session makes so much sense but I am always so scared I will hurt or offend my T. I know this is more about me and my need to always try to please everyone and make them like me. I would like to give this a try because I really do love my T and I think if I could do this with my T maybe I could find the strength to be stronger in all my relationships.
MorningGlory

You've got a great attitude and a strong heart, morningglory. Thank you for reminding me of something I often forget, that I can be proactive instead of reactive. This is something I really need to work on. It's a pleasure to have met you on this board.

SG